Camronwit still stuck in Japanese custody

[cougar52]

This story just gets weirder and weirder - first he says he brought it from Thailand forgetting it was in his hand luggage before leaving Thailand and not found then coming back he put it in his medicine bag so he knew he had it then - why not put in his suitcase or better get rid!!!!!Then his son flies out to prove he has ownership papers for this gun and today he says he is using a close aid to contact the person who gave him the gun and get the ownership papers off him - confusing!

To get to the bottom of the ownership problem, it is quite simple to run the serial number of the gun and get it's history and he was the last to actually own it. Follow the paper trail.

You could find out maybe if it was from Thailand, Japan, or maybe even Dubai.

[Thai at Heart]

The CTX-9000DSi scanners are based on cat scan technology. It identifies explosive material plus metal objects. I find it difficult to believe the scanner would not have identified the gun if it was in a vertical position as reported by the airport official.

Don't the CTX things deal with hold baggage. This was in his hand luggage.

I think you are right and we are talking about 2 different things (scanners) here.

An earlier report said that he had said he had put the gun (medicine bag) in his checked luggage when he left BKK and it was found in his carry on bag in Japan.

There was a photo somewhere from a CCTV camera at the airport in Thailand of him putting his carry on bag on the conveyer leading to an X ray machine.

So two different types of scan or three if you include the body scan that you must pass through.

If the gun had been in his checked luggage in Japan he may have got away with it, whereas if it had been in his carry on bag in BKK it would have been seen as the bag passed through the X ray where the screen is monitored full time.

A small gun like this could get missed in hand luggage very easily. Thing is, its pretty obvious they may not have been checked at all in SVB because they are pooyai and above the law.

Which of course would reflect very badly on the whole airport security system

[smutcakes]

I hope to God this guy is only receiving the embassy assistance that you, i of Khun Somchai would receive given we were somehow caught in the same predicament.

Sadly i expect the tax payer will be funding lawyers, flights over there and much time and resources of embassy staff and other diplomats

[Inepto Cracy]

This gun is not only carried for self defence. It is used to commit naughty acts of retaliation. Just because this guy was a police big wig, he should get an even harsher sentence because he should know better. Take his sentence, double it and add on an extra half for being a complete jerk and adding to the downfall of the Thai Airways safety issues. Now it is the airports as well as the Thai planes here that have safety issues now. Well done numbnuts.

[Robby nz]

The CTX-9000DSi scanners are based on cat scan technology. It identifies explosive material plus metal objects. I find it difficult to believe the scanner would not have identified the gun if it was in a vertical position as reported by the airport official.

Don't the CTX things deal with hold baggage. This was in his hand luggage.

I think you are right and we are talking about 2 different things (scanners) here.

An earlier report said that he had said he had put the gun (medicine bag) in his checked luggage when he left BKK and it was found in his carry on bag in Japan.

There was a photo somewhere from a CCTV camera at the airport in Thailand of him putting his carry on bag on the conveyer leading to an X ray machine.

So two different types of scan or three if you include the body scan that you must pass through.

If the gun had been in his checked luggage in Japan he may have got away with it, whereas if it had been in his carry on bag in BKK it would have been seen as the bag passed through the X ray where the screen is monitored full time.

A small gun like this could get missed in hand luggage very easily. Thing is, its pretty obvious they may not have been checked at all in SVB because they are pooyai and above the law.

Which of course would reflect very badly on the whole airport security system

Its not that small, almost full hand size so I doubt it would be missed. After all that is the sort of thing they are looking for.

Both he and the airport said he went through scans so they confirm each other and as I posted there was a photo somewhere, don't remember if it was on here or another publication, of him in the airport at the conveyer to a scan.

"Which of course would reflect very badly on the whole airport security system"

The whole airport security system ? try not to exaggerate things out of all proportion it does no good for your credibility.

[Inepto Cracy]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

[Basil B]

This story just gets weirder and weirder - first he says he brought it from Thailand forgetting it was in his hand luggage before leaving Thailand and not found then coming back he put it in his medicine bag so he knew he had it then - why not put in his suitcase or better get rid!!!!!Then his son flies out to prove he has ownership papers for this gun and today he says he is using a close aid to contact the person who gave him the gun and get the ownership papers off him - confusing!

To get to the bottom of the ownership problem, it is quite simple to run the serial number of the gun and get it's history and he was the last to actually own it. Follow the paper trail.

You could find out maybe if it was from Thailand, Japan, or maybe even Dubai.

One would have thought he new better...

Gun as a gift, if someone gives you a gun just like that, the paper chase of the serial number will end with the last registered owner.

If tests establish the gun has been used in crime, that's a lot of explaining to do.

For sure the will be a paper trail on the gun, most importantly when manufactured where was it shipped?

Who was the last registered owner?

Hope the number was not filled off, though special processes can detect the serial number even if it has been filed off.

Lot of questions... and a story that changes every time the last one was disproved wont help.

[Jay Sata]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

Not just pilots...I have found some of their air traffic controllers suffer from very poor English.

[Colabamumbai]

Typical Thais lies, lies and more lies.

[JAG]

A Japanese jail can't be that bad - after all he will be fed on rice? If it was a western nick he might be having to eat sadwiches!

[Jim walker]

Don’t these common Japanese understand that he is a member of the Thai elite and can get off with committing any crime in Thailand carry a gun or accidently shoot someone when the gun just goes off in your hand that’s just a walk away accident, what sort of example is this high ranking policeman showing to the Thai youth of today next they will be trying the same when coming home from Pakistan or some other foreign destination shame on him.

[billphillips]

Hmmmm. It now seems the guns registration papers are in a friends name. That doesn't work for me. The whole purpose of having the gun registered to the owner is to provide a direct link between the weapon and the individual responsible for it. No one in their right mind lends a registered gun to someone else. If you gift or sell a gun to someone, then of course you change the registration and ownership to them.

Two main points ...

1, illegal possession of a firearm ( no licence in Japan ).

2, attempting to carry a loaded firearm onto a plane.

Either of these are serious offences, jointly they must equate to jail time. I suspect that an old pal is scurrying around somewhere in the bowels of police HQ Thailand, in an attempt to make up enough excuses for the worm to wriggle free.

[Jay Sata]

His current room will look something like this

[Pimay1]

The CTX-9000DSi scanners are based on cat scan technology. It identifies explosive material plus metal objects. I find it difficult to believe the scanner would not have identified the gun if it was in a vertical position as reported by the airport official.

Don't the CTX things deal with hold baggage. This was in his hand luggage.

Correct, CTX scanners are used for checked in baggage. According to Japanese officials the gun was in his checked suitcase. Camronwit has told so many different versions of the "truth" anything he says now is not credible. I don't believe he would be stupid enough to put the gun in a carry on bag and try to slip passed the xray scanner at Bangkok that will red flag a small nail file. I believe it was in his checked baggage when he left Thailand. According to the news report below it was in his checked baggage at Narita airport. I believe a Japanese police official on the scene would describe the events truthfully. On the other hand Thai officials.........

http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/article/1827270/airport-denies-gun-security-breach

Lieutenant General Comronwit Thoopgrajank was arrested on Monday at Tokyo's Narita International Airport on his way back to Bangkok with a handgun containing five bullets in his check-in luggage, according to a police official at Narita. The official said the gun was detected by X-ray check after it passed the airline check-in counter. Comronwit had in the meantime obtained his boarding pass and gone to the gate, where police brought his suitcase and opened it in his presence.

The official said Comronwit's explanation was that he had forgotten the gun was in his suitcase.

[Robby nz]

The lady boss tells me that it is being said on facebook that the gun has no serial number. That would make it an illegal weapon.

If this is true it adds a whole new dimension to the charges that can be leveled against the EX police general and leaves him right up to his ears in it.

[Oziex1]

The lady boss tells me that it is being said on facebook that the gun has no serial number. That would make it an illegal weapon.

If this is true it adds a whole new dimension to the charges that can be leveled against the EX police general and leaves him right up to his ears in it.

If true what would be the point of showing registration papers to the Japs?

[Robby nz]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

I have read that the gripe of the IAOC is not with the airlines or airports but with the Govt dept that governs safety in the industry and with their poor regulation..

None of the things you mention have anything to do with this topic nor has the language abilities of pilots.

[Robby nz]

The lady boss tells me that it is being said on facebook that the gun has no serial number. That would make it an illegal weapon.

If this is true it adds a whole new dimension to the charges that can be leveled against the EX police general and leaves him right up to his ears in it.

If true what would be the point of showing registration papers to the Japs?

If true there would be no registration papers for any papers would have to be matched with the serial number of the weapon.

Of last report the Japanese police had not seen any registration papers, it was first reported that his son had taken them with him to Japan.

Last report said an 'aid' had been sent to look for the friend who gave the gun as a present in order to get the papers.

We wait for farther reports to see if the friend has been located and has come up with papers.

We also wait for an official report on whether or not the gun has a serial number.

[Jay Sata]

Very conveniant to have a gun in your possesion that is registered to a third party 'friend' who gave it you you as a present.

I don't have any friends who would ever give me a gun and I would be wary if they did.

Of course this way if it is ever used in anger it can not be traced back to our dear incarcerated friend.

No doubt some dubious paperwork will emerge...you can buy everything on the Khoa San Rd.

The friend defence is used a lot in Thailand. I seem to recall Chalerm has a friend who loaned him some very expensive cars from Singapore.

[Thai at Heart]

The lady boss tells me that it is being said on facebook that the gun has no serial number. That would make it an illegal weapon.

If this is true it adds a whole new dimension to the charges that can be leveled against the EX police general and leaves him right up to his ears in it.

If true what would be the point of showing registration papers to the Japs?

If true there would be no registration papers for any papers would have to be matched with the serial number of the weapon.

Of last report the Japanese police had not seen any registration papers, it was first reported that his son had taken them with him to Japan.

Last report said an 'aid' had been sent to look for the friend who gave the gun as a present in order to get the papers.

We wait for farther reports to see if the friend has been located and has come up with papers.

We also wait for an official report on whether or not the gun has a serial number.

The fact that its registered serves only to prove it came from Thailand. In away AOT would rather there aren't any papers, so they can claim he got it in Japan.

Either way, it doesn't legitimise taking it on an aeroplane...

[scorecard]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

Does it also cover proper check at the gate, on boarding of:

- Check name on ticket 100% same as name on identification document.

- Not accept ID document unless it has a photo.

- Check the person in the photo on the ID document is the actual person presenting the photo ID document?

[billphillips]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

Some Thai pilots can't speak English ... Hmmm ... The radio part of the pilots exam / test must be interesting then, particularly the phonetic alphabet section.

Ermmmm ... And relevant to this thread in what way?

[Jay Sata]

@ Robby nz.

I take it you do not know the full extent of the safety issues regarding the red flagging of Thailand by the IAOC? I am a pilot here and all aspects of safety issues are covered, from airports, planes, maintenance of buildings, radar, control towers and runways.. Did you also not know that some Thai pilots cannot even speak English? Better get up to speed please.

Some Thai pilots can't speak English ... Hmmm ... The radio part of the pilots exam / test must be interesting then, particularly the phonetic alphabet section.

Ermmmm ... And relevant to this thread in what way?

Thread drift to lax standards on security and the recent red flagging of Thailands DCA. If you have spent any time in Thailand as I am sure you have you will know that passing an English exam does not mean you have to speak English. I suspect a good proportion of Thai aircraft engineers are unable to read the maintenance manuals.

I doubt this police chief can speak english but the odds are most of the Japanese he has met can.

[aimbc]

So shouldn't the headline be.. Laxed security in Thai airport?

[rametindallas]

"surely a senior policeman would not be so stupid ....."

SERIOUSLY? lol Oh no they are indeed known for their intellect; just like the other "geniuses" running the asylum.

Exactly. They are promoted for their reliability in blindly following instructions from above and their loyalty.

An official of the Japanese government, when contacted by the Kom Chad Luek newspaper, reportedly said the gun was inside Camronwit's medicine bag and it was loaded with five bullets.

Couldn't he have at least unloaded it before trying to bring it on the plane. Proof that it's who you know and not what you know that gets you ahead in Thailand.

Ron White - "You Can't Fix Stupid" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDvQ77JP8nw

.

[rametindallas]

I thought I read originally that the son was traveling to Japan with the gun registration papers. Now we hear that a "friend" who gave him the gun has the / his papers. Or is it that the local plod are too slow in coming up with a set of papers that will pass international scrutiny for a gun they have never seen? In any event, surely a senior policeman would not be so stupid as to travel abroad with a gun without carrying its papers. There is clearly more to this than we are being told.

I would suggest the registration papers, if they exist, are something of an irrelevance as they are only applicable to Thailand.

Carrying a gun overseas without clearance from the host country is stupid and it's unlikely to have been given. Apart from the fact that the Japanese are hot on gun control and possession why would he need one when the purpose of visit was supposedly inspecting waste disposal systems ?

Thais need to learn, no mean feat, that who they think they are, what they can do, what they can get away with ends when they leave the country.

Looking this weapon up on Google, I'm surprised at how small it is. There are several models, and we don't know if this is the regular, the long rifle, or the magnum version, but they are all basically derringer sized, which means you could basically cover the thing with your hand. I have no idea what a "medicine bag" is. I think Native Americans used to carry magical implements and relics in what was translated from their languages as a "medicine bag." If it is used to carry medicines which must be taken regularly it's hard to see how he could not have been reminded of the presence of the thing every morning, noon, and night, or however often he had to take his medicine. On the other hand if it was filled with stuff like bandages, tourniquet, and disinfectant, to be used only in case of an emergency, it's hard to see why he was carrying it at all.

Assuming he has reason to be fearful of assassins, perhaps he has guns stashed all over his house and routinely carries something like this little dandy, and maybe he did just forget it. It's kind of bizarre. Not that a VIP like him would bypass the security check in Thailand, but that he would take a gun to Japan, where even the police are usually unarmed.

Oh, I just scrolled through some other replies and see that a helpful video was posted, telling us that this is the magnum version. Not sure how helpful it would be against a really determined attacker, but certainly deadly if you're lucky enough to hit the right spot.

Not sure how helpful it would be against a really determined attacker, but certainly deadly if you're lucky enough to hit the right spot.

If you are a common mugger and you get shot with a .22 magnum round, unless you are a hired assassin your priorities will quickly change from wanting to mug that person to wanting to seek medical attention. It doesn't have to be deadly, which it most certainly can be, to be protection.

.

[rametindallas]

"He has now assigned a close aide to contact his friend to get the registration papers for the gun, which will be used as evidence,"

The only evidence I see here is that the gun was never registered in his name, otherwise his son would have brought it to Japan.

I read elsewhere the scans of his luggage when he checked in in Bkk were deleted which is common after 3 days. However, he was caught in Tokyo within this time frame…

I suspect the "registration papers" happen to be in a big brown envelope

or a 'snack box'.

.

[Jay Sata]

The fact the gun was loaded makes his problems worse.

Who would carry a gun abroad by accident?

A loaded gun suggests ready to use.

What sort of normal person carries a loaded gun around and is not aware they have it?

Most people return from a trip and empty their luggage.

Pre departure they load their luggage being aware of weight and restrictions.

In my opinion he thought he was on a VIP trip and would not be checked.

The gun probably showed up on the scanner in BK but the operator was not going to rock the boat.

The question is how does he escape from this mess.

Nearly a week in the slammer!

[Robby nz]

The lady boss tells me that it is being said on facebook that the gun has no serial number. That would make it an illegal weapon.

If this is true it adds a whole new dimension to the charges that can be leveled against the EX police general and leaves him right up to his ears in it.

If true what would be the point of showing registration papers to the Japs?

If true there would be no registration papers for any papers would have to be matched with the serial number of the weapon.

Of last report the Japanese police had not seen any registration papers, it was first reported that his son had taken them with him to Japan.

Last report said an 'aid' had been sent to look for the friend who gave the gun as a present in order to get the papers.

We wait for farther reports to see if the friend has been located and has come up with papers.

We also wait for an official report on whether or not the gun has a serial number.

The fact that its registered serves only to prove it came from Thailand. In away AOT would rather there aren't any papers, so they can claim he got it in Japan.

Either way, it doesn't legitimise taking it on an aeroplane...

No it does not, the fact that it is registered proves that it is a legal weapon and that he had a permit to carry it regardless of where it came from.

The airport in Thailand have clearly stated their position and are making no excuses and no claims, they are saying the gun was not detected in the scan that was done, they are not saying it was not there.

Read the piece in the BKK Post under 'learning English from the news'.

If there are no papers and as has been suggested there are no ID numbers (been removed) on the gun then it is illegal and that puts a whole new dimension on things for as well as attempting to take a weapon on a plane it then becomes 'in possession of an illegal weapon'

We now go here for an update http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/836311-camronwits-gun-found-to-be-unregistered/

Edited June 27, 2015 by Robby nz

[aimbc]

It appears that the Thai government will have a hard time explaining how their laxed security checked allowed the gun to pass through. In light of the flight safety order against Thailand. I think the guy is on his own. Of course there is his buddy TS. But I doubt TS will help. His many goons are not the brightest. Hate to say it most cops are just mafia bosses.