Cholestreol management

[FNQ]

Hi

I am trying to determine what statins preferably generic brands in Lue of Lipitor that are available in Thailand and their costs . I currently use an Atorvastatin (Sandoz) cant find here.

current forums are 2013 and I think there was some changes since re availability and costs ?

Thanks in advance

P.S Herbal info welcome also.

[lopburi3]

If by here you mean Thailand Sandoz 10mg Atorvastastin (white pill) is proscribed to me by Vejthani Hospital for the last year; so it is available. (but not cheap - almost as much as Lipitor).

For a cheaper statin many use Bestatin but it is not the same at Lipitor

[muskoka]

P.S Herbal info welcome also.

I would be a bit concerned about the side effects of statin drugs as described here

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/high-blood-cholesterol/in-depth/statin-side-effects/art-20046013

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/10717431/Why-Ive-ditched-statins-for-good.html

some herbal ideas would include (I just did a quick google search for - "thai herbs for cholestreol" ), some results below of some products easily available throughout Thailand, lots of info out there - Doug

http://www.gaiaherbs.com/articles/detail/42/The-Surprising-Health-Benefits-of-Hibiscus

http://www.jiaogulan.com/cholesterol.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gynostemma_pentaphyllum

http://lowcholesterol-dietplan.com/cholesterol-lowering-herbs/

[sfokevin]

I used Lipitor for years (20mg/day)... When I moved here I switched to Bestatin (40mg/day - Twice the mg)...

Works just as well and is inexpensive and readily available ;-)

[FNQ]

I used Lipitor for years (20mg/day)... When I moved here I switched to Bestatin (40mg/day - Twice the mg)...

Works just as well and is inexpensive and readily available ;-)

What are you paying for the 40mg Bestatin ?

[Sheryl]

Yes, many local brands of simvastatin and quite cheap.

[sfokevin]

I used Lipitor for years (20mg/day)... When I moved here I switched to Bestatin (40mg/day - Twice the mg)...

Works just as well and is inexpensive and readily available ;-)

What are you paying for the 40mg Bestatin ?

I think it's 60 baht for a strip with 10 pills

[Jingthing]

Don't even think about going off statins without close medical supervision and just checking out some herbs. That's one of the issues with statins in the first place. Once you're on them, there is medical risk to stop them, and yes that even means significant increase in risk of death.

[NickJ]

JT is 100% right. However.......I was faced with high cholesterol for the first time in my life six months ago......rather than start a drug protocol I would have to be on for pretty much ever I Changed a few things....Oatmeal for breakfast....uncooked with non fat milk and honey......two juice shakes a day.....kale carrot bitter mellon....tastes like i am eating my yard clippings.......got rid of shit cheese and meat....I figure i have the money so when I eat meat or cheese i will only eat hi quality. I increased my intake of superfoods.....kim chi almonds wheat grass....shitake green tea.......after three months.....back to normal........

[Sandman77]

I stop using medicine for high cholesterol, to many side effects

I visit a Chinese doctor in Chiang mai and drink now chinese herbal tea to take cholestoral out body

It helps when you drink every day 3 month directly from Mother Nature !

If needed I can post a picture of the tea bag

[Issangeorge]

I stop using medicine for high cholesterol, to many side effects

I visit a Chinese doctor in Chiang mai and drink now chinese herbal tea to take cholestoral out body

It helps when you drink every day 3 month directly from Mother Nature !

If needed I can post a picture of the tea bag

Please do, my cholesterol is a little high, but I refuse to go the pharmaceutical route, however I would like to get it down, thanks.

[Jingthing]

There are strong pros and cons to going on statins.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[i claudius]

I have been on statins for 27 years my cholesterol is normal ,no side effects ever

Edited April 4, 2015 by i claudius

[samuibeachcomber]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

for lowering cholesterol naturally do the

following.Stop eating processed foods,Only cook in oil like coconut oil on low heat.stop eating deep fried foods,all junk food including crisps,french fries,chocolate.Cut out sugar,yellow cheese butter,sweetened yoghurt,beef that has high fat content.

Eat more vegetables,nuts,like almonds,hazelnuts,pistachio nuts,walnuts.Eat more salads.The more raw food you eat the better you will feel.Juice vegies once a day like carrots,beetroot and celery.low fat white cheese is ok,hommus,tabouli,falafel,salmon is good,avocado's too.buy acidopholous yoghurt(sour yoghurt)its good for good bacteria in bowels and intestines.Eat as much alkaline foods as you can(google alkaline foods) for a list.

[partington]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

Edited April 4, 2015 by partington

[h90]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

Anabolic Steroids (=Hormones) do various ugly things to the cholesterol levels. Lowering HDL increasing LDL.....While Estrogene seems to have a positive effect.

Causing problems for this walking walls of meat and methods to counter that problem (also with Statin) are discussed.

Maybe from there comes this confusion with Hormone and Statin?

[h90]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

for lowering cholesterol naturally do the

following.Stop eating processed foods,Only cook in oil like coconut oil on low heat.stop eating deep fried foods,all junk food including crisps,french fries,chocolate.Cut out sugar,yellow cheese butter,sweetened yoghurt,beef that has high fat content.

Eat more vegetables,nuts,like almonds,hazelnuts,pistachio nuts,walnuts.Eat more salads.The more raw food you eat the better you will feel.Juice vegies once a day like carrots,beetroot and celery.low fat white cheese is ok,hommus,tabouli,falafel,salmon is good,avocado's too.buy acidopholous yoghurt(sour yoghurt)its good for good bacteria in bowels and intestines.Eat as much alkaline foods as you can(google alkaline foods) for a list.

Or short version:

Everything that tastes good has to be replaced with ugly stuff......Even if you don't live longer, it will feel much longer eating beetroot and celery....

(Don't misunderstand my sarcasms, I actually agree with your recommendations....just it is sad...)

[partington]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

Anabolic Steroids (=Hormones) do various ugly things to the cholesterol levels. Lowering HDL increasing LDL.....While Estrogene seems to have a positive effect.

Causing problems for this walking walls of meat and methods to counter that problem (also with Statin) are discussed.

Maybe from there comes this confusion with Hormone and Statin?

Maybe you're right and this is about steroid hormones.

I suppose, in theory, because the body makes steroid hormones from cholesterol, if you gave such a huge dose of statins that there was not enough cholesterol available you could reduce natural steroid hormone production.

I don't think this ever is a problem in real life though, as I don't think you could give a big enough dose of statins to reduce blood cholesterol to zero, and so the adrenal (and other) glands would always have enough cholesterol available from the blood to make steroid hormones.

In any case the HDL increasing , not decreasing, effect of statins is pretty well documented.

Edited April 4, 2015 by partington

[DogNo1]

It is now understood that cholesterol does not cause arterial blockages. In fact, statins cause a lot of harm. Recommended reading is anything on spacedoc.com, the Time Magazine issue with "Eat Butter" on the cover and the recent book "The Big Fat Surprise." Moderate amounts of fat and red meat are once again good for you. Reading through recent articles in the Health Section of The New York Times will provide the same information. Also, assessing HDL and LDL separately is now passe. It's total cholesterol now. But relax! It's not the fat that kills you - it's now said to be the sweets and the carbs. If you can't find the NYT articles, PM your email address and I'll send some recent articles. The one about red meat in your diet appeared just this past week.

[uli65]

thank you DogNo1 for your smart post. you are right that statins do lot of harm. There is no reason to take this toxic medicine.

[Tolley]

People have been conned for years about high cholesterol. They have been conned into believing that lowering cholesterol levels will reduce their chance of heart disease when in fact this is not true at all. They have been conned into taking drugs that actually can cause all sorts of diseases and worsen their health. It is an absolute disgrace and of course pharmaceutical companies are the big winners generating billions of dollars from this scam.

The FDA and AMA should also take responsibility for lots of heart disease because they demonised saturated fat as being complicit in heart disease when it never was and caused the great low fat revolution with all those low fat high sugar foods that are the real killers along with all those empty carbs.

It gets even better than that as even high LDL levels don't mean much unless you know the type of LDL as not all LDLs are created equally.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/03/17/study-questions-fat-and-heart-disease-link/?_r=0

[samuibeachcomber]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

ok i stand corrected...you know your stuff.A doctor wanted to put me on statins but told me i would need to come back every month to make sure my liver was ok. I asked why and he said that statins worked by stopping the liver from producing cholestorol.

[moe666]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

Anabolic Steroids (=Hormones) do various ugly things to the cholesterol levels. Lowering HDL increasing LDL.....While Estrogene seems to have a positive effect.

Causing problems for this walking walls of meat and methods to counter that problem (also with Statin) are discussed.

Maybe from there comes this confusion with Hormone and Statin?

Do a bit more research cholestreol is the building block of estrogen, and testosterone, it has been established in some cases of high cholestreol that supplamenting with testosterone in men and estorgen in women has lowered cholestreol levels.

[moe666]

My problem is low cholestreol around 130 or so, do not recommend more meat doesn't work to raise the levels. The problems with low cholestreol is memory loss (brain mostly fat and C), low hormone levels, higher incident of mental illiness and sucide. I had to look very hard to find what info I could on low C the focus is on lowering it not raiseing it

[h90]

statins block a hormone in the liver that produces good cholestorol.Be careful what you decide to do.Natural ways to lower cholesterol would be better in my opinion.

No, they quite definitely do not. Statins block the most important step in the sequence of biochemical reactions that the body uses to make cholesterol out of simple molcules derived from sugars. They do this by blocking a protein called HMG CoA reductase, an enzyme, not a hormone, which when blocked stops cholesterol being made.

I am not sure what you have read that you are getting confused about, butg ood and bad cholesterol refers not to cholesterol itself, which is always the same, but the particles in which cholesterol is carried: LDL bad, HDL good.

Good cholesterol particles, HDL, are now understood to be made by a cell surface protein called ABCA1. A protein called apo AI which is floating around in the blood attaches onto ABCA1which transports the molecular cholesterol out of the cell and attaches it to the protein apoAI. This new particle containing cholesterol and apo AI is HDL, and this is how good cholesterol particles are formed. This is not blocked by statins.

Statins do not reduce HDL, in fact most studies show a small but significant increase in HDL (good cholesterol).

Not quite sure what you are on about, with this hormone stuff?

Anabolic Steroids (=Hormones) do various ugly things to the cholesterol levels. Lowering HDL increasing LDL.....While Estrogene seems to have a positive effect.

Causing problems for this walking walls of meat and methods to counter that problem (also with Statin) are discussed.

Maybe from there comes this confusion with Hormone and Statin?

Do a bit more research cholestreol is the building block of estrogen, and testosterone, it has been established in some cases of high cholestreol that supplamenting with testosterone in men and estorgen in women has lowered cholestreol levels.

Read what Winstrol does to Cholesterol, it is scary.....It is not so much the Testosterone than the synthetic c17 modified steroids that really mess with it.

[DogNo1]

Did anyone see the Sixty Minutes episode about residents of Del Webb's Leisure World which is located near Los Angeles but is now called something else. It's a retirement community that only admits residents over 50. It was presented by Leslie Stahl. An analysis of the medical records for the past 30 years revealed that both men and women over 70 who had low cholesterol levels were less healthy and died sooner than those with high levels. The episode is probably on the Internet somewhere.

[muskoka]

Extremely interesting article below, partial quote, read at the link.

An aside, remember many years back (+/-50y) we were inundated (in Canada) with health scares about eating butter, and everyone was told to switch to margerine if they want to live long and healthy lives. Turned out to be BS, now "butter is better".

Up until a short few years back people were told to limit their consumption of eggs to 1 or 2 a week. Turned out to be BS, eat as many as you want, for some people (like me) I eat an average of 10 a week and have for years and years, but I try and buy organic when available.

Now the BS we have been fed about cholesterol is being exposed.

Doug

The role and importance of cholesterol

Our blood vessels become damaged in a variety of ways, through irritations caused by free radicals or viruses, or because they are structurally weak. When this weakness occurs, the body's natural defenses kick in and release a healing substance known as cholesterol. Cholesterol is a alcohol that is produced in the liver and in most human cells. It plays many vital roles in maintaining good health. Some of its important roles include:

Cholesterol gives our cells necessary stiffness and stability. Due to diets that contain an excess of polyunsaturated fatty acids (particularly omega 6), the saturated fatty acids in the cell membrane are replaced, which causes the cell walls to become flabby. When this occurs, cholesterol is driven into the tissues to give them structural integrity.

Cholesterol acts as precursor to hormones that help us manage stress and protect the body against heart disease and cancer.

Cholesterol is a precursor to vitamin D, an important fat-soluble vitamin needed for healthy bones, a healthy nervous system and immune system, good muscle tone, mineral metabolism, insulin production, and reproduction.

Its needed for production of bile salts, which are vital for digestion and assimilation of fats.

It acts as an antioxidant, which protects us from free radical damage that leads to heart disease and cancer.

It's needed for proper function of serotonin ("feel good" chemical) receptors in the brain. Low cholesterol levels have been linked to violent behavior, depression, and suicidal tendencies.

Mother's milk is very rich in cholesterol and contains a special enzyme that allows the baby to use this nutrient. Cholesterol rich foods are very important in the growing years to ensure proper development of the brain and nervous system.

Dietary cholesterol plays an important role in maintaining the health of the intestinal wall. A vegetarian diet low in cholesterol can often lead to leaky gut syndrome and other intestinal disorders. ...

http://www.naturalnews.com/049230_cholesterol_lies_natural_health_heart_disease.html#

[Choonpon]

Red yeast rice is able to reduce bad cholesterol.

[Issangeorge]

Extremely interesting article below, partial quote, read at the link.

An aside, remember many years back (+/-50y) we were inundated (in Canada) with health scares about eating butter, and everyone was told to switch to margerine if they want to live long and healthy lives. Turned out to be BS, now "butter is better".

Up until a short few years back people were told to limit their consumption of eggs to 1 or 2 a week. Turned out to be BS, eat as many as you want, for some people (like me) I eat an average of 10 a week and have for years and years, but I try and buy organic when available.

Now the BS we have been fed about cholesterol is being exposed.

Doug

The role and importance of cholesterol

Our blood vessels become damaged in a variety of ways, through irritations caused by free radicals or viruses, or because they are structurally weak. When this weakness occurs, the body's natural defenses kick in and release a healing substance known as cholesterol. Cholesterol is a alcohol that is produced in the liver and in most human cells. It plays many vital roles in maintaining good health. Some of its important roles include:

Cholesterol gives our cells necessary stiffness and stability. Due to diets that contain an excess of polyunsaturated fatty acids (particularly omega 6), the saturated fatty acids in the cell membrane are replaced, which causes the cell walls to become flabby. When this occurs, cholesterol is driven into the tissues to give them structural integrity.

Cholesterol acts as precursor to hormones that help us manage stress and protect the body against heart disease and cancer.

Cholesterol is a precursor to vitamin D, an important fat-soluble vitamin needed for healthy bones, a healthy nervous system and immune system, good muscle tone, mineral metabolism, insulin production, and reproduction.

Its needed for production of bile salts, which are vital for digestion and assimilation of fats.

It acts as an antioxidant, which protects us from free radical damage that leads to heart disease and cancer.

It's needed for proper function of serotonin ("feel good" chemical) receptors in the brain. Low cholesterol levels have been linked to violent behavior, depression, and suicidal tendencies.

Mother's milk is very rich in cholesterol and contains a special enzyme that allows the baby to use this nutrient. Cholesterol rich foods are very important in the growing years to ensure proper development of the brain and nervous system.

Dietary cholesterol plays an important role in maintaining the health of the intestinal wall. A vegetarian diet low in cholesterol can often lead to leaky gut syndrome and other intestinal disorders. ...

http://www.naturalnews.com/049230_cholesterol_lies_natural_health_heart_disease.html#

I remember back in the sixties, my mother buying bags of margarine, it was a sickly white colour, and there was a small bag of food colouring, that we would break and squeeze the big bag a large amount of times to mix the food colouring in, so it looked more like butter. I used to hate it, when my mother gave me the bag to squeeze. Edited April 6, 2015 by Issangeorge

[h90]

Extremely interesting article below, partial quote, read at the link.

An aside, remember many years back (+/-50y) we were inundated (in Canada) with health scares about eating butter, and everyone was told to switch to margerine if they want to live long and healthy lives. Turned out to be BS, now "butter is better".

Up until a short few years back people were told to limit their consumption of eggs to 1 or 2 a week. Turned out to be BS, eat as many as you want, for some people (like me) I eat an average of 10 a week and have for years and years, but I try and buy organic when available.

Now the BS we have been fed about cholesterol is being exposed.

Doug

The role and importance of cholesterol

Our blood vessels become damaged in a variety of ways, through irritations caused by free radicals or viruses, or because they are structurally weak. When this weakness occurs, the body's natural defenses kick in and release a healing substance known as cholesterol. Cholesterol is a alcohol that is produced in the liver and in most human cells. It plays many vital roles in maintaining good health. Some of its important roles include:

Cholesterol gives our cells necessary stiffness and stability. Due to diets that contain an excess of polyunsaturated fatty acids (particularly omega 6), the saturated fatty acids in the cell membrane are replaced, which causes the cell walls to become flabby. When this occurs, cholesterol is driven into the tissues to give them structural integrity.

Cholesterol acts as precursor to hormones that help us manage stress and protect the body against heart disease and cancer.

Cholesterol is a precursor to vitamin D, an important fat-soluble vitamin needed for healthy bones, a healthy nervous system and immune system, good muscle tone, mineral metabolism, insulin production, and reproduction.

Its needed for production of bile salts, which are vital for digestion and assimilation of fats.

It acts as an antioxidant, which protects us from free radical damage that leads to heart disease and cancer.

It's needed for proper function of serotonin ("feel good" chemical) receptors in the brain. Low cholesterol levels have been linked to violent behavior, depression, and suicidal tendencies.

Mother's milk is very rich in cholesterol and contains a special enzyme that allows the baby to use this nutrient. Cholesterol rich foods are very important in the growing years to ensure proper development of the brain and nervous system.

Dietary cholesterol plays an important role in maintaining the health of the intestinal wall. A vegetarian diet low in cholesterol can often lead to leaky gut syndrome and other intestinal disorders. ...

http://www.naturalnews.com/049230_cholesterol_lies_natural_health_heart_disease.html#

It is like fashion.

breast feeding, baby milk from the supermarket, breast feeding, milk.....

Estrogen for elderly women, no Estrogen, Estrogen.

Older men need Testosterone, not give Testosterone, give Testosterone

Fluoride in water not fluoride...

vaccine, better not vaccine to much, vaccine against everything.

etc etc etc

And for all there are tons of studies.....

On one side the pharma companies try to sell as much as possible and bribing doctors. On the other side fanatics, homeopathy, etc who want to tell us that all is evil and kill us.....