Visa Terminology is important

[Jaggg88]

Yes have to agree with you. Ubonjoe is doing a great job.. It is also very common that people in general just refuse to use the proper terms and words for what is what... Retirement-VISA is VERY common, there is no retirement-VISA but they just never stop.. it is being called extenstion of stay... and so on.....

Glegolo

Immigration staff at Chiang Mai certainly refer to an extension as "retirement visa".

and you can obtain a 'retirement visa (multi entry)' from outside Thailand so I'm not surprised the newbies get confused

[koolaukid]

Hello All,

I'm a 60 year old American living in Hawaii, getting ready to attempt retirement in Bangkok and have been following ThaiVisa for months trying to learn the best strategy for doing so. I used to own a business importing rattan furniture from the Philippines and Indonesia, so I have some exposure to Asia but don't have a lot of experience with Thailand. I hope to use Thailand as a base from which to travel and explore the region while retaining an apartment in Bangkok.

It has been a bit of a struggle trying to understand the process and requirements required to enter and stay in Thailand. This thread has been very helpful in helping me understand what is needed and in what sequence. The problem is, as the first poster mentioned, inconsistent terminology and to a lesser degree, the differences in requirements for different nationalities. Thank you UbonJoe and laislica as well as others for taking the time to make this clear.

My understanding is that I need to apply for a 60 day Tourist double entry Visa from the Los Angeles Consulate prior to departing the US. By leveraging the Tourist Visa correctly, I should be able to stay for a total of 180 days. Within the last 30 days of my Tourist Visa I should start applying for a Retirement Extension. Toward this end, I'm securing a criminal background check and medical check. When granted, I also purchase a multiple entry permit so I can continue traveling. From there on, the Retirement Extension is good for a year but as always, I've got to report my location every 90 days.

That sound about right?

[Maestro]

Yes, you got the terminology and the sequence of events right, with two exceptions: for the application for the retirement extension at your local immigration office, no criminal background check and no medical check is required. These two requirements would be for an application for a non-O/A (long-stay) visa at a Thai consulate.

[ubonjoe]

Hello All,

I'm a 60 year old American living in Hawaii, getting ready to attempt retirement in Bangkok and have been following ThaiVisa for months trying to learn the best strategy for doing so. I used to own a business importing rattan furniture from the Philippines and Indonesia, so I have some exposure to Asia but don't have a lot of experience with Thailand. I hope to use Thailand as a base from which to travel and explore the region while retaining an apartment in Bangkok.

It has been a bit of a struggle trying to understand the process and requirements required to enter and stay in Thailand. This thread has been very helpful in helping me understand what is needed and in what sequence. The problem is, as the first poster mentioned, inconsistent terminology and to a lesser degree, the differences in requirements for different nationalities. Thank you UbonJoe and laislica as well as others for taking the time to make this clear.

My understanding is that I need to apply for a 60 day Tourist double entry Visa from the Los Angeles Consulate prior to departing the US. By leveraging the Tourist Visa correctly, I should be able to stay for a total of 180 days. Within the last 30 days of my Tourist Visa I should start applying for a Retirement Extension. Toward this end, I'm securing a criminal background check and medical check. When granted, I also purchase a multiple entry permit so I can continue traveling. From there on, the Retirement Extension is good for a year but as always, I've got to report my location every 90 days.

That sound about right?

Since you are in Hawaii you can get a single entry non-o visa at the honorary Thai consulate in Honolulu. Then you could apply for your extension of stay during the last 30 day of the 90 entry you will get from your visa. Contact info follows.

HAWAII ROYAL THAI HONORARY CONSULATE-GENERAL

1035 Kikowaena Place Honolulu, HI 96819

Tel : (808) 524-7787 Fax : (808) 523-0044

E-mail : [email protected]

www.thaiconsulatehi.org

Honorary Consul-General, MR. COLIN MIYABARA

No medical or background check will be need to apply for an extension of stay.

[JimGant]

As Joe says, getting a Non Imm O before you even leave the States is a better option than a tourist visa (saves at least one trip to Immigration for the conversion). And by your name, it sounds like you live on Oahu, so an in-person trip to the honorary consulate works out, because most honorary consulates won't do mail applications, as this notice on the Houston site indicates:

Per new instructions from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Kingdom of Thailand we are not accepting visa applications by mail or Fed Ex until further notice. All applications must be made in person.

Toward this end, I'm securing a criminal background check and medical check.

If you're well on your way on that path (or the cop and cough checks are easy to do), you should consider a mail application to the Thai Embassy DC for a Non Imm O-A "long stay" visa. As reported a zillion times on this forum, such a visa will give you nearly two years of stay, with only one trip ever required to Immigration, and that for your re-entry permit in the second year, after your visa expires (90 day reports can be done by mail, or soon via the internet (we hope)).

I recommend DC over LA, 'cause for sure DC doesn't require any pesky notarizations. LA maybe not too -- but the jury is still out with them. So if you're going to do a mail application anyway, use DC.

[koolaukid]

So I call the Thai Consulate here in Honolulu, they tell me they don't do visas at all and refer me to the Los Angeles Consulate.

End up speaking to someone there, I explain my circumstances and he tells me to just get a "retirement visa". He said that because a retirement visa isn't available in Thailand it would be best were I to get one before I go. Is it possible to get a Non-Immigrant "O" and a retirement extension at the same time?

[Maestro]

There is no such thing as a "retirement visa"

The non-o visa is issued by a Thai consulate, ie outside Thailand. The retirement extension is issued by your local immigration office in Thailand. Therefore, it is not possible to get both at the same time. Get the visa, travel to Thailand, then get the extension.

[koolaukid]

Thank you again.

Wish me luck, I'm going in!

Scott

[ubonjoe]

So I call the Thai Consulate here in Honolulu, they tell me they don't do visas at all and refer me to the Los Angeles Consulate.

End up speaking to someone there, I explain my circumstances and he tells me to just get a "retirement visa". He said that because a retirement visa isn't available in Thailand it would be best were I to get one before I go. Is it possible to get a Non-Immigrant "O" and a retirement extension at the same time?

Did you ask about a single entry non-o visa or a retirement visa. I think they thought you were asking for a OA visa which they cannot do. There have been reports of them doing non-o visas. both single and multiple entry.

[JimGant]

Yes, LA won't issue a Non Imm O visa for the purposes of retirement -- and neither will the other three MFA consulates -- Chicago, NY, and DC. Instead, they'll direct you to apply for a Non Imm O-A "long stay" visa, commonly referred to as a "retirement visa." So, yeah, the person you spoke to in LA gave you the standard guidance, i.e., apply for the Non Imm O-A "retirement visa."

But, if you do this by mail, as previously said, DC is a better choice.

HNL may, in fact, not issue Non Imm O visas for the purpose of retirement. Many honorary consulates won't, including, for sure, Houston, as I found out with a direct inquiry. Portland, however, will issue such visas (or at least they have in the immediate past).

As the title of this thread suggests, HNL may have misunderstood your request for a 'Non Imm visa for the purpose of retirement,' thinking, as Joe said, a request for a Non Imm O-A visa (which, as of a few years back, the honorary consulates could no longer issue). But, if you're still kicking around Oahu, it might be worth another phone call to the HNL consulate to see if they understand your request is for only the Non Imm O visa (which, of course, they do issue -- but maybe not for the purpose of retirement).

[JimGant]

End up speaking to someone there, I explain my circumstances and he tells me to just get a "retirement visa". He said that because a retirement visa isn't available in Thailand it would be best were I to get one before I go. Is it possible to get a Non-Immigrant "O" and a retirement extension at the same time?

Re-reading the above, it sounds like visa terminology has, indeed, confused you. As said, the LA guy was recommending a Non Imm O-A visa. But it sounds like you believe he'll issue a Non Imm O visa, with a retirement extension attached. Easy to see why one could conclude that -- because the end result is the same, namely a Non Immigrant visa leading to a one-year permission of stay. Only the Non Imm O-A visa pre-approves that one-year extension, thus you get the one-year stamp when you go thru immigration at the airport. (With the Non Imm O visa, you'll get a 90 day stamp at the airport, then must get your retirement financial requirement in order, then visit Immigration in Thailand to get your one-year extension.)

If you already understand the above, I apologize. If not, suggest you visit the many threads comparing both methods of one-year stays in Thailand. In a nutshell, the O-A avenue requires the medical and police reports, while the O avenue, with in-country application for extension, does not. But the O-A (only issued as a multi-entry) gives you nearly two years in Thailand, with no in-country financials required -- and no visits to Immigration (unless you need a re-entry permit in year two).

Good luck.

[koolaukid]

Jim, thanks for taking the time to clarify that. Some of this stuff just leaves me scratching my head.

Called the Honolulu Consulate again, spoke to Nohea, who was very helpful (and spoke marvelous English). Honolulu does provide "O" visas but not "O-A". To avoid the travel requirements of an "O" visa, the "O-A" visa is preferable, I already ordered the federal criminal clearance 60 days ago so will wait for that and apply through the Washington DC office instead of Los Angeles.

I'm a little leery about leaving $26K in a Thai bank and would prefer to prove my income which comes from rental properties I own. What would be the best way to prove this income when applying for an "O-A"?

[JimGant]

I'm a little leery about leaving $26K in a Thai bank and would prefer to prove my income which comes from rental properties I own. What would be the best way to prove this income when applying for an "O-A"?

Ah, another feature of the O-A visa is -- financial requirements are strictly from Stateside sources (no Thai bank account needed). Do you have financial accounts with the required $25k in Stateside financial institutions? If not totaling $25k, you can combine with income proof to reach the 800k baht equivalent. Not 100% sure how Thai Embassy DC would like to see the rental income proof shown -- but I would overwhelm them with contracts, Sched E's, etc -- with a cover letter explaining it all.

Their website has a medical form to download, if you haven't already done so. Also, the site has some misinformation, namely:

Upon arrival, holder of this type of visa [O-A]will be permitted to stay in Thailand for 1 year from the date of first entry. During the one-year period, if he or she wishes to leave and re-enter the country, he or she is required to apply at the Immigration office for re-entry permit (single or multiple) before departure.

Not true. This dates back to when O-A visas were single entry. They're now all multi-entry, thus valid for one year, and per definition, multiple entries. So, during its one year validity, you can come and go as many times as you like, with no requirement for a re-entry permit -- since the valid visa is its own re-entry permit (one-year permitted per each and every entry). But, take a trip out and in near the visa's expiration date -- to get another (and last) one-year permission of stay stamp from the border/airport immigration folks. Then, yeah, per the Embassy' guidance, you'll now need to make that one trip to Immigration to get a re-entry permit, assuming you want to leave Thailand during year two.

Did the HNL consulate say you could get Non Imm O visa for the purposes of retirement? Just curious, as that avenue does suit some folks who'd rather not go with the medical/police requirement.

Aloha (10 years Foster Village)

[koolaukid]

Honolulu did say we could apply for an Non Imm "O" for retirement through them. For whatever reason they just don't do the "O-A"s there.

Didn't realize that an "O-A" visa would consider funds in US banks. That, along with reduced border runs are enormous benefits. And since we mailed away for the federal criminal clearance about 60 days ago, we should be expecting that soon.

So I guess I'll be pursuing the "O-A" through the Washington DC embassy.

This thread has helped me again. Thank you.

Scott

[Maestro]

We shouldn't really be discussing individual visa questions in this particular topic, which is about the importance of the correct use of terminology in a general sense, but I am happy to know that in your case the confusion about the meaningless term of "retirement visa" got cleared up.

Meaningless, in this context, means that different people use the same term to mean different things, so much so that in the end the term has no specific meaning, and in this particular case never had a clearly defined meaning from the beginning.

[JimGant]

Kool, you said "we." Do you mean a non-Thai wife? If so, will she be independently applying for her own O-A visa? No problem, if she meets the financials independently, plus her own police and medical report. But see this thread, particularly item #16:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/724100-us-citizen-applying-for-retirement-visa-for-the-first-time/

For whatever reason (like, not enough financials for both), if you want your non-Thai spouse to piggyback off your one-year retirement permit of stay, the Non Imm O, with in-country extension route is best. I haven't the foggiest why, but UbonJoe can tell you.

Anyway, nice to know HNL *does* isssue Non Imm visas for the purpose of retirement.

[Maestro]

That's another reason why this talk about a member's application for a non-O/A visa should be a separate topic.