Koh Tao headman's son gives DNA sample to quell controversy

[hobz]

Let's wait for the DNA results, but for this to be a full on conspiracy, it would mean the involvment of:

1) RTP

2) Chulalongkorn Hospital

3) Siriraj Hospital

4) Ramathibodi Hospital

5) Police General Hospital

6) An airline (for Nomsod's flight)

7) Staff at a Thai airport

8) Staff at the dorm (CCTV/security guys)

9) Scotland Yard (possibly could be done without them knowing, but I doubt it)

10) A boatman (to get him off the island)

11) Phone companies

12) Driver (from Surat Thani to airport?)

13) Staff at the university

14) Classmates at university

Just one break in that link and you've got him. Who knows, maybe they have? I wouldn't hold my breath though.

All the above would be needed for a conspiracy imo. Some of it may be possible, but ot all of it. This guy is the son of a village Headman. Not Kim Jong-Un.

1) RTP <-- Yes, they are involved in the conspiracy

2) Chulalongkorn Hospital <-- Nope, they don't need to be involved,, they simply get sample A and sample B and tell if it's matching. They are not present when the samples are obtained.

3) Siriraj Hospital <-- Nope, they don't need to be involved,, they simply get sample A and sample B and tell if it's matching. They are not present when the samples are obtained.

4) Ramathibodi Hospital <-- Nope, they don't need to be involved,, they simply get sample A and sample B and tell if it's matching. They are not present when the samples are obtained.

5) Police General Hospital <-- Nope, they don't need to be involved,, they simply get sample A and sample B and tell if it's matching. They are not present when the samples are obtained.

6) An airline (for Nomsod's flight) <-- Nope, they have no obligation to go through their flight records unless police or court request them..

7) Staff at a Thai airport <-- Highly unlikely that they remember seeing Nom Sod... they see too many people every day... Nom Sod was not exactly a famous person until a week or so after the murders.

8) Staff at the dorm (CCTV/security guys) <-- Yes, they probably would need to be involved.

9) Scotland Yard (possibly could be done without them knowing, but I doubt it) <-- Nope, Scotland Yard already suspects/knows that this is a frameup, otherwise they wouldn't be here.. The problem is that they need to prove it without causing a diplomatic incident and breaking Thai law .. They are officially not allowed to investigate but simply to observe.

10) A boatman (to get him off the island) <-- Yes

11) Phone companies <-- No, police/court would need to make a warrant first.. Phone companies doesn't even have a right to start their own investigation without a court order, it would be a violation of privacy.

12) Driver (from Surat Thani to airport?) <-- Maybe, depends on what he remembers...

13) Staff at the university <-- Nope, Nom Sod was skipping school because he was so upset about the murders (his words)

14) Classmates at university <-- Nope, Nom Sod was skipping school because he was so upset about the murders (his words)

So your reduced list is

1) RTP

8) Staff at the dorm (CCTV/security guys) <-- Yes, they probably would need to be involved.

10) A boatman (to get him off the island) <-- Yes, very likely! although there is a tiny small chance that he didn't remember / recognize Nom Sod..

12) Driver (from Surat Thani to airport?) <-- Maybe, depends on what he remembers... again, Nom Sod was not famous recognizable figure at the time..

So,, the police are in their pockets, this has been collaborated by tons of Koh Tao people.. And anyone living in thailand a couple of years must have paid bribes a couple of times.. I allegedly have ,..

8) Staff at the dorm (CCTV/security guys) <--,,, This is probably where we could get a leak ... because everyone working in that dorm (actually condo) must be aware that their CCTV is a major piece of evidence in the crime.. So they all must be asking about it .. They are probably between 5 and 20 people working there including cleaning staff etc... The security minimum 5 guys right? They would all be able to check it out for themselves out of curiosity ...

10) A boatman (to get him off the island) <-- easy to pay .. probably only 1-2 guys.. not rich.. can need a good cash payment

12) Driver (from Surat Thani to airport?) <-- easy to pay .. probably only 1 guy.. not rich.. can need a good cash payment

So to solve the case we need to look at the staff of the condo where the cctv footage is coming from....

[hobz]

This test today may have been a nice little set up with very high authorities knowing that the Burmese are scapegoats and there DNA does not match . Maybe today they used a red herring to catch the real culprit . Tomorrow we should know.

So,, you are speculating that they will say "oh sorry the scapegoats dna tests was just a mistake.. NOW WE ARE SURE THIS TIME" .. If any court would accept the DNA tests as evidence today, and i say IF .. Then after yet another mistake they would just have to throw out all the dna from evidence...

In other words, for your theory to come through, the police would need to admit to having mistakenly matched the scapegoats dna wrong.. And in admitting that, the courts would throw out all dna evidence.. future and present..

In other words,, not going to happen,... or maybe i'm overestimating the IQ of the police again... very easy to do

Edited October 30, 2014 by hobz

[hobz]

It is possible to get DNA test results in less than 24 hours if using the latest technology. The new wiz bang testers take only 4 hours or so.

I have no idea what hardware is in use in Thailand.

nonsense. quote your source please. I think you have no idea, period.

Acs.org

Please try to be more polite in future just in case you don't know what you are talking about.

This is not a link. Please quote your source, specifically for the four hour DNA profiling test, with a link that can be followed and verified.

http://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html

Fast forensic test can match suspects DNA with crime samples in four hours Edited October 30, 2014 by hobz

[hobz]

so 6 weeks later the son the headman, the real culprit did feel the urge to comply with the law.... what a joke! a sickening joke!

of course the result will be tampered, dont forget the tourism here, is a multi billon US Dollars industry... in thailand money rules!

Police had previously cleared him and determined he was not on the island when this happened. There is no law he violated and was never compelled to provide DNA sample. However his father and uncle were taken into custody and compelled and provided DNA samples.

Even this sample is not being provided as evidence in the case (they already cleared him and matched the crime scene DNA to suspects in custody) but rather to try to quiet some online conspiracy theorists who demanded he be tested ... but we all now this will not quiet them as they just move to one nonsense theory and demand they need fulfilled to believe to another and they feign outrage over untrue fantasies like this kid didn't comply with the law for 6 weeks.

Wipe you mouth the bs running out , what a stupid statement saying the sample is not being provided as evidence .

So if it proves positive do you think they are just going to let him go .?

Did you even read the OP? 1) Police have already cleared him 2) Koh Tao Leader's Son Gives DNA Sample to Quell Controversy

This is not part of the police investigation. Use your head, the DNA has already been matched to the suspects in custody it would be IMPOSSIBLE for it to match this kid too.

Exactly,,, So it makes no sense to test him at this point... unless the police themselves admit that they may have made a mistake when testing the scapegoats.. lol

*Edit* Testing him again is violating my logical mind... it makes no sense.. yet they make a big deal out of it and spend money on it etc... It's raping my logical mind... I almost want to scream out loud.. how stupid are these people...

Edited October 30, 2014 by hobz

[geistfunke]

He should have given more evidence at the start that he was in Bangkok, not just a couple of sketchy video stills. In a city where almost everything is filmed

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

I am happy that you have described this video, but you are missing the point. The question is "how exactly" this 160cm high person in the two videos is moving his arms and legs. This will be one evidence later in the court, proofed by experts.

[Bleacher Bum East]

It does not seem at all wrong to me, that if any country wants to benefit from a certain threshold amount of tourist dollars, which thailand would certainly qualify, the country should be open to international investigators performing tests like these. If you want the tourist money, you have to sign on the dotted line and agree to this. Seems reasonable. The world has got to put a stop to ridiculous stuff like this.

There is an agreement to which both the UK and Thailand are signatories.

See article 55 of the Vienna Convention on Consular Relations.

Article 55

Respect for the laws and regulations of the receiving State

1. Without prejudice to their privileges and immunities, it is the duty of all

persons enjoying such privileges and immunities to respect the laws and

regulations of the receiving State. They also have a duty not to interfere in

the internal affairs of that State.

JD you and JL Crab have thrown this Article of the Vienna Convention out several times without any real explanation. The implication seems to be that this Article prohibits the UK investigators/observers from doing pretty much anything meaningful.

If that is your read of this Article, then I disagree.

First of all, this is not a black and white law such as a speed limit. Articles like this are subject to a high degree of interpretation (and in fact many articles of the Vienna Convention have been subject to heated disputes over interpretation).

Interpretation of a treaty article requires you to look at the purpose and history of the article, and to apply the provisions of the article to the facts and circumstances of each case.

The provision that "it is the duty of all persons enjoying such privileges and immunities to respect the laws and

regulations of the receiving State" was put in the Convention as a counterbalance to the almost absolute level of diplomatic immunity given to consular officials.

Seeing the problems that full diplomatic immunity would potentially cause, this is an admonishment that the Convention does not in any way give diplomatic agents permission to violate the laws and regulations of the receiving state. So they can't just knowingly flaunt local laws on purpose and then cry "Nah Nah, diplomatic immunity!"

But as long as they stay within local laws, they can go about their business and do as locals would do.

With one exception, and that is they also don't "interfere in the internal affairs of that State."

But the meaning of this clause is also subject to a high degree of interpretation.

If they paid people to rig an election, that would clearly interfering. If they published or gave interviews of their own analysis of an election, probably not interfering. In between, a gray area.

So in the current situation, the UK team of diplomats and observers/investigators will have looked very closely at, and interpreted, three things:

1. Does what we would like to do violate any local laws?

2. Does what we would like to do interfere with the internal affairs of Thailand?

3. Even if in our interpretation it does not violate local laws or interfere with the internal affairs, should we not do it anyways because it would cause diplomatic problems.

I've not seen any Thai laws cited that would clearly prohibit any form of non-Thai-government investigation into a crime. As long as the UK team did not do anything that violates a law on the books, then it could presumably conduct some form of investigation along with it's observation. If there are specific laws they need to observe, I'm sure they are aware of them.

The team could not interfere with the legal process in Thailand, but that could be interpreted in many ways as well. For example, the Article could easily be interpreted to allow the UK team to issue it's own report back in the UK and this would not interfere with the internal affairs of Thailand (whether it chooses to do so is then a matter of diplomacy, not law or agreement).

Anyways, the point if all this is that this is not at all a black and white issue as you present it to be. Quite the opposite, it is a very gray area that is as much diplomacy as it is legal rights.

One thing I really believe is that the UK government has not interpreted this Article to be a stop sign as you have suggested. I think most countries will interpret the provisions of the Article broadly or narrowly depending on how important they view the issue, and the diplomatic implications involved. And this is no exception.

In any event, they will do what they will do based on many factors, and we get to see how it all unfolds.

BTW what I'm talking about here is an analysis of Article 55 ... the UK and Thai governments may have come to a separate understanding outside of this convention, and that is another matter.

It is a very interesting issue that well-meaning people can and do land on both sides on.

PS I apologize to everyone for the long-winded posts. These issues interest me, I care about how they will impact people that I love and their country, and I enjoy fleshing them out ... hopefully the thoughts will be interesting and useful to a few other people (with long attention spans ) as well.

Edited October 30, 2014 by Bleacher Bum East

[hobz]

He should have given more evidence at the start that he was in Bangkok, not just a couple of sketchy video stills. In a city where almost everything is filmed, add to that his phone records and his receipts etc. If I was in his position and had his means I would have dug up all the proof possible when the rumours started.

Its all a bit late now in my opinion to quell the rumours, he has been found guilty by social media rightly or wrongly.

What phone records would he have? How do you know the police didn't check with the phone company? How do you know what police did to publicly state he had been cleared after publicly stating they suspected he was involved?

The DNA test is an attempt to silence some of the conspiracy nuts who are accusing this family without basis but of course this will not work and will just make conspiracy theorists double down on their claims. And of course the DNA will not match as they already have the suspects whose DNA it matches in custody.

Meanwhile, Police have also offered to allow the DNA of the two suspects be retested ... but another worthless point in trying to convince conspiracy theorists they will just demand more and find other reasons to point the finger at somebody they have no proof against except fantasy.

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

What phone records would he have? How do you know the police didn't check with the phone company? How do you know what police did to publicly state he had been cleared after publicly stating they suspected he was involved?

Good point about the phone records.. Just because something hasn't been reported doesn't mean we know it didn't happen.. The police could have gone through phone records.. They also could not have.. we don't know at this time.. and unless the full investigation is released to the public (they do this in sweden) we may never know.

The DNA test is an attempt to silence some of the conspiracy nuts who are accusing this family without basis but of course this will not work and will just make conspiracy theorists double down on their claims. And of course the DNA will not match as they already have the suspects whose DNA it matches in custody.

Meanwhile, Police have also offered to allow the DNA of the two suspects be retested ... but another worthless point in trying to convince conspiracy theorists they will just demand more and find other reasons to point the finger at somebody they have no proof against except fantasy.

Yeah testing his dna makes no sense in my mind.. I mean,, how could it possible match when the scapegoats dna is already matching... makes zero sense... but obviously you are right,, they are ATTEMPTING to silence some of the conspiracy nuts,, those that scream conspiracy but are stupid and illogical (as opposed to me, smart and logical:) The main point here is that police either have the right suspects,,, OR they have already swapped the dna samples from the victims bodies with those of the scapegoats... Either way,, further dna tests will give the same results... the question remains,, did police swap the dna from the victims .. i think it's not unlikely that they did... I believe it's thai police mo to fake evidence to frame suspects to make crimes go away.. they wanted this solved and gone way before the high season.. ofcourse i could be wrong.

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

http://www.southampton.ac.uk/research/southamptonstories/medhealthlife/walk_this_way.html

In fact, we all have a signature walking style that can be identified much like a fingerprint. Realising this, engineers from Southampton’s School of Electronics and Computer Science (ECS) have been working on a computer system that can analyse the gait of criminals caught on CCTV and then compare them with those of a suspect.

I have sent an email to the professor behind the research, including the video you mentioned.. Hope he replies,.. That being said,, I have viewed the video multiple times and I'm not 100% confident it's him... But I have no training in recognizing walking styles...

It reminds me of playing led zeppelin backwards ... first you hear nothing,, and then someone tells you: "listen at xx:xx, he clearly says i love satan" .. and then you hear it .. looking at the video i feel the same way... "look it's the same" "yes"

That being said,, he has some weird characteristics that not everyone has...

Isn't it also possible that the walking style is mimicked by close friends and relatives subconsciously,, specially if the person with the walking style is an "alpha male" that people looks up too..

In other words, isn't it possible that the unidentified person is someone close to Nom Sod ..

[jdinasia]

BBE

Can a foreigner work in Thailand w/o a work permit?

Was the visit arranged at literally the top level of diplomacy? Can consular staff work w/o a work permit?

Work a bit on those questions.

[partington]

It is possible to get DNA test results in less than 24 hours if using the latest technology. The new wiz bang testers take only 4 hours or so.

I have no idea what hardware is in use in Thailand.

nonsense. quote your source please. I think you have no idea, period.

Acs.org

Please try to be more polite in future just in case you don't know what you are talking about.

http://www.acs.org/content/acs//pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html en

Fast forensic test can match suspects DNA with crime samples in four hours

Yes, this is under development, potentially useful, but not yet adopted as a forensic technique even in advanced western labs, never mind by the comparatively limited Thai forensic services.

The actual reference from 2010 says:

" By integrating such an instrument and microfluidic cartridge with the forensic process, we believe it will be possible in the near future to process a DNA sample taken from an individual in police custody and compare the profile with the DNA profiles held on a DNA Database in as little as 3 h."

Clearly, believing something "will be possible in the near future" on the basis of a research paper is not the same as it actually being possible currently, in routine forensic analysis.

It simply isn't done NOW.

[hobz]

Acs.org

Please try to be more polite in future just in case you don't know what you are talking about.

http://www.acs.org/content/acs//pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html en

Fast forensic test can match suspects DNA with crime samples in four hours

Yes, this is under development, potentially useful, but not yet adopted as a forensic technique even in advanced western labs, never mind by the comparatively limited Thai forensic services.

The actual reference from 2010 says:

" By integrating such an instrument and microfluidic cartridge with the forensic process, we believe it will be possible in the near future to process a DNA sample taken from an individual in police custody and compare the profile with the DNA profiles held on a DNA Database in as little as 3 h."

Clearly, believing something "will be possible in the near future" on the basis of a research paper is not the same as it actually being possible currently, in routine forensic analysis.

It simply isn't done NOW.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Science/2011_April_12#.282.29_How_long_does_DNA_testing_take.2C_and_why.3F

The actual DNA test can be done in hours. It consists of a) isolation PCR c) DNA fingerprinting. The entire sequence can be completed by a technician within a few hours; the average DNA analyst can, by staggering procedures, probably churn through several in a day. The reason that real cops and prosecutors wait weeks or months for results is that there is a backlog of submitted evidence. Occasionally, a high-profile case will get rushed, but generally it is first come-first served, and everyone waits in line.

Sounds like it is being done now..

[Dogmatix]

The police chief certainly had something to smile about today and it wasn't to do with Nomsod's DNA test. His shares in Watana Capital moved up another 16% today and he and his wife have doubled the B360 million they invested in this loss making penny stock in a private placement at B0.36 that was announced to the SET following the company's 6 October board meeting in less than a month. The stock is now trading at B0.07. With a nose like that for undervalued penny stocks he should consider giving up poorly paid police work and becoming a day trader.

[Bleacher Bum East]

BBE

Can a foreigner work in Thailand w/o a work permit?

Was the visit arranged at literally the top level of diplomacy? Can consular staff work w/o a work permit?

Work a bit on those questions.

Not sure and I have some other things I have to do right now so can't research. . . but off the top of my head, this is what I think is the answer based on what I've read:

The consulate can designate persons who are to be considered its consular officers who will be working on its behalf and be given diplomatic immunity, and therefore I would assume are also directly subject to the Vienna Convention on Consular Relations.

These persons I do not believe are subject to a country's work permit regulations . . . they are part of the consular privileges enjoyed by each visiting state (Hence it's a big thing to ask a member of a consular staff to leave a country).

So I think the UK Embassy could have designated the investigative team as working on their behalf. I can't imagine they would not do that and leave the investigators without diplomatic immunity (unless there was a separate agreement on this).

This is a semi-educated guess ... the honest answer is I'm not sure.

[bangrak]

&lt;deleted&gt; is all this media circus by the 'authorities' about having the top specialists of the best universities, whether they can be trusted or not being a different matter, to collect and analyse the DNA sample of this guy, with Lt Gen Somyot, the national police chief involved on the frontline, as long as all the same don't get, for sure, genuine, untampered with, DNA samples, correctly collected on the victim, as far as it has ever existed and still does, to analyse too, and to compare with! When not, this is just the next BS intox by the 'authorities' for the modal Khaosod readers, and, I'm afraid, quite some 'anti-Thai-bashing' posters here, who are not seeing any further than the tip of their obviously very short nose! Anyone pretending that at this point the only truly important matter(s) is/are not 1° not to lose face, and, eventually, 2° to protect the real perpetrators, is not right in his mind IMO, simple as that!

Reminds me of an old cartoon, wherein a boy wanted to touch up with black paint a very small dent he had made while playing on a cupboard in his parents' living room, job done, takes a few steps back to look at it, knocks over the big pot, spilling all the black paint on the timber floor, then gets the brilliant idea to paint all of the living floor black, 'for his parents not to see', starting with the opening of the access door, and going back on and on, until getting blocked in the corner of two walls, with no possible exit... (Quick & Flupke by Hergé) From Belgium, so ridiculous it is funny, ...so Thai in the mind's articulations it depicts.

[bangrak]

10606226_10201853141850142_5664172514246056707_n.jpg

The police chief certainly had something to smile about today and it wasn't to do with Nomsod's DNA test. His shares in Watana Capital moved up another 16% today and he and his wife have doubled the B360 million they invested in this loss making penny stock in a private placement at B0.36 that was announced to the SET following the company's 6 October board meeting in less than a month. The stock is now trading at B0.07. With a nose like that for undervalued penny stocks he should consider giving up poorly paid police work and becoming a day trader.

Hush, might get you into trouble, when he would be investigated for possible insiders' trading...

[Dogmatix]

http://www.acs.org/content/acs//pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html en

Fast forensic test can match suspects DNA with crime samples in four hours

Yes, this is under development, potentially useful, but not yet adopted as a forensic technique even in advanced western labs, never mind by the comparatively limited Thai forensic services.

The actual reference from 2010 says:

" By integrating such an instrument and microfluidic cartridge with the forensic process, we believe it will be possible in the near future to process a DNA sample taken from an individual in police custody and compare the profile with the DNA profiles held on a DNA Database in as little as 3 h."

Clearly, believing something "will be possible in the near future" on the basis of a research paper is not the same as it actually being possible currently, in routine forensic analysis.

It simply isn't done NOW.

You are wrong. As the saying goes, there is nothing under the sun that Thai police cannot do. They have overtaken Western forensic science and can now get the results of a DNA test in -12 hours.

[Dogmatix]

10606226_10201853141850142_5664172514246056707_n.jpg

The police chief certainly had something to smile about today and it wasn't to do with Nomsod's DNA test. His shares in Watana Capital moved up another 16% today and he and his wife have doubled the B360 million they invested in this loss making penny stock in a private placement at B0.36 that was announced to the SET following the company's 6 October board meeting in less than a month. The stock is now trading at B0.07. With a nose like that for undervalued penny stocks he should consider giving up poorly paid police work and becoming a day trader.

Hush, might get you into trouble, when he would be investigated for possible insiders' trading...

It is public information that is available on the SET's website.

[hobz]

10606226_10201853141850142_5664172514246056707_n.jpg

The police chief certainly had something to smile about today and it wasn't to do with Nomsod's DNA test. His shares in Watana Capital moved up another 16% today and he and his wife have doubled the B360 million they invested in this loss making penny stock in a private placement at B0.36 that was announced to the SET following the company's 6 October board meeting in less than a month. The stock is now trading at B0.07. With a nose like that for undervalued penny stocks he should consider giving up poorly paid police work and becoming a day trader.

Hush, might get you into trouble, when he would be investigated for possible insiders' trading...

It is public information that is available on the SET's website.

Websites are forbidden under martial law.

[BirdsandBooze]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

[MikePhuket1970]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

It will confirm nothing unless some independent organisation witness the whole process

from start to end

[hobz]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

It will be up to the court to decide what all these DNA tests mean,,, I think it's possible that the court rules that all the DNA evidence is unreliable because it hasn't been handled profesionally (no forensic experts on the crime scene,, crime scene "violated" by non police bystanders (mafia))

[hobz]

In Sweden there are laws that prevents politicians to pressure the legal system into certain decisions... It is up to the legal system to handle cases.. It is up to politicians to make laws... Does Thailand have similar laws?

*edit* and if thailand does have such laws, do they apply to the military regime?

*edit2* I see HEAVY pressure coming from the regime towards the court for a quick and decisive decision in this case....

Edited October 30, 2014 by hobz

[culicine]

Must be nice to have the police on your side, standing in the trenches with you... Must make you feel like you can do anything you want...

And looks where the paymaster sits...right in the MIDDLE.....cops forced to sit on the end lol. That tells you about all you need to know.

Has it really reached this level of lunacy to speculate on non-suspects in a case being guilty because of where they sit for a press conference that has nothing to do with police demanding anything of this family or the police even suspecting this family any more?

Actually I just love winding up fools like you 555

[Dogmatix]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

There were two bareback rapists whose semen was found inside the victim. A third man had sex with her using a condom violently enough to leave traces of her blood on the outside of the condom but, mysteriously, no traces of DNA in the inside. This third man could conceivably have been David before the death squad arrived but that doesn't seem very likely, as there were no other traces of his DNA found on Hannah. So there could have been three rapists and, as you suggest, and several murderers, not to mention accessories to and after the fact. It is strange that the police investigation limited itself to the two pint sized suspects. Initially they said that whoever took down David must have been physically big and strong, given David's fit 6'6" frame.

Edited October 30, 2014 by Dogmatix

[seahorse]

He should have given more evidence at the start that he was in Bangkok, not just a couple of sketchy video stills. In a city where almost everything is filmed, add to that his phone records and his receipts etc. If I was in his position and had his means I would have dug up all the proof possible when the rumours started.

Its all a bit late now in my opinion to quell the rumours, he has been found guilty by social media rightly or wrongly.

What phone records would he have? How do you know the police didn't check with the phone company? How do you know what police did to publicly state he had been cleared after publicly stating they suspected he was involved?

The DNA test is an attempt to silence some of the conspiracy nuts who are accusing this family without basis but of course this will not work and will just make conspiracy theorists double down on their claims. And of course the DNA will not match as they already have the suspects whose DNA it matches in custody.

Meanwhile, Police have also offered to allow the DNA of the two suspects be retested ... but another worthless point in trying to convince conspiracy theorists they will just demand more and find other reasons to point the finger at somebody they have no proof against except fantasy.

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

Totally wrong.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21528835.600-cameras-know-you-by-your-walk.html

Cameras know you by your walk

The unique way someone walks can betray who they are with almost as much accuracy as fingerprints, scientists have found.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8815241/What-the-way-you-walk-can-reveal-about-you.html

The way Nom Sod walks is unique. The two videos show a person with the same gait.

Case closed.

[hobz]

What phone records would he have? How do you know the police didn't check with the phone company? How do you know what police did to publicly state he had been cleared after publicly stating they suspected he was involved?

The DNA test is an attempt to silence some of the conspiracy nuts who are accusing this family without basis but of course this will not work and will just make conspiracy theorists double down on their claims. And of course the DNA will not match as they already have the suspects whose DNA it matches in custody.

Meanwhile, Police have also offered to allow the DNA of the two suspects be retested ... but another worthless point in trying to convince conspiracy theorists they will just demand more and find other reasons to point the finger at somebody they have no proof against except fantasy.

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

Totally wrong.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21528835.600-cameras-know-you-by-your-walk.html

Cameras know you by your walk

The unique way someone walks can betray who they are with almost as much accuracy as fingerprints, scientists have found.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8815241/What-the-way-you-walk-can-reveal-about-you.html

The way Nom Sod walks is unique. The two videos show a person with the same gait.

Case closed.

I've been asking this allover and tried to find it on google:

Is it possible that close friends or relatives mimmick the same walking style of an alpha male? Subconsciously perhaps?

So IF the person seen running on CCTV in Koh Tao and Nom Sod have the same walking style, is it not possible that they simply mimick eachother or a third alpha male in a close group (family,friends,whatever)?

*edit* *spoiler alert* I do think it is possible,, As a youngster I found myself mimicking the walking styles of some rapper I liked ... One of my friends pointed it out to me because I was doing it subconsciously...

Edited October 30, 2014 by hobz

[Thai at Heart]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

There were two bareback rapists whose semen was found inside the victim. A third man had sex with her using a condom violently enough to leave traces of her blood on the outside of the condom but, mysteriously, no traces of DNA in the inside. This third man could conceivably have been David before the death squad arrived but that doesn't seem very likely, as there were no other traces of his DNA found on Hannah. So there could have been three rapists and, as you suggest, and several murderers, not to mention accessories to and after the fact. It is strange that the police investigation limited itself to the two pint sized suspects. Initially they said that whoever took down David must have been physically big and strong, given David's fit 6'6" frame.

This assumes completely that the BIB have been honest and upfront from the start.

The odds that there is no DNA in the condom is ludicrously low, so that is probably a wash job. There could have been 10 peoples DNA in the victim, but if the front is to fit up two Burmese , of course there would only be a report of two DNA hits.

I don't beleive anything the cops say about how many people were involved because they have zero credibility. Zero

[geistfunke]

*edit* *spoiler alert* I do think it is possible,, As a youngster I found myself mimicking the walking styles of some rapper I liked ... One of my friends pointed it out to me because I was doing it subconsciously...

...but not at 4:49am in the morning two times near the crime scene.

I agree with "seahorse", in this point the case is closed.

[JohnThailandJohn]

What phone records would he have? How do you know the police didn't check with the phone company? How do you know what police did to publicly state he had been cleared after publicly stating they suspected he was involved?

The DNA test is an attempt to silence some of the conspiracy nuts who are accusing this family without basis but of course this will not work and will just make conspiracy theorists double down on their claims. And of course the DNA will not match as they already have the suspects whose DNA it matches in custody.

Meanwhile, Police have also offered to allow the DNA of the two suspects be retested ... but another worthless point in trying to convince conspiracy theorists they will just demand more and find other reasons to point the finger at somebody they have no proof against except fantasy.

The latest from Facebook is to compare the headman's video of the son in Bangkok the morning of the killing with video from the previous night. They are running it side by side to show they two could be the same person despite the only similarity being they both at least appear to be Asian and both walk on two legs and move their arms, like most people when they walk.

Totally wrong.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21528835.600-cameras-know-you-by-your-walk.html

Cameras know you by your walk

The unique way someone walks can betray who they are with almost as much accuracy as fingerprints, scientists have found.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8815241/What-the-way-you-walk-can-reveal-about-you.html

The way Nom Sod walks is unique. The two videos show a person with the same gait.

Case closed.

I've been asking this allover and tried to find it on google:

Is it possible that close friends or relatives mimmick the same walking style of an alpha male? Subconsciously perhaps?

So IF the person seen running on CCTV in Koh Tao and Nom Sod have the same walking style, is it not possible that they simply mimick eachother or a third alpha male in a close group (family,friends,whatever)?

*edit* *spoiler alert* I do think it is possible,, As a youngster I found myself mimicking the walking styles of some rapper I liked ... One of my friends pointed it out to me because I was doing it subconsciously...

I think the saddest thing is people don't even realize how out there they sound and even go so far as submitting proof through a link that clearly states technology is not currently available to determine a person by their walk and certainly the facebook morons not using such technology and ignoring the fact that such idiotic internet detective work is not needs as it has been investigated and confirmed the kid wasn't on the island and they have matching dna to the two suspects in custody and this kid now has volunteered his dna in hopes it will stop such lunatic gossip and rumor based on idiocy.

From the link provided above ...

But despite more than three decades of research, using gait analysis as a biometric has never taken off. Until now, perhaps. Recent advances in the accuracy of automated gait recognition suggest the technology could soon form the basis for a new generation of security systems.

Edited October 30, 2014 by JohnThailandJohn

[hobz]

A negative DNA test will only confirm that he was not one of the rapists. It will not prove whether he was involved in the murder or not.

There were two bareback rapists whose semen was found inside the victim. A third man had sex with her using a condom violently enough to leave traces of her blood on the outside of the condom but, mysteriously, no traces of DNA in the inside. This third man could conceivably have been David before the death squad arrived but that doesn't seem very likely, as there were no other traces of his DNA found on Hannah. So there could have been three rapists and, as you suggest, and several murderers, not to mention accessories to and after the fact. It is strange that the police investigation limited itself to the two pint sized suspects. Initially they said that whoever took down David must have been physically big and strong, given David's fit 6'6" frame.

This assumes completely that the BIB have been honest and upfront from the start.

The odds that there is no DNA in the condom is ludicrously low, so that is probably a wash job. There could have been 10 peoples DNA in the victim, but if the front is to fit up two Burmese , of course there would only be a report of two DNA hits.

I don't beleive anything the cops say about how many people were involved because they have zero credibility. Zero

I agree that they have zero credibility,, but that doesn't mean they must be lying.

[hobz]

Totally wrong.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21528835.600-cameras-know-you-by-your-walk.html

Cameras know you by your walk

The unique way someone walks can betray who they are with almost as much accuracy as fingerprints, scientists have found.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8815241/What-the-way-you-walk-can-reveal-about-you.html

The way Nom Sod walks is unique. The two videos show a person with the same gait.

Case closed.

I've been asking this allover and tried to find it on google:

Is it possible that close friends or relatives mimmick the same walking style of an alpha male? Subconsciously perhaps?

So IF the person seen running on CCTV in Koh Tao and Nom Sod have the same walking style, is it not possible that they simply mimick eachother or a third alpha male in a close group (family,friends,whatever)?

*edit* *spoiler alert* I do think it is possible,, As a youngster I found myself mimicking the walking styles of some rapper I liked ... One of my friends pointed it out to me because I was doing it subconsciously...

I think the saddest thing is people don't even realize how out there they sound and even go so far as submitting proof through a link that clearly states technology is not currently available to determine a person by their walk and certainly the facebook morons not using such technology and ignoring the fact that such idiotic internet detective work is not needs as it has been investigated and confirmed the kid wasn't on the island and they have matching dna to the two suspects in custody and this kid now has volunteered his dna in hopes it will stop such lunatic gossip and rumor based on idiocy.

From the link provided above ...

But despite more than three decades of research, using gait analysis as a biometric has never taken off. Until now, perhaps. Recent advances in the accuracy of automated gait recognition suggest the technology could soon form the basis for a new generation of security systems.

Still you make it sound like it would be impossible to match someone based on walking style,, while researchers believe it's like a fingerprint...