Thai Nominee Shareholding Crackdown in Pattaya announced by DSI

[bertty]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You think any of those companies have been set up illegally ?

Thailand is going after the bent companies which it has every right to do, not those that comply with the law.

I doubt Toyota sat in some back street lawyer office and agreed when told 'that's how we do it here, 20,000 baht and it's all sorted'

I just hope that many of those that wanted the ED VISA people out of the country 'because we don't want your sort here' are caught up in this and lose millions.

Sour grapes ? no I believe it's called karma.

Wonderful.

[smedly]

Is this really going to go as far as confiscating property bought using this method, if so it has huge implications for many

I believe it will. It's the main reason I kept my money safe and just rent a property here. Xenophobia is alive and well, this announcement just confirms it. In addition to business ownership there is nothing more that Thais dislike then foreigners owning land.

At the end of the day the activity of business ownership and land ownership has been abused for years. How many companies are there out there set up by solicitors with fictitious Thai employees to fill the quota and also companies set up with minimal (if any) trading purely so the house can be put in a company name? I suspect a lot of them, but it is a loophole and if people decided to do this it was always a risk.

I hope it blows over and everything works out or it could be a very real problem for many foreign people living here. This will not help anybody, including the Thai economy as investors will run scared. Not because they are doing anything illegal necessarily but simply because you just don't know what will be decided next. I can also imagine it will have an effect on property pricing as people look to sell and pull out their cash.

All pretty horrible really.

I'm sure I have read many many times foreigners are not allowed to own land. If it's against the law then I'm sure they wouldn't be very happy about it at all.

Funny thing is we all knew this would happen.

First all the people laughed about the student visa boy's and girl's, well now looks like their turn to laugh.

They may have lost 20-30,000 baht. This will cost some people millions. But hey like you said when laughing at the ED visa's you knew it wasn't legal !!!!

Karma maybe.

I see a lot of young Thai ladies getting rich very quick as they suddenly become the owners of many businesses around the city of Pattaya and within months ditch their foolish newly acquired boyfriends/husbands and leave them fighting unwinnable lengthy battles in court that will outlive them

[bertty]

Well thats about every dive center on every island in the shit and going under.. i think there trying to persuade us to get out of town.

Isnt that the idea of a dive center ?

[bertty]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You think any of those companies have been set up illegally ?

Thailand is going after the bent companies which it has every right to do, not those that comply with the law.

I doubt Toyota sat in some back street lawyer office and agreed when told 'that's how we do it here, 20,000 baht and it's all sorted'

I just hope that many of those that wanted the ED VISA people out of the country 'because we don't want your sort here' are caught up in this and lose millions.

Sour grapes ? no I believe it's called karma.

Wonderful.

it must really suck to be you.

No not really. Just nice to see those that broke the law because they thought they were above the law realize they are not.

What was it the great Lord Python said ??? .. Do not judge other unless you want to be judged yourself ...

Something along those lines.

[Japhrodisiac]

Typical of everything in Thailand, this is a problem created by Thais by not understanding how to analyze and simplify things, and to align themselves with how things are done elsewhere.

The Thai nominee issue is also a problem for Thais, as previously, they had to have a minimum of 7 shareholders (changed a few years back to 4). Who wants to have a company where you sign up people who have no financial interest in the company just to satisfy some government regulation that makes no sense?

If this is really a backdoor way of addressing the land ownership issue, and likely that is what they are really after, then these solutions I propose are also simple :

- Make all land in Thailand of 2 types of title, Chanote that can be owned, and Crown Land/State land that can not. Thailand now has something like 13 different types of titles, it's a total mess

- By law all Chanote land has legal access to it, and access of utilities. No one can hold you hostage for ridiculous fees, this is simple and written in law.

- Foreigners can own a condo, or lease land.

- Leases to be increased to world standards from 30yrs maximum to 90 or 99 years as elsewhere.

- The end

Thailand desperately needs to end the thinking that to solve one problem, you simply create 3 or 4 new problems.

[Briggsy]

I speculate one of the driving factors behind this as Thailand joining a long list of countries that have put the squeeze on "hot" Russian money trying to find a home. They will find no lack of support and enthusiasm for such a move from Western governments.

[sgtsabai]

I think this is a long slippery slope. What's next, house in your wife's name but she doesn't have a job? No proof of her ability to purchase the house, hmmmm. You paid for it farang. Close many of the bars, turn Pattaya etc. into an area for baptist family church camp, yea certainly seems in the works and screw you do-gooders that think that's great, crawl back in your troglodyte hole. For many of those cheering on these "reforms" be careful what you wish for, it can and will come back to bite you in the ass. How did that go, something like first they came for.......

[JesseFrank]

First if it is not a real company operating and generating revenue and taxes, then it's purpose should be questioned.

If they are not ready to share the money then they should go back home.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Good luck with that

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/Voting-rights-in-spotlight-30018611.html

Voting rights in spotlight

Voting rights might be among the areas to be revised in the Foreign Business Act as part of an effort to stem loopholes arising from the nominee problem, Sakol Harnsuthiwarin, secretary to the commerce minister, said yesterday.

Speaking at a seminar titled "Nominee Problem in the Foreign Business Act BE 2542: Policies Related to Surveillance and Impact", he said voting rights that allow minority shareholders higher entitlements than majority shareholders were unfair.

"Any change in the law should have regard to both law enforcement and investment," he said.

The dean of the Faculty of Law at Chulalongkorn University, Asst Professor Tithiphan Chuerboonchai, gave the example of the rights of Thai investors who are major shareholders in Kularb Kaew being inferior to those of foreign investors, who are actually minor shareholders.

Cypress Holdings, in which Singapore's Temasek Holdings is the major shareholder, owns common shares with a 49-per-cent stake, while Thai investors hold preferred shares representing a 51-per-cent stake in Kularb Kaew. Kularb Kaew is a major shareholder in Cedar Holdings and a firm set up to buy out Shin Corp from ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's family.

Cedar Holdings holds 54.43 per cent of Shin while Aspen Holdings, another indirect unit of Temasek Holdings, owns 41.76 per cent.

He cited these limitations: Thai investors' returns from investing in Cedar Holdings are restricted to 3 per cent per annum; their preferred shares are not saleable, transferable or cannot create obligations without approval from Kularb Kaew's board; and Thai investors' voting rights are limited to 9.43 per cent, while Cypress Holdings makes up the rest.

Even though the structure of Kularb Kaew does not violate Article 4 of the Foreign Business Act, it appears that Thai investors have been set up as nominees to avoid the 49-per-cent shareholding restriction if these issues are considered, Tithiphan said.

[Furryman]

I guess the Powers That Be have decided these sorts of foreigners are not the 'right' kind of people for Thailand.

[Furryman]

Me I got an ED VISA thanks for asking. I also got rather peeved about people pointing out 99.95% of ED VISA are abusing the system, by people that are abusing the system. So do tell me why I should have any sympathy for people who are breaking the law ?

Yes indeed, the shoe is on the other foot now I guess.

[veleron]

Let the purge begin... It will be ugly

[thurien]

I feel sorry for the foreigner using Thai Nominee Shareholding ..., but they know it was illegal in the beginning

why should one feel sorry for somebody losing everything to his own farang greed?

[IAMSOBAD]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You do know that Pizza Company is owned by the Minor Food Group which is owned by a Thai person don't you.

Maybe you should educate yourself before posting next.

I happen to be a shareholder in Minor Food Group and know who the real owner is. And so does everyone else. An American who became a Thai through connections and who his partners are. I cannot mention names here.

[Tatsujin]

First if it is not a real company operating and generating revenue and taxes, then it's purpose should be questioned.

If they are not ready to share the money then they should go back home.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Good luck with that

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/Voting-rights-in-spotlight-30018611.html

Voting rights in spotlight

Voting rights might be among the areas to be revised in the Foreign Business Act as part of an effort to stem loopholes arising from the nominee problem, Sakol Harnsuthiwarin, secretary to the commerce minister, said yesterday.

Speaking at a seminar titled "Nominee Problem in the Foreign Business Act BE 2542: Policies Related to Surveillance and Impact", he said voting rights that allow minority shareholders higher entitlements than majority shareholders were unfair.

"Any change in the law should have regard to both law enforcement and investment," he said.

The dean of the Faculty of Law at Chulalongkorn University, Asst Professor Tithiphan Chuerboonchai, gave the example of the rights of Thai investors who are major shareholders in Kularb Kaew being inferior to those of foreign investors, who are actually minor shareholders.

Cypress Holdings, in which Singapore's Temasek Holdings is the major shareholder, owns common shares with a 49-per-cent stake, while Thai investors hold preferred shares representing a 51-per-cent stake in Kularb Kaew. Kularb Kaew is a major shareholder in Cedar Holdings and a firm set up to buy out Shin Corp from ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's family.

Cedar Holdings holds 54.43 per cent of Shin while Aspen Holdings, another indirect unit of Temasek Holdings, owns 41.76 per cent.

He cited these limitations: Thai investors' returns from investing in Cedar Holdings are restricted to 3 per cent per annum; their preferred shares are not saleable, transferable or cannot create obligations without approval from Kularb Kaew's board; and Thai investors' voting rights are limited to 9.43 per cent, while Cypress Holdings makes up the rest.

Even though the structure of Kularb Kaew does not violate Article 4 of the Foreign Business Act, it appears that Thai investors have been set up as nominees to avoid the 49-per-cent shareholding restriction if these issues are considered, Tithiphan said.

That was from 2006, has the law actually been altered since then? If not then it's still perfectly legal to have majority/minority voting rights.

[JesseFrank]

Is this really going to go as far as confiscating property bought using this method, if so it has huge implications for many

what part of

Foreign business operators

is it you don't understand?

Isn't every foreigner who made himself director of the company ltd that owns his house a foreign business operator?

[MeowBundit]

Perfect. Then, abusers of BOI licenses next.

[Benmart]

How dare these nasty foreigners dare to contribute to the Thai economy!!!

I agree, specifically the point of contributing to the Thai economy. However, as in my home country, compliance with the law is one way to avoid problems further down the road.

[JesseFrank]

First if it is not a real company operating and generating revenue and taxes, then it's purpose should be questioned.

If they are not ready to share the money then they should go back home.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Control can be retained with preference shares.

Good luck with that

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/Voting-rights-in-spotlight-30018611.html

Voting rights in spotlight

Voting rights might be among the areas to be revised in the Foreign Business Act as part of an effort to stem loopholes arising from the nominee problem, Sakol Harnsuthiwarin, secretary to the commerce minister, said yesterday.

Speaking at a seminar titled "Nominee Problem in the Foreign Business Act BE 2542: Policies Related to Surveillance and Impact", he said voting rights that allow minority shareholders higher entitlements than majority shareholders were unfair.

"Any change in the law should have regard to both law enforcement and investment," he said.

The dean of the Faculty of Law at Chulalongkorn University, Asst Professor Tithiphan Chuerboonchai, gave the example of the rights of Thai investors who are major shareholders in Kularb Kaew being inferior to those of foreign investors, who are actually minor shareholders.

Cypress Holdings, in which Singapore's Temasek Holdings is the major shareholder, owns common shares with a 49-per-cent stake, while Thai investors hold preferred shares representing a 51-per-cent stake in Kularb Kaew. Kularb Kaew is a major shareholder in Cedar Holdings and a firm set up to buy out Shin Corp from ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's family.

Cedar Holdings holds 54.43 per cent of Shin while Aspen Holdings, another indirect unit of Temasek Holdings, owns 41.76 per cent.

He cited these limitations: Thai investors' returns from investing in Cedar Holdings are restricted to 3 per cent per annum; their preferred shares are not saleable, transferable or cannot create obligations without approval from Kularb Kaew's board; and Thai investors' voting rights are limited to 9.43 per cent, while Cypress Holdings makes up the rest.

Even though the structure of Kularb Kaew does not violate Article 4 of the Foreign Business Act, it appears that Thai investors have been set up as nominees to avoid the 49-per-cent shareholding restriction if these issues are considered, Tithiphan said.

That was from 2006, has the law actually been altered since then? If not then it's still perfectly legal to have majority/minority voting rights.

The law hasn't been altered since as far as I'm aware, but even yesterday people were shouting from high towers that there NEVER would be a crack down on nominee shareholding companies.

With the current people in power the law can be altered to that effect by this afternoon

[fxe1200]

'til the last farrang turns off the light...

..good idea. Anyhow, nobody is forced to live here, or do business. There are other countries with by far better opportunities and laws.

[smedly]

Funny I had a conversation with a falang friend of mine that is currently in the process of divorce from his Thai wife, he bought land and property that was in her name

Unusually she was willing to do a transfer over to him of some of the assets, I asked him how he was going to achieve this and guess what......yes you guessed it lol

I cautioned him that he could be in trouble going this route as it's not strictly legal, he denied this claiming his Thai layer told him it was all above board, not wanting to get into an argument over it I just told him to check it out and that I had made him aware of a possible issue going forward, so it was left at that, I told him to get a 2nd opinion and be very careful with layers here.

[Benmart]

In the days long past, I disobeyed many of the laws back home. I created many problems in doing so. I've since learned to obey the laws and it's been smooth sailing since then.

Thai laws are no different. I may not agree with them, but I obey them none-the-less.

"I can justify my defiance all the way to prison".

[KittenKong]

You do know that Pizza Company is owned by the Minor Food Group which is owned by a Thai person don't you.

Bill Heinecke may have "Thailand" stamped on the front of his passport but he still doesnt look very Thai to me.

[kannot]

Now those xenophobic true colors are shining through . . . let's protect Thailand from the nasty corrupt foreigners even more, cos heaven forbid we can't have a level playing field here . . .

they cant play anyway...................

[camo007]

Under BOI people like me have 100% western owned investment company with no Thai Nationals. Its 100% legal and includes special benefits such as Work Permits. So legal options do exist!

[loppylugs1]

I cannot stand this any longer,the heartache ,the suicides,the utter horror of losing everything.

i am past caring I just want out of Thailand

[kimamey]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

I think Toyota, Honda ect are different as they are authorised by the Board of Investment. Many of the others are franchises which are owned by Thai companies including Minor Food Group. I think they operate Swensens, Dairy Queen and Pizza Company amongst others. Those 3 are a real threat to my waistline.

[Maestro]

Removed a baiting post.

[Spoonman]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You do know that Pizza Company is owned by the Minor Food Group which is owned by a Thai person don't you.

Maybe you should educate yourself before posting next.

I happen to be a shareholder in Minor Food Group and know who the real owner is. And so does everyone else. An American who became a Thai through connections and who his partners are. I cannot mention names here.

Thankyou for confirming the owner is Thai.

[Tony125]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You do know that Pizza Company is owned by the Minor Food Group which is owned by a Thai person don't you.

Maybe you should educate yourself before posting next.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/suzynam/2013/05/16/bill-heinecke-billionaire/

The "Thai" person who owns Minor Food Group and The Pizza Company is William Heinecke a US Born citizen who later gave up his US Citizenship in 1991 and became a Thai Citizen.

[Spoonman]

Shoot themselves in the foot because of silly childish laws.

I hope TOYOTA and HONDA and PIZZA COMPANY and every foreign company slam the door and move on.

SAVE FACE LOSE MONEY new Thai slogan.

You do know that Pizza Company is owned by the Minor Food Group which is owned by a Thai person don't you.

Maybe you should educate yourself before posting next.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/suzynam/2013/05/16/bill-heinecke-billionaire/

The "Thai" person who owns Minor Food Group and The Pizza Company is William Heinecke a US Born citizen who later gave up his US Citizenship in 1991 and became a Thai Citizen.

Is a Thai citizen not Thai these days ?