Chiang Mai and the Hippie Trail

[mesquite]

Ah, the good old days.

There’s nothing like living in the past. Some say the 70’s were good here, and I’m sure they were, but I miss the really good old days, about 230 million years ago when dinosaurs roamed the area that's now Loi Kroh! Man, that was the time to be here. No pollution, traffic or bar fines. Those were the days, all right.

[JulieM]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

[harrry]

CMHomeboy78:

Your post knocks me right over. What a long, strange trip it's been....

My former wife and I started off in Europe in the fall of '76. Quickly discovered that the weather didn't suit our clothes. Went to Israel and worked on a moshav in the West bank, and then to a kibbutz near Acre on the Med. From there flew to Istanbul, (Sultan Ahmet, Hotel Gungor, The Pudding Shop, etc.) and discovered what a lovely, fantastic country is Turkey. Saw a lot of the coast, then Cappadocia, Anatolia, Eastern Tuurkey, across quiet and inky black Lake Van at night. Arrived in Iran without visas. HUGE mistake. They almost took us to jail. It was the last years of the Shah's reign, and there were cops all over the place. We had to spend the bulk of our week in Teheran getting permission to be there,then permission to leave, and then to get visas to Afghanistan.

Herat was a hippie dreamworld. Got local police permission to take local transport along the Northern Route, skirting the border of the USSR. Took three days to Bamian/Maimana, then south to Kabul. Took a quick train trip across Pakistan, which got hairy after I made the horrible mistake of answering truthfully when asked my opinion of the local religion.. SO STUPID! This was after the conductor made my wife go to the womens' car. Those people take their s--t seriously!

Was never so glad to see anyplace as I was to see the Indian border. So hot there! We escaped to Kashmir, one of the most beautiful places on earth. Recovered a while in an ancient houseboat on Lake Dal in Srinigar. Then took a plane to Kathmandu, which was all as you said. Thieving delinquent monkeys at the Monkey Temple, odd specimens of Eastern and Western Humanity in the streets. 4th of July 1977 there was an Open House for all Americans (even the likes of US) at the American Embassy. Free beer and eats. Don't think that is happening anymore.

Flew to Bangkok, stayed in some noisy dump by the train station. Went downtown and saw the daily milking of venomous snakes at the Red Cross. Met some guys who invited us to their rooms at the relatively opulent Malaysia Hotel. Shared some of their smoky hospitality, which I think came by way of the Golden Triangle. Whew!

Took the overnight sleeper to Chiang Mai, and felt like we were in a Somerset Maugham story. This town seemed really exotic and "end of the trail," which of course it was not. After ten months, we were out of money and time, so flew to Hong Kong then Korea then home. It took some months to recover from the effects of dysentery I had acquired in Afghanistan. There was some poor fellow traveler we met in Bangkok who kept being refused a ticket because his eyeballs and face had the telltale yellow of jaundice. He asked me, "Seriously man, do the whites of my eyes look yellow??" They did, poor guy.

Back then you carried travelers checks, and picked up your eagerly awaited mail from home mail at Post Restante. A call home was crazy expensive. Nobody did that. People traded paperbacks, and had conversations about places and things seen, and there seemed to be a subtle competition about who had been the farthest "off the beaten path" and who had traveled the cheapest. My biggest regret: we never made it to Burma, where the price of admission was a fifth of Johny Walker and a carton of 555 cigs. Others told us how cool it was.

I have a warm spot in my heart for the young backpackers of today. It's fun to sit at the Black Canyon at Thapae Gate and watch the passing parade. I sometimes think it's like they used to say about Times Square. Sit there long enough, and you'll see everybody you ever knew.

Thanks again. That was the best read of the day for me, from any source.

Fantastic reply. I'll try to address some of the points you raise when I have more time.

For starters, was the "...noisy dump by the train station." in Bangkok the Yee Peng? I remember that and a very similar one next to it. The old Nanking Hotel off Yaowarat was cleaner, and a hotbed of vice... we loved it! The rooms were big, and on the first floor you could score whatever you wanted in the way of mood-elevators. The second floor was devoted to various types of Chinese gambling that we steered clear of for fear of being ripped-off. The third floor was Heaven - that's where the girls were. I had never seen a place like that in my life and I won't forget it until the day I die.

There were a lot of noisy dumps near the railway station. The old Thai Son Geet was not the best to stay in but the food was pretty good and the beert was cheap as were the ladies, THey were a strange mix to....some rough as nails and others that became lifetime friends...while you were in Bangkok anyway.

Better and cheaper to stay was the Pepsi. with its wide verandas it seemed to catch breezes and sometimes was almost pleasant. THe owner threatened me with a cleaver one night when returning late.....but did not remember a thing of it in the morning. There was a Student Card factory there and one day there was a police raid..nothing found...but the head policeman, leaning against the notice board with the advertisment for them complete with pictures and the room to contact said in a friendly voice: "Next time we might come back with someone who can read English."

Just up that road and round the corner was a big concrete hotel which was cheap and asked no questions. Sometimes had to stay there when the other options were full.

Of course we cannot start on the Thermae or the post would be too big.

In Chiangmai I initially stayed at the JeTaime guesthouse which was a niche place ran by a sculptor and his wife. A couple of years ago I noticed it was still there but closed and spoke to a loverly lady there who confirmed that it was she and sadly told me with tears in her eyes that her husband had died the year before. The place is still there but she generally does not have guests now.

I then moved to a building about where the Pun Pun is now. Stayed there for about six months but it was a bit far out of town in the country and moved into town.

A lott of guest houses there then, The Garden was just starting and made the best Peanut Butter that I have ever tasted. There was another one whose name I cannot remember which had first class food as the owner was the cook at the top French Resturant in town....I

that should give you something to talk about for a while.

[mesquite]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

Edited October 7, 2014 by mesquite

[Trujillo]

We wasted a lot of time trudging around to find information that's now a click away.

--- Frank James

I disagree. Those episodes help to mold the trip into personal legend. What is it now? Trying to find a powerpoint to charge your phone/internet device? Walking around trying to find a wifi hotspot? Cursing yourself for not bringing that 64 gig card?

Aside from the fact that the world has rapidly been combed over by travelers and development, now we have modern travelers who would rather tap on their phones/iPads etal than watch the sunset.

The old days, the roughing it, the original discoveries before the places were overrun or trashed, or both, are pretty much gone. And the sad truth is these places will never recover. For those of us old enough and fortunate enough to have been in places "before it was on the map" -- and on everyone's smart phone/internet (an example comes to mind of Angkor in the early 90s), they are memories that we not only cherish, but that can never be had by those who venture forth today.

I tell younger travelers to be sure and take lots of photos of street scenes and things you might not think are photo-worthy now, because in 20 more years, that beautiful spot will be even thicker with tourists (most likely uncouth Chinese with a smattering of South Koreans) and more congested, commercial and developed.

[JulieM]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Edited October 7, 2014 by JulieM

[elektrified]

We wasted a lot of time trudging around to find information that's now a click away.

--- Frank James

I disagree. Those episodes help to mold the trip into personal legend. What is it now? Trying to find a powerpoint to charge your phone/internet device? Walking around trying to find a wifi hotspot? Cursing yourself for not bringing that 64 gig card?

Aside from the fact that the world has rapidly been combed over by travelers and development, now we have modern travelers who would rather tap on their phones/iPads etal than watch the sunset.

The old days, the roughing it, the original discoveries before the places were overrun or trashed, or both, are pretty much gone. And the sad truth is these places will never recover. For those of us old enough and fortunate enough to have been in places "before it was on the map" -- and on everyone's smart phone/internet (an example comes to mind of Angkor in the early 90s), they are memories that we not only cherish, but that can never be had by those who venture forth today.

I tell younger travelers to be sure and take lots of photos of street scenes and things you might not think are photo-worthy now, because in 20 more years, that beautiful spot will be even thicker with tourists (most likely uncouth Chinese with a smattering of South Koreans) and more congested, commercial and developed.

Right. So very true. When I travel around Thailand I never bring any electronic devices with me as I am only interested in seeing the islands, mountains, the sunsets, swimming, walking, sitting back with a good book, getting exercise and so forth. The g/f does bring an old mobile with her just so we can check in once every other day and see how our pets are, if there are any problems at home, etc. (if there is reception). Up until about a year ago we would just use a phone booth - has worked for me just fine in my travels over many years. I always traveled that way when I lived in Europe.

I see people traveling with their faces buried in electronic devices, reading facebook, with those earplugs in, etc. Why bother leaving your house and traveling? I doubt they remember much of what they saw on their trip.

Edited October 7, 2014 by elektrified

[Mapguy]

Do I hear rocking chairs on the veranda ?!

Why, when Marco and I traveled to Xanadu, those were really the days!

Keep those reminiscences coming! Fun to read!

[Frank James]

It seems that some members have read these reminiscences and concluded that here we have more old (your favorite dismissive generalization goes here), living in the past. How boring! Honestly, I do remember those days fondly but also remember what a drag a lot of that stuff was. For the young, this is your time, make the most of it, whatever that means to you. You will someday feel nostalgic for these days, as the world changes and changes.

We're all "temps" on this job.

[northernjohn]

It seems that some members have read these reminiscences and concluded that here we have more old (your favorite dismissive generalization goes here), living in the past. How boring! Honestly, I do remember those days fondly but also remember what a drag a lot of that stuff was. For the young, this is your time, make the most of it, whatever that means to you. You will someday feel nostalgic for these days, as the world changes and changes.

We're all "temps" on this job.

This has been probably the best thread I have ever read. Your self and several others have certainly brought things to life for me.

Things I would just give a passing nod to. You people have given life to your memories. They are not just reminiscing for lack of some thing to do. They are living experiences.

I guess what I am trying to say is even though I thank you very much I am still jealous.

Please keep the stories coming.

[Johpa]

Chiang Mai may not have been the end of the road, but it was the gateway to the end of the road, or from another perspective, the gateway to some of the rare entrances to Zomia (look it up) where journey was by foot. The true end of the road spots were places like the Cave Lodge beyond Pai or the Karen Coffee Shop north of Thaton. I found an old grainy pic from some old slides of a bungalow of the Karen Coffee Shop, its owner Panga then, and a recent photo of Panga today. Panga's youngest son now runs the Clef Bar down in Khao Lak.

[Maybole]

I first got to Chiangmai in April 1979 by train vi Kuala Lumpur, Penang,Hatyai, bankok, Ayuthaya and Lampang. In Ayuthaya I ate in an old riverboat and was accosted by a film crew who fed me Thai whisky all evening and I woke up the next day with the most foul head I have ever experienced.

In Chiangmai I stayed in a chinese hotel on Moon Muang I think it is now called Muang Thong Hotel. I ate often in Aroon (Rai) and at midday I found myself surrounded there by girls from the nearby Commercial College, all wanting me to help with their English homework.

I could walk down the middle of Thapae Road with only the sound of a Samlor ringing his bell at me trying to attract custom.

I came back every year for about 5 years and met my wife there in 1982. It has of course changed a lot and the hippies have all become old grandfathers.

[harrry]

I first got to Chiangmai in April 1979 by train vi Kuala Lumpur, Penang,Hatyai, bankok, Ayuthaya and Lampang. In Ayuthaya I ate in an old riverboat and was accosted by a film crew who fed me Thai whisky all evening and I woke up the next day with the most foul head I have ever experienced.

In Chiangmai I stayed in a chinese hotel on Moon Muang I think it is now called Muang Thong Hotel. I ate often in Aroon (Rai) and at midday I found myself surrounded there by girls from the nearby Commercial College, all wanting me to help with their English homework.

I could walk down the middle of Thapae Road with only the sound of a Samlor ringing his bell at me trying to attract custom.

I came back every year for about 5 years and met my wife there in 1982. It has of course changed a lot and the hippies have all become old grandfathers.

Well I have but I am sure some of them became grandmothers.

Near the Pun Pun there used to be in 1979 a basic resturaunt (near the wat) which was ran by a lady who used to cook for the king. (I think anyone who could cook claimed that). They made the best Khao Soi I have ever tasted.

I visited there recently and mentioned this to the lady at the now very big and busy multi cook resturaunt and she asked me if I remembered her as she was the little girl there then. I said I remember my daughter playing with someone there and she jumped up and down with joy and since then has treated me as a special friend.

The road from there into town was full of rice fields and I can remember walking along there into town and telling my daughter the story of how rice was grown...She made me tell it everytime and strangely it is one of the few memories she has of here now.

[Ulysses G.]

Great post Harrry. You brought tears to my eyes.

[mesquite]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Lighten up! Gently take that chip off your shoulder and mail it back to Portland. This is Thailand, often called the Land of Smiles! Most of us here are retired, or tourists, and are simply enjoying life.

[harrry]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Lighten up! Gently take that chip off your shoulder and mail it back to Portland. This is Thailand, often called the Land of Smiles! Most of us here are retired, or tourists, and are simply enjoying life.

Well no need for you to try and make it miserable for others enjoying their lives is there.

[Konini]

What a magnificent thread.this is turning in to. Please keep the stories rolling in.

I used to think it was just me, but that feeling of coming home seems to be a recurring theme. Maybe it's not me that's being a bit odd, it's a phenomenon, just like the Bermuda Triangle, but being so close to the Golden Triangle with all of those poppies up in them there hills, maybe it's the Opium Triangle.

What is it about Chiang Mai that makes us feel as though we're home when we get here?

Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors?

Now if we're going to go down that particular track, we are going to have to ask ourselves has this always happened, or have we all been drawn back here at this point in the, probably, infinite time of the universe for some specific reason and purpose..................

[mesquite]

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Lighten up! Gently take that chip off your shoulder and mail it back to Portland. This is Thailand, often called the Land of Smiles! Most of us here are retired, or tourists, and are simply enjoying life.

Well no need for you to try and make it miserable for others enjoying their lives is there.

I have never done that.

[Konini]

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Lighten up! Gently take that chip off your shoulder and mail it back to Portland. This is Thailand, often called the Land of Smiles! Most of us here are retired, or tourists, and are simply enjoying life.

To be honest, I took your original comment to be a tongue in cheek one. You're right of course, we shouldn't live in the past because there certainly isn't anything wrong with the right here, right now; can we seriously imagine life without the internet? Or even worse; being, as all young people always have been and always will be, foolish enough to think that we knew it all and that anyone over the age of 25 30 was a total dinosaur and couldn't possibly be interesting so therefore didn't deserve even 5 minutes of our time.

I clearly remember when 40 became the new 30 for me. Then it was 50. Now that I'm 50, I'm finally wise enough to know that there isn't any number to be the new whatever it is age.

I really enjoy engaging older people in a conversation of what things were like when they were young and knew it all. It usually cheers them up thinking about it, and I certainly like to hear the stories. We should all try to do that more often than we do, no matter how old you are, there's always somebody older, and no matter how sad or lonely you are, there's always someone sadder and lonelier than you.

It doesn't cost anything to sit down for half an hour with someone and get them chuckling whilst retelling some long forgotten story. We really ought to do it more. There really is no better sight to see than tears of laughter running down a well wrinkled face

[onthedarkside]

An offensive post has been removed.

[Saan]

Inadvertently it was because of Australian hippies that I ended up in Chiang Mai. I spent a lot of my life, from 21 onwards, in Carlton an inner Melbourne suburb. It was then inhabited by the 'push' - writers, actors, artists and hippies. A number of the hippies used to talk about this mystical place called Chiang Mai. The name of this Shangri la lay pretty much lay dormant in my mind in my mind for over 40 years.

I came to Thailand on a visit about 8 years ago. A few days in Bangkok and then down to Pattaya. I hated Pattaya and wondered where I would spend the rest of my time in Thailand. Then through the mire I remembered the hippy paradise - Chiang Mai. Throw in an overnight train trip, something I longed to do, and it seemed a good idea. The train trip was a ball, spent mostly in the dining car. When I arrived in Chiang Mai I experienced that strange, inexplicable feeling others have mentioned. There on the station platform I felt I had arrived home. I felt elated. And that feeling of elation has never really left me. I talked with a Buddhist monk about that arrival and feeling so much at home and he said it was because I had lived here in another life. I like his explanation and it is not up for debate.

On a degree of separation several of the Carlton push knocked around with Richard Neville in London and I worked with his brother Cliff on a newspaper in Sydney.

For me, in the end, all roads led to Chiang Mai.

Thanks for your piece CMHomeboy, it prompted some good memories.

[Saan]

The 1978 Iranian Revolution, followed by the 1979 Russian invasion of Afghanistan ended the magical mystery tour suddenly and violently.

It was quite a trip while it lasted.

Combined with the emergence of more affordable long distance flights and tourism, I think that was about the time it just shifted to flying into major regional centers like Bangkok and then schlepping it from there across SE Asia, sometimes also including Nepal, Hong Kong, etc. Or as part of an 'Around the World' ticket that airlines did back then.

With "The Book", of course.

(EDIT: Ah.. that turned out to be a BIG image.. but perhaps apt, given how monumental it was in shaping travel in the region. So I'll leave it. )

My first foray into South East Asia was in 1972 armed with Lonely Planet's Bali On A Dollar A Day.

Ah, the old Bali. But that's another story.

[Dante99]

We wasted a lot of time trudging around to find information that's now a click away.

--- Frank James

I disagree. Those episodes help to mold the trip into personal legend.

[/quote)

Yes, that was not time wasted. Getting lost was and is an important part of traveling. Without it, I do not feel that I have taken a trip.

Edited October 8, 2014 by Dante99

[Bill97]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

Mesquite, you have no idea how long I've been a member. Simply because I am now posting under other another name doesn't mean anything. Why do you assume that they need any reminder whatsoever about the here and now? Jesus.

Lighten up! Gently take that chip off your shoulder and mail it back to Portland. This is Thailand, often called the Land of Smiles! Most of us here are retired, or tourists, and are simply enjoying life.

Well no need for you to try and make it miserable for others enjoying their lives is there.

Right Harry. That routine is offensive and totally off topic.

Edited October 8, 2014 by Bill97

[RottingCorpse]

I found this thread a fantastic read and the OP well written. Took me back, not to CM (where I've not been in a long time and tend to avoid like the cancer) however it went to remind me the Thailand, especially, in expat circles, which is long passed. I have many happy memories of picking up dollies at the Mal which was the ONLY place during proper coups (which make todays nonsense look lame)

Thailand is a very different place in these days of a ''quick read of Stickman an 2 week TEFL and you ' know it all' merchants''.....

Thanks OP.

[harrry]

The 1978 Iranian Revolution, followed by the 1979 Russian invasion of Afghanistan ended the magical mystery tour suddenly and violently.

It was quite a trip while it lasted.

Combined with the emergence of more affordable long distance flights and tourism, I think that was about the time it just shifted to flying into major regional centers like Bangkok and then schlepping it from there across SE Asia, sometimes also including Nepal, Hong Kong, etc. Or as part of an 'Around the World' ticket that airlines did back then.

With "The Book", of course.

(EDIT: Ah.. that turned out to be a BIG image.. but perhaps apt, given how monumental it was in shaping travel in the region. So I'll leave it. )

My first foray into South East Asia was in 1972 armed with Lonely Planet's Bali On A Dollar A Day.

Ah, the old Bali. But that's another story.

For those who want to know where it all started Lonely Planet's Across Asia on the Cheap is available for the massive price of 6 cents on Amazon for the Kindle reader.

This had not been written when I started. I met Tony and his wife on their way to Australia in the Youth Hostel on the beach at Mallaca.

[Bill97]

The 1978 Iranian Revolution, followed by the 1979 Russian invasion of Afghanistan ended the magical mystery tour suddenly and violently.

It was quite a trip while it lasted.

Combined with the emergence of more affordable long distance flights and tourism, I think that was about the time it just shifted to flying into major regional centers like Bangkok and then schlepping it from there across SE Asia, sometimes also including Nepal, Hong Kong, etc. Or as part of an 'Around the World' ticket that airlines did back then.

With "The Book", of course.

(EDIT: Ah.. that turned out to be a BIG image.. but perhaps apt, given how monumental it was in shaping travel in the region. So I'll leave it. )

My first foray into South East Asia was in 1972 armed with Lonely Planet's Bali On A Dollar A Day.

Ah, the old Bali. But that's another story.

And the great thing about that is that you could do it on much less than a dollar.

[Saan]

Mesquite, they are recollecting the past, not living in it. You have a problem with that? This thread is one of the better ones for a very long time.

"A very long time" being the six weeks you've been a member?

Just reminding these people that for them life is quite good here and now.

God help us. Another one. 'I've been here longer than you and that makes me smarter.'

[harrry]

The 1978 Iranian Revolution, followed by the 1979 Russian invasion of Afghanistan ended the magical mystery tour suddenly and violently.

It was quite a trip while it lasted.

Combined with the emergence of more affordable long distance flights and tourism, I think that was about the time it just shifted to flying into major regional centers like Bangkok and then schlepping it from there across SE Asia, sometimes also including Nepal, Hong Kong, etc. Or as part of an 'Around the World' ticket that airlines did back then.

With "The Book", of course.

(EDIT: Ah.. that turned out to be a BIG image.. but perhaps apt, given how monumental it was in shaping travel in the region. So I'll leave it. )

My first foray into South East Asia was in 1972 armed with Lonely Planet's Bali On A Dollar A Day.

Ah, the old Bali. But that's another story.

And the great thing about that is that you could do it on much less than a dollar.

Not that it matters but the One Dollar a Day books were published by Frommer. They were a bit more upmarket than the Lonely Planet.

[vagabond48]

It seems that some members have read these reminiscences and concluded that here we have more old (your favorite dismissive generalization goes here), living in the past. How boring! Honestly, I do remember those days fondly but also remember what a drag a lot of that stuff was. For the young, this is your time, make the most of it, whatever that means to you. You will someday feel nostalgic for these days, as the world changes and changes.

We're all "temps" on this job.

"Thanks for the Memories". I rarely think about Bob.

It's great to have memories until finally you are physically, "puff", no more.