SinSot type payments

[MaeJoMTB]

. So many telling you not to get married, dont trust a thai etc. Only you can decide if you think she is genuine and not looking to take you for a ride. You said she is 40, how old are you? I wish you all the best and remember not all Thai girls are the same, just like all the girls from the UK or USA are not all the same.

she is late 30's approaching 40, I'm about 6 or 7 years older.

In the past I've enjoyed the bar scene and all that is part and parcel of that and have been striving for more meaningful encounters for around 4 years now

Move on, this isn't a meaningful relationship, just a bigger bar-fine.

[whooshbang]

A few people on this thread have mentioned never to take a Thai girl to your home country.... why? Is that based on the slim chance that when she's got a passport she will ultimately do one?

Yes there is that - plus check out the divorce laws in <insert your farang homeland here> vs those in Thailand. I'm no expert, but as far as I'm aware, under Thai divorce law, you get to keep any assets that were yours before the marriage. If you're divorced in farangland, no such restrictions apply.

Divorce laws can be also be very hazy about 'domicile' and 'country of residence' etc. , so even if you lived back in farangland just for a few years, the divorce laws might work against you. It's no coincidence that women married to wealthy men who have quite tenuous connections to the UK are moving heaven and earth to get their cases tried there (because they're so advantageous to women).

I would say to anyone considering marriage, treat it like a business contract. I'd say it's definitely worth spending maybe 500 dollars on a 1-2 hour consultation with a good divorce lawyer to see what the ramifications might be for you down the road if things go pear-shaped (bearing in mind also that in 10+ years' time you could be considerably wealthier).

Thanks for that. If, and its a big "if" we get married it will be in LOS followed by very small ceremony at her farm with family and some friends. She is actually against the idea of having a big bash and flashing loads of money around etc so i am happy about that bit.

I possible that a Thai marriage followed by any divorce appears more straight forward in LOS and these days even in my farangland (UK) she'll be lucky to get her hands on my assets especially if i have treated her well and don't commit adultery etc. Plus there's always a pre-nuptial agreement that can be jointly signed and i will not marry until thats done. Even if she hits me with the "if you really love me you not make me sign"

[MaeJoMTB]

I possible that a Thai marriage followed by any divorce appears more straight forward in LOS and these days even in my farangland (UK) she'll be lucky to get her hands on my assets especially if i have treated her well and don't commit adultery etc. Plus there's always a pre-nuptial agreement that can be jointly signed and i will not marry until thats done. Even if she hits me with the "if you really love me you not make me sign"

Sorry to be the one to tell you, but UK operates a 'No Fault' divorce system.

Behavior of the people in the marriage does not affect the division of assets.

Prenuptial agreement is null and void in the UK, upon birth of any children.

On a more positive note, she can't get access to the UK court system without being in the UK.

So don't take her there. (Yes, I know the rules say different, but if not in the UK they just give you a paper chase run around)

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Same in Canada. Prenuptial is useless, but she can access the court system through a lawyer even if in Thailand. I'm sure it's the same in UK.

[wprime]

1 million baht if she's a good Bangkok girl and as much gold as you can afford.

Your lucky gold is really low now and if you wait it could get cheaper. Its Sin Sod not Sot. According to the rules it only serves as bragging rights for the mother and after the ceremony it should be returned to you and your wife but seeing as how your a foreigner don't hold your breath on this one. If your not happy with the girl its none refundable. I would suggest you move on as there are lots of fish in the sea although we are in a drought weather wise but there is no drought with regard to the number of Thai ladies looking for love. Once your a giver always a giver. Never tell Thai ladies how much money you have always plead poverty they will understand that.

Firstly you really shouldn't be correcting other people's spelling. Whether you write it as Sin Sot or Sin Sod depends on the transliteration standard you are using. It is however pronounced Sin Sot.

[whooshbang]

I possible that a Thai marriage followed by any divorce appears more straight forward in LOS and these days even in my farangland (UK) she'll be lucky to get her hands on my assets especially if i have treated her well and don't commit adultery etc. Plus there's always a pre-nuptial agreement that can be jointly signed and i will not marry until thats done. Even if she hits me with the "if you really love me you not make me sign"

Sorry to be the one to tell you, but UK operates a 'No Fault' divorce system.

Behavior of the people in the marriage does not affect the division of assets.

Prenuptial agreement is null and void in the UK, upon birth of any children.

On a more positive note, she can't get access to the UK court system without being in the UK.

So don't take her there. (Yes, I know the rules say different, but if not in the UK they just give you a paper chase run around)

ah, righty ho! there won't be any kids as i can't have em but i do have assets in the UK and Thailand. I'll need to dig deeper and see what exactly she is entitled to after a Thai marriage. Maybe her reluctance to accept a sin sot is because she has her eye on the bigger prize ;-)

But I would hazard a guess that even after paying a 100,000thb sin sot (which i'm not expected to do), shindig in the village and running around getting the knot tied in Ampher, it would still be cheaper than doing it in my home country to a fellow citizen.

I wonder how the original poster is getting on after trying to negotiate his sin sot terms?

[MaeJoMTB]

^^

Best asset security, is not to tell her you have them.

Tell her no assets in the UK, and she won't look for them.

Tell her no bank account in the UK, and she won't be able to find it.

Boasters always lose most.

[fang37]

No $$$ - no sin sod! Nuffin much of anything?

[spidermike007]

Simply put, the older the woman is, the lower her sin sot value. Her mom gets 100k. Very fair. Any more may be extortion.

[whooshbang]

^^

Best asset security, is not to tell her you have them.

Tell her no assets in the UK, and she won't look for them.

Tell her no bank account in the UK, and she won't be able to find it.

Boasters always lose most.

good advice. i have played my UK assets right down. And i'm relatively low income too as far as she's concerned. She knows about my pokey little condo in Thailand though.. ain't worth much!

[wprime]

^^

Best asset security, is not to tell her you have them.

Tell her no assets in the UK, and she won't look for them.

Tell her no bank account in the UK, and she won't be able to find it.

Boasters always lose most.

good advice. i have played my UK assets right down. And i'm relatively low income too as far as she's concerned. She knows about my pokey little condo in Thailand though.. ain't worth much!

It also helps the girls trust you. Most Thai girls have trouble feeling secure with wealthier men.

[tonray]

^^

Best asset security, is not to tell her you have them.

Tell her no assets in the UK, and she won't look for them.

Tell her no bank account in the UK, and she won't be able to find it.

Boasters always lose most.

good advice. i have played my UK assets right down. And i'm relatively low income too as far as she's concerned. She knows about my pokey little condo in Thailand though.. ain't worth much!

It also helps the girls trust you. Most Thai girls have trouble feeling secure with wealthier men.

Insecurity must be in demand then because they sure are not shy about seeking out wealthy farangs.

[bwpage3]

Rhamkanghang is the lowest form of Bangkok Education. In your country her degree would be worthless so don't except her to land a job that can help you out.

If you bring her to your own country and you do not have a house, car, etc. do not be surprised if sooner or later she dumps you. Women marry foreigners expected well to improve their situation and fulfill their own dreams of having something better.

That being said, Sin Sod is an individual preference. Many people that swear up and down they will never pay Sin Sod, simply do not want to admit they do not have the money to pay.

I married an Isaan gal and out of respect for her and her father in a tiny village, paid 300,000 baht Sin Sod and about 6 baht of gold. The gold was all for my wife's wedding jewelry which I would have bought anyways.

My father in law gave the money back to my wife right after the ceremony and before the giant party we threw with live entertainment for a crowd of around 500. That cost me another 100K but was well worth it to my wife and the entire village who had never seen such a spectacle.

The invitations sent out collected about 30,000 baht returned which was unexpected from such a poor village. So the wedding bash ended up costing 70K

Once again the experience was something we will both remember the rest of our lives.

Sin Sod, you really have to know the parents and who you are dealing with. If there is no agreement to return the money guaranteed by your wife to be, I would be very, very cautious and suspect something was awash. Then it becomes more about money and not about you. If that is the case, I would bail out.

We were together for about 4 years before the wedding so I knew her father in law extremely well and never had any trust issues.

If you cannot reach agreement and they feel they must keep the Sin Sod, you are really nothing to them and the money is something.

[kungpao]

It sounds obvious that mom relies on daughter. Must be hard for her. She only has daughter to help her. Then if her daughter marries...someone has to care for mom.

Maybe I've said it before, but it would help to forget about thinking of all of the concepts around "Thai girls" and all that. People are people. This is a simple financial matter.

Sure, mom would like you to marry. She's thinking about her own skin and how she will survive beyond that 500 baht a month from the government.

When I got married, I fully expected/accepted/volunteered to later help out my wife's parents. They are very good people. Her whole family is good. I'm very happy. Wife is very good. Never so happy in my 50 years. So...this is a practical matter. This is a matter of what is right. If the good parents raised a great daughter then we must help them in some way. Care for them. This is what we do for our parents.

I don't think of my wife as a Thai woman. I think if her as a woman from Thailand. And her parents are not Thai people. They are people who live in Thailand. At the end of the day, they are good people, they are family and not faceless people with labels attached, unfair labels and stereotypes.

[Linzz]

How old is she? What's her educational background? Does she have children? How wealthy is the family?

she''s approaching 40, got a degree from Ramkemheng, her dad passed away when she was young, her 2 brothers aren't as well educated, I wouldn't describe them as rich or high so, just an ordinary work a day family, she's not got kids, not been married before (at least not admitting to it), having seen her visa application I believe that to be true.

Being almost 40 makes her value drop considerably. If she is still a virgin well then the price goes up. If she is very attractive (she must be because you love her) the price goes up. If you want to take her back to the homeland chances are she will not work ( and will join the local coffee clatching smoking gossip clubs) and you have to support her and this causes the price to go down. I would say about 50,000 bahts and a baht of gold should seal the deal. Maybe forget the gold. Just be careful I always use the rule of thumb "Never take the Thai out of Thailand" If her affection for you cools there well things could get pretty hot for you. The welfare system does not want to get stuck for your mistakes. They will come looking for you. When exposed to another culture a "Keeping up with the Jones" mentality can form. Always remember love and hate walk an awfully thin line.

My experience is different. I did take mine back to my home country. She's got a job and never stops working. She doesn't like other Thai's so much because she finds them too gossipy. We talked about sin sod before we got married but I never paid any because I said I didn't have extra and besides an engagement ring and wedding ring was my sin sot in my tradition. I told her she had to buy my wedding ring and she did. She's never mentioned it since but there is a point that while some or most may be gold diggers in this respect, others feel that for us to part with money shows our sincerity and gives security that she trusts your'e not going to end up being a skinflint. You can tell her you don't like to buy a wife and you will be told it's traditional and it is and sometimes Thai men pay a massive amount. Up to you really but in my case my wife has no parents since they're both deceased so I had no pressure from anywhere.You could tell her you will go to India and find a bride there because in their tradition the wife's family has to pay you the dowry as was the case originally in Western culture. Good luck but try not to flash your money because it brings temptation and greed and that applies to any culture.Stick with your own cultural values but be generous in other non prescriptive ways if she's sincere.

[pigeonjake]

these threads are allways good for a laugh,

who paid this, i paid this, i paid that, i didnt pay anything,, i give this, they dont ask for more, she wasnt a bar girl, her perents are rich,,

bloody hell,

how did men go on with girls before they came here,

did they have to ask a forum who to date,?

[MaeJoMTB]

how did men go on with girls before they came here,

We didn't have girls back then.

[wprime]

^^

Best asset security, is not to tell her you have them.

Tell her no assets in the UK, and she won't look for them.

Tell her no bank account in the UK, and she won't be able to find it.

Boasters always lose most.

good advice. i have played my UK assets right down. And i'm relatively low income too as far as she's concerned. She knows about my pokey little condo in Thailand though.. ain't worth much!

It also helps the girls trust you. Most Thai girls have trouble feeling secure with wealthier men.

Insecurity must be in demand then because they sure are not shy about seeking out wealthy farangs.

Most people feel comfortable with partner's of the same status (on a relational level measured in confidence but socioeconomic status tends to be proportional). Obviously there are a dozen other reasons but this is the main the reason why most genuinely wealthy people hide their wealth (not just for partners but for all relationships). It's difficult to build a meaningful relationship where there exists a status difference.

[jerojero]

Same in Canada. Prenuptial is useless, but she can access the court system through a lawyer even if in Thailand. I'm sure it's the same in UK.

But in Canada assets owned before the marriage remain owned by the individual and not subject to split upon divorce.

[jerojero]

I'm kinda in the same situation here. been with a Thai girl for 1.5 years and when i visit this December it's meet the parents time. We haven't any solid plans to get married but we talked of it and i have mentioned the sin sot to her and she laughed it off and said "you don't worry about sin sot". I told her in the interests of tradition i should at least bring a gift for my first visit in december. Fruit being the obvious first choice but then she says "I buy mom some gold ok, only small and tell her you buy". doesn't sound like a golddigger to me!

now am I missing something here? I don;t know. In the event she were to move to my home country she wants to work and send money home because after my mortgage and bills it isn't gonna come outta my pocket. Thats been established.

A few people on this thread have mentioned never to take a Thai girl to your home country.... why? Is that based on the slim chance that when she's got a passport she will ultimately do one?

I don't think all these girls are cut from the same cloth so i am gonna give it whirl. worse case scenario i am a few grand down and broken hearted (been there before)..... best case scenario I live a long happy life with a beautiful, caring and kind lady.

OP try telling her you are not willing to pay that much sin sot and see how she reacts.

I'm in same boat as you my friend, and as long as we don't sink our life savings into the relationship or will become destitute if things down the road turn bad.

[khunpa]

I got married to my 44 year old Thai-girlfriend last year, who I had known since she was 37.

Never been asked for money or pressured into marriage by her family. We even had a kid together before we decide to marry and the main reason for getting married was because we wanted to do the best for our son.

If you are getting pressured into anything, then I advise you to get out of it. And if you are being asked for money, then that is of course your choice. However, I would personally never had been with my girl-friend/wife, if she had asked me for money or her family had.

[samuibeachcomber]

You marrying her or her mother?

I have come to understand when dealing with a poor thai family(materially speaking)that there is an expectation from the daughter for you to give something,a show of respect if you like.I see no problem with this(jai naam)...but only give what you can afford either in cash or if you see their home is poor maybe spend a little to improve it,showing generosity in thailand is part of their culture and it would be expected if their daughter was involves with a thai man too.

[samuibeachcomber]

these threads are allways good for a laugh,

who paid this, i paid this, i paid that, i didnt pay anything,, i give this, they dont ask for more, she wasnt a bar girl, her perents are rich,,

bloody hell,

how did men go on with girls before they came here,

did they have to ask a forum who to date,?

no but if this guy is serious it would be good to have some understanding of thai culture,because the questions asked will also apply to a thai man in the same situation.

[coulson]

You're taking her away from a salary that she will not be able to earn in your home, at least you appear to understand you'll have to compensate for this.

As far as the sin sot is concerned, there are plenty of valuable resources on this site (aside from this thread alone) that will give you a deeper insight. If you are not savvy to the sin sot concept then you are likely not understanding many of the other cultural challenges you are going to face.

Sin sot would be discussed at the early stages of the wedding preparation for one, and with her and her family, its not a hint here and there to test the water, if it is......then return like with like, tell her you will not pay anything to gauge her interest in you, let her sit for a while and her behavior will be telling. Remove money from the equation and a lot of truths come out, don't rush into it. If its not enough for her to know that you'll somehow benefit her mother by marrying and taking care of her for life, then..........

When the time comes a suitable compromise can be met that could satisfy everyone. If there is a rush on the table also check out the family debt situation, or whatever other financial needs require addressing, you just don't sound like you know too much about this particular situation.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

You marrying her or her mother?

in thailand is part of their culture and it would be expected if their daughter was involves with a thai man too.

Respectfully disagree. I am certainly not an expert in Thai culture, but I have dated a well off Thai girl in Canada (meaning she was able to explain in great detail everything about Thai men) and currently am in a long term relationship with a middle class Thai woman here in Bangkok. Both of them want nothing to do with Thai men. They only stick with us because we are more gullible. Fact.

[RT85]

i offered 100k or Nothing.

guess which they took?

in all fairness our sinsot was more for 'show' than anything else... life has been good so far...

good luck!

[never me]

You marrying her or her mother?

He is not sure yet as the mother winked at him the other night.

You lucky little aussie.

[never me]

Whats the difference between sinsot & Human Trafficking ?............Nothing. They are same same.

Thailand is still on tier 3 for Human trafficking.

[Linzz]

Whats the difference between sinsot & Human Trafficking ?............Nothing. They are same same.

Thailand is still on tier 3 for Human trafficking.

That sounds a bit extreme. Agreed Thailand has a human trafficking problem that has to be dealt to and relates to slavery. Maybe you can equate sinsot to buying and selling but it depends on each individual case. If money is showcased for traditional reasons to demonstrate sincerity of the suitor with a statement of ability to provide and to reflect the status of and desirability of the bride, then not so. In many cases that money is then returned so I don't think you can equate that to human trafficking. If the bride is sold against her will and money exchanged in a completed transaction, then yes that would amount to human trafficking.

[jacko45k]

You marrying her or her mother?

I have come to understand when dealing with a poor thai family(materially speaking)that there is an expectation from the daughter for you to give something,a show of respect if you like.I see no problem with this(jai naam)...but only give what you can afford either in cash or if you see their home is poor maybe spend a little to improve it,showing generosity in thailand is part of their culture and it would be expected if their daughter was involves with a thai man too.

Yes I have noticed that, and the respect required often involves an outstretched palm more than a wai.

I have explained to my partner of 12 years is that I am not a Thai man, so do not expect the behaviour of one from me. Some of that may be good, some of that may not suit them. In the early days that exhibited itself as rather unsophisticated attempts to manipulate me.

Things seem to have settled nicely and my behaviour has been better than that of one or 2 of her brothers.

Pressure from her 'mum' is something I do not respond well to.