Dtac internet Scam or Not?

[Equalizer]

Every time my internet package expires i feel i am getting unauthorized internet charges. I have a Samsung Galaxy III and if my balance is not enough to renew my subscription I.E if the monthly subscription is 799 baht and i have 750 Baht in credit Dtac take it upon themselves to deduct 49 baht per day from my balance for internet until it cleans the balance to zero. I called them up and asked them who is authorizing them to take this money from my account. They said to me that there is a feature in my phone that when activated opens the gateway to the internet. I said to them that this gate has to be passed through by yourselves because you are allowing the internet to pass through it. I then proceeded to ask them what on earth something in the settings of my phone should allow them to take money from my balance without asking me to authorize it. They said the system is set up to automatically connect me to the internet if this is in the on position and it is up to me to turn it off if i do not want to be charged. My question is how can this be legal within the realms of trading standards. How can something in the settings of a phone allow a company to force a service on you without asking first? Would you not agree that if there is not enough in the balance to top up the Internet subscription, the service should cease altogether until you top up and activate it again? Similarly if you had for a novice user example, 1000 baht in credit with a new phone you know little about and because you turned on a button in the phone a provider thinks they have a right to go ahead and use the money without so much as a message asking you to authorize the use of the gateway? To me this is blatant robbery and very devious.

[Upnotover]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

[Equalizer]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

This is my point, i am in control of a button in my settings. Having this button in the on position does not connect me to the internet. This button just leaves the gateway open. The service provider has to either manually or automatically use this gateway and this is controlled at their end not mine. Otherwise why would it not give me internet with a negative balance in my account?

[TobiasML]

DTAC will deduct and provide the internet service as long as you have money in your account. By buying the card and activating the internet you asked DTAC to provide you the service of using the internet. Therefore it is up to you to decide if you like to continue this service or not. DTAC as well as all other providers will provide you what you are asking for. By leaving your internet connection enabled they are deducting the smallest package available instead of charging by kb or mb. If you like to avoid this you can call DTAC and ask them to completely disable the internet. After doing this DTAC would be responsible in case they still allow you to use the internet.

Just my 2 cents to this topic.

[Upnotover]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

This is my point, i am in control of a button in my settings. Having this button in the on position does not connect me to the internet. This button just leaves the gateway open. The service provider has to either manually or automatically use this gateway and this is controlled at their end not mine. Otherwise why would it not give me internet with a negative balance in my account?

It works the same with all providers and not only in Thailand. When I go to the UK I have a pay as you go phone. On arrival I buy a data bundle, and turn on data. If the bundle expires and I don't turn off data then it starts charging from my balance. Same way with voice bundles and sms bundles. DTAC cannot know that you only want data when you buy a package and as you don't turn it off will just provide it at their standard rate until your credit is gone.

[lopburi3]

Your phone is likely checking email every hour or some such other automatic connection from your phone which you must turn off - as long as you have credit in your account DTAC will provide the service you are requesting it to provide (which is non plan and expensive when between plans like this). I have noted that DTAC will now accept renewal of packages on day of expiration (maybe earlier) so should not be an issue if you remember to renew - they used to refuse new package until current package expired which was rather nasty.

[Pib]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

This is my point, i am in control of a button in my settings. Having this button in the on position does not connect me to the internet. This button just leaves the gateway open. The service provider has to either manually or automatically use this gateway and this is controlled at their end not mine. Otherwise why would it not give me internet with a negative balance in my account?

When you have you Mobile Data switch on it is connected to the internet via DTAC unless you have constant Wifi connection...and any apps which use the internet, even if they just call home occasionally in the background, then you are actively using the DTAC internet connection. Plus, with the Mobile Data switch on and say none of your Apps are using the internet in the background, control bytes are still flowing back and forth to maintain the connection. And it don't matter in a time-based plan if your connection uses 1 byte of data (or 1 MegaByte of data), you are still using the Mobile Data and based on the length of time you are connected you will be charged. And I guess some time-based plans have a minimum charge per day even if your turn your Mobile Data switch on only for a few minutes. Time-based plans require close management which includes management of the Mobile Data on/off switch.

[casualbiker]

Op. You should be happy it's charging this way.. it could get REAL expensive the other way. Per minute billing

[Digitalbanana]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

This is my point, i am in control of a button in my settings. Having this button in the on position does not connect me to the internet.

This is where you are screwing up. I have done the same. By having data services turned on your device at at the stroke of midnight DTAC will be accessed by your device, and if your internet package has expired, you will default to DTACs general package of 49THB/day. To avoid this crap, I always have an app installed and running (such as Automateit) that turns off data services at 23:55 hrs on the last day of my package so I can subscribe to a new one I actually want (not necessarily the 49THB package) the next day.

[Equalizer]

You just need to switch data off when your package expires, and switch it back on when you renew it. You are the one that controls if your phone connects to the internet, not DTAC.

This is my point, i am in control of a button in my settings. Having this button in the on position does not connect me to the internet.

This is where you are screwing up. I have done the same. By having data services turned on your device at at the stroke of midnight DTAC will be accessed by your device, and if your internet package has expired, you will default to DTACs general package of 49THB/day. To avoid this crap, I always have an app installed and running (such as Automateit) that turns off data services at 23:55 hrs on the last day of my package so I can subscribe to a new one I actually want (not necessarily the 49THB package) the next day.

The App sounds like a winner. I will look into this. I just think reading the replies everyone seems resigned to this rip off as standard practice and so the cheek of it has mellowed inside everyone. I know for a fact that these providers have automation set up to jump on this scam as soon as it becomes available. The fact remains they are the ones who ultimately send this service through your gateway. They have the power to refrain from doing it. Stepping back and looking at it objectively we can agree that no matter how you twist it these providers can and will use money in your account without authorization. Just because it is standard practice does not make it right and leaving a button on in the settings of a phone to justify it to me is complete madness. What about Joe Bloggs who decides his 10 year old Nokia has had its day and buys a smart phone, does not use the internet, has no idea how to use his new accusation. He then puts 1000baht onto his credit and because there is some on off button in his settings his provider has the right to clean out his balance. This analogy is what trading standards are supposed to be protecting us from.

[casualbiker]

The other option is to get postpay. Easy then they bill you. You pay via internet banking.

[SoiBiker]

You authorised them to do it when you asked them to provide you with an internet service. No matter how twist it, you're the only one who thinks this is somehow a scam,

[Equalizer]

You authorised them to do it when you asked them to provide you with an internet service. No matter how twist it, you're the only one who thinks this is somehow a scam

You can go and buy any Dtac sim card that is compatible in your smart phone, leave this button on and they will take the money so what are you saying? And buying a smart phone is not asking a service provider for an internet service. Read what i have written pal the facts are there if you stop skip reading. Joe Bloggs did not ask for internet did he? What is your answer to that analogy then? Plus it is not only me who is thinking it is a scam. It is simple what i am asking (Q) How can a service provider take money from your account without authorization. Buying a sim card is not authorization.

[Upnotover]

I actually know a couple of these Joe Bloggs characters, they did indeed switch from old phones to new smartphones and indeed their credit soon disappeared. Guess what they both did? Turned off data.

[jpinx]

You authorised them to do it when you asked them to provide you with an internet service. No matter how twist it, you're the only one who thinks this is somehow a scam

You can go and buy any Dtac sim card that is compatible in your smart phone, leave this button on and they will take the money so what are you saying? And buying a smart phone is not asking a service provider for an internet service. Read what i have written pal the facts are there if you stop skip reading. Joe Bloggs did not ask for internet did he? What is your answer to that analogy then? Plus it is not only me who is thinking it is a scam. It is simple what i am asking (Q) How can a service provider take money from your account without authorization. Buying a sim card is not authorization.

That's a bit like connecting the water pipe to the mains and being annoyed when water comes out because you turn the tap on !

fwiw -- you can get a monthly Dtac package and just make sure there is enough credit the day before the end of the 30 days and it'll automatically renew at the "normal" price.

[Equalizer]

I actually know a couple of these Joe Bloggs characters, they did indeed switch from old phones to new smartphones and indeed their credit soon disappeared. Guess what they both did? Turned off data.

Where do you work my son, star ship enterprise? Or maybe Dtac! I am talking about people who know how to use a shovel and pick not sit on the jacksy all day analyzing futures.

[Equalizer]

You authorised them to do it when you asked them to provide you with an internet service. No matter how twist it, you're the only one who thinks this is somehow a scam

You can go and buy any Dtac sim card that is compatible in your smart phone, leave this button on and they will take the money so what are you saying? And buying a smart phone is not asking a service provider for an internet service. Read what i have written pal the facts are there if you stop skip reading. Joe Bloggs did not ask for internet did he? What is your answer to that analogy then? Plus it is not only me who is thinking it is a scam. It is simple what i am asking (Q) How can a service provider take money from your account without authorization. Buying a sim card is not authorization.

That's a bit like connecting the water pipe to the mains and being annoyed when water comes out because you turn the tap on !

fwiw -- you can get a monthly Dtac package and just make sure there is enough credit the day before the end of the 30 days and it'll automatically renew at the "normal" price.

Well yes you would if you was the one who knew the water pipe was being connected. Maybe the water board came and installed the pipe turned it on whilst you was out and you had to pay for it.

[jpinx]

You authorised them to do it when you asked them to provide you with an internet service. No matter how twist it, you're the only one who thinks this is somehow a scam

You can go and buy any Dtac sim card that is compatible in your smart phone, leave this button on and they will take the money so what are you saying? And buying a smart phone is not asking a service provider for an internet service. Read what i have written pal the facts are there if you stop skip reading. Joe Bloggs did not ask for internet did he? What is your answer to that analogy then? Plus it is not only me who is thinking it is a scam. It is simple what i am asking (Q) How can a service provider take money from your account without authorization. Buying a sim card is not authorization.

That's a bit like connecting the water pipe to the mains and being annoyed when water comes out because you turn the tap on !

fwiw -- you can get a monthly Dtac package and just make sure there is enough credit the day before the end of the 30 days and it'll automatically renew at the "normal" price.

Well yes you would if you was the one who knew the water pipe was being connected. Maybe the water board came and installed the pipe turned it on whilst you was out and you had to pay for it.

Ouch! The analogy cannot withstand such labouring

[Digitalbanana]

fwiw -- you can get a monthly Dtac package and just make sure there is enough credit the day before the end of the 30 days and it'll automatically renew at the "normal" price.

This is another thing to watch out for. If you sign up for a repeating package, it will repeat until all your money is gone whether you use the net / data, or not as long as there is enough money in your account to suck out. Some packages however do not automatically renew- which are the kind I like because the only way to stop the renewing ones is through the call center and speaking to someone - at least it was last time I got caught a few months back.

[jpinx]

fwiw -- you can get a monthly Dtac package and just make sure there is enough credit the day before the end of the 30 days and it'll automatically renew at the "normal" price.

This is another thing to watch out for. If you sign up for a repeating package, it will repeat until all your money is gone whether you use the net / data, or not as long as there is enough money in your account to suck out. Some packages however do not automatically renew- which are the kind I like because the only way to stop the renewing ones is through the call center and speaking to someone - at least it was last time I got caught a few months back.

Yes - that's a given - it's in the T&C for the packages. Using the unlimited monthly "slow" 420Baht one is good enough for me and renews as long as I have credit until I switch the phone off or remove the sim card when I leave thailand.

[mikebike]

Equalizer, I will try to explain why this is not a scam. It is your phone which is requesting internet access when your plan runs out, not Dtac pushing the service to you. You, through your phone's data settings are requesting THEIR service. If you do not turn data services off your phone will constantly look for an internet connection and if it does not find wifi it WILL connect to Dtac. It is your lack of phone savvy which is screwing you, not Dtac.

Edited August 13, 2014 by mikebike

[Chicog]

And if Equaliser actually bothers to read the small print on the service agreement, probably cunningly buried somewhere on their website, everything that has been said to him will doubtless be confirmed.

[Digitalbanana]

And if Equaliser actually bothers to read the small print on the service agreement, probably cunningly buried somewhere on their website, everything that has been said to him will doubtless be confirmed.

I think "cunningly buried" is what is key and can piss a lot of people off. If the mobile providers could put their terms in large notices clearly, like the warnings on cigarette packs, then customers would have more trust in them.

[Kalebiran]

Dump dtac and move to AIS . Far better net deals

[Digitalbanana]

Dump dtac and move to AIS . Far better net deals

Surely you need to back up such a comment? When I just checked I notice following - which suggests DTAC comes out a better deal:

Monthly:

DTAC:

199THB/month unlimited 1GB at 4G speed. Activation *104*26*9#

vs

AIS:

199THB/month unlimited 300MB at 4G speed. Activation *777*984#

Daily:

DTAC:

19THB/day unlimited 100MB at 4G speed then 384kbps. Activation *104*391*9#

AIS:

49THB/day unlimited 384kbps speed. Activation *777*722#

Granted the daily DTAC 100MB daily allowance for 4G speeds seems superfluous as it will be gone in a few minutes and enough to annoy anyone, but at least it is better than the AIS option?

[build6]

If I don't have a data plan active, but still use data, I get a warning SMS once I use 10 baht worth of data, which is well before I hit the daily cap of 49 baht. Why ignore this?

Not only that, if I have insufficient funds for a renewal of a recurring package, I get a warning SMS before the renewal date, to remind me to top up my account.

It seems to me there are plenty of opportunities to avoid unnecessary charges.

The 49 baht charge is also the price for their "daily unlimited" package, so their capping the fee at that seems both logical and extremely fair to me.

When I first came to Thailand and got my first prepaid DTAC SIM, I was frankly overjoyed when I discovered the usage would be automatically capped at 49 baht per day - if you're complaining about this you haven't been to any of the countries where they don't cap it. I once burned through $20 of data at one go in Malaysia without realising it, for example. no recourse.

[Digitalbanana]

The 49 baht charge is also the price for their "daily unlimited" package, so their capping the fee at that seems both logical and extremely fair to me.

You can get the same 49 baht daily charge plan for 19 baht using the activation code I gave above. DTAC could be a little more forthcoming about this I think, but I agree having the daily charge cap in there offers some protection to the uninitiated of which there are many.

Sent from my SM-P601 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[build6]

You can get the same 49 baht daily charge plan for 19 baht using the activation code I gave

Yes, although my understanding of the 19 baht plan is that it's a "promotion" (the ad/alerts I got about them used to include a "end of availability" date, though that kept being pushed farther and farther out and now no longer appears). So technically it can be withdrawn in the future?

In any case, the OP's initial example was about being shifted to the daily deduction if he didn't have enough funds to renew the recurring plan. He should have received multiple warning SMSes, first about insufficient funds to renew, then another saying that renewal failed, either of which would have allowed him to fix the problem before it cost him money. After that, every day there would be first a warning SMS that more than 10 baht had been charged, then that 49 baht usage had been reached and will be capped there for the rest of the day. I actually can understand what he says he wants as a system (if failure to renew, then cut off internet access on the telco end, and not via his phone). But insofar as you get a warning SMS that there are insufficient funds to renew, then I think the onus is on you from that point on.

[Kalebiran]

Dump dtac and move to AIS . Far better net deals

Surely you need to back up such a comment? When I just checked I notice following - which suggests DTAC comes out a better deal:

Monthly:

DTAC:

199THB/month unlimited 1GB at 4G speed. Activation *104*26*9#

vs

AIS:

199THB/month unlimited 300MB at 4G speed. Activation *777*984#

Daily:

DTAC:

19THB/day unlimited 100MB at 4G speed then 384kbps. Activation *104*391*9#

AIS:

49THB/day unlimited 384kbps speed. Activation *777*722#

Granted the daily DTAC 100MB daily allowance for 4G speeds seems superfluous as it will be gone in a few minutes and enough to annoy anyone, but at least it is better than the AIS option?

AIS 99 baht a week unlimited 3G pre pay or 299baht a month 100 free talk mins and unlimited internet, 750mbs at 3G

[Digitalbanana]

Dump dtac and move to AIS . Far better net deals

Surely you need to back up such a comment? When I just checked I notice following - which suggests DTAC comes out a better deal:

Monthly:

DTAC:

199THB/month unlimited 1GB at 4G speed. Activation *104*26*9#

vs

AIS:

199THB/month unlimited 300MB at 4G speed. Activation *777*984#

Daily:

DTAC:

19THB/day unlimited 100MB at 4G speed then 384kbps. Activation *104*391*9#

AIS:

49THB/day unlimited 384kbps speed. Activation *777*722#

Granted the daily DTAC 100MB daily allowance for 4G speeds seems superfluous as it will be gone in a few minutes and enough to annoy anyone, but at least it is better than the AIS option?

AIS 99 baht a week unlimited 3G pre pay or 299baht a month 100 free talk mins and unlimited internet, 750mbs at 3G

DTAC is 79THB/week and 199/month so "Far better net deals" remains a mystery to me.