Bangkok’s Bible Thumpers

[John K]

We have heard about them, we have read about them, and some of us have seen them. The Bible thumpers in Bangkok. We all have our opinions of them some good some bad and some indifferent. The reason that they are there is somewhat unknown. Are they on a mission of God, or are they just meeting some religious requirement. Comments I have heard from a variety of people say a variety of things. One Thai told me that some Thais see them as doing the opposite of what they intend. By saying that sex is something wrong simply is read as “They should not show their dirty laundry in public.” When I asked him what he meant he said “They should not talk about their personal sex problems in public, it only encourages us to be sure we have no problem.” He also said he felt sad for them because they had a problem and they should go and find a lady to see if she could help.

I found that to be a bit humorous but I can see how he can come to that conclusion. The ability to have sex is often talked about as “having power” as I have heard that term often used. Showing that you can have sex is apparently part of the Thai culture. I am not sure if it is a form of status but I suspect it could easily be as appearance is everything. The ability to have sex is a sign strength. The Bible thumpers seem to be encouraging weakness if that is the case.

Thai artwork often depicts topless ladies and in some cases sexual situations. Even at Thai schools you will find this type of art as it is part of Thai culture. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it in my mind but I am sure some will disagree. I suspect you would find no such cultural artwork from where the Bible thumpers are from and even less in some Muslim countries. The Muslim extremists have taken a different approach with explosives but the intent is the same, simply to force their views on others. So does that make the Bible thumpers religious extremists too?

As we all come from different religions we all have our own beliefs and I respect them, however I feel it is wrong to force ones belief on another. I have worked with some Born again Christians that were so annoying we simply found ourselves thinking the opposite of what they were preaching as a way to make them go away. I certainly felt that I did not want to end up like them so I felt I should move in the opposite direction to insure that. If I want to hear preaching I will go to a house of worship I don’t want them bothering me on my own time or at work.

So the question is, what do you think about The Bible thumpers who visit the night life venues, are they hurting or helping their cause?

[johng]

I think they are hurting their cause.

[Tingnongnoi]

me too can't see them winning over any new recruits to the cause there.

[H2oDunc]

me too can't see them winning over any new recruits to the cause there.

In a predominantly Buddist country why do they feel the need to push their beliefs on other people. If people in Thailand want to become christians then let them. When I was in BKK earlier in the year I saw lots of these bible bashers along the kho san rd blasting about hel_l and damnation through their loud speakers. GIVE IT A REST Rant over

[Ijustwannateach]

I'm not particularly fond of missionaries of any stripe. I figure if they want to invade the nightlife zones and proselytize, you guys in those zones should take your, um, ladies to the churches and hang out as you would normally do. Fair's fair!

[John K]

I'm not particularly fond of missionaries of any stripe. I figure if they want to invade the nightlife zones and proselytize, you guys in those zones should take your, um, ladies to the churches and hang out as you would normally do. Fair's fair!

Sounds like a plan to me

[libya 115]

I think that Christian missionaries active within Thailand are, at best immature witnesses to their beliefs. I concur that they are 'trying to spread the word': Yet they are doing so in a way similar to sandwich board men, who in my teens, near football grounds: were preaching;

'The end is near; repent you evil sinners' etc. etc.

How far better it would be, instead of preaching of the evils of sex and money; they led by example, helping the poor and needy, teaching for free, offering educational help. etc.

It seems to me these people are just 'casting the first stone'.

[GuestHouse]

I've read some <deleted> on TV but the Opening Post here is among the worst.

Has he any idea of Thai cultural values towards sex? - It seems not. Did he even ever have that conversation with a Thai regarding Christian Missionaries?

Rather than rush to rant against Christian Missionaries in Thailand, take time look at some of the work done by Christians in Thailand (particularly in the areas of caring for orphans, the stateless, and people suffering from HIV/AIDS)

Very many of the problems created by the sex industry in Thailand are taken care of by faith groups of which the Christian Community are perhaps the most active and visible.

As for the message they are putting out - Well it's obviously reached this forum, so it is to some extent hitting its mark.

[britmaveric]

Seen as jokes by most thai/farang alike. Mind you - do have inkling more a show than practice. Prob very same lads preaching end up shagging away when no one is looking.

[unforgiven]

me too can't see them winning over any new recruits to the cause there.

In a predominantly Buddist country why do they feel the need to push their beliefs on other people. If people in Thailand want to become christians then let them. When I was in BKK earlier in the year I saw lots of these bible bashers along the kho san rd blasting about hel_l and damnation through their loud speakers. GIVE IT A REST Rant over

there zllots

[mittheimp]

I've read some <deleted> on TV but the Opening Post here is among the worst.

Has he any idea of Thai cultural values towards sex? - It seems not. Did he even ever have that conversation with a Thai regarding Christian Missionaries?

Rather than rush to rant against Christian Missionaries in Thailand, take time look at some of the work done by Christians in Thailand (particularly in the areas of caring for orphans, the stateless, and people suffering from HIV/AIDS)

Very many of the problems created by the sex industry in Thailand are taken care of by faith groups of which the Christian Community are perhaps the most active and visible.

As for the message they are putting out - Well it's obviously reached this forum, so it is to some extent hitting its mark.

well, at least you managed to understand it! I read it three times and still had no idea what half of it was on about!

[dog412]

religion is thumped, all of them.

[backflip]

Everyone has to believe in something, and I believe I'll have another beer.

[Belfastboy]

i agree with Gueshouse...don't be so quick to judge. The so called Bible Thumpers are just doing what they believe is right for themselves and right for the rest of us, they have our best interests at heart.

although i don't agree with the medium they use, they are not a threat to anyone. I find it so depressing when so many of us judge these guys and have them hung, drawn and quartered just for spreading their religion. And yet it's the same guys who mock the bible guys, they are the ones standing up for sex with underage girls etc...

the world needs a few good guys...god help us if there wasn't the decent honest people out there, especially in a country like thailand where there is so much corruption, poverty etc... just look at the pattaya orphanage for kids, its run by a christian guy. I bet his work has saved thousands of kids lives from prostitution and drugs ....i always imagine if it was my child or sister etc...just makes my sad to hear people condemn people for trying to better the world and yet they have no qualms about contributing to the problem

live and let live...the world is a sick place and a little love and honesty is so refreshing..imo

[Johpa]

Christianity is a bit like hypnotherapy, eh John? It works for some and not for others. I have never heard of either group actually causing harm or of being of any concern to anyone in the environs of metropolitan Bangkok.

[Donz]

I hate thumpers of all religions, If i want to know a religion i will go and find out. Hate is probaly a too strong of a word, really the ones on the street i dont mind, i just ignore them, its the ones who come to my house that bug me.

Once this jahova witness (spelling) came around i said ok what you want, he pulls out a little pamphlet and said how old is this guy on here (it was a picture of a young man. I said about 25, he goes no he is 400 years old. I started cracking up and slammed the door in his face.

I mean come on, what do they think i am?? If you going to try spread your message you think using something more believable would be better.

I agree christians do good with charities and i do donate money to them every year (not much) but I think they shouldnt do the door knocking.

[chang35baht]

The part that bugs me about the Mormon missionaries up here in C,RAI is the fact that they(apparently) can only do their mishing between the ages of 18-21. One minute you see them laughing and giggling, riding their bikes along the road with no hands(whee! Look at me). the next they`re at my next door neighbours house trying to tell them how good their life will be if they follow the bible etc. They`re just kids. BTW my neighbours are an 80 year old couple. Why bring conflict into their life? Isn`t religion the 2nd biggest killer of mankind. I know what I`m praying for. <deleted> OFF.

[Donz]

Well i do think religion just causes trouble, many wonty aggree but if you believe in it too much then its not a good thing

[John K]

Before I came to Thailand I lived in a condominium complex with a huge sign at both front and back entrances that said “No Solicitors.” Only the religious groups ignored the signs and occasionally small children for some school event. The small children I can understand because they did not know what the sign meant. The religious groups mostly said God knows no boundaries. So from the go they start off on the wrong foot.

I happened to be on the subway a few months ago within ear shout of three missionaries. They were taking in such a way to each other that could be described as passing the word to a captive audience. They talked loud enough about God so that nearly everyone within 10 seats could hear them. They go on and carried on from the Mo Chit BTS interchange and were still at it when I got off at Sukhumvit. I got the feeling they were using the subway as a pulpit. That attitude certainly puts a negative spin on even the most positive message. Thank goodness I have security as my apartment here. The ramming religion down your throat approach is very wrong.

Donz, I think you hit the nail on the head. Every war I can think of was for religion or real estate. look at the south.

[ThaiPauly]

There is a BIG diference between Missionaries and Missions

The Christion Missions do fine work for the orphans in BK (Klong Toey for example) and those that do work for those with HIV as already mentioned.

Personally I don't have much time for Missionaries myself. We have a lot of them up here in CM who are "Trying" to "Help" the Karen Hilltribes to "Come to Jesus"

I would imagine that if they are visiting nightclubs in BK (I have never seen that) they must be taking a very big risk with their own personal safety as trying to convert "Drunks" is a very dangerous "mission" I would imagine.

I was sat in a Doctor's surgery a month or so ago and struck up a conversation with the only other farang in the waiting room. We cahtted fine for the first ten minutes then we started to discuss what brought us to Chiang Mai. It was then he told me he was a Missionary and my heart just sunk..I tried my best to change the conversation topic as quickly as possible, and to be fair to the guy he did not give me "The Treatment"..but I could not wait for one of us to be called in to see the Doctor.

Then once I took a night train from BK to CM and we were in a carriage with around 50 of them. Young boys ,no older than 22-23, all with regulation white shirts and balck ties, every one of them sitting quietly throughout the waking hours reading their Bibles.

I was not sure who to feel more sorry for..them or the people they were about to push Jesus on.

[beammeup]

The only harm they do is remind some people that they have wandered off the path. Some of you people must feel pretty guilty to hate them so much. If you dont like what they say just ignore them.

[Oleg_Rus]

I think they are cool. I like loud speaker concept, intentions, courage and self dedication.

Dedication is the word. they don't live in posh hotels, theu go to shit holes and try to establish conversation with m/**f/***s at night venues.

[Donz]

I wonder if they approve of Benny "rip you off" Hinn

[Gary A]

You are free to worship your God anyway you like. Do it in your own way and don't try to push it down anyone else's throat. Worship should be a private thing and no one else's business so just keep it to yourself and don't be bothering other people who are not interested.

Actually I believe that organised religion is the worst threat people have ever faced. From the christian crusades to the muslim madness of today religious freaks have managed to brainwash people to do whatever the freaks want them to do. My God NEVER wrote any fairytale books and he did NOT tell any man to write a book for him.

[John K]

If you think about terrorists they want to force Islam on everyone and kill the non believers. I am sure before they got around to killing people the used a more passive approach. I think that was pre 1970. I read a recent news story about someone who converted from Islam to another religion. That simply carried a death sentence in that country. He was let off the hook but had to flee the country for fear of his life from extremists. By forcing one’s religious beliefs on others could very well be the spark that starts conflicts. The terrorists can’t live with anyone who does not share their beliefs because they wish a pure society. However on that note they can’t even live with themselves and proceed to kill each other too.

To be informed is one thing, to force their will on you is entirely another. Simply I see the Bible thumpers as religious extremists.

Thaipauly I see your point about the flock of boys. I hope they were not forced into spreading the word.

[ThaiPauly]

The only harm they do is remind some people that they have wandered off the path. Some of you people must feel pretty guilty to hate them so much. If you dont like what they say just ignore them.

I do

[dave111223]

Seems to be a lot of posts about "keep it to yourself", but its the nature of the religion not to keep it to youself. If your Christian, and believe all non-believers will end up going to hel_l, then you are obligated to try to hep them.

The thing that does bug me is those "Preaching" who do not actually know enough about the religion to be doing so.

Until you know your religion inside and out stay away from the Preaching, and continue learning. People do have questions, and when the street Preachers just stand there bemused it doesnt really help anyone.

But i'm not sure that Christianity is the same thing in Thailand anyways. My wife got roped into going to a Christian church group meeting and people just kept saying "Do you accept?" , "Do you believe?", despite the fact that no one had yet told her anything about the religion.

She said they just kept saying "Oh My God" repeatedly.

The funniest part of the evening was when some woman said to her:

"You should accept, I accepted and now i always get the good parking space whenever i go to Central"

[tourleadersi]

What I don't understand is that some of them truly believe that the only way you can be saved if you find not only their God, but also their way of worshiping him/her/it!

(Actual conversation I had)

"So let me get this straight. Your God created all people on the earth right? He put small tribes deep in the Rain Forest miles away from anyone. People in the deserts. Remote mountains and on small islands. Then he says "You must find and follow my way or you are all damned to hel_l". Is that how you view it?"

"Thats about right"

"So you believe in a God that has a dark sense of humour then? I mean really, what kind of god would do something as sick as that? And what the hel_l are you doing sitting here drinking that latte? Shouldn't you clearoff to one of these deserts and help them find god instead of telling me, an educated westerner from a Christian Nation about it?"

I am sure if Jesus were around today he wouldn't approve of some of the things that happen here in Thailand. That would possibly include having his message forced upon other people.

[Donz]

Seems to be a lot of posts about "keep it to yourself", but its the nature of the religion not to keep it to youself. If your Christian, and believe all non-believers will end up going to hel_l, then you are obligated to try to hep them.

The thing that does bug me is those "Preaching" who do not actually know enough about the religion to be doing so.

Until you know your religion inside and out stay away from the Preaching, and continue learning. People do have questions, and when the street Preachers just stand there bemused it doesnt really help anyone.

But i'm not sure that Christianity is the same thing in Thailand anyways. My wife got roped into going to a Christian church group meeting and people just kept saying "Do you accept?" , "Do you believe?", despite the fact that no one had yet told her anything about the religion.

She said they just kept saying "Oh My God" repeatedly.

The funniest part of the evening was when some woman said to her:

"You should accept, I accepted and now i always get the good parking space whenever i go to Central"

Im sure if they start preaching that you will go to hel_l if you dont believe around the pubs that they way recieve a few un-expected left hooks and right crosses to the head.

[John K]

Typically I avoid discussions on two topics simply because it causes arguments. They are religion and politics. I have made several posts in recent months in the news clipping section on the political issues in Thailand, but more as pro democracy and taking task with Thaksin mostly because he appears to be very anti democratic in his actions. I don’t see that as political discussions but more as pro freedom and democracy. Politics is a product of democracy.

The topic of this thread was are they helping or hurting their cause. Base on the bulk of the reactions in posts it seems they are hurting it because they are causing conflict. If having a beer and talking with a lady at Big Dogs at Nana plaza will send you to hel_l, then surly causing conflicts will too. They should take a page from their own book and read it. They may want to take a lesson from the Buddhists about everything in moderation. For many the Bible thumpers have already worn out their welcome.

Edited July 31, 2006 by John K