Immigration Confirms The End Of Border Runs From Oct 1, 2006

[Big Dogster]

I symathize with you Dalmation, there are countless people in a variety of situations who get shafted by this development. As someone stated earlier, this is a crisis. I resent the people trying to state that this only affects "bums" "illegals" "undesireables" "Khao San Rd Hippies" or whoever. They may be a percentage but I suspect far more fit categories as above. This development sucks ass and just watch, I guarantee this has a huge negative effect on Thailand. All these high and mighty's days will come also when they get the shaft here in one form or another. mark my words

Edited September 11, 2006 by Big Dogster

[LivinLOS]

Non O based on a house rental agreement. sounds like a scam to me. I suppose u expect to be able to do this every year. Not a chance

Why a scam?

I had a rental agreement. I got a non-o visa. I asked for it. Got it.

I came. Got married. Wife's pregnant. I'm renting a house.

Next year I'll probably rent a house.

I'll do the 1 year extension in a week.

Again, why a scam?

The reason it has been labelled a scam is there is no non imm O given on the basis of renting a house.

Non imm O's for over 50's, for marriage, etc..

The fact you found a friendly embassy or consul that bends the rules.. And then criticise others for bending rules shows a lack of logic and sympathy.

I am here also on a non imm O given by a friendly embassy but I unlike you realize that actually I have no right to that visa and having the rug pulled out from under your feet after investing time and effort and money in setting up and building a life based on one set of rules and those goalposts being moved is a concern.

Once again.. For the under 50s, who are not married to a Thai, are not working for a Thai company, have only a 3 million baht option.

[chuckygobyebye]

This is a disaster. For all you non-imm O holders, not all visa runners are miscreants, they're teachers, dive instructors, journalists or simply employees of companies who are too lazy to spring for a work permit.

I've finally got a work permit after a process of nine months. Now I can only get three-month 'B' visas as the last two consulates I went to wouldn't issue a 12-month visa. Our company is new, small and hasn't been operating long enough for me to apply for an extension of stay. So don't tell me it's easy to stay here legitimately, I've been trying for the last three years.

The visa run situation is obviously ridiculous but it's a situation that developed with the consent of the immigration bureau and it would not have developed if the rules reflected the realities of working and doing business here. If it's so easy to get a work permit why don't all the visa runners have them? Think it's fun to take the bus every month?

Are visa runners stealing jobs? I can't see why, as an employer we find that Thais are always cheaper than foreigners, but it's hard to find one who can do the job. The argument that this is to stop the flood of Indians and Chinese is rubbish, they don't get the 30 day exemption.

I aplaud the end of the visa-run situation but think it should go hand in hand with an ammnesty and reform of visa rules.

[Big Dogster]

I would have thought it was obvious that i meant married to a Thai. If you're married to a farang, she is obviously restricted to the same immigration laws as anyone else, and as Sunbelt says, she doesnt qualify for retirement visa.

Again, you have the choice to live here or not. Both of you have the right to stay (on their terms) or leave, on your own.

Someone married to a Thai might not be able to leave so freely, hence the more equitable visa situation for them.

Life is simple, innit?

And, let's get it into perspective. You're not being asked for 800,000. It's still your money. You just have to show you have those funds so you can support yourself or perhaps you would prefer if the Thai government supported you?

Bendix, I used to think you were cool but you are proving yourself to be very very lame

[enuff said]

.

well said bendix.

If some Thai immigration officials are reading this RIGHT NOW(and believe me, they KNOW about this board), I bet they are nodding their heads and will be glad to get rid of 90% of the posters on here.

Who would want such a group of self-righteous, carping people trying to live in one's country?

It's the Thai way OR the highway.

Up to you,

'nuff said

~

[A_Traveller]

Something to note here, is that there is still no official statement, or ministerial regulation, or even a departmental press release to confirm this.

The act does not provide for a 90 day in, 90 day out, though it does prescibe tourism as a 90 day maximum activity.

It must be best to wait for a formal release, which then should clarify the breadth of this 'reinforcement' of the regulatory position. I am sure that legal advisors who often post here are trying to get confirmation from their contacts within the IB, but my understanding is that there is no official confirmation available at this time.

Regards

/edit sentence//

Edited September 11, 2006 by A_Traveller

[fruittbatt]

.

well said bendix.

If some Thai immigration officials are reading this RIGHT NOW(and believe me, they KNOW about this board), I bet they are nodding their heads and will be glad to get rid of 90% of the posters on here.

Who would want such a group of self-righteous, carping people trying to live in one's country?

It's the Thai way OR the highway.

Up to you,

'nuff said

~

that about sums it up...but there are always loopholes for those who are caught up in this and need a way out . The Laos - 3mths, Thailand - 3mths option makes sense for those who do not have a job here and are not old enough to retire. a bit of creative thought will no doubt reveal other means of circumventing the laws for those affected.

Edited September 11, 2006 by fruittbatt

[Scott]

It is, of course, sad that when they make changes that some good, genuine, legitimate people get disqualified. One of the things that they can do--and they may do with regards to retirement visas etc. is to grandfather people in.

Some years back I had a friend who had been retired here for many years and had a retirement visa. For some strange reason he decided to return to his own country, but after about 9 months he decided to return to Thailand. In the meantime, they had upped the am't of money and he no longer met the eligibility requirements.

For some technical reason, the higher up immigration officer (without financial encouragement), decided he had been out of the country less than a year on a year long visa and said he did not have to meet the new requirements. He was allowed to stay, as were others, under the old rules.

Perhaps some of the people involved might want to check. I don't think immigration wants to have a mass exodus of people.

[Erwin1011]

Is it 3 back to back visas and out for 90 days no mater how long you have stayed for on the visas. Example 1st one lets say 2 weeks then the next 3 weeks and the last the full 30 days. This is not staying in thailand for 90 days but it is 3 back to back visas

I would imagine that there will be some mechanism to calculate the 90 days quota of multiple stays (altough no such thing has been mentioned anywhere yet). The 65 days in your example might leave you with a 15 days "credit" until the 90 days forced pause sets in, or something...

The primary focus is presumably on back-to-back (i.e. seamless) re-entries, often -- but not exclusively -- employed by farangs whose Thailand stay is not entirely in the "tourist" category.

It so happens that the better part of the -- uhm -- civilized world has immigration regulations which simply don't allow for endless re-entries. The European country that's issuing my passport has a maximum allowance of 180 days/year.

To be fair: as screwed-up as the "new regulation" may sound: farang who have the [legal] means for a long-term stay shouldn't have a problem to get non-immigrant visas either -- or am I completely naïve?

Just like in Thailand the 180 days rule is for taxation purposes. I you stay 180 days in the country you become taxable by that country. This has nothing to do with the length you are allowed to stay with your visa.

[Pui]

The message from immigration seems to be “get a visa”. They must be trying to put an end to visa runs. This is a good thing. For starters it will cut down on the massive queues at popular visa run border crossings. So genuine tourists can pass more freely. I was once queued at Poi Pet for a couple of hours in the baking sun. Never again.

When I decided to make Thailand my home I found ThaiVisa.com very useful. They even have a template for what you cover letter should look like.

Once a year I go back to England and the service is amazing. It’s about as difficult as joining a video library.

What baffles me is trying to understand why so many people are confused. Most presumably educated individuals from the western world. This site really has some great info. I get a Non-B 1 year visa. Now in my fourth year.

Yes I remember visa runs. What a headache. Hot, sweaty bus or train journeys to borders. That’s what prompted me to get a yearly visa. Non-B. Guys do yourselves a favour and get a visa.

[jbhh]

I agree with... whoever it was, that is retired now.

If you stay for more than 3 months in Thailand, your not the average tourist.

And this rule is only for the tourist visa, so if you get yourself a non-immigrant visa of any type, this wont affect you, you can renew your visa as many times as you want. Basically it's a big kick in the behind to get yourself a legal status in Thailand, if you want to live here.

I do agree though, that "Thai Brides" services will be the coming big business. Maybe soon we wont see real estate office poping up like 7elevens, but marriage services

Isn't it funny, how everythime you try to make it hard for people, you end up creating new business areas for corruption?

[creation2474]

I don't see many airplanes "flying" when they are "parked" in a hanger. Is that another "kind" ? Gee I hate smart assed nit pickers!

There are "parked" airplanes, and airplanes of another type - those that are "flying"

Running out of gas while flying, is a crisis.

Pilot, the crises you mention are all psychological problems solely based on physical problems. It is a fact, though, that psychological problems without any seemingly physical reason behind, very well can be felt as painful as any problem caused by a physical problem, if not more. What is more, those kind of problems are far more difficult to deal with, because they are less tangible and normally far more complex. Just to mention one example, it is now scientifically proved, that people who live a significantly different lives than their family and fellowmen (e.g. people with dirrerent religions, family values, philosophically or politically understandings and perceptions, etc.) feel exactly the same kind of pain the exactly same place in the brain, as the person who have just broken his leg. Your comments are not just ignorant and callous, they are a result of a very materialistic psyche.

On the other hand, I don't think a psychological crises of any kind can or should be a reason for avoiding doing the paperwork required, in order to stay in a foreign country.

[oz457]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

[Nikkijah]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

This is the thing oz457 surely, I see many people complaining about this, most of them falangs but what about the thai business owners, isn't it in their interest to investigate considering it is them who will suffer the most financially??

[wombat]

jes--us,

what about all the casual farang working in the dive industry on the islands.

99% are on tourist visa's.

they'll be pissed.

bummer dude

ya pays ya money and ya takes ya chances.......?

[Mobi]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have no affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

Edited September 11, 2006 by Mobi D'Ark

[Nikkijah]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

But Mobi D'Ark, this also does not help the Thai business owners, shouldn't the government listen to them? Or are they not making noises like many TV members here...

[pistonpilot]

Oh I see, that explains everything. No you're right, not a scam. You've got a load of other problems, visa should not be one of them. I prefer my visa problems to the probs you have. what a nightmare. And let me tell you something, your tone toward anyone caught up in this visa nitemare is not very understanding or nice. I'm a caring and sympathetc person, I sympathize with you and the quagmire you are caught up in as well as the visa people. I am glad though that you bring to light how much worse a situation can be

Sit Doggie.

Good doggie.

My wife loves me and I love her. She's pregnant. We are thrilled. My first and her first.

Save your sympathy for someone who needs it.

[Nikkijah]

This subject is getting more interest than any other topic I've seen here on TV, over 22,000 views and with approx 400 people viewing the topic at any one time - I guess this is mostly made up of falangs but is there any Thai business people viewing this right now? And what are their opinions on the subject, how are they going to prepare for this if it turns out to be entirely true?

[george]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have no affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

How to apply for NON-B visa:

http://www.thaivisa.com/294.0.html

Example letter for NON-B visa:

http://www.thaivisa.com/332.0.html

[pistonpilot]

Pilot, the crises you mention are all psychological problems solely based on physical problems. It is a fact, though, that psychological problems without any seemingly physical reason behind, very well can be felt as painful as any problem caused by a physical problem, if not more. What is more, those kind of problems are far more difficult to deal with, because they are less tangible and normally far more complex. Just to mention one example, it is now scientifically proved, that people who live a significantly different lives than their family and fellowmen (e.g. people with dirrerent religions, family values, philosophically or politically understandings and perceptions, etc.) feel exactly the same kind of pain the exactly same place in the brain, as the person who have just broken his leg. Your comments are not just ignorant and callous, they are a result of a very materialistic psyche.

On the other hand, I don't think a psychological crises of any kind can or should be a reason for avoiding doing the paperwork required, in order to stay in a foreign country.

Thank you. Please advise where I can send you a check to cover the therapy you just provided. I feel so much better.

[Vespa]

I guess this is mostly made up of falangs but is there any Thai business people viewing this right now? And what are their opinions on the subject, how are they going to prepare for this if it turns out to be entirely true?

I think the % of farangs this will affect ( besides those who read a forum like this) will be quite small compared to the amount of "standard" tourists in the Kingdom at any given time, so

Thai business owners will most likely not give 2 farts about it.

[Mobi]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

But Mobi D'Ark, this also does not help the Thai business owners, shouldn't the government listen to them? Or are they not making noises like many TV members here...

This is Thailand. Nobody listens to anyone.

And if someone makes a bad decision, it's unlikely to be reversed, because that would mean loss of face to the officail who made the decision in the first place.

There's no compassion in the implemenation of ruling. Of course a lot of "innocent" people will be devastated and traumatised. If they cared at all, they could have easily announced a phasing in of the rule - say give people 6 months notice, so that they have time to make alternative arrangements and sort out their affairs.

But they couldn't give a toss, I'm afraid.

[Nikkijah]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

But Mobi D'Ark, this also does not help the Thai business owners, shouldn't the government listen to them? Or are they not making noises like many TV members here...

This is Thailand. Nobody listens to anyone.

And if someone makes a bad decision, it's unlikely to be reversed, because that would mean loss of face to the officail who made the decision in the first place.

There's no compassion in the implemenation of ruling. Of course a lot of "innocent" people will be devastated and traumatised. If they cared at all, they could have easily announced a phasing in of the rule - say give people 6 months notice, so that they have time to make alternative arrangements and sort out their affairs.

But they couldn't give a toss, I'm afraid.

I understand this, there doesn't seem to be much listenning going on unless the talking is being done by someone influential, so where will this lead many small businesses to? I'm not exclusively talking about falang businesses either, visa run companies, bus tour operators, immigration officials etc etc

[Soju]

That's not such a good news for Thailand! I'm coming to thailand every 2 months to buy merchandise and send it out by container. If I'm not allowed to get into Thailand any more afer 2 or 3 visits, I'll have to do my purchases somewhere else. It seems China is going to be my next destination.

Sorry for the business with Thailand. I'll have to tell this the companies I'm trading with.

If you're doing business here, you can get non-immigrant B visa. This ruling should have no affect on people coming on genuine business trips. All you need is a letter from one of your suppliers to submit with your visa application.

How to apply for NON-B visa:

http://www.thaivisa.com/294.0.html

Example letter for NON-B visa:

http://www.thaivisa.com/332.0.html

I seem to be missing something. From reading those links, the Non-B visa seems to be for someone who wants to get a work visa in Thailand. But it sounds like oz457 is just a businessman who comes to Thailand to conduct business, possibly with various suppliers and/or buyers. This type of situation is very common. There is absolutely no employment involved in such cases. Requiring these people to get a work visa just to conduct normal business is really asking way too much. Businesses will go elsewhere unless they relax the rules for such cases.

[pistonpilot]

The reason it has been labelled a scam is there is no non imm O given on the basis of renting a house.

Non imm O's for over 50's, for marriage, etc..

The fact you found a friendly embassy or consul that bends the rules.. And then criticise others for bending rules shows a lack of logic and sympathy.

I am here also on a non imm O given by a friendly embassy but I unlike you realize that actually I have no right to that visa and having the rug pulled out from under your feet after investing time and effort and money in setting up and building a life based on one set of rules and those goalposts being moved is a concern.

Once again.. For the under 50s, who are not married to a Thai, are not working for a Thai company, have only a 3 million baht option.

Words mean things. The word scam has a meaning. If I presented a request to the Thai Embassy and the Embassy granted my request, how is that a scam?

Don't bandy about the word scam when it doesn't apply. If I tell you I'm going to sell you a broken car, I suppose you will cry "scam" after you pay for it.

Grow up.

Rules? Are there rules in Thailand? Do Embassies follow them, or make their own?

[bendix]

Bendix, I used to think you were cool but you are proving yourself to be very very lame

Sadly for me, I tend to agree with your assessment. But I try my best.

[A_Traveller]

I think the % of farangs this will affect ( besides those who read a forum like this) will be quite small compared to the amount of "standard" tourists in the Kingdom at any given time, so

Thai business owners will most likely not give 2 farts about it.

The point is, I think, how will the Thai business community respond to a situation where the real cost of a foreign 'resource' is now greater, and or more visible rather than using 'tourists'.

Regards

[BattyBatty]

I got as far as page 7 and found myself a little confused...

I have been here 3 years, mostly on VOA's but with one or two single entry 60 day tourist visa's thrown in the mix.

So, the new law - does this mean i have to fly to Penang/Singapore to apply for a 60 day tourist visa, and then on expiry fly back and get another, and another and so on?

Or does this mean that whatever happens, without employment or a company, i only have 180 days in LOS and then have to leave for 90?

In short, without employment, retirement, 850K US or a company, you can not stay here for more than say, 6 months? Correct?

Can anyone confirm this for me?

Edited September 11, 2006 by BattyBatty

[creation2474]

Pilot, the crises you mention are all psychological problems solely based on physical problems. It is a fact, though, that psychological problems without any seemingly physical reason behind, very well can be felt as painful as any problem caused by a physical problem, if not more. What is more, those kind of problems are far more difficult to deal with, because they are less tangible and normally far more complex. Just to mention one example, it is now scientifically proved, that people who live a significantly different lives than their family and fellowmen (e.g. people with dirrerent religions, family values, philosophically or politically understandings and perceptions, etc.) feel exactly the same kind of pain the exactly same place in the brain, as the person who have just broken his leg. Your comments are not just ignorant and callous, they are a result of a very materialistic psyche.

On the other hand, I don't think a psychological crises of any kind can or should be a reason for avoiding doing the paperwork required, in order to stay in a foreign country.

Thank you. Please advise where I can send you a check to cover the therapy you just provided. I feel so much better.

Some people are just out of reach. You seem to be one of them. Good luck with your life.