Thai Charter writing: CDC's new political system slammed

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#27 Your first point: I don't believe that the monarchy is primarily upheld by military and I am convinced that we Thais still would have a Monarchy in case our military would disappear. Your second point: According to our previous constitution everybody was equal on front of the law, the problem was it wasn't enforced.

Without military monarchy is impossible. What do you think this is, 'Liliput' (oh, right ...). And:

I am convinced that we Thais still would have a Monarchy in case our military would disappear

Besides the point you appear to have appointed yourself (s'catching here ...) spokes woman for all Thais, I can assure you this is most certainly not the case. But hey, can't go down that road can we. And:

According to our previous constitution everybody was equal on front of the law, the problem was it wasn't enforced.

You can take the man/woman out of thailand, but apparently not Thailand out of the Thai.

Pointless discussion which cannot be fully explored for my two aforesaid points. Been nice chatting with you

[whybother]

Critics see proposal as a move to extend junta's tenure;

That's why the Germans use the system, right?

Thats a gross excuse for argument, in fact it is beneath you. Care to explain how german electoral systems are relevant to the desire of the Thai people it would appear to avoid having to rely anything but the vote. More simply, to decide on the system that works for them, not dependent on "Good People" Or the powers that be?

I could be wrong, though it appears to be the case that Germany is not Thailand, nor is Thailand a clone of Germany now or at anytime.

Maybe you missed the news, but the CDC are proposing to use a system used in Germany for the lower house.

[Fatty123]

Critics see proposal as a move to extend junta's tenure;

That's why the Germans use the system, right?

come on, this isn't really the German system, right?

It's got similarities with the one in the 1930s.

[sjaak327]

Critics see proposal as a move to extend junta's tenure;

That's why the Germans use the system, right?

Thats a gross excuse for argument, in fact it is beneath you. Care to explain how german electoral systems are relevant to the desire of the Thai people it would appear to avoid having to rely anything but the vote. More simply, to decide on the system that works for them, not dependent on "Good People" Or the powers that be?

I could be wrong, though it appears to be the case that Germany is not Thailand, nor is Thailand a clone of Germany now or at anytime.

Maybe you missed the news, but the CDC are proposing to use a system used in Germany for the lower house.

Most of the criticism isn't about the lower house. The criticism handles the senate and the outsider PM. I personally see no problems with the outsider PM providing he would be selected by the lower house. I do see a huge problem in the way they propose to populate the senate.

[rubl]

#27 Your first point: I don't believe that the monarchy is primarily upheld by military and I am convinced that we Thais still would have a Monarchy in case our military would disappear. Your second point: According to our previous constitution everybody was equal on front of the law, the problem was it wasn't enforced.

Without military monarchy is impossible. What do you think this is, 'Liliput' (oh, right ...). And:

I am convinced that we Thais still would have a Monarchy in case our military would disappear

Besides the point you appear to have appointed yourself (s'catching here ...) spokes woman for all Thais, I can assure you this is most certainly not the case. But hey, can't go down that road can we. And:

According to our previous constitution everybody was equal on front of the law, the problem was it wasn't enforced.

You can take the man/woman out of thailand, but apparently not Thailand out of the Thai.

Pointless discussion which cannot be fully explored for my two aforesaid points. Been nice chatting with you

If without Military Monarchy is impossible, you might have a closer look at other countries with a Monarchy. Maybe the Netherlands, or the UK?

[tomacht8]

No matter what kind of electoral system exists, the basic requirement is that only honest people are selectable,
which are willing to have a full scrutiny about their past and their finances including a public review of the origin of assets with
matching tax declarations before they come on election lists.

No criminals and/or corrupt people on electoral lists!

No criminals and/or corrupt people in government, parliament or as a civil servant!

Excluded are all persons from Parliament and from electoral lists which

a have criminal records.

b running free on bail.

c were already banned from parliament in the past.

d against are corruption or crime cases opened.

Important is, to make it impossible for all criminals and corrupt people to have access to public offices or public money.

[ThaiUser]

# 31

First of all this isnt Liliput but a sovereign state and:

I havent appointed myself as spokes woman for all Thais but I said that I am convinced that without the military we still would have a Monarchy. That doesnt mean that I am right because the problem with beliefs is that you hold something to be true of which you dont have any evidence. My conviction is based on the fact that I speak to Thai people in our own language from Thai to Thai and maybe we are more open against each others as we would be with foreigners (I dont like the expression farang because it would label my husband too).

But hey, cant do down that road can we? I wouldnt know what road that would be. Abandon my beliefs and accept your point of view without challenging it or stand my ground and argue my point, which you dont seem to like?

Your last 2 sentences on its own are insults because it shows how you feel about Thai people and the country. I have read comments here by Europeans or Americans and that they are proud of their heritage and stand up for their country. Why should we be less valued as you, a guest in this country?

The point with discussions is that you argue your convictions. That engulfs listening to the other party or parties involved and after that you put your arguments forward. Saying that a discussion is pointless is the stand of a person that has no convincing arguments or knows that he might be wrong.

Still, have a Happy New Year and best wishes from me.

[ThaiUser]

# 31 First of all this isnt Liliput but a sovereign state and:

I havent appointed myself as spokes woman for all Thais but I said that I am convinced that without the military we still would have a Monarchy. That doesnt mean that I am right because the problem with beliefs is that you hold something to be true of which you dont have any evidence. My conviction is based on the fact that I speak to Thai people in our own language from Thai to Thai and maybe we are more open against each others as we would be with foreigners (I dont like the expression farang because it would label my husband too).

"But hey, cant go down that road can we?" I wouldnt know what road that would be. Abandon my beliefs and accept your point of view without challenging it or stand my ground and argue my point, which you dont seem to like? Your last 2 sentences on its own are insults because it shows how you feel about Thai people and the country. I have read comments here by Europeans or Americans and that they are proud of their heritage and stand up for their country. Why should we be less valued as you, a guest in this country? The point with discussions is that you argue your convictions. That engulfs listening to the other party or parties involved and after that you put your arguments forward. Saying that a discussion is pointless is the stand of a person that has no convincing arguments or knows that he might be wrong. Still, have a Happy New Year and best wishes from me.

[smedly]

No matter what kind of electoral system exists, the basic requirement is that only honest people are selectable,

which are willing to have a full scrutiny about their past and their finances including a public review of the origin of assets with

matching tax declarations before they come on election lists.

No criminals and/or corrupt people on electoral lists!

No criminals and/or corrupt people in government, parliament or as a civil servant!

Excluded are all persons from Parliament and from electoral lists which

a have criminal records.

b running free on bail.

c were already banned from parliament in the past.

d against are corruption or crime cases opened.

Important is, to make it impossible for all criminals and corrupt people to have access to public offices or public money.

I agree with you 100%, probably one of the most sensible posts this year

who is going to be left lol

it excludes an awful lot of people but you are absolutely correct

[heybruce]

People need to understand the whole reason for the coup and this new constitution is to limit the power of one political party. Anyone who believes otherwise is fools.

Anyone who believes that limiting the power of Thaksin affiliated parties was the only reason for the coup is a fool

[heybruce]

Unless the people have the right to vote for all positions vacant in the parliament it is nothing other than a upmarket Junta ,where is the reform Democracy , the people of Thailand should be by now voicing their concerns that unelected persons can call the tune in the running of Thailand , this is precisely what you don't need and any idiot can see that this will cause problems in the future, corruption only being one of them, then again the word is - control.

do you honestly want to have a party like PT sitting in office again after the last debacle - I think not

I could go on but most people understand what they did - tried to do - cost the Thai people and if they had been allowed to continue god knows how it would have ended up - lies - corruption - power abuse on a scale never seen before in this countries recent history, not to mention all at the behest of a billionaire convicted criminal living abroad currently on the run from justice - and he was as everybody knows the defacto PM

Previous debacles were caused by the party that was not in power refusing to accept the results of past elections. Until the Democrats and the elites accept the choices of the voters there will be no democracy in Thailand.

[heybruce]

No matter what kind of electoral system exists, the basic requirement is that only honest people are selectable,

which are willing to have a full scrutiny about their past and their finances including a public review of the origin of assets with

matching tax declarations before they come on election lists.

No criminals and/or corrupt people on electoral lists!

No criminals and/or corrupt people in government, parliament or as a civil servant!

Excluded are all persons from Parliament and from electoral lists which

a have criminal records.

b running free on bail.

c were already banned from parliament in the past.

d against are corruption or crime cases opened.

Important is, to make it impossible for all criminals and corrupt people to have access to public offices or public money.

Shall we add "Staged a coup" to the list?

[chainarong]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Unless the people have the right to vote for all positions vacant in the parliament it is nothing other than a upmarket Junta ,where is the reform Democracy , the people of Thailand should be by now voicing their concerns that unelected persons can call the tune in the running of Thailand , this is precisely what you don't need and any idiot can see that this will cause problems in the future, corruption only being one of them, then again the word is - control. width=32 alt=coffee1.gif>

do you honestly want to have a party like PT sitting in office again after the last debacle - I think not

I could go on but most people understand what they did - tried to do - cost the Thai people and if they had been allowed to continue god knows how it would have ended up - lies - corruption - power abuse on a scale never seen before in this countries recent history, not to mention all at the behest of a billionaire convicted criminal living abroad currently on the run from justice - and he was as everybody knows the defacto PM

I didn't read chainarong's post as advocating Taksin should have been allowed to continue his go at the trough. I do wish posters would get over him, it's boring and not at all pertinent to where this country goes from here.

Chainarong does indeed raise some very salient points in that the people of Thailand, who appear to be a side issue as far as all players/posters are concerned, do not now have a voice as to how their country should be run. There will therefore of course be problems the longer this situation is allowed to continue. How can it be otherwise? How many countries of Thailand's similar good standing have allowed themselves to be controlled/surpressed in perpetuity? North Korea and certain African countries were always undeveloped and therefore vulnerable to this type of mass takeover. Doubt the Thais would stand for being pushed too far once ever more draconian measures by a drunk with power mob (of whichever stripe) inevitably step over the line.

Thankyou for your support, the main factor as you rightly point out is the people have now been silenced in the CDC model , lots of good people (400 Students) over the decades gave their life to move forward with democracy, now Thailand takes a step backwards back to the Junta era , as for my support, I am in Abhisit (Marks ) camp,(Big Time) as for electing bad governments, look no further than Australia , the people get what they voted for , they never got there by people like General Prayut -o casting he's vote. HNY Thailand.

[jpeg]

If without Military Monarchy is impossible, you might have a closer look at other countries with a Monarchy. Maybe the Netherlands, or the UK?

BUT This country is most certainly NOT a First World country with First World mores and thinking. Is it

Dear God ...

[rubl]

If without Military Monarchy is impossible, you might have a closer look at other countries with a Monarchy. Maybe the Netherlands, or the UK?

BUT This country is most certainly NOT a First World country with First World mores and thinking. Is it

Dear God ...

You just confirmed that a lot of comments here are meaningless as they are reasoned from a First World perspective which doesn't apply to Thailand.

[aussieinthailand]

the ones making the most noise about this are the ptp/reds/thaksin lovers because they know it will stop them from being able to hold sway over the country. Thaksin will be totally peeved with the idea he will not be able to run things in Thailand and all his paid minions are bleating about it for him because they can see an end to their pay packets. Anything that is good for the thai people is not good for thaksin and the ptp/reds.

"Anything that is good for the Thai people is not good for thaksin and the ptp/reds."

Care to back that up with facts?

Mr T put several things in place that greatly improved many many Thai peoples living standards,

A few facts for you.

: The first universal health care program, the 30 baht scheme, now the poor are not being just left to die or sell the family farm to save the life of a family member.

: Reducing rural poverty be half in four years.

: Swapy airport massive improvement on D/M airport.

: Low interest loans to start a new mum and dad businesses, that really cut into the loan sharks market.

: Lowering the public sector dept from 57% GDP to 41%, Think that was good for Thai people don't you?

: investing in public transport and roads.

GEEEZZZZZ no bloody wonder the poor rural farmers like him so much, Finally some one was taking them seriously and doing something for them and not just for those in the south and BKK.

So again your statement shows you either have no idea, or so blinded by contempt that you choose not to see the facts as they quite clearly are...

You don't like the man or his policy's that's cool but please try to stick with the facts, difficult as it may be for the bias but give it a crack.

Happy new year cheers

[jpeg]

# 31 First of all this isnt Liliput but a sovereign state and: I havent appointed myself as spokes woman for all Thais but I said that I am convinced that without the military we still would have a Monarchy. That doesnt mean that I am right because the problem with beliefs is that you hold something to be true of which you dont have any evidence. My conviction is based on the fact that I speak to Thai people in our own language from Thai to Thai and maybe we are more open against each others as we would be with foreigners (I dont like the expression farang because it would label my husband too). But hey, cant do down that road can we? I wouldnt know what road that would be. Abandon my beliefs and accept your point of view without challenging it or stand my ground and argue my point, which you dont seem to like? Your last 2 sentences on its own are insults because it shows how you feel about Thai people and the country. I have read comments here by Europeans or Americans and that they are proud of their heritage and stand up for their country. Why should we be less valued as you, a guest in this country? The point with discussions is that you argue your convictions. That engulfs listening to the other party or parties involved and after that you put your arguments forward. Saying that a discussion is pointless is the stand of a person that has no convincing arguments or knows that he might be wrong. Still, have a Happy New Year and best wishes from me.

Your proficiency in English has already pointed you out to have either been educated in the West OR married to a native (admitted) of that particular country and, presumably have taken up residence there? Do you feel like a 'guest'? Have you been able to gain Citizenship/Resident status from your 'farang' husband's country?

[ThaiUser]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

# 31 First of all this isnt Liliput but a sovereign state and: I havent appointed myself as spokes woman for all Thais but I said that I am convinced that without the military we still would have a Monarchy. That doesnt mean that I am right because the problem with beliefs is that you hold something to be true of which you dont have any evidence. My conviction is based on the fact that I speak to Thai people in our own language from Thai to Thai and maybe we are more open against each others as we would be with foreigners (I dont like the expression farang because it would label my husband too). But hey, cant do down that road can we? I wouldnt know what road that would be. Abandon my beliefs and accept your point of view without challenging it or stand my ground and argue my point, which you dont seem to like? Your last 2 sentences on its own are insults because it shows how you feel about Thai people and the country. I have read comments here by Europeans or Americans and that they are proud of their heritage and stand up for their country. Why should we be less valued as you, a guest in this country? The point with discussions is that you argue your convictions. That engulfs listening to the other party or parties involved and after that you put your arguments forward. Saying that a discussion is pointless is the stand of a person that has no convincing arguments or knows that he might be wrong. Still, have a Happy New Year and best wishes from me.

Your proficiency in English has already pointed you out to have either been educated in the West OR married to a native (admitted) of that particular country and, presumably have taken up residence there? Do you feel like a 'guest'? Have you been able to gain Citizenship/Resident status from your 'farang' husband's country?

I have not been educated in the West but have been married to a European now for 20 years (his mother Dutch, father German, one grandmother French). I have lived in Europe and the UK for over 20 years before returning to Thailand in 2006. I left school in Thailand when I was fourteen years old to work in the fields and that is the only school certificate I hold.

But one thing I have never been satisfied with was the level of education I had and the knowledge I had gained. I also worked my entire life (not that I had to but I wanted too) and in the UK I started in a Thai restaurant kitchen as a junior chef working my way up to become a partner in that business. From my mid twenties I annoyed my husband to show me how to program computers (he is an IT consultant) and today I write my own software and if I am permitted to say so not without success.

Yes I hold dual nationality but not because of my husband; speaking Dutch and German too I would be entitled to a German passport after being married to my husband for that long. I gained my dual nationality in the UK during my time working there and getting involved in children and educational projects and it was the Member of Parliament for that constituency that brought the matter up and suggest that I should apply for British citizenship since I had and was still contributing to society.

Do I feel as a guest? Not really but more like an unwanted alien as I discovered last year (2014) when I went back to the UK for 6 month to visit friends and family over there.

[jcisco]

Critics see proposal as a move to extend junta's tenure;

That's why the Germans use the system, right?

Thats a gross excuse for argument, in fact it is beneath you. Care to explain how german electoral systems are relevant to the desire of the Thai people it would appear to avoid having to rely anything but the vote. More simply, to decide on the system that works for them, not dependent on "Good People" Or the powers that be?

I could be wrong, though it appears to be the case that Germany is not Thailand, nor is Thailand a clone of Germany now or at anytime.

Maybe you missed the news, but the CDC are proposing to use a system used in Germany for the lower house.

I already aware of that, however my point was well, its been made.

[whybother]

I already aware of that, however my point was well, its been made.

OK. Hopefully I can find someone to explain your point to me, because I have no idea what it was.

Edited January 1, 2015 by whybother