UK pensions-life certificate

[khastan]

In any email I send them I always quote their reference number and my NI number. They know exactly who they are talking too. I suggest the reason they are so reluctant or refuse to correspond by email is like many government departments is for accountability for their actions!

Edited September 22, 2018 by khastan

[beet man]

I asked my bank manger to do it for me . No charge

[simoh1490]

18 minutes ago, khastan said:

In any email I send them I always quote their reference number and my NI number. They know exactly who they are talking too. I suggest the reason they are so reluctant or refuse to correspond by email is like many government departments is for accountability for their actions!

More likely fraud prevention.

[khastan]

It surprised me I can tell you! The lack of efficiency and accountability in many government departments is astounding nowadays and seems to be getting worse. With regards to Wolverhampton mail center. A great deal of DWP correspondence apparently now goes to the Wolverhampton Mail Center. I think the DWP has a contract with the Post Office to open letters and then scan them to computer.

New DWP postal addresses
As you may be aware the DWP now has a contract with the Royal Mail to open letters and scan them onto computer.

As part of this process a lot of the old addresses that you sent mail to have been changed to either "Mail Handling Site A" or "Post Handling Site B".
Both are Wolverhampton addresses BUT there are a range of postcodes for each site depending on just which office the mail is intended for.
So you need to be careful which postcode you use.

Many, but not all, Jobcentres are now also using these Wolverhampton mail opening sites.

Edited September 22, 2018 by khastan
added text

[billd766]

1 hour ago, transam said:

They don't like emails because they don't know who they are "really" talking too...

 

That equally applies to a phone call.

 

It is quite possible to have a sim card cloned.

[Kwasaki]

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

That equally applies to a phone call.

 

It is quite possible to have a sim card cloned.

Come on Bill you go through security check over phone, well I did. 

[transam]

5 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

That equally applies to a phone call.

 

It is quite possible to have a sim card cloned.

They asked me security questions before they would discuss my form arrival..

[billd766]

Just now, Kwasaki said:

Come on Bill you go through security check over phone, well I did. 

 

True, but how many people and agencies have your details on data files which can also be hacked?

 

Do you keep your personal data on your pc which can also be hacked?

[billd766]

1 minute ago, transam said:

They asked me security questions before they would discuss my form arrival..

 

Slow down. I am still replying to your first post.

[simoh1490]

When I spoke with International Pension Centre two months ago they asked me security questions that only they and I would know the answers to, I was seriously impressed and quite taken back, one was, which countries have you lived and worked in!

[OJAS]

19 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

When I spoke with International Pension Centre two months ago they asked me security questions that only they and I would know the answers to, I was seriously impressed and quite taken back, one was, which countries have you lived and worked in!

Makes me seriously wonder why we are expected to go through this Life Certificate malarky then. It seems to me that all IPC need to do is to send us letters periodically asking us to call their phone number for verification purposes by a certain date, or else our State Pension will be stopped. Satisfactory answers on our part to their security questions in the circumstances you describe should surely constitute reasonably sufficient evidence as far as they were concerned that we were still in the land of the living?

[simoh1490]

3 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Makes me seriously wonder why we are expected to go through this Life Certificate malarky then. It seems to me that all IPC need to do is to send us letters periodically asking us to call their phone number for verification purposes by a certain date, or else our State Pension will be stopped. Satisfactory answers on our part to their security questions in the circumstances you describe should surely constitute reasonably sufficient evidence as far as they were concerned that we were still in the land of the living?

I think they regard wet signatures as being the most foolproof method.

[dabhand]

There are other verification processes that they could use.

 

I have recently had to undergo a video verification for an Indian Tax 'Digital Signature Certificate' that enables my company's local tax advisors to sign off our yearly tax return. The initial setup was a bit of a pain, as is most things to do with India, with a need to send notorised documents to prove your identity. A local Pattaya notorisation service was acceptable for this. Then had to download a short video of myself and it was all verified within a couple of days.

 

The other method would be by voice recognition. I contacted one of my UK banks recently and was pleasantly surprised that, instead of the usual security questions rigmarole, I was told that I had passed their security based on my voice matching their system record. 

 

Whilst the video verification might not be suitable for some pensioners, a voice verification process should be quite simple to implement. At least it would certainly help to reduce, if not totally eliminate, the mountains of paper that are currently generated. Having a choice would be good. 

 

So, maybe the UK DWP might eventually join the 21st century?!! 

[transam]

1 minute ago, dabhand said:

There are other verification processes that they could use.

 

I have recently had to undergo a video verification for an Indian Tax 'Digital Signature Certificate' that enables my company's local tax advisors to sign off our yearly tax return. The initial setup was a bit of a pain, as is most things to do with India, with a need to send notorised documents to prove your identity. A local Pattaya notorisation service was acceptable for this. Then had to download a short video of myself and it was all verified within a couple of days.

 

The other method would be by voice recognition. I contacted one of my UK banks recently and was pleasantly surprised that, instead of the usual security questions rigmarole, I was told that I had passed their security based on my voice matching their system record. 

 

Whilst the video verification might not be suitable for some pensioners, a voice verification process should be quite simple to implement. At least it would certainly help to reduce, if not totally eliminate, the mountains of paper that are currently generated. Having a choice would be good. 

 

So, maybe the UK DWP might eventually join the 21st century?!! 

Weeeell, a bit busy with bomb stuff at the mo....☺️

[billd766]

38 minutes ago, OJAS said:

Makes me seriously wonder why we are expected to go through this Life Certificate malarky then. It seems to me that all IPC need to do is to send us letters periodically asking us to call their phone number for verification purposes by a certain date, or else our State Pension will be stopped. Satisfactory answers on our part to their security questions in the circumstances you describe should surely constitute reasonably sufficient evidence as far as they were concerned that we were still in the land of the living?

 

That is a good idea. Probably not acceptable to the mandarins at the DWP though.

 

Or even as "dabhand" at post #493 suggested and video conference link. It may not work for every one though.

[SantiSuk]

DO YOU NEED TO FIND A WITNESS WHO HAS A STAMP AND CAN STAMP YOUR LIFE CERTIFICATE?  NO YOU DO NOT, PER THE PENSION SERVICE

 

This is a perennial question raised on threads about the Life Certificate.

 

A couple of years ago I posted to confirm that I had raised this question with the International Pension Centre and received the answer that the stamping bit by your witness is not an actual requirement.

 

I now have another Life Certificate awaiting response so I refreshed my question to the call centre at the International Pension Centre (tel: +44 191 21 87777). this evening - about 2:00pm UK time. The call centre is based in Newcastle.

 

I received the answer from John in the Newcastle call centre that you can use a person of good standing in the community even if they have no stamp to apply to the certificate. I asked if John would reveal his family name to attach to this verbal representation. He responded that "John in the Newcastle International Pensions Centre" would be sufficient to identify the Pension Service staff member who gave the representation on behalf of The Pension Service.

 

That's good - I can use one of several falang teacher mates or a retired UK professional friend and can tell them with authority that they need not worry about ignoring an apparent requirement of the Certificate that would otherwise appear to be down to them.

 

Let's just celebrate the leniency and not harp on about "so why include it as an apparent requirement in the first place" or "you must have been talking to a Thai government department by mistake .."????

 

 

If anyone wants to clarify anything with them they are helpful and accessible - maybe up to a 5 minute wait so use Skype or similar. They did not require me to identify myself even though the auto response message indicated they would want me to reveal the Nat Insurance No (or maybe whatever other reference number) that is quoted at the top of the Life Certificate request letter. I guess that they would have done so if it were not a generic issue of practice or principle that was under discussion.

Edited November 14, 2018 by SantiSuk

[Jip99]

11 minutes ago, SantiSuk said:

DO YOU NEED TO FIND A WITNESS WHO HAS A STAMP AND CAN STAMP YOUR LIFE CERTIFICATE?  NO YOU DO NOT, PER THE PENSION SERVICE

 

This is a perennial question raised on threads about the Life Certificate.

 

A couple of years ago I posted to confirm that I had raised this question with the International Pension Centre and received the answer that the stamping bit by your witness is not an actual requirement.

 

I now have another Life Certificate awaiting response so I refreshed my question to the call centre at the International Pension Centre (tel: +44 191 21 87777). The call centre is based in Newcastle.

 

I received the answer from John in the Newcastle call centre that you can use a person of good standing in the community even if they have no stamp to apply to the certificate. I asked if John would reveal his family name to attach to this verbal representation. He responded that "John in the Newcastle International Pensions Centre" would be sufficient to identify the Pension Service staff member who gave the representation on behalf of The Pension Service.

 

That's good - I can use one of several falang teacher mates or a retired UK professional friend and can tell them with authority that they need not worry about ignoring an apparent requirement of the Certificate that would otherwise appear to be down to them.

 

Let's just celebrate the leniency and not harp on about "so why include it as an apparent requirement in the first place" or "you must have been talking to a Thai government department by mistake .."????

 

 

If anyone wants to clarify anything with them they are helpful and accessible - maybe up to a 5 minute wait so use Skype or similar. They did not require me to identify myself even though the auto response message indicated they would want me to reveal the Nat Insurance No (or maybe whatever other reference number) that is quoted at the top of the Life Certificate request letter. I guess that they would have done so if it were not a generic issue of practice or principle that was under discussion.

 

 

Spot on.

 

I was told that the general rule is that you if you are eligible to countersign British passport applications we can sign  Life certificates.

 

It is not a Draconian exercise, they are only (quite rightly) ticking their boxes.

[Kwasaki]

9 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Spot on.

 

I was told that the general rule is that you if you are eligible to countersign British passport applications we can sign  Life certificates.

 

It is not a Draconian exercise, they are only (quite rightly) ticking their boxes.

I knew about the ink stamp not being required 5 years ago, it's just a place for a stamp if the person signing has one.

[MartinL]

I've signed a number of Life Certificates over the years, for both UK state and private pensions. I've never had a stamp to apply to the form but just quoted ' ... retired former Member of (engineering institution) ... '. No certificate has ever been rejected. Maybe they check with the organisation mentioned, maybe not, I've no idea.

 

Same applies for passport applications and renewals I've signed.

 

I've noticed that, for my private pensions (not yet old enough for UK state pension), if I've communicated with the pension provider for any reason in the last year or so, I don't get a Life Certificate request from them. Could DWP work on a similar basis?

[Kwasaki]

14 minutes ago, MartinL said:

I've noticed that, for my private pensions (not yet old enough for UK state pension), if I've communicated with the pension provider for any reason in the last year or so, I don't get a Life Certificate request from them. Could DWP work on a similar basis?

My private pensions have never sent me a Life Certificate request I think they just check with the UK bank maybe or with the UK IPC.

I haven't had a Life Certificate request from IPC for nearly 5 years maybe because I'm on Facebook. ????

[stereolab]

On ‎9‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 1:47 PM, dabhand said:

There are other verification processes that they could use.

 

I have recently had to undergo a video verification for an Indian Tax 'Digital Signature Certificate' that enables my company's local tax advisors to sign off our yearly tax return. The initial setup was a bit of a pain, as is most things to do with India, with a need to send notorised documents to prove your identity. A local Pattaya notorisation service was acceptable for this. Then had to download a short video of myself and it was all verified within a couple of days.

 

The other method would be by voice recognition. I contacted one of my UK banks recently and was pleasantly surprised that, instead of the usual security questions rigmarole, I was told that I had passed their security based on my voice matching their system record. 

 

Whilst the video verification might not be suitable for some pensioners, a voice verification process should be quite simple to implement. At least it would certainly help to reduce, if not totally eliminate, the mountains of paper that are currently generated. Having a choice would be good. 

 

So, maybe the UK DWP might eventually join the 21st century?!! 

Fully agree on the Voice Verification option. It would certainly be of use to the older pensioner. They should give this as an option when checking on proof of Life, as mail from the UK still continues to go missing. My initial letter confirming I would receive the full UK pension never arrived. I called but they said not to worry as everything had been set up and that my payments were scheduled to commence. They did. 

[OJAS]

On 11/15/2018 at 6:40 AM, Kwasaki said:

I knew about the ink stamp not being required 5 years ago, it's just a place for a stamp if the person signing has one.

I am, however, in some difficulty in understanding the purpose of including a box in the form for a stamp which is not actually required!

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, OJAS said:

I am, however, in some difficulty in understanding the purpose of including a box in the form for a stamp which is not actually required!

Don't see why not understanding it's a place on the form for a rubber address stamp for the person signing if they have one, it doesn't say it's a requirement.

[OJAS]

8 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Don't see why not understanding it's a place on the form for a rubber address stamp for the person signing if they have one, it doesn't say it's a requirement.

But it doesn't say it's optional either!

[Kwasaki]

11 hours ago, OJAS said:

But it doesn't say it's optional either!

Nor is jumping off a balcony.

Never had trouble signing 2 forms.

If your so bother telephone IPC or DWP and ask them there very helpful.

[Kwasaki]

8 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Nor is jumping off a balcony.

Never had trouble signing 2 forms.

If your so bother telephone IPC or DWP and ask them there very helpful.

Dunno what the confusion is pretty straight forward.

[SantiSuk]

On 11/16/2018 at 3:39 PM, Kwasaki said:

Don't see why not understanding it's a place on the form for a rubber address stamp for the person signing if they have one, it doesn't say it's a requirement.

I doesn't specifically say it's a requirement, but IMO it implies it's a requirement. As a witness one is required to sign a form which says 'I have applied my stamp' (or something similar - haven't got the form in front of me right now. It does not say 'if available' or 'where appropriate' or indicate any optionality/exclusion.

 

I feel uncomfortable asking someone to sign the form as it stands just saying "don't bother about that bit", which is why I check with the International Pensions Service to ensure they are still not concerned about having no stamp so that I can reinforce my 'don't bother' statement. Others also clearly bother about it which is why I posted the details of my contact with IPS.

[Kwasaki]

9 hours ago, SantiSuk said:

Others also clearly bother about it which is why I posted the details of my contact with IPC.

That's why have said in previous posts I don't have a stamp and had no problem, if you don't believe me ring em up.

Edited November 18, 2018 by Kwasaki

[transam]

10 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

That's why have said in previous posts I don't have a stamp and had no problem, if you don't believe me ring em up.

My first farang witness never had a stamp as he was retired, the rest were witnessed by a farang friend with a business in LOS that had a rubber stamp, all were accepted....????

[p414]

I used a police officer [friend of my wife] he signed and stamped it ..2 years ago.