Why are there a different rules for Westerners and Asian Workers?

[Rorri]

Why westerners expect privileges ?

We don't, that is simply how you believe we are. What most "westerners" expect, is to be treated fairly, same as any "foreigner" expects to be treated in western countries. If a tourist, in Australia, was treated the same as tourists in Thailand then legal action could taken against those who single out tourists for "special" attention.

[Rorri]

Why westerners expect privileges ?

We don't, that is simply how you believe we are. What most "westerners" expect, is to be treated fairly, same as any "foreigner" expects to be treated in western countries. If a tourist, in Australia, was treated the same as tourists in Thailand then legal action could taken against those who single out tourists for "special" attention.

[Rorri]

There are special rules for migrant workers from Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar because Thailand has a need for laborers.

I would not call it a double standard. Would you be willing to work for 300 baht a day?

Isn't working for 300 baht/day a personal choice, how did race come into it.

I wouldn't have thought 300 per day was a "choice" for most.

OB

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Of course it is...no one is forced to work for 300 Baht a day....

[Oceanbat]

There are special rules for migrant workers from Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar because Thailand has a need for laborers.

I would not call it a double standard. Would you be willing to work for 300 baht a day?

Isn't working for 300 baht/day a personal choice, how did race come into it.

I wouldn't have thought 300 per day was a "choice" for most.

OB

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Of course it is...no one is forced to work for 300 Baht a day....

Really?

OB

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[Rorri]

I imagine the Immigration Officer would say Thai nationals support the parks with their taxes. Visitors do not.

Rumor is a Thai driver license or Tabien Baan will get you local admission prices at national parks, museums, etc. I have not yet put that to a test.

First, a large portion of Thais do not pay taxes....in Australia, locals and tourists all pay the same.

Secondly, so far I have NOT been allowed "local" admission prices to national parks, museums etc, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just saying it's not guaranteed.

I think a large portion of Aussies don't pay taxes either on a net basis. Around 50% of the working population. However they are Australian citizens, much as the Thai that don't pay taxes are Thai.

OB

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Wow 50%, I guess a wild guess is better than none, please supply your source for this guess.. Those people who work most pay as they earn.

[Oceanbat]

I imagine the Immigration Officer would say Thai nationals support the parks with their taxes. Visitors do not.

Rumor is a Thai driver license or Tabien Baan will get you local admission prices at national parks, museums, etc. I have not yet put that to a test.

First, a large portion of Thais do not pay taxes....in Australia, locals and tourists all pay the same.

Secondly, so far I have NOT been allowed "local" admission prices to national parks, museums etc, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just saying it's not guaranteed.

I think a large portion of Aussies don't pay taxes either on a net basis. Around 50% of the working population. However they are Australian citizens, much as the Thai that don't pay taxes are Thai.

OB

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Wow 50%, I guess a wild guess is better than none, please supply your source for this guess.. Those people who work most pay as they earn.

HALF of Australian families receive more in welfare than they pay in income tax, new figures reveal.

As the Abbott government sharpens its budget razor on welfare, the figures reveal just how dependent we’ve become.

LATEST STORIES: Budget 2014

BUDGET 2014: Government considers raising fuel tax

The exclusive modelling for News Corp Australia by the National Centre for Social and Economic Modelling at the University of Canberra reveals 48 per cent of Australia’s 12.2 million “income units” pay no net tax. Any tax they do contribute is more than offset by the welfare — pensions, family tax benefits or childcare rebates — they receive.

OB

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Rorri]

In the local supermarket in the UK, there was a Frenchman, German, Greek, Spaniard, Dutch, Belgium, Polish and Portagueese working there and had just arrived in the UK that morning. My Thai wife of 20 years and living in the UK for almost a year isnt allowed to work....example only..double standards or what

They are all from EU countries.

Exactly, and the Cambodians, Laotians and Burmeese the OP is talking about are all from SE.Asian countries..as they say in Thailand same same.

True, but until next year there is no free trade in labor. As we have seen recently, many do not have WPs and fled back to Cambodia.

[Rorri]

Oceanbat... OMG, you only posted the part to show you are "right", however the rest of the article clarifies it, here is just a portion On average, Australian families will pay $12,935 in income tax this year but receive $9515 in benefits — a net yearly contribution to the public purse of just $3424.

The figures include welfare paid in pensions, family benefits, jobless support and childcare support.

They include all income taxes paid but not indirect taxes, such as cigarette excise and state-levied taxes such as the GST. Needless to say, not all taxpayers receive the pension lol, child support, family benefits or job support. You need to understand what you read.

Here is the link to the whole article.

http://www.news.com.au/national/welcome-to-the-welfare-nation-half-of-australias-families-pay-no-net-tax/story-fncynjr2-1226911042149.

[Oceanbat]

Oceanbat... OMG, you only posted the part to show you are "right", however the rest of the article clarifies it, here is just a portion On average, Australian families will pay $12,935 in income tax this year but receive $9515 in benefits — a net yearly contribution to the public purse of just $3424.

The figures include welfare paid in pensions, family benefits, jobless support and childcare support.

They include all income taxes paid but not indirect taxes, such as cigarette excise and state-levied taxes such as the GST. Needless to say, not all taxpayers receive the pension lol, child support, family benefits or job support. You need to understand what you read.

Here is the link to the whole article.

http://www.news.com.au/national/welcome-to-the-welfare-nation-half-of-australias-families-pay-no-net-tax/story-fncynjr2-1226911042149.

Yup. I thought you said a large portion of Thais don't pay taxes? I imagine they pay indirect taxes here too. You are right my recollection was incorrect as it wasn't individual punters but families. Shocking right?

OB

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[enuff said]

.

.

Hundreds of examples of price differences depending on whether or not you are a local in the USA...

Yeah? Besides University tuition, I can't think of any examples of pricing based on nationality in the US. National parks charge the same price to everyone, regardless of passport. What am I missing?


~

I didn't say "national", I said "local".

As just one example, many state parks charge fees to out of state users. People in the state already contribute by other means to the state park system.

Thai people have paid not just taxes but with their own blood and sweat for the last 1000 years to have their own country. And you? 5 bucks is too much to ask?

You are missing the ability to read and comprehend simple sentences.

'nuff said

~

[pistachios]

OP got a point.

Thailand is as much in need of english teachers than low cost labourers.

If a cambodian can get his work permit in a few days, why does the process for a teacher (westerner or even philippino) take few months causing major headaches for the schools?

[joshstiles]

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Ask the Immigration officer when you arrive next time, same time you can ask him why you have to pay 200 THB to visist a national park in Thailand when the locals pay only 40 THB.

lol....that's funny....I pay what the thai people pay at the national parks because I just show them my thai drivers license

[joshstiles]

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There are special rules for migrant workers from Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar because Thailand has a need for laborers.

I would not call it a double standard. Would you be willing to work for 300 baht a day?

Yes....

[joshstiles]

how typical that there wouldn't be a single intelligent answer from the subscribers on this site

[Soutpeel]

OP got a point.

Thailand is as much in need of english teachers than low cost labourers.

If a cambodian can get his work permit in a few days, why does the process for a teacher (westerner or even philippino) take few months causing major headaches for the schools?

Why ? Thailand currently has no inclination to make English an official language any time soon

the number of Thai's as a population that are even exposed to English or have a need for English on a day to day basis is minimal and that's not going to change, a rice farmer in the wilds of isaan doesn't need English, his daughter might, to snag a farang, but she will be pick up workable English in Pattaya no problem

However what is needed as the country develops is roads, houses and infrastructure and currently this is the priority, not English, that's why they get the WP quicker.... Priorites and need

As westerners go, excluding "teachers" WP are issued pretty quickly as well, the last I had to a apply for a WP, start to finish 7 days blue book in hand

[banglassie]

how typical that there wouldn't be a single intelligent answer from the subscribers on this site

Then why don't you give an intelligent answer instead of whining about what others write?

[Oceanbat]

OP got a point.

Thailand is as much in need of english teachers than low cost labourers.

If a cambodian can get his work permit in a few days, why does the process for a teacher (westerner or even philippino) take few months causing major headaches for the schools?

Why ? Thailand currently has no inclination to make English an official language any time soon

the number of Thai's as a population that are even exposed to English or have a need for English on a day to day basis is minimal and that's not going to change, a rice farmer in the wilds of isaan doesn't need English, his daughter might, to snag a farang, but she will be pick up workable English in Pattaya no problem

However what is needed as the country develops is roads, houses and infrastructure and currently this is the priority, not English, that's why they get the WP quicker.... Priorites and need

As westerners go, excluding "teachers" WP are issued pretty quickly as well, the last I had to a apply for a WP, start to finish 7 days blue book in hand

That's my experience. Once I was on the ground it took about 5 days as well as me turning up at immigration for an hour for the officer to look at me.

OB

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[Soutpeel]

how typical that there wouldn't be a single intelligent answer from the subscribers on this site

I expect your saying this because your getting answers you don't want to hear that's why

So what would you like to see as an intelligent answer ?

All Thai's are xenophobic racists, and it not fair how westerners are treated ?

The natives should be kowtowing down every time a farang enters their presence, the natives must give me a long term visa and a work permit because I am a lilly white "arjan" ?

[DrTuner]

Thailand needs it's low cost labor. They don't need western high-paid workers. Simple.

[Suradit69]

"Why is there a difference for different foreigners? Isn't this a double standard?"

Why are there differences for Canadians entering the US or Americans entering Canada compared to other nationals?

Why are there differences for citizens of EU countries entering other EU countries compared to those from say North Africa?

If someone from Sri Lanka went to UK looking for work would he be treated the same as someone from Germany or The Netherlands?

If you are Cambodian or Laos and come to Thailand to work on construction, why are you not treated as nicely as some unqualified, otherwise unemployable person from UK who wants to teach English to unsuspecting, innocent Thai children.

[sustento]

In the local supermarket in the UK, there was a Frenchman, German, Greek, Spaniard, Dutch, Belgium, Polish and Portagueese working there and had just arrived in the UK that morning. My Thai wife of 20 years and living in the UK for almost a year isnt allowed to work....example only..double standards or what

If your wife could get a French, German, Greek, Spanish, Dutch, Belgian, Polish or Portuguese passport she'd be able to work there too. She'd be an EU citizen. Doh!

[samran]

There are special rules for migrant workers from Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar because Thailand has a need for laborers.

I would not call it a double standard. Would you be willing to work for 300 baht a day?

Hypothetically, what if a farang was willing to work for 300 baht a day?

The fact he is not allowed to, is discrimination, isn't it?

He can work. He just won't get an extension of stay that's all.

[mrtoad]

how typical that there wouldn't be a single intelligent answer from the subscribers on this site

Or is it because people don't agree with your whining and sense of entitlement?

[forumuser10]

Not correct, if you are Japanese, Korean etc, you can't work in the same way as a person from Cambodia.

[tomyumchai]

Isn't there a double standard where you are from - can a rich man from Switzerland enter England more easily than a poor man from Nigeria? The world is full of double standards… anyone who has had a girlfriend knows this…

blimey chap when did you last take a look in the UK? i cant even count 1 swiss person here however everywhere i turn all i see are............

[Gimbo]

A person comes from Sweden to Norway to work. There is no passport check at the border and none is needed. All he has to do is register his or her adress for tax purposes within 7 days of entering the country.

A person comes from Thailand to Norway to work.

Must pay 3000 baht only to be allowed to hand the application for a visa and work permit. Must wait for a 6-12 months to get the visa.

Need a sponsor in Norway with an income of more than 1,5 million baht.

Must take a language course and be fluent in the Norwegian language up to high school level, to get a cleaning job.

Must re-apply every year for 3 years, paying 5000 baht each time...

Edited July 19, 2014 by Gimbo

[mikebike]

how typical that there wouldn't be a single intelligent answer from the subscribers on this site

There were plenty of intelligent and correct answers.

I will attempt to spell it out for you.

1. TWO Thai ministries control the movement of foreign nationals into Thailand: the Foreign Ministry sets the policy/laws; and the Immigration Department enforces policy/laws.

2. Work permits are issued by the Labour Ministry but may require additional professional certification or endorsements from specific departments (such as education ministry). The requirements for work permits vary according to the type of labour - i.e.: a labourer requires no endorsement of education, nor any certificates of qualification or graduation, whereas a professional most certainly does.

3. As with almost any nation, preferential treatment regarding immigration is given to neighbouring nations labourers to fill empty jobs that local nationals are unwilling or unable to fill.

4. Commercial sectors requiring or dependant upon imported labour have worked long and hard to secure bilateral agreements and concessions to allowing local foreign labour to be able to work and reside in the Kingdom.

5. The Royal Thai Education Ministry, many schools and many teacher-placement agencies have for many, many years, been "gaming" their own immigration system: That is they have relied upon the seemingly endless supply of young, cheap, transient, uncertified, native english speakers to fill teaching jobs without every worrying about immigration requirements, and often without worrying about professional qualifications.

6. Thai immigration has recently decided to step up its enforcement of existing policy/laws/requirements seemingly making it more difficult to "game" the system using tourist visas and exempt entries to live and work in Thailand.

7. The issue you have described is not Asia v West thing. It is a local unskilled labour v foreign professional worker and shady employer thing. You, as a NES looking for teaching work in Thailand must understand the visa and professional requirements to legally teach in Thailand and you must understand the history of NES teachers in Thailand has been one of huge oversupply and little regard for legality. At a time when the country is in need of NES teachers the Ministry, schools, and agencies had better pull their heads outta the sand and make it easier for teachers to be legal.

[Arkady]

It is indeed strange. I am not even sure how they get exemption from the restricted occupations list. I suppose it must be buried in the temporary but renewable regulations they issue to do with alien labourers. They get pink ID cards which most district offices refuse to issue to permanent residents, even though it is a requirement in the BORA regulations.

They have got on a train they can't get off. It is now like the flood of Chinese labourers that came in in the first half of the 20th century. Now they own the place.

[mrfaroukh]

Probably the Asian have some set of laws between the countries that allow them to do so the same way a European go from one country to another without any problem.

[Centrum]

Isn't there a double standard where you are from - can a rich man from Switzerland enter England more easily than a poor man from Nigeria? The world is full of double standards… anyone who has had a girlfriend knows this…

I follow your logic but can you. or anyone, explain how hundreds of Indians are able to work as salespeople in places like Indra, Platinum and Khao san?