Thailand beach murders: Police defend bizarre public 'reconstruction' of slayings by suspects

[phuketandsee]

The are always vile disgusting shows that do nothing for the pursuit of justice.

Unfortunately, the police thought yesterday's show was a display of wonderful abilities and don't even realize how it makes everyone else want to vomit.

Actually crime scene reenactments are normal in murder cases even in first world countries but they are usually done via computer. They are important in most cases to show how the crime was committed and to show it was plausible or not depending on whose side put together the computer reenactment. Having the suspects actually do the reenactment is more valuable than a computer reenactment both in terms of accuracy as well as truth but certainly more insensitive to loved ones.

Don't these use actors though, not suspects? And aren't they mostly used to jog potential witness's memories?

[JohnThailandJohn]

The are always vile disgusting shows that do nothing for the pursuit of justice.

Unfortunately, the police thought yesterday's show was a display of wonderful abilities and don't even realize how it makes everyone else want to vomit.

Actually crime scene reenactments are normal in murder cases even in first world countries but they are usually done via computer. They are important in most cases to show how the crime was committed and to show it was plausible or not depending on whose side put together the computer reenactment. Having the suspects actually do the reenactment is more valuable than a computer reenactment both in terms of accuracy as well as truth but certainly more insensitive to loved ones.

Don't these use actors though, not suspects? And aren't they mostly used to jog potential witness's memories?

No. http://www.ehow.com/info_8138722_crime-scene-reenactments-courtrooms.html or https://www.google.com/search?q=why+crime+scene+reenactments&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS582US582&oq=why+crime+scene+reenactments&aqs=chrome..69i57.15600j0j4&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=122&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=why+have+crime+scene+reenactments

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[loonodingle]

(1) The vests & helmets were unnecessary. There was no animosity in the crowd as it is universally understood among the people of Koh Tao that these poor kids are scapegoats. The locals know exactly who committed the crime.

(2) The two poor Cambodians had to be "walked through" the re-enactment: Shown where to walk, where to point, how to swing the weapon -- because they quite obviously had no understanding of the crime scene.

These two factors are widely discussed in Thai blogs. The people aren't stupid.

I understand they are Burmese. But your observations on the enactment (a re-enactment implies they had done it before) are spot on.

Many local and international reporters actually there at the reenactment as well as foreigners taking part in the reenactment and not one has made such a comment as far as I can see. Numerous have stated it was a spectacle and something in their mind strange to do but none have said they needed to be directed how to do what in front of the hundreds of onlookers. But lets go to facebook to check the facts off of what they interpret from video snippets, likely without sound, of the reenactment.

Do you not see the illogical things you are desperately latching onto to not accept the overwhelming evidence against these guys?

An absolute independent review by the UK Police of the basics. DNA Hair Phone etc would get a swift confirmation.

Lets face it if you was innocent you would volunteer wouldn't you. As long as you trusted the team doing the investigations.

Think of the credence a UK police forces confirmation of the results and evidence would bring to this whole sad saga. If these 2 are the bad guys then its a double whammy!!

RTP are correct and backed by UK police results.

Tourists would be flocking to the island without any fear.

The Thais should DNA and finger print all workers on the island and keep records.

This would instil such confidence among all tourists and their family's who now worry their selves sick.

Of course only someone with something to hide would reject this idea I guess.!!!!!!!!

[englishoak]

(1) The vests & helmets were unnecessary. There was no animosity in the crowd as it is universally understood among the people of Koh Tao that these poor kids are scapegoats. The locals know exactly who committed the crime.

(2) The two poor Cambodians had to be "walked through" the re-enactment: Shown where to walk, where to point, how to swing the weapon -- because they quite obviously had no understanding of the crime scene.

These two factors are widely discussed in Thai blogs. The people aren't stupid.

I understand they are Burmese. But your observations on the enactment (a re-enactment implies they had done it before) are spot on.

Many local and international reporters actually there at the reenactment as well as foreigners taking part in the reenactment and not one has made such a comment as far as I can see. Numerous have stated it was a spectacle and something in their mind strange to do but none have said they needed to be directed how to do what in front of the hundreds of onlookers. But lets go to facebook to check the facts off of what they interpret from video snippets, likely without sound, of the reenactment.

Do you not see the illogical things you are desperately latching onto to not accept the overwhelming evidence against these guys?

Sorry to burst your bubble but it wouldnt even go to court in most counties as it stands, defence would have a field day if it did and case thrown out.

No lawyer for a start, what rights do they even know they have ?

Overwhelming evidence ? without DNA you mean circumstantial at best and until an outside independent source free of corruption confirms the DNA match 100% itll stay that way.

[moodymoo]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

The are always vile disgusting shows that do nothing for the pursuit of justice.

Unfortunately, the police thought yesterday's show was a display of wonderful abilities and don't even realize how it makes everyone else want to vomit.

Actually crime scene reenactments are normal in murder cases even in first world countries but they are usually done via computer. They are important in most cases to show how the crime was committed and to show it was plausible or not depending on whose side put together the computer reenactment. Having the suspects actually do the reenactment is more valuable than a computer reenactment both in terms of accuracy as well as truth but certainly more insensitive to loved ones.

Don't these use actors though, not suspects? And aren't they mostly used to jog potential witness's memories?

No. When I lived in Indonesia I got burgled and when the police caught the guys they brought them over to my house for a reenactment.

[JohnThailandJohn]

(1) The vests & helmets were unnecessary. There was no animosity in the crowd as it is universally understood among the people of Koh Tao that these poor kids are scapegoats. The locals know exactly who committed the crime.

(2) The two poor Cambodians had to be "walked through" the re-enactment: Shown where to walk, where to point, how to swing the weapon -- because they quite obviously had no understanding of the crime scene.

These two factors are widely discussed in Thai blogs. The people aren't stupid.

I understand they are Burmese. But your observations on the enactment (a re-enactment implies they had done it before) are spot on.

Many local and international reporters actually there at the reenactment as well as foreigners taking part in the reenactment and not one has made such a comment as far as I can see. Numerous have stated it was a spectacle and something in their mind strange to do but none have said they needed to be directed how to do what in front of the hundreds of onlookers. But lets go to facebook to check the facts off of what they interpret from video snippets, likely without sound, of the reenactment.

Do you not see the illogical things you are desperately latching onto to not accept the overwhelming evidence against these guys?

An absolute independent review by the UK Police of the basics. DNA Hair Phone etc would get a swift confirmation.

Lets face it if you was innocent you would volunteer wouldn't you. As long as you trusted the team doing the investigations.

Think of the credence a UK police forces confirmation of the results and evidence would bring to this whole sad saga. If these 2 are the bad guys then its a double whammy!!

RTP are correct and backed by UK police results.

Tourists would be flocking to the island without any fear.

The Thais should DNA and finger print all workers on the island and keep records.

This would instil such confidence among all tourists and their family's who now worry their selves sick.

Of course only someone with something to hide would reject this idea I guess.!!!!!!!!

Tourists will be back regardless. People mainly avoiding the area now because of all the police presence and news. Just because a murder, even gruesome, doesn't stop the vast majority of people from going to a place. A serial killer yes but a single incident, no. Memories are short and news cycles even shorter. Regardless if this murder was committed by a Thai, illegal or another Farang Tourist doesn't matter to most tourists because for one it happened in Thailand doesn;t matter who did it but the other is most people don't see the news like many here on Thaivisa as every incident being representative an entire group. They don;t read a story (or numerous one) in the UK about a Britt thug and then tell themselves all Brits are thugs.

Even if they never caught the culprits this would blow over. But since they did it will blow over faster.

Personally I don;t believe in knee jerk reactions every time something happens and if you want to fingerprint and DNA everyone then include everyone including tourists. Just because a couple migrant workers did this, doesn;t mean they are all should be treated as if they are potential rapists and murderers. Numerous Farangs have been arrested for murder in Thailand and don;t believe all of them should be treated as potential suspects for a crime that hasn;t even happened yet.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[Friendly Stranger]

Don't know much other than what has been reported but a poster has made some interesting points as to why them now and not before (worked same bar?)

If they're scape goats then I guess nothing has changed even with the new government.

There is something wrong when you can't trust the authorities. Those so called powerful families on these islands can keep it as many will give it a pass and rightfully so.

[JohnThailandJohn]

all you can comment is Thailand is bad....how pathetic....nowhere is perfect but Thailand is better than your equally corrupt countries and has lots more class and beauty

My country they have just legalized corruption on grand scales so we are not corrupted. People in general are good all over but I have a special love for the general Thai and culture of trying to be happy. So many have such crappy lives and although they are aware life is tough, they spend their time trying to see the good and enjoying life, not whining.

Yes such a beautiful country so full of beauty and chaos too and a place that has yet to become a police state and where people have to be responsible for themselves instead of government forcing what they say is right and safe for them. It has changed a losing this but still better than my home country in this respect.

I just couldn;t imagine moving to a country that I felt a constant need to complain about. Again, letting some Thai rub off on you is a good thing in the sense of simply trying to see good and enjoy life despite its hardships and imperfections.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[sabaii69]

Disgusting frame up.

BTW those aren't jackets, they are vests. They look like level IIIA (iiiA, pronounced "3A") and they won't stop a rifle bullet or the bigger handgun rounds.

LEVEL IIIA

pik,pik. Who cares what the actors are wearing. (they are all actors)

[JohnThailandJohn]

(1) The vests & helmets were unnecessary. There was no animosity in the crowd as it is universally understood among the people of Koh Tao that these poor kids are scapegoats. The locals know exactly who committed the crime.

(2) The two poor Cambodians had to be "walked through" the re-enactment: Shown where to walk, where to point, how to swing the weapon -- because they quite obviously had no understanding of the crime scene.

These two factors are widely discussed in Thai blogs. The people aren't stupid.

I understand they are Burmese. But your observations on the enactment (a re-enactment implies they had done it before) are spot on.

Many local and international reporters actually there at the reenactment as well as foreigners taking part in the reenactment and not one has made such a comment as far as I can see. Numerous have stated it was a spectacle and something in their mind strange to do but none have said they needed to be directed how to do what in front of the hundreds of onlookers. But lets go to facebook to check the facts off of what they interpret from video snippets, likely without sound, of the reenactment.

Do you not see the illogical things you are desperately latching onto to not accept the overwhelming evidence against these guys?

Sorry to burst your bubble but it wouldnt even go to court in most counties as it stands, defence would have a field day if it did and case thrown out.

No lawyer for a start, what rights do they even know they have ?

Overwhelming evidence ? without DNA you mean circumstantial at best and until an outside independent source free of corruption confirms the DNA match 100% itll stay that way.

Friend of suspects is a witness

Witnesses reporting them near crime scene at time

Confessions

Reenactment

Phone of one of the victims found at suspects place (not the same phone police collected and showed day of or after murders)

Video of them around the time

Their DNA matching semen at scene

And MANY confessions are got without lawyers in the US (most of them). Not sure where your comments come from that it would never go to court but kind of matches with the random bizzare and desperate comments of those who cannot let got of the fact it is not a rich thai kid despite no actual evidence.

They had probable cause to question these two and they admitted it and unless they took DNA by force then this case would without a doubt be viable in the US.

Do I think police questioned them perfectly or afforded them every legal right, probably not but I do believe they got the right guys and the DNA pretty much confirms this unless you think they maybe were beating off nearby and a big gust of wind deposited their semen in the victim.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[loonodingle]

An absolute independent review by the UK Police of the basics. DNA Hair Phone etc would get a swift confirmation.

Lets face it if you was innocent you would volunteer wouldn't you. As long as you trusted the team doing the investigations.

Think of the credence a UK police forces confirmation of the results and evidence would bring to this whole sad saga. If these 2 are the bad guys then its a double whammy!!

RTP are correct and backed by UK police results.

Tourists would be flocking to the island without any fear.

The Thais should DNA and finger print all workers on the island and keep records.

This would instil such confidence among all tourists and their family's who now worry their selves sick.

Of course only someone with something to hide would reject this idea I guess.!!!!!!!!

Tourists will be back regardless. People mainly avoiding the area now because of all the police presence. Just because a murder, even gruesome, doesn't stop the vast majority of people from going to a place. A serial killer yes but a single incident, no. Memories are short and news cycles even shorter. Regardless if this murder was committed by a Thai, illegal or another Farang Tourist doesn't matter to most tourists because for one it happened in Thailand doesn;t matter who did it but the other is most people don't see the news like many here on Thaivisa as every incident being representative an entire group. They don;t read a story (or numerous one) in the UK about a Britt thug and then tell themselves all Brits are thugs.

Even if they never caught the culprits this would blow over. But since they did it will blow over faster.

Personally I don;t believe in knee jerk reactions every time something happens and if you want to fingerprint and DNA everyone then include everyone including tourists. Just because a couple migrant workers did this, doesn;t mean they are all should be treated as if they are potential rapists and murderers. Numerous Farangs have been arrested for murder in Thailand and don;t believe all of them should be treated as potential suspects for a crime that hasn;t even happened yet.

OH Dear John,

To much don't care, and it doesn't matter from u. It matters to the parents. The friends and family of the victims. I guess you have no offspring. Perhaps you cant imagine what those parents are going through on a daily/nightly basis.

You also obviously don't realise that every Thai who settles in the UK gets a Full Biometric check. You do not enter the UK without having this done. Even children.

So having the same for migrant workers in Thailand seems an excellent idea IMHO.

Most 1st world country's already do this. Its not racist its just common sense.

I came to Thailand 20 odd years ago. What a place. Wonderful.... Times have moved on now. getting the basics right is for the benefit of the whole population. Its not bashing its protecting them, their income their way of life.

Evil is all over the world and we all rely on the police etc to protect us. If there's any doubt in the ability of the law to protect us then what's wrong with safeguards?

[JohnThailandJohn]

An absolute independent review by the UK Police of the basics. DNA Hair Phone etc would get a swift confirmation.

Lets face it if you was innocent you would volunteer wouldn't you. As long as you trusted the team doing the investigations.

Think of the credence a UK police forces confirmation of the results and evidence would bring to this whole sad saga. If these 2 are the bad guys then its a double whammy!!

RTP are correct and backed by UK police results.

Tourists would be flocking to the island without any fear.

The Thais should DNA and finger print all workers on the island and keep records.

This would instil such confidence among all tourists and their family's who now worry their selves sick.

Of course only someone with something to hide would reject this idea I guess.!!!!!!!!

Tourists will be back regardless. People mainly avoiding the area now because of all the police presence. Just because a murder, even gruesome, doesn't stop the vast majority of people from going to a place. A serial killer yes but a single incident, no. Memories are short and news cycles even shorter. Regardless if this murder was committed by a Thai, illegal or another Farang Tourist doesn't matter to most tourists because for one it happened in Thailand doesn;t matter who did it but the other is most people don't see the news like many here on Thaivisa as every incident being representative an entire group. They don;t read a story (or numerous one) in the UK about a Britt thug and then tell themselves all Brits are thugs.

Even if they never caught the culprits this would blow over. But since they did it will blow over faster.

Personally I don;t believe in knee jerk reactions every time something happens and if you want to fingerprint and DNA everyone then include everyone including tourists. Just because a couple migrant workers did this, doesn;t mean they are all should be treated as if they are potential rapists and murderers. Numerous Farangs have been arrested for murder in Thailand and don;t believe all of them should be treated as potential suspects for a crime that hasn;t even happened yet.

OH Dear John,

To much don't care, and it doesn't matter from u. It matters to the parents. The friends and family of the victims. I guess you have no offspring. Perhaps you cant imagine what those parents are going through on a daily/nightly basis.

You also obviously don't realise that every Thai who settles in the UK gets a Full Biometric check. You do not enter the UK without having this done. Even children.

So having the same for migrant workers in Thailand seems an excellent idea IMHO.

Most 1st world country's already do this. Its not racist its just common sense.

I came to Thailand 20 odd years ago. What a place. Wonderful.... Times have moved on now. getting the basics right is for the benefit of the whole population. Its not bashing its protecting them, their income their way of life.

Evil is all over the world and we all rely on the police etc to protect us. If there's any doubt in the ability of the law to protect us then what's wrong with safeguards?

So, in the US and UK you think they get DNA and Fingerprints from all illegal workers?

And the question was not about entering Thailand but rather this island. Nor was it about family and friends but about tourism.

And never did I say I don;t care or it doesn;t matter these folks were killed. But the reality is it will blow over when it comes to tourism.

Pretty much everything you are responding to are things you want to believe were said but not said in the post you;re responding. A lot of this going on with facts (as reported) about this case.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[Patsycat]

I don't know if anything can be done any longer but I urge any one of you here to do your bit and sign the petition.

https://www.change.org/p/the-government-of-the-united-kingdom-independently-investigate-the-horrific-murders-of-hannah-witheridge-and-david-miller

Tried to sign it and it didn't work. I wonder how many others it didn't work for

7,600 signatures, i put mine in when it was about 400.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Patsycat

[loonodingle]

An absolute independent review by the UK Police of the basics. DNA Hair Phone etc would get a swift confirmation.

Lets face it if you was innocent you would volunteer wouldn't you. As long as you trusted the team doing the investigations.

Think of the credence a UK police forces confirmation of the results and evidence would bring to this whole sad saga. If these 2 are the bad guys then its a double whammy!!

RTP are correct and backed by UK police results.

Tourists would be flocking to the island without any fear.

The Thais should DNA and finger print all workers on the island and keep records.

This would instil such confidence among all tourists and their family's who now worry their selves sick.

Of course only someone with something to hide would reject this idea I guess.!!!!!!!!

Tourists will be back regardless. People mainly avoiding the area now because of all the police presence. Just because a murder, even gruesome, doesn't stop the vast majority of people from going to a place. A serial killer yes but a single incident, no. Memories are short and news cycles even shorter. Regardless if this murder was committed by a Thai, illegal or another Farang Tourist doesn't matter to most tourists because for one it happened in Thailand doesn;t matter who did it but the other is most people don't see the news like many here on Thaivisa as every incident being representative an entire group. They don;t read a story (or numerous one) in the UK about a Britt thug and then tell themselves all Brits are thugs.

Even if they never caught the culprits this would blow over. But since they did it will blow over faster.

Personally I don;t believe in knee jerk reactions every time something happens and if you want to fingerprint and DNA everyone then include everyone including tourists. Just because a couple migrant workers did this, doesn;t mean they are all should be treated as if they are potential rapists and murderers. Numerous Farangs have been arrested for murder in Thailand and don;t believe all of them should be treated as potential suspects for a crime that hasn;t even happened yet.

OH Dear John,

To much don't care, and it doesn't matter from u. It matters to the parents. The friends and family of the victims. I guess you have no offspring. Perhaps you cant imagine what those parents are going through on a daily/nightly basis.

You also obviously don't realise that every Thai who settles in the UK gets a Full Biometric check. You do not enter the UK without having this done. Even children.

So having the same for migrant workers in Thailand seems an excellent idea IMHO.

Most 1st world country's already do this. Its not racist its just common sense.

I came to Thailand 20 odd years ago. What a place. Wonderful.... Times have moved on now. getting the basics right is for the benefit of the whole population. Its not bashing its protecting them, their income their way of life.

Evil is all over the world and we all rely on the police etc to protect us. If there's any doubt in the ability of the law to protect us then what's wrong with safeguards?

So, in the US and UK you think they get DNA and Fingerprints from all illegals?

And the question was not about entering Thailand but rather this island.

And never did I say I don;t care or it doesn;t matter.

Pretty much everything you are responding to are things you want to believe were said but not said in the post you;re responding.

Migrant workers have to provide complete hand prints. Iris recognition was also a requirement but I believe its been shelved. All dna is stored for many years if it is ever taken. In the UK.

Lets be honest, if you have nothing to hide then what's the problem.

[JohnThailandJohn]

OH Dear John,

To much don't care, and it doesn't matter from u. It matters to the parents. The friends and family of the victims. I guess you have no offspring. Perhaps you cant imagine what those parents are going through on a daily/nightly basis.

You also obviously don't realise that every Thai who settles in the UK gets a Full Biometric check. You do not enter the UK without having this done. Even children.

So having the same for migrant workers in Thailand seems an excellent idea IMHO.

Most 1st world country's already do this. Its not racist its just common sense.

I came to Thailand 20 odd years ago. What a place. Wonderful.... Times have moved on now. getting the basics right is for the benefit of the whole population. Its not bashing its protecting them, their income their way of life.

Evil is all over the world and we all rely on the police etc to protect us. If there's any doubt in the ability of the law to protect us then what's wrong with safeguards?

So, in the US and UK you think they get DNA and Fingerprints from all illegals?

And the question was not about entering Thailand but rather this island.

And never did I say I don;t care or it doesn;t matter.

Pretty much everything you are responding to are things you want to believe were said but not said in the post you;re responding.

Migrant workers have to provide complete hand prints. Iris recognition was also a requirement but I believe its been shelved. All dna is stored for many years if it is ever taken. In the UK.

Lets be honest, if you have nothing to hide then what's the problem.

These are illegals we are talking about. Again, I will ask... So, in the UK you think they get DNA and Fingerprints from all illegals?

As well I doubt the UK has DNA on everyone on file who immigrates or comes their to work or vacation. Biometric information is not DNA.

Again I will also say you are not responding to anything said but rather trying to distract.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[noitom]

This case is another stain on THailand.

[englishoak]

I understand they are Burmese. But your observations on the enactment (a re-enactment implies they had done it before) are spot on.

Many local and international reporters actually there at the reenactment as well as foreigners taking part in the reenactment and not one has made such a comment as far as I can see. Numerous have stated it was a spectacle and something in their mind strange to do but none have said they needed to be directed how to do what in front of the hundreds of onlookers. But lets go to facebook to check the facts off of what they interpret from video snippets, likely without sound, of the reenactment.

Do you not see the illogical things you are desperately latching onto to not accept the overwhelming evidence against these guys?

Sorry to burst your bubble but it wouldnt even go to court in most counties as it stands, defence would have a field day if it did and case thrown out.

No lawyer for a start, what rights do they even know they have ?

Overwhelming evidence ? without DNA you mean circumstantial at best and until an outside independent source free of corruption confirms the DNA match 100% itll stay that way.

Friend of suspects is a witness

Witnesses reporting them near crime scene at time

Confessions

Reenactment

Phone of one of the victims found at suspects place (not the same phone police collected and showed day of or after murders)

Video of them around the time

Their DNA matching semen at scene

And MANY confessions are got without lawyers in the US (most of them). Not sure where your comments come from that it would never go to court but kind of matches with the random bizzare and desperate comments of those who cannot let got of the fact it is not a rich thai kid despite no actual evidence.

They had probable cause to question these two and they admitted it and unless they took DNA by force then this case would without a doubt be viable in the US.

Do I think police questioned them perfectly or afforded them every legal right, probably not but I do believe they got the right guys and the DNA pretty much confirms this unless you think they maybe were beating off nearby and a big gust of wind deposited their semen in the victim.

K first off

Friend of suspect as a witness, witness to what exactly ? see taxi driver asked by police to be a fabricated witness ...

Confessions, under interrogation, no lawyers present, probably forced with torture... they retract them they mean nothing

Re-enactment... have you seen it ? they were virtually shown what to do and show, they always are ... talk about being led by the nose.Re enactments prove absolutely nothing but just a parade for the police to look cool. They are also used to fill in gaps the police wish to add or tidy up ... thats a fact .. how do i know ? my cousin-in-law an ex RTP told me years ago this is normal practise.

Phone how do we know its not the same phone the friend had ? answer ...we dont.

Video of what ? the missing 2 mins of CCTV ? its not surprising bar workers would be around the area now is it ?

A fag butt 50 meters away from scene ? dyed blonde hair that was already black before the murder ? wrong builds from the original estimate... footprints weve hard nothing of since .. cos they dont match obviously...

Finally atm DNA, but only said so by the Thai authorities and no i dont believe anything they say from long time experience here. Look at everything they have said they have denied later. They can say whatever they wish but it dosnt make it true ...

They havnt even charged them yet ... but buried them in the media even the PM has.

Now I dont know how long youve been in LOS but im telling you now nearly every Thai I know is saying the same thing as most here... you dont see that very often ..... yet of course you trust the RTP ... why because you like Thailand ? man you have either not been here long or youve had your head in the sand the whole time. My Thai family all think it stinks, both sides of the pond 90% of my Thai associates including some in gov positions the forces and yes even the RTP think its a stitch up, they all know how it works here, im not even going to bother with the UK contacts I have and the police there that are following it as it comes out... disgusted isnt a strong enough word from them.

Now as much as id like to spend the next 3 pages pointing out and throwing up all the questions and incompetence and contradictions and claims the RTP have been spouting since day 1 I wont, I really cant be bothered wasting time on yet another whos got their head in the clouds because the sun shines and people smile at them.

As to your little attempt at sarcasm son your wasting your time, you mean nothing to me and not worthy

All it needs is the UK forensics team to corroborate, i'll go with that finding .... whats the problem with clearing the name of Thailand over all this disbelief ?

Then theres motive.... the attacks were SO violent and so OTT its more than a whim, show it to a pathologist or head shrink and ask

Its rage killing and very violent and not just sexual arousal .... really cant stress that enough... these murders were one of rage and anger and to show power... .. think im wrong look to murders in countries where theres ethnic violence and rage/revenge killing.. it fits the profile perfectly.

it dosnt fit the profile of a couple of hard working, long time on island poor ( and apparently also polite unassuming ), Burmese illegal immigrants.. it just dosnt. Now im not saying these guys are innocent but I am saying there's serious cause for concern and also growing reason to be concerned they arnt the killers ... with that in mind im not going to hang them out to dry because the RTP say so...

Seems to me there is no benefit in NOT getting the DNA and findings looked at and verified by the UK, after all its their citizens that were butchered.

So whats the problem ? and anyone saying why should Thailand do that ? my reply is simple.... why wouldnt they ??? if they are so proud and certain they are correct theres no cover up or wrong doing dont they ask Scotland yard as was already offered to use their expertise and corroborate the evidence you say is so overwhelming ... it should be no problem doing it...

THEN ill shut up

[noitom]

These two guys are being "railroaded" by the Thai police.

[Theforeigner]

There is now a petition for an independent investigation :- 10000 signatures are needed, still 2,092 NEEDED , it will go to Mark Kent, the UK ambassador to Thailand

Please sign!!!

https://www.change.o....d-miller#share

[phuketandsee]

The are always vile disgusting shows that do nothing for the pursuit of justice.

Unfortunately, the police thought yesterday's show was a display of wonderful abilities and don't even realize how it makes everyone else want to vomit.

Actually crime scene reenactments are normal in murder cases even in first world countries but they are usually done via computer. They are important in most cases to show how the crime was committed and to show it was plausible or not depending on whose side put together the computer reenactment. Having the suspects actually do the reenactment is more valuable than a computer reenactment both in terms of accuracy as well as truth but certainly more insensitive to loved ones.

Don't these use actors though, not suspects? And aren't they mostly used to jog potential witness's memories?

No. http://www.ehow.com/info_8138722_crime-scene-reenactments-courtrooms.html or https://www.google.com/search?q=why+crime+scene+reenactments&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS582US582&oq=why+crime+scene+reenactments&aqs=chrome..69i57.15600j0j4&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=122&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=why+have+crime+scene+reenactments

Your first link makes no mention of the accused participating in a re-enactment. I can't be bothered to search through the google link but I did click on the George Zimmerman re-enactment but he was doing it to demonstrate his innocence - big difference.

And moodymoo - how long has Indonesia been a first world country?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Actually crime scene reenactments are normal in murder cases even in first world countries but they are usually done via computer. They are important in most cases to show how the crime was committed and to show it was plausible or not depending on whose side put together the computer reenactment. Having the suspects actually do the reenactment is more valuable than a computer reenactment both in terms of accuracy as well as truth but certainly more insensitive to loved ones.

Don't these use actors though, not suspects? And aren't they mostly used to jog potential witness's memories?

No. http://www.ehow.com/info_8138722_crime-scene-reenactments-courtrooms.html or https://www.google.com/search?q=why+crime+scene+reenactments&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS582US582&oq=why+crime+scene+reenactments&aqs=chrome..69i57.15600j0j4&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=122&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=why+have+crime+scene+reenactments

Your first link makes no mention of the accused participating in a re-enactment. I can't be bothered to search through the google link but I did click on the George Zimmerman re-enactment but he was doing it to demonstrate his innocence - big difference.

And moodymoo - how long has Indonesia been a first world country?

You asked a general question about reenactments. And I answered you and provided a link directly to further answer your general question about reenactments as well as a general Google Search Link with many explanations for the purpose of reenactments,which you didn't care to look through more. The post I made you originally responded to explains about accused doing reenactments as well the link I provided also mentions witnesses doing reenactments (a witness can be the accused)

Then you respond to another poster who took the time to respond and mention another country where they accused reenacted the crime and you talk about the stage of development of a country. If you don't want an answer to a question then don't ask.

By the way even in first world countries it is not uncommon for police to bring the accused to a scene to reenact if the police are questioning how the crime happened. Difference is it is usually not a public event. The bottom line is yes countries are at different levels in their development and are different when it comes to their laws and procedures but as I originally posted reenactments and recreation of a crime is also common in first world countries but they usually are done with computers or if just a partial reenactment such as how a person was stabbed it may be done by a lawyer, witness, expert of even the accused. Bottom line reenactments are often needed to explain details in a crime as well as helping to gain convictions (mostly) or to defend a suspect. Nothing more powerful for the state to have the accused acting out the crimes they committed themselves but yes, can be insensitive to others when it is a public spectacle as done here.

Edited October 4, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[metisdead]

Inflammatory posts and replies have been removed.

Off topic deflection posts have been removed as well as the replies.

A post containing a link to the gruesome photos at the crime scene has been removed as well as the replies.

Another post linking to Andrew Drummond's site has been removed. Please understand Thai Visa is not employed as a tool to obtain information for Andrew Drummond nor do we use material from his web site.

[ScotBkk]

They made it a show, unknowingly to the dismay of all the world.

But that's how their minds work.

Just get somebody that is not Thai to get rid of these pesky foreigners bothering us to solve the murder.

I am a father also, and I feel deeply for the parents of the girl and the boy and I would never rest till the real murderers are found.

I don't believe a word of what the Thai police is saying.

I too am a father and it's why, within days of the murders, I finally walked out of Thailand. It's a pity all expats don't do the same and show a stand of solidarity that we will not longer support such a regime. For most thought their bar stools are far too comfortable.

Actions people are far more powerful than empty rhetoric.

maybe because for decades the lawlessness of Thailand has attracted the lowest class "expat" scum from all over the Earth to live here.

Are you speaking about people like yourself ??

[phuketandsee]

JTJ,

"By the way even in first world countries it is not uncommon for police to bring the accused to a scene to reenact if the police are questioning how the crime happened. Difference is it is usually not a public event. The bottom line is yes countries are at different levels in their development and are different when it comes to their laws and procedures but as I originally posted reenactments and recreation of a crime is also common in first world countries but they usually are done with computers or if just a partial reenactment such as how a person was stabbed it may be done by a lawyer, witness, expert of even the accused. Bottom line reenactments are often needed to explain details in a crime as well as helping to gain convictions (mostly) or to defend a suspect. Nothing more powerful for the state to have the accused acting out the crimes they committed themselves but yes, can be insensitive to others when it is a public spectacle as done here".

Can you site an example of where it is an accused has participated in a re-enactment in a first world country? I cannot imagine a defense attorney allowing such a prejudicial act.

Edited October 4, 2014 by phuketandsee

[benalibina]

all of this Thai bashing, is really getting to be too much! Let the police do their work, and stay out of this! This murder, should have never been a topic, open for discussion on this forum. All of the negative bs from TV members has hurt the investigation, I am really embarrassed for some of you, you are really setting back, Thai, Farang relations!! How would you like it if foreigners came to your home country and continually insulted you, calling you stupid and worse. This is a everyday occurrence on TV, I only hope that Thai people are not reading these derogatory comments. Please remember, that Thailand is our host country, and that we are guests, and if we don't like it, then we need to go!

Setting back thai and foreign relations .......money you mean ?

Where do you think those derogatory comments come from......the host's policeforce and social structure of society.........i guess.

In cases like this it cannot be emphasized enough that its crap and if the thai people stood up themselves against all the injustice and corruption related to their own policeforce, things might improve for the better. As this sad case gets international presscoverage i can only imagine that many thai families of murdered siblings/parents/children, whose cases hardly get into the national press, would pray that the policeforce would do its job properly.

Not to much to ask is it ?

[Hisseho]

Vous pourriez avoir raison, il est très facile de manipuler des échantillons d'ADN. Surtout quand les originaux existent en dehors du pays.

I wish some people would think before they write this stuff.

So you think that the DNA is still good and intact? I am relieved.

I just wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't.

I think exactly like him.

The DNA of the guilty is still accessible in the body of the victim and will remain so for many years. (A microgram is sufficient) An exchange of deception would be easy to remove by any lawyer.

This DNA was most probably controlled by the Columbia authorities upon return of the body.

Also, the new leaders of Myanmar will most certainly CLAIM also irrefutable evidence and monitor results. This sordid crime heavily tarnished their image.

Finally only the distinguished members of Thai Visa cry conspiracy. Must say that matire Colombo keyboards we are world champions here. The new dream team of Sherlock ...

[RuthieB]

Sean McAnna, living it up in Choppers Bar during a pub crawl, just a few HOURS after the horrific murder of his 'good friend'.

Clearly devastated.

[JenniferSG]

Sean McAnna, living it up in Choppers Bar during a pub crawl, just a few HOURS after the horrific murder of his 'good friend'.

Clearly devastated.

SEAN.jpg

The murder wasn't discovered until the next morning, was it?

[Cambodger]

Sean McAnna, living it up in Choppers Bar during a pub crawl, just a few HOURS after the horrific murder of his 'good friend'.

Clearly devastated.

SEAN.jpg

The party will go on regardless...

You would think after such horrific murders on a island as small as Koh Tao, that the whole place would be subdued, at least for a day or two...

[Patsycat]

There is now a petition for an independent investigation :- 10000 signatures are needed, still 2,092 NEEDED , it will go to Mark Kent, the UK ambassador to Thailand

Please sign!!!

https://www.change.o....d-miller#share

I sent it to all my facebook friends, hopefully they shall send it to theirs...