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No Longer "dreaming" Of Retiring In Thailand

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Please, don't forget the Canadians. :D Imagine what it would be like to live close by where 50% (more and --probably-- less :o ) of the population have posters of G. Bush in their bedrooms VS Britney Spears (unbelievable, but true :D ).

T O O F U N N Y ! and highly therapeutic ... cheque in mail.

Thanks so much ! You can just so totally not say that amongst US "teachers" in China.

AND THEY CAN NOT SEE THE PARALLELS BETWEEN CHINA AND THE U>S>. They come to China and carry on about BRAINWASHING !

Am I really allowed to say these things about America ?

I have a gorgeous husband from the USA, BTW.

I don't have a gorgeous husband from the USA --and that's a good thing :D -- but I agree with you.

The way I see it --as a European immigrant/Canadian citizen living in Canada-- is that all countries have a bureau of propaganda. Of course, in Burma, etc. it is the only bureau! :D

The US has the Federal Bureau of Investigation and CNN/FOX (they have the guts of naming it FOX,... :D ) Anyway,...

Reality is that we are all more or less manipulated. Many Americans (like many Canadians and Europeans, etc.) living in rural areas (and who don't have access to a variety (divergent) of news) read and see things that don't matter and then the occasional newsclip of Bush acting like an angel (same in Canada with our PM). All of those people are not anymore stupid than the rest of us, they are just so badly informed about what is going on. After all, what are the chance of Michael Moore's film showing in a remote town in Texas? And,... after years of being brainwashed (school and TV,...), it is not surprising that some would support a guy like Bush and be proud nationalists. Remember! These guys (in US, Canada, ...) are well informed and have the media behind them (especially in rural areas). Maybe the internet will make a difference, but I am sure they will shut that door somehow.

Teachers are the key in that can make a difference, break the cycle. Guess why teachers are always made fun off?

BTW, I am not a teacher,... I am a learning assistance teacher! :D

Here on a secret mission! :D

BTW, Doc. I thought your post to be touching. Hopefully things are not as bad as they appear.

Good night from Canada!

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Sorry I didn't meanto be a "downer" guys.

I see sick people all week so I tend to be a realist.

I'm just thinking tha moving to Thailand now is like "jumping from the frying pan into the fire."

I am with you, Doc, but let it be known that they use woks in Thailand! :D However, they do use fire/gas to cook, so ... you may have a point ! :D On the other hand, there is no oil in Thailand ,... except in the wok, of course! :o There is a lucrative tourism industry! I think they would be fools to tamper with that too much! People making VOE runs were playing with fire! :D People who follow most of the rules --I think-- we'll be ok! (I stress the word MOST. :D)

Please, don't forget the Canadians. Imagine what it would be like to live close by where 50% (more and --probably-- less ) of the population have posters of G. Bush in their bedrooms VS Britney Spears (unbelievable, but true ).

T O O F U N N Y ! and highly therapeutic ... cheque in mail.

Thanks so much ! You can just so totally not say that amongst US "teachers" in China.

AND THEY CAN NOT SEE THE PARALLELS BETWEEN CHINA AND THE U>S>. They come to China and carry on about BRAINWASHING ! :D:D:D

Am I really allowed to say these things about America ?

I have a gorgeous husband from the USA, BTW.

jes--us bloody christ changchang,

your a she of the female variety. :D:D

im out of here.

:o

Sorry I didn't meanto be a "downer" guys.

I see sick people all week so I tend to be a realist.

I'm just thinking tha moving to Thailand now is like "jumping from the frying pan into the fire."

Pepe,

Having resided for years under the same politcal umbrella as you, rest assured that the only flames here will be of the personally ignited type.

Despite the auto-reactionary 'doom and gloom' mentality of many TV members, life it LOS still consists of many enlightening moments sans flames. :o:D

Don't let a dream die so easily, stop in for a visit the to the just opened --- InspirationsRus in BKK during your next visit. :D

Sorry I didn't meanto be a "downer" guys.

I see sick people all week so I tend to be a realist.

I'm just thinking tha moving to Thailand now is like "jumping from the frying pan into the fire."

cricky's doc pepe, :D

i realise that you have to be with sick punters all week long and i feel real sorry for you as thats got to be crap and depressing.

you might be earning a squillion quid a week my friend but you deserve no less for doing that crud job.

back bottoms, front bottoms and all that :D

no wonder you frigging depressed mate. ? :D

thailand and this forum are at the top of the ladder my learn'ed man and you must pull your self together and get your financially well off arse over here quick smart and reclaim your bleeding life.

you'll be dead before you do anything about it. :D

look fella,

think of it this way, if you dont bloody like it you can bolt back to septic land and be depressed over there.

come on pepe,

get out your sharpest scalpel and have a crack over here. :D

just to cheer you up you can come to my piss up on rambuttri st in november. :D

cheers dr pepe. :o

just one more thing doc,

hows my prostrate check looking :D

.

Hey Doc,

I am just the opposite of you. I can not wait to get out of the USA. Should be in LOS permently in January. Tired of being the World Police, tired of the 11 MILLION illegal aliens (and growing) living in the US and most of them in Southern California with you and me, tired of the escalating prices and taxes and tired of the politicians making hollow promises. At least Thailand is trying to clean up the illegal tourists on VOAs. The longer I live in the USA the better Thailand looks.

Two years ago I came close to packing up my medical practice and retiring in Thailand. I love this country and have traveled there since 1971. Circiumstances did not allow it at that time. Now I'm glad I didn't.

Although not active on the forum these days, I do read it regularly.

I am truely concerned about the changes taking place in Thailand.

It is enough to deal with losing personal freedoms here at home. I can't imagine losing even more freedoms one has by residing in Thailand. What's the trade off?

<snip>

I have met Taksin, twice. Once in Thailand at the Dutch Embassy and once here in at the Thai Embassy in Los Angeles. No thanks.

It is refreshing to see so much open dissent/discussion on the board about Taksin and the other governmental, cultural and socio-economic BS that permeates the culture.

"Freedommmm!!!" - William Wallace

I remember a time, not too long ago, when this was discussed very cautiously and conservatively. Mostly encouraged not to discuss these kinds of things at all.

However it appears that "the gloves have most certainly come off now."

I applaud the moderators for permitting and the members for contributing the truth.

I will be in Thailand from 11-07 to 12-07.

"Doc" I had promised you a bottle (or two) of good red wine on more than one occasion.

If it's OK to put liquids in the luggage, at that time, let me know where we can meet so you can take delivery. I will be around Samuts Sakorn for a few days visiting family before traveling around the country.

Best of luck to all of you.

We've all got an opinion let me close with one more,

"Instant karma's gonna get you. It's gonna knock you one the head.

Better recognize your brother. Pretty soon your gonna be dead."

'Cause we all shine on. Like the moon and the stars and the sun. Yeah we all shine on. On an on and on and on and on on onnnnn."

- John Lennon :D

Well I will be there next year. Im sure I will love the place, I hope you wont miss it too much :D

Well I will be there next year. Im sure I will love the place, I hope you wont miss it too much :D

DONZ

Take of your pink sunglasses (they don't fit you. by the way)

Have you ever morrgaged (spelling) a house and a car, put your kid(s) trough a deasent school, got your "tank" emptied and flushed and last but not least had your Mother in law (Jai) telling your wife how to do simple things in the wrong way (like bringing up children)? if not, don't reply to these topics

PS

The laws are going to be tougher on the undsirebles (no income,no visa and no life) :o

Morty

(you got me at last) :D

In what way are people with current stamps in their passports "illegal" tourists. If they have a stamp, they are not overstaying, and are fully legal to stay in Thailand.

Sorry, this is not the same thing as a Guatamalan crossing the Rio Grande into the US with no passport, no visa, and then working.

The point not to miss here is that Pepe is exactly the kind of person that Thailand professes to want to attract.

Educated, solvent and heading to spend a life’s savings in Thailand.

He chooses not to do so on the basis of where he sees Thailand going and his judgment is made on the basis of long association with Thailand.

The caution his decision sends deserves consideration for all of us.

The point not to miss here is that Pepe is exactly the kind of person that Thailand professes to want to attract.

Educated, solvent and heading to spend a life’s savings in Thailand.

He chooses not to do so on the basis of where he sees Thailand going and his judgment is made on the basis of long association with Thailand.

The caution his decision sends deserves consideration for all of us.

im not so sure about that guesthouse,

as i feel that the long term expats are much more educated and experienced in all things thai.

much more than pepe, who is only a visitor to los.

even though the expats have a whinge every now and then they are not screaming for every one to leave los and bolt back home to farang land are they ?

what do you really think is going to happen here in los ?

a plane flying into the bayoke tower maybe ?

possible but not relevant, but extremely relevant in the U.S.A.

look,

ive just changed my mind about this and i now feel that if dr pepe does'nt think los is a good shot he should just stay home in septic land and deal with sick punters for the rest of his existance.

los needs punters that do want to come here, arn't frigging depressed and have a positive attitude to this very fine country.

its not rocket science my good friend.

how can we be happy if we dont have a good attitude to our place of abode ?

cheers :o

Hey Doc,

I am just the opposite of you. I can not wait to get out of the USA. Should be in LOS permently in January. Tired of being the World Police, tired of the 11 MILLION illegal aliens (and growing) living in the US and most of them in Southern California with you and me, tired of the escalating prices and taxes and tired of the politicians making hollow promises. At least Thailand is trying to clean up the illegal tourists on VOAs. The longer I live in the USA the better Thailand looks.

look mate,

you might not be a doctor but i think you got a lot more smarts than pepe . :o

as i feel that the long term expats are much more educated and experienced in all things thai.

As a long term expat I take the view that the issues facing Thailand in the not too distant future are considerable and should not be dismissed out of hand.

Changes are afoot, and the inevitable change that is coming includes a huge challenge to much of what has made Thailand the comfortable welcoming place it is.

We have nationalism and xenophobia now, but it is controlled.

When the wise council and control is gone things will change and there are no signs the change will be an improvement.

Quite the contrary

:o

as i feel that the long term expats are much more educated and experienced in all things thai.

As a long term expat I take the view that the issues facing Thailand in the not too distant future are considerable and should not be dismissed out of hand.

Changes are afoot, and the inevitable change that is coming includes a huge challenge to much of what has made Thailand the comfortable welcoming place it is.

We have nationalism and xenophobia now, but it is controlled.

When the wise council and control is gone things will change and there are no signs the change will be an improvement.

Quite the contrary

fair enough,

but i 'll bet you a carton of singa that if you love thailand you wont be bolting back to your own country at the drop of a hat.

things would have to denigrate at a rapid rate of knots before many farang would consider leaving.

los is built on farang money, farang investment and farang love this place spending &lt;deleted&gt; loads of money here.

if you are a long term expat, you will know the government cannot risk scareing off farang investment and tourism .

its there bread and butter, also things change very quickly in los.

the government might make a bad call but they will repeal it just as quick.

you mention nationalism and xenophobia in los, but lets keep this in perspective please.

its nothing compared with some western countries is it ? :D

things would have to denigrate at a rapid rate of knots before many farang would consider leaving.

I think for that assessment to be of any value we first need to understand that there are many who have burned their boats and nolonger have the finacial werewithall to go anywhere else.

So in the event of things going t1ts up they are trapped.

As you say yourself

things change very quickly in los.
there is no guarantee they change for the better and every indication that things are becoming more nationalist, more xenophobic.

As for what Thais would do in terms of their best interest, don't assume that their best interest would be measured in terms that relate to your own ideas of what 'best interest might be'.

Am I really allowed to say stuff about Bush here ? Have I rejoined the free world ?

We'd prefer you to keep the discussion Thailand-related...

:o

in other words, on this board, you are not aloowed to say a word about bush, just like those american boards you described

I'm sure ''Bush and his cronies are trying to shaft Thailand with the Thai-US FTA'' would be acceptable ...

things would have to denigrate at a rapid rate of knots before many farang would consider leaving.

I think for that assessment to be of any value we first need to understand that there are many who have burned their boats and nolonger have the finacial werewithall to go anywhere else.

So in the event of things going t1ts up they are trapped.

As you say yourself

things change very quickly in los.
there is no guarantee they change for the better and every indication that things are becoming more nationalist, more xenophobic.

As for what Thais would do in terms of their best interest, don't assume that their best interest would be measured in terms that relate to your own ideas of what 'best interest might be'.

of course the silly farang that play silly games come unstuck, lose all there money and become stuck in los.

how about telling me something i dont know.

ive been involved in business in los for many years in the past and have seen it all.

actually i might be able to help you out with your future plans for business.

if you want to start a guest house, 15 rooms will just about keep you solvent but you need to keep them full. :D

be very carefull where you invest and with who'm, as you might find yourself on the pavement with our poor unfortunate friends.

there's a &lt;deleted&gt; load of them out there and how does that happen ?

quick answer is,

hooking up with smart women and making bad business decisions regarding investment in los.

as far as assuming things goes, take it from me that i never assume anything regarding thailand.

i talk only from many years experience with the thai and doing business with thai.

only a silly man would assume things and base a business decision based on an assumption.

there's lots that do, as thats a fact and not an assumption

as far as nationalism and xenophobia goes, it seems to have you a bit concerned ?

look this is an assumption im making now and here it is.

i assume it will never affect me or you. :D

my first and last assumption. :o

I think I've enough experience and understanding of Thailand not to worry about your assumptions.

I think I've enough experience and understanding of Thailand not to worry about your assumptions.

well you dont have to worry then, as i only ever made one assumption and i assume it will never be a problem. :D

be carefull with the guesthouse gig guesthouse and remember the rule of 15.

do you know what that is ?

15 rooms to break even old son. :o

Am I really allowed to say stuff about Bush here ? Have I rejoined the free world ?

We'd prefer you to keep the discussion Thailand-related...

:o

in other words, on this board, you are not aloowed to say a word about bush, just like those american boards you described

Mostly because it is just plain boring. :D

nationalism and xenophobia goes, it seems to have you a bit concerned ?

It is to my mind the single most critical issue in terms of the long term viability of Thailand as a business/retirement destination for foreigners.

I base that on my personal observation is that Nationalism and Xenophobia has increased dramatically in Thailand over the last decade and that this is having a direct impact on the acceptance and treatment of foreigners in Thailand.

This of course is a personal observation, but it is based on my experience of living and working in Thailand and on my discussions with Thais, observation of the problems that I have seen between Thais and foreigners and on reflection of the Thai media's portrayal of foreigners in Thailand.

My response to this is not perhaps as negative as Pepe, where he states he no longer plans to retire within Thailand, I still plan to retire in Thailand but always maintain the majority of my (our) capital outside of Thailand.

Your suggestion that making the wrong decision might result in finding oneself on the pavement, never arises.

Assumption has its place when considering investment in Thailand.

My assumption is that life for all foreigners in Thailand can, and may indeed go t1ts up.

The response to that assumption is not to burn one’s bridges.

I can now and always will be able to walk away from any investment I have made or ever will make in Thailand.

Others, like Pepe, perhaps don’t want to take even that risk.

Both positions are sound given the risks.

nationalism and xenophobia goes, it seems to have you a bit concerned ?

It is to my mind the single most critical issue in terms of the long term viability of Thailand as a business/retirement destination for foreigners.

I base that on my personal observation is that Nationalism and Xenophobia has increased dramatically in Thailand over the last decade and that this is having a direct impact on the acceptance and treatment of foreigners in Thailand.

This of course is a personal observation, but it is based on my experience of living and working in Thailand and on my discussions with Thais, observation of the problems that I have seen between Thais and foreigners and on reflection of the Thai media's portrayal of foreigners in Thailand.

My response to this is not perhaps as negative as Pepe, where he states he no longer plans to retire within Thailand, I still plan to retire in Thailand but always maintain the majority of my (our) capital outside of Thailand.

Your suggestion that making the wrong decision might result in finding oneself on the pavement, never arises.

Assumption has its place when considering investment in Thailand.

My assumption is that life for all foreigners in Thailand can, and may indeed go t1ts up.

The response to that assumption is not to burn one’s bridges.

I can now and always will be able to walk away from any investment I have made or ever will make in Thailand.

Others, like Pepe, perhaps don’t want to take even that risk.

Both positions are sound given the risks.

now your talking the talk guesthouse.

golden rule # 1 for all smart punters is, always leave your capital at home safe and sound being a nice little earner for your good self.

golden rule # 2 is only invest what you can afford to lose especially when dealing with the female variety.

golden rule # 3 is never burn your bridges concerning your home country as its always a place you can go to if thailand goes tits up as you say.

but to be perfectly honest,

INMO it will never come to that as thailand is dead with out its expat community and tourists. the government will never let this happen as its all about the money my friend.

the new visa rules have got people running scared, but if you are a legitimate farang you have no problems at all.

is your wife thai ?

if so you are ok for a visa. :D

are you 50 or over ?

brilliant then, as you get a retirement visa easily. :D

only a problem if your living on a tourist visa and as one punter has said before,

you cant do it in his country so why should los be any different ? :D

as far as pepe goes,

he feels he dont want to be here so he can just stay at home as it wont worry me and you will it ?

myself tend to associate with positive people who love los.

im sure you love it as well, as you would not be considering investing big money here.

if you are that concern'ed about the future of los why even do it ?

just retire here and get a nice hobby, ready to flee home when it all goes to &lt;deleted&gt;. :D

your very worried about this arn't you mate, the reason being you are going to invest money here.

its not to hard really, as if you are that sure this will come about, just dont do any business.

i done all my business years ago and will retire in thailand on a retirement visa keeping all my investments in aussie :D

anyway mate, good luck with the guesthouse and dont bleeding worry so much.

cheers :o

as far as pepe goes,

he feels he dont want to be here so he can just stay at home as it wont worry me and you will it ?

myself tend to associate with positive people who love los.

:o

Thank you for your encouragement Terry, I'll not worry so much, especially about the decisions other people choose to make.

'Nice hobby' - That's what I thought, a guesthouse.

At the moment i have a bit the same feeling as the DOC.

For me it is time to make a choice, a choice that is timed because the age of my children. Go back home?, stay here?, go somewhere else?

I make my money in my own country so that is not really a problem. I am married so have no visa problems. Children schooling is a problem as of yet i have not found a good school, and time is running out. (not rich enough to put two children in an International school).

And i have not lived here long enough to be able to feel the 'fundamentals' of Thailand.

I am influenced strongly what i see on a day to day basis, without really knowing enough of the Thai history.

It might be like, this will blow over soon, and when you have lived here a long time you would probably feel this. I act mostly on my experiences and 'gut' feeling. Never failed me before.

At the moment i feel things are getting worse and worse. No 'Future' can be planned here, not even een loosly planned one.

But again that is because i have not been through the up and down cycles in Thailand.

For my own country i know 100% sure that if there is some bad period it will go away and bounce back. A feeling, a 'knowing' i miss for Thailand.

With this 'decision' i have to be patient and consider my options carefully. I hope after this wave of 'bad' news there will be good news.

At the moment i have a bit the same feeling as the DOC.

For me it is time to make a choice, a choice that is timed because the age of my children. Go back home?, stay here?, go somewhere else?

I make my money in my own country so that is not really a problem. I am married so have no visa problems. Children schooling is a problem as of yet i have not found a good school, and time is running out. (not rich enough to put two children in an International school).

And i have not lived here long enough to be able to feel the 'fundamentals' of Thailand.

I am influenced strongly what i see on a day to day basis, without really knowing enough of the Thai history.

It might be like, this will blow over soon, and when you have lived here a long time you would probably feel this. I act mostly on my experiences and 'gut' feeling. Never failed me before.

At the moment i feel things are getting worse and worse. No 'Future' can be planned here, not even een loosly planned one.

But again that is because i have not been through the up and down cycles in Thailand.

For my own country i know 100% sure that if there is some bad period it will go away and bounce back. A feeling, a 'knowing' i miss for Thailand.

With this 'decision' i have to be patient and consider my options carefully. I hope after this wave of 'bad' news there will be good news.

cricky's mate ;

now your starting to get worried about things.

ive just had to help my good friend guest house out, and now he's feeling heaps better.

look this is the story of life my friend,

its the ying and the yang, the ups and the downs, the merry go round, going round and round and frigging round.

it will be all okay at the end of the day fella. :D

look mate :D

if i told you about the &lt;deleted&gt; things that have happen'ed to me in my life you would spew :D

but it done the circle and its all sweet now.

anyway,

ring your mate up, head of to the rubitty dub dub for a nice pint of lager, a dogs eye with dead horse and your on a winner.

cheers friend :o

Tell me Terry, now that you've sorted me out.

How long have you lived in Thailand and where are you now?

Also, if its not too intrusive to ask

Do you speek Thai?

Tell me Terry, now that you've sorted me out.

How long have you lived in Thailand and where are you now?

Also, if its not too intrusive to ask

Do you speek Thai?

cricky's guest house, :D

thats real personal stuff you are asking me there but its not a problem, as i'll give you my life's frigging history if you really want to know. :D

arrived in thailand 1987 on a back packing holiday.

immediatly feel in love with los.

started a diving business on koh tao 1988. we were # 2 shop on the island.

now theres 38 shops.

had a thai partner and a canadian.

thai partner killed by the mafia and canadian partner run away to his mommy. :D

sold my share after 7 years as it was getting to large and serious for me.

i was the lucky one as i got out of it ok. :D

return to los every 3 months and will retire in los shortly.

live in my home town of fremantle, perth and am now a veteran fire fighter saving life and property.

studying thai at the moment and hope to speak it before i retire in los, but i must add that its not easy for me to learn the lingo fluently.

so guesthouse, :D

thats it in short and thats why i know all the good oil on all things thai my friend. :D

now what about you mate ?

do you live in los full time ?

can you speak the lingo well ?

have you got a lovely thai wife ?

when are you going to start your guest house ?

and whats your story ?

cheers friend :o

Two years ago I came close to packing up my medical practice and retiring in Thailand. I love this country and have traveled there since 1971. Circiumstances did not allow it at that time. Now I'm glad I didn't.

Although not active on the forum these days, I do read it regularly.

I am truely concerned about the changes taking place in Thailand.

It is enough to deal with losing personal freedoms here at home. I can't imagine losing even more freedoms one has by residing in Thailand. What's the trade off?

<snip>

I have met Taksin, twice. Once in Thailand at the Dutch Embassy and once here in at the Thai Embassy in Los Angeles. No thanks.

It is refreshing to see so much open dissent/discussion on the board about Taksin and the other governmental, cultural and socio-economic BS that permeates the culture.

"Freedommmm!!!" - William Wallace

I remember a time, not too long ago, when this was discussed very cautiously and conservatively. Mostly encouraged not to discuss these kinds of things at all.

However it appears that "the gloves have most certainly come off now."

I applaud the moderators for permitting and the members for contributing the truth.

I will be in Thailand from 11-07 to 12-07.

"Doc" I had promised you a bottle (or two) of good red wine on more than one occasion.

If it's OK to put liquids in the luggage, at that time, let me know where we can meet so you can take delivery. I will be around Samuts Sakorn for a few days visiting family before traveling around the country.

Best of luck to all of you.

We've all got an opinion let me close with one more,

"Instant karma's gonna get you. It's gonna knock you one the head.

Better recognize your brother. Pretty soon your gonna be dead."

'Cause we all shine on. Like the moon and the stars and the sun. Yeah we all shine on. On an on and on and on and on on onnnnn."

- John Lennon :D

/Mod Edit - Discussion on Thai Royalty deleted - please see the Forum Rules.

I think I'm burned out on LOS but still dream about retiring there someday (I've been retired 8 yrs now [early retirement]). I started going to LOS during the crash of 1997 or 98 and have been there maybe a dozen times. I haven't been back now going on 2 years. Everytime I start thinking about going back, I get the feeling like I'm not getting enough air :o One of these days, I'm going to make it there... to SEA if not to LOS.

well he will probably live a longer fuller more interesting life than a BKK expat who goes to an early grave so it may be the best decision you ever made. Expats all seem to expire at an early age you dont see anyone over 65 years. All that beer and women and chilling in a hammock !

  • Author

I first wanted to say thanks for all the feedback. In this post I think Guesthouse sums up very nicely and simply, pretty close to exactly how I'm feeling.

I'm at the moment a pretty heathy 54. Ihave spent many years traveling to Thailand, since 1972 have in-laws in Samuts Sakorn. And been married to a Thai women for seven years.

There have been years where I have spent up to six months in Thailand and never vacation less than one month.

My brother in-law, from England, is a friend for over 20 years. He is married to my wife's older sister. He has lived in Thailand for ten years and has done business between Thailand, India, Hong Kong etc for the past twenty years.

So what I can't get from first hand experience I get from the "Cliff Notes" he gives me.

I will say I have a fairly good idea how things work but I can allways learn more.

Maybe I'm tired or as some have pointed out a little depressed.

I have tried to live my life according to Buddhist principles since 1974. Sometimes successfully, sometimes not. But allways on the path. And I won't stop in this life.

I don't recall where the saying comes from but it goes like this,

"Even though the ostrich puts it's head uder the ground, the lion still comes."

Again thanks to all of you guys. Everyones perspective has great value to me, even the quite cavalier characters.

Pepe'

Can't wait for vacation!!!

PS Doc lets talk about where to deliver your vino, again, if I can put liquids in the baggage at that time. I will be around Samuts Sakorn/Kratumban for a few days.

as i feel that the long term expats are much more educated and experienced in all things thai.

As a long term expat I take the view that the issues facing Thailand in the not too distant future are considerable and should not be dismissed out of hand.

Changes are afoot, and the inevitable change that is coming includes a huge challenge to much of what has made Thailand the comfortable welcoming place it is.

We have nationalism and xenophobia now, but it is controlled.

When the wise council and control is gone things will change and there are no signs the change will be an improvement.

Quite the contrary

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