Are new cars a luxury in Thailand?

[jmccarty]

Only real luxury cars are cinsidered and cost what a luxury car costs.

 

Everything else locally assembled including BMW and Mercedes can cost a fair amount but are still cheaper than the made in Germany same model grey market imported or even just purchased in Germany or the UK. 

 

OP - No, if your driving a corolla or city, you will be viewed as somone that can afford an entry level car!

Edited August 5, 2014 by jmccarty

[konying]

can an average office worker work hard...
...
back in my country, a Corolla would cost about six months salary

Income:
Seven 11 about 9000 Baht/month.
Skilled factory labourer up to 20000.
Avarage office worker might earn up to 30000 (no managment position)
School director/high level government officer might make 60000.
(farang English teacher 25000 to 40000 and more )
 
A corolla type car in basic edition costs about 600000 Baht.
 
600000/9000: 67 months, out of reach
/20000: 30 months, very hard even with going deep into debt.
/30000: 20 months, still hard
/60000: 10 months, doable
 
So even the 30000 Baht middle class income has to struggle hard.
Different perspective if there is a couple with good double income.
 
There were some statistics recently about private debt of Thai families.
Thais are very high in debt.
Some low earners pay 40% of their income just for car dept.
 
Other way round: in Germany an avarage office worker could make 3500 EUR/month, about 150000 Baht/month.
If he would invest 20 months of income for the car, that would make up for 70000 EUR.
That would be much more than a Corolla
An the truth is: some do!

Who told you these figures? I think you are off. If you think Toyota is paying their factory workers 20,000B a month you are kidding yourself.
They make minimum wage. I pay my factory workers above minimum wages and they still only average about 8000B a month without overtime.
Office staff makes 10-12K per month. Accountant is getting 20,000B a month and I pay more than my Thai friends that own companies. My friend his wife was the assistant to the CEO of HUTCH, she speaks, Thai, English and French fluently and has a masters and she was only making 35K per month.
7-11 I'm sure is only paying minimum wage so 6 days a week is 7,200B a month. I own a company at this time but have worked in Thailand for 20 years and been in several management positions over the years never seen any office staff getting paid more than 15K per month in a non-management position.

Not sure what you own and how you claim to pay above minimum wage , when minimum wage is 9000 baht per month but your staff averages 8000.

Their days off must be paid for or you are breaking the law.

7-11 does not pay per day , but as a proper company pays for days off as full time employees are entitled to it by law, so their salary is 9000 baht per month.

A receptionist in a company or real estate starts on 15k per month.

Office staff with some years of experience are in 25-30k per month.

[kuifje]

 

Some days it seems like just about everyone in Thailand has a new car and new iPhone.  I can't imagine what their debt to income ratio is, but eventually it is going to end in tears.

 

Thai household debts have increased to an average of 219,000 baht per household this year -  the highest level in nine years. Debt-to-GDP rose to 82.3% at end-2013, from 77.3% at end-2012,

a

Bubble bubble, toil and trouble. . . 

 

 

 

 

Wow, thanks for this information.   This is helpfull.   I most say only 219,000 per household, its even lower than I expected.    That is very low and not to bad.  Household debts include all debts, houses, cars, finance company's. How many income's in one household on average, 2 ? 3? more?   So even if they are in the lower income brackets, they can repay there debts!     This means also, most people have more assets, then debts !!!!!

What you think is the average debt is in some advanced economies ?   Many 100.000's euro's or dollars for house, car &  other debts.   In many cases only one income to pay off those debts,no one will help you if you are in problems.  

 

Yes many people in Thailand have to many debts, some will not be able to pay them.  And yes it is a bubble, which will burst for some.   They will lose some of there assets along the way.   But most will survive with the help of hard (long) work and help from there family.  In the many years in Asia I see the vitality and survival of people here.   If they have a problem, they adjust and go on.   

[KhunBENQ]

Some posters found my estimates for income too high.

So may it be.

Just supports the point I want to show: cars are a "luxury" product for the lower income range and need a lot of effort and maybe support from the whole family to finance.

I don't want to start another thread about income if Thais, but good luck finding skilled workers for the minumum wage,

Difficult even in upcountry Isan.

 

 

[Spoonman]

can an average office worker work hard...
...
back in my country, a Corolla would cost about six months salary

Income:
Seven 11 about 9000 Baht/month.
Skilled factory labourer up to 20000.
Avarage office worker might earn up to 30000 (no managment position)
School director/high level government officer might make 60000.
(farang English teacher 25000 to 40000 and more )
 
A corolla type car in basic edition costs about 600000 Baht.
 
600000/9000: 67 months, out of reach
/20000: 30 months, very hard even with going deep into debt.
/30000: 20 months, still hard
/60000: 10 months, doable
 
So even the 30000 Baht middle class income has to struggle hard.
Different perspective if there is a couple with good double income.
 
There were some statistics recently about private debt of Thai families.
Thais are very high in debt.
Some low earners pay 40% of their income just for car dept.
 
Other way round: in Germany an avarage office worker could make 3500 EUR/month, about 150000 Baht/month.
If he would invest 20 months of income for the car, that would make up for 70000 EUR.
That would be much more than a Corolla
An the truth is: some do!

Who told you these figures? I think you are off. If you think Toyota is paying their factory workers 20,000B a month you are kidding yourself.
They make minimum wage. I pay my factory workers above minimum wages and they still only average about 8000B a month without overtime.
Office staff makes 10-12K per month. Accountant is getting 20,000B a month and I pay more than my Thai friends that own companies. My friend his wife was the assistant to the CEO of HUTCH, she speaks, Thai, English and French fluently and has a masters and she was only making 35K per month.
7-11 I'm sure is only paying minimum wage so 6 days a week is 7,200B a month. I own a company at this time but have worked in Thailand for 20 years and been in several management positions over the years never seen any office staff getting paid more than 15K per month in a non-management position.

Not sure what you own and how you claim to pay above minimum wage , when minimum wage is 9000 baht per month but your staff averages 8000.

@ 300b per day minimum wage the monthly total would be Bt7800.00.

300b x 6 days x 52 weeks / 12 months.

[Suradit69]

Yes, private household debt ratio in Thailand is amongst the highest in the world.

 

I have added/edited my post in the meantime (comparison with Germany).

TV is so fast!

 

"Yes, private household debt ratio in Thailand is amongst the highest in the world."

 

Ratio? Compared to what? To GDP, not really. It is worryingly high, but probably not on the same scale as real estate debt to market value in western countries before that unsustainable debt precipitated the recent economic collapse in those countries.

 

UK, Denmark and Japan are around 100% plus.

 

Even just in Asia, Thailand doesn't top the list.

[thairastawoman]

Cars should cost double price because anyway they don't know how to drive, so they should not be allowed to own one !

[Tchooptip]

Honda city = University students, or new to the job office staff or bankers. No big deal, just like buying milk at makro.

 

Corolla = Entry-mid level managers. Again no big deal.

 

And yes, their debt is crazy. New car debt is accountable for most Thai's salary. I once fired a saleslady, after my acceptance of her job application, she immediately got a new Toyota vios red plated. All hi-so and stuff in "her society", didn't catch my interest at all. Upon been fired, she didn't complain about why, what, who.

 

"BUT, I buy new car, cannot get fired. Who pay?"

?????...Because it's supposed to be funny   

[JacChang]

 

Honda city = University students, or new to the job office staff or bankers. No big deal, just like buying milk at makro.

 

Corolla = Entry-mid level managers. Again no big deal.

 

And yes, their debt is crazy. New car debt is accountable for most Thai's salary. I once fired a saleslady, after my acceptance of her job application, she immediately got a new Toyota vios red plated. All hi-so and stuff in "her society", didn't catch my interest at all. Upon been fired, she didn't complain about why, what, who.

 

"BUT, I buy new car, cannot get fired. Who pay?"

?????...Because it's supposed to be funny   

 

Exactly.

 

That girl had the same face as you.

 

Same types think alike.       

[Westaurel]

Yes when I go there, I feeling myself more poor than them. Just looking so rich with their big cars and big houses in comparison with the old retired farang driving motorbike !

 

But you cannot see the real depth of their debts' hole !

 

As in another countries where it's not well seen to show your poverty, you agree as everybody to have big debts to show you succeed (a hidden reality) and get anything to live: house & big car !

 

Edited August 5, 2014 by Westaurel

[konying]

@ 300b per day minimum wage the monthly total would be Bt7800.00.

300b x 6 days x 52 weeks / 12 months.

Full time employees must have days off paid. Edited August 5, 2014 by konying

[Spoonman]

@ 300b per day minimum wage the monthly total would be Bt7800.00.

300b x 6 days x 52 weeks / 12 months.

Full time employees must have days off paid.

Correct. those days off would fall under either annual(12 days)/sick (30 days) or personal (7 days) leave.

The 7th day of the week is not paid as the working week is 48 hours made up of 6 x 8hour days.

[konying]

 

 

@ 300b per day minimum wage the monthly total would be Bt7800.00.

300b x 6 days x 52 weeks / 12 months.

Full time employees must have days off paid.

 

Correct. those days off would fall under either annual(12 days)/sick (30 days) or personal (7 days) leave.

The 7th day of the week is not paid as the working week is 48 hours made up of 6 x 8hour days.

 

 

Disagree, the one day off per week is paid by the company and must be paid for all full time employees.

 

Please show me labor law allowing company NOT to pay for 7th day.?

[Spoonman]

 

 

 

@ 300b per day minimum wage the monthly total would be Bt7800.00.

300b x 6 days x 52 weeks / 12 months.

Full time employees must have days off paid.

 

Correct. those days off would fall under either annual(12 days)/sick (30 days) or personal (7 days) leave.

The 7th day of the week is not paid as the working week is 48 hours made up of 6 x 8hour days.

 

 

Disagree, the one day off per week is paid by the company and must be paid for all full time employees.

 

Please show me labor law allowing company NOT to pay for 7th day.?

 

 

Read the Thai Labour Act.

 

[konying]

Read the Thai Labour Act.

 
I did not ask for your advice on what i should read, i asked you to post a link to section of the labor law which supports your post, claiming to be a fact that full time employees do not need to be paid for their day off, the 7th day.
 
Please post link to support your claim

[bkkjames]

Now back on topic - what was it again?

[Spoonman]

 

Read the Thai Labour Act.

 
I did not ask for your advice on what i should read, i asked you to post a link to section of the labor law which supports your post, claiming to be a fact that full time employees do not need to be paid for their day off, the 7th day.
 
Please post link to support your claim

 

 

No. Iam not going to go through the whole ACT to find the page to prove my claim which is regarded as common knowledge, your are saying Iam wrong so you provide your proof.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[konying]

 

Read the Thai Labour Act.

 
I did not ask for your advice on what i should read, i asked you to post a link to section of the labor law which supports your post, claiming to be a fact that full time employees do not need to be paid for their day off, the 7th day.
 
Please post link to support your claim
 

 
No. Iam not going to go through the whole ACT to find the page to prove my claim which is regarded as common knowledge, your are saying Iam wrong so you provide your proof.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

You are wrong and I do not need to prove it. Read labor law before you find yourself in serious trouble if you own a business .

Not paying for day off for full time employees is common knowledge? I suggest you do as posted above , read the labor law.

[bkkjames]

aren't people here paid monthly - if so then you can say you pay them 7 days a week or not - it's irrelevant no?

[konying]

aren't people here paid monthly - if so then you can say you pay them 7 days a week or not - it's irrelevant no?

Some people are paid daily , like casual or part time staff , full timers are paid monthly , minimum monthly wage of 9000 baht , meaning days off are paid , as it must by law

[bkkjames]

aren't people here paid monthly - if so then you can say you pay them 7 days a week or not - it's irrelevant no?

Some people are paid daily , like casual or part time staff , full timers are paid monthly , minimum monthly wage of 9000 baht , meaning days off are paid , as it must by law

The casual or part time workers don't get paid for days off nor are they financing a new car in most cases.

Sent from my LG-P970 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Spoonman]

Full time staff are paid for a 48 hour week, The 48 hour week takes place over a 6 day period. The law stipulates they must have 1 day off after every 6.

 

How that interprets to "are paid 7 days per week" is something only a very special person could come up with.

 

Anyway back on topic. An entry level vanilla car is definitely not considered a "luxury".

[Ace of Pop]

What about Hospital Staff with antisocial hours i wonder.

[konying]

Full time staff are paid for a 48 hour week, The 48 hour week takes place over a 6 day period. The law stipulates they must have 1 day off after every 6.
 
How that interprets to "are paid 7 days per week" is something only a very special person could come up with.
 
Anyway back on topic. An entry level vanilla car is definitely not considered a "luxury".

You keep on spouting same nonsense over and over again. Post a link to labor law which states full time employees do not have to be paid for their day off?

Also post a link to law which states they must have a day off. Law states they are entitled to day off, which is not the same as must, if you really want to get technical.

[Spoonman]

 

Full time staff are paid for a 48 hour week, The 48 hour week takes place over a 6 day period. The law stipulates they must have 1 day off after every 6.
 
How that interprets to "are paid 7 days per week" is something only a very special person could come up with.
 
Anyway back on topic. An entry level vanilla car is definitely not considered a "luxury".

You keep on spouting same nonsense over and over again. Post a link to labor law which states full time employees do not have to be paid for their day off?

Also post a link to law which states they must have a day off. Law states they are entitled to day off, which is not the same as must, if you really want to get technical.

 

 

Thank you for confirming by law they are entitled to 1 day off per week, that is consistent with the 48hour/6day week (that the law states).

 

Have a read of the ministry of labour website.

 

http://www.mol.go.th/en/content/page/6309

Edited August 5, 2014 by Spoonman

[rgs2001uk]

 

 

can an average office worker work hard...
...
back in my country, a Corolla would cost about six months salary

Income:
Seven 11 about 9000 Baht/month.
Skilled factory labourer up to 20000.
Avarage office worker might earn up to 30000 (no managment position)
School director/high level government officer might make 60000.
(farang English teacher 25000 to 40000 and more )
 
A corolla type car in basic edition costs about 600000 Baht.
 
600000/9000: 67 months, out of reach
/20000: 30 months, very hard even with going deep into debt.
/30000: 20 months, still hard
/60000: 10 months, doable
 
So even the 30000 Baht middle class income has to struggle hard.
Different perspective if there is a couple with good double income.
 
There were some statistics recently about private debt of Thai families.
Thais are very high in debt.
Some low earners pay 40% of their income just for car dept.
 
Other way round: in Germany an avarage office worker could make 3500 EUR/month, about 150000 Baht/month.
If he would invest 20 months of income for the car, that would make up for 70000 EUR.
That would be much more than a Corolla
An the truth is: some do!

 

Who told you these figures? I think you are off. If you think Toyota is paying their factory workers 20,000B a month you are kidding yourself.
They make minimum wage. I pay my factory workers above minimum wages and they still only average about 8000B a month without overtime.
Office staff makes 10-12K per month. Accountant is getting 20,000B a month and I pay more than my Thai friends that own companies. My friend his wife was the assistant to the CEO of HUTCH, she speaks, Thai, English and French fluently and has a masters and she was only making 35K per month.
7-11 I'm sure is only paying minimum wage so 6 days a week is 7,200B a month. I own a company at this time but have worked in Thailand for 20 years and been in several management positions over the years never seen any office staff getting paid more than 15K per month in a non-management position.

 

 

You might want to update your figures or pay a visit to Bkk circa 2014.

 

Cleaners, 500 baht per day.

Factory workers making 10-12k per month, with free company accomodation.

Truck drivers (as writen on the back of farmhouse delivery truck adverts) salary 15-20k per month.

Uni graduates walking into 25k + jobs (non management position).

BIL engineer Nissan, 40k per month.

 

As for the trilingual speaking woman you mention, she could easily double that in Bkk.

 

Just as a matter of interest, where are you posting from/where is your factory?

 

[konying]

Full time staff are paid for a 48 hour week, The 48 hour week takes place over a 6 day period. The law stipulates they must have 1 day off after every 6.
 
How that interprets to "are paid 7 days per week" is something only a very special person could come up with.
 
Anyway back on topic. An entry level vanilla car is definitely not considered a "luxury".

You keep on spouting same nonsense over and over again. Post a link to labor law which states full time employees do not have to be paid for their day off?

Also post a link to law which states they must have a day off. Law states they are entitled to day off, which is not the same as must, if you really want to get technical.

 
Thank you for confirming by law they are entitled to 1 day off per week, that is consistent with the 48hour/6day week (that the law states).
 
Have a read of the ministry of labour website.
 
http://www.mol.go.th/en/content/page/6309

This would be i am sure the 6th time i am asking to post link to section of the law stating full time employees do not have to be paid for their 7th day off.

You claim to be an expert on the matter, so posting the exact section of the law should not be a problem, should it?

You did not say entitled, you were quoting the law saying they must.

While its semantics, you are posting wrong information which you refuse to clarify and anyone in the position of employing would be breaking the law following your advise.

I am happy to be proven wrong, so do feel free to reference to exact section of the law confirming your assertions that full time employees do not have to be paid for the 7th day off

[Spoonman]

Sorry, your are just too damn stupid to reply to anymore.

 

Goodbye.

[A1Str8]

Yes. That's why most of the new cars are financed.

[konying]

Sorry, your are just too damn stupid to reply to anymore.

 

Goodbye.

 

Very intelligent response. Possibly as intelligent as your knowledge of Thai labor law