Students with pierced ears, visible tattoos to be barred from vocational schools

[HHTel]

Adisorn Sinprasong, secretary of the Association of Private Technological and Vocational Education Colleges is obviously a person of very little intelect who has been given a position that indeed requires a modicum of intelligence.

No-one with half a brain would say ------

"Young people with large ear-piercings and tattoos are at risk of engaging in antisocial behaviour and violence," he claimed.

As we would say in the UK "What a plonker!"

[duanebigsby]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

[Asheron]

Is it not stupid to permanently disfigure yourself?

If someone could find a way to remove a tattoo completely after say six months, they would sure get rich.

Or what about a tattoo ink that fades completely over a year or two?

Does circumcision of penises count as disfiguring?

Do you walk around with yours "visible"?

I don't see "possum1931" write anything about visible. Do you?

[happy Joe]

Seeing that the overwhelming majority of Thai Visa menbers is against ... Then it must be a good decision.

[casualbiker]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

But companies certainly do!

Police in UK

http://www.theguardian.com/careers/careers-blog/tattoos-workplace-job-prospects-career

Police in USA

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-chicago-police-union-fights-policy-banning-visible-tattoos-2015-6

And a quick Google also found a fair few diploma and degree courses that also banned "visible" tattoos and big ear ear piercing.

[casualbiker]

Is it not stupid to permanently disfigure yourself?

If someone could find a way to remove a tattoo completely after say six months, they would sure get rich.

Or what about a tattoo ink that fades completely over a year or two?

Does circumcision of penises count as disfiguring?

Do you walk around with yours "visible"?

I don't see "possum1931" write anything about visible. Do you?

But that's exactly what the OP is about!

Visible tattoos and visible large hole ear piercing.

[duanebigsby]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

But companies certainly do!

Police in UK

http://www.theguardian.com/careers/careers-blog/tattoos-workplace-job-prospects-career

Police in USA

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-chicago-police-union-fights-policy-banning-visible-tattoos-2015-6

And a quick Google also found a fair few diploma and degree courses that also banned "visible" tattoos and big ear ear piercing.

Those are employer specific rules. The schools are informing students who want to work as airline cabin crew and police, etc, the rules for employment.

How many plumbers, electricians, and mechanics are being turned away from schools in the UK or USA?

[starky]

I find it interesting the number of posters that either missed or are ignoring the qualifier "large ear-piercings and visable tattoos" and are basing their arguments on a different level of body modification. Whether you agree or not, tats will affect the type of jobs available to you.

The person getting a tattoo or piercing knows full well it may lower job opportunities.

It should be up to him, it's their choice and they shouldn't have the educational opportunity taken away.

These people are going to be motorbike mechanics and plumbers. Who cares if they get tattoos?

Yes of course. Absolutely no University educated or successful people in the world have tattoos or piercings only the lower class riff raff and criminals. 555 you old farts are really starting to show your age but your archaic prejudices

[casualbiker]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

But companies certainly do!

Police in UK

http://www.theguardian.com/careers/careers-blog/tattoos-workplace-job-prospects-career

Police in USA

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-chicago-police-union-fights-policy-banning-visible-tattoos-2015-6

And a quick Google also found a fair few diploma and degree courses that also banned "visible" tattoos and big ear ear piercing.

Those are employer specific rules. The schools are informing students who want to work as airline cabin crew and police, etc, the rules.

How many plumbers, electricians, and mechanics are being turned away from schools in the UK or USA?

Absolutely no idea.. Possibly because the UK and USA don't have a technical college gang war going on!

I've taught in a technical college (briefly) and honestly there are some great students, there are also bad students. And then there are technical college yakuza.. Complete morons indoctrinated into a group, that happens to copy yakuza anime!

It's extremely bizarre. But they love it. The tattoos are NOT traditional Buddhist style tattoos but the flamboyant colour tattoos like in the anime.

[johninbkk71]

This is called serving the Elite !

The kids of the elite don't go to vocational schools.

Many companies in the West have spoken and in spoken rules when it comes to hiring people with tattoos and body percings

[sawadee1947]

"Tattooing serves a variety of purposes depending on individuals. It could be for cosmetic, spiritual, and fashion reasons," he said. "As a father, I conceive tattoos as a symbol of disobedience."

yeah, that's true. Those students should be given slaps three times daily as medicine. Maybe then they will kiss the a...of superoirs and parents!

Make them living ants you can step on.!!

[Mudcrab]

Oh dear...look at all the posters who supposedly know all about Thailand.

Simple fact is, and has been for many, many years, part of the Thai culture actually, is if you have visible tattoos you won't get hired,at least not in any meaningful/professional position.

Simple as that.

If you get tatts after you are employed ..all good...just keep them covered up.

Tatts don't mean the same here as they do in the West.

They are a sign of low class.

It wasn't that long ago that only the rough and tumble guys in the west got tatts...think sailors etc.

Nowadays in western culture every man and his dog (and boy aren't them some dogs) NEEDS to get a tatt, for reasons that elude me.

[Mudcrab]

I find it interesting the number of posters that either missed or are ignoring the qualifier "large ear-piercings and visable tattoos" and are basing their arguments on a different level of body modification. Whether you agree or not, tats will affect the type of jobs available to you.

The person getting a tattoo or piercing knows full well it may lower job opportunities.

It should be up to him, it's their choice and they shouldn't have the educational opportunity taken away.

These people are going to be motorbike mechanics and plumbers. Who cares if they get tattoos?

Yes of course. Absolutely no University educated or successful people in the world have tattoos or piercings only the lower class riff raff and criminals. 555 you old farts are really starting to show your age but your archaic prejudices

Starky,

You might find to your dismay that the old farts are the ones doing the hiring (and firing) these days.

And don't forget that the old farts now were the real rebels in the 1960's who changed the world to allow you to have the right to call them old farts.

If it wasn't for them you would still be a citizen with short back and sides conforming as the Government requires you to.

[ourmanflint]

As mentioned, plenty of Schools and Colleges in the USA and UK, have dress codes for teachers, which do not generally allow piercings (except one 1-2 in ears and nose) and no visible tattoos. Why on earth would they do that do you think?

Also in the UK it is illegal for anyone under the age of 18 to have a tattoo anyway, so schools and technical colleges should not have to do anything if it is already illegal.

[Mudcrab]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

It may have missed your keen eyesight...but we ain't talking about the the UK or the USA or anywhere else for that matter.

Welcome to Thailand.

[Fat Haggis]

I find it interesting the number of posters that either missed or are ignoring the qualifier "large ear-piercings and visable tattoos" and are basing their arguments on a different level of body modification. Whether you agree or not, tats will affect the type of jobs available to you.

The person getting a tattoo or piercing knows full well it may lower job opportunities.

It should be up to him, it's their choice and they shouldn't have the educational opportunity taken away.

These people are going to be motorbike mechanics and plumbers. Who cares if they get tattoos?

Yes of course. Absolutely no University educated or successful people in the world have tattoos or piercings only the lower class riff raff and criminals. 555 you old farts are really starting to show your age but your archaic prejudices

Starky,

You might find to your dismay that the old farts are the ones doing the hiring (and firing) these days.

And don't forget that the old farts now were the real rebels in the 1960's who changed the world to allow you to have the right to call them old farts.

If it wasn't for them you would still be a citizen with short back and sides conforming as the Government requires you to.

Sp pray tell me why it's mostly "The old farts" who were condemning the 14 students who stood up to this conforming government!!!!!! ????

Hypocrites more like !!

[duanebigsby]

As mentioned, plenty of Schools and Colleges in the USA and UK, have dress codes for teachers, which do not generally allow piercings (except one 1-2 in ears and nose) and no visible tattoos. Why on earth would they do that do you think?

Also in the UK it is illegal for anyone under the age of 18 to have a tattoo anyway, so schools and technical colleges should not have to do anything if it is already illegal.

"Why on earth would they do that?"

Because that profession requires a higher level of outward looking professionalism.

These people are studying to become welders and mechanics and electricians etc.

[duanebigsby]

Personally, I dislike multiple and large piercings and tattoos in general.

I think it's horrible to discriminate against people who do like them however.

I wouldn't hire someone with face or neck tattoos, but I'd never deny them a chance at education.

I'm amazed at the amount of people on this thread who deem the denial of the right to education based on tattoos or piercings acceptable.

Probably the same people who deplore their own country's nanny state status.

Basic human rights should never be denied.

And again! THEY are not denying an education. They are technical colleges that have decided that their young students (age range 16-22) will not have visible tattoos or large ear opening piercings in the mainstream classes. If students have these and are unable or unwilling to cover up then they will have to take evening classes.

I do wonder what the rules are in the USA or UK.

If you've gotten one of those 10 baht coin sized ear piercing you can't hide it. If you must attend limited evening classes it's discrimination.

Rules in UK and USA don't restrict admission to school.

It may have missed your keen eyesight...but we ain't talking about the the UK or the USA or anywhere else for that matter.

Welcome to Thailand.

I was addressing a statement about the UK and US directly.

My "keen eyesight" picked up on another post and someone was talking about the US and UK.

I think it's wrong to restrict classes for those with body mods who want to be tradesmen. Just because employers may not hire them is not sufficient

to restrict their access to education.

[thailand49]

This is not rocket science. The tattoos runs much deeper than just getting one. Kids here seem to be more followers than leaders and their education system needs to be overall. It has been well documented. Many if not majority in the public system particularly the boys have no male figure to guide them the ones that do are no better than their sons when they were young. So generation after generation it goes on and on and on.. there is no light at the end of the tunnel. The boys are pushed along until they finish M-3, if their grades are too low basically the High School will not take them so unless they can get into a Tech school they are done. Now you are taking another option away. I can tell you first hand discrimination against them and forcing them to go at night is not the answer. For a young population that is already lacking in parental guidance this is like giving them a green card to stay out late when there should be a curfew in place and riding a motorbike without a license should be strictly enforce nation wide.

Currently, the kids under 18 already have too many choices. I know a half dozen kids first hand that are just 16, that are given choices they can go to school once a week like Sunday, while the rest of the week they just stay home doing nothing. Many kids at 15, once done with M-3, middle school just decide to take a year off but never return.

Although Thailand at kid at 15 years of age is still a child there is no way their brains have developed yet here in Thailand they are given choices like Adults, no wonder you find some many just hanging out riding their bikes in groups, drinking looking for clubs all along 3rd road, Face club closed now that do not check for I.D. most disturbing the pregnancy rate with these kids. It is basically monkey see monkey do!

The solution is not to ban them but for starts make it a Law, that Tattoos shops need to be license by the Health department. There are lot's of independent wannabes doing tattoos to practice on their friends. All this needs to be brought under control with a Law that requires a License shop to ask for I.D. that the kid are over 18 years of age. If not, they must bring in the parent and obtain written permission. Majority of the kids I know think they can just removed them with water they are just too young to understand or just too dump like the government officials who continue to come up with nonsense! Violator must be dealt with lost of license and monetary damages to the family.

Lots of the kids are getting them before the age of 18 years of age they are too young to understand the ramification of getting one at such a early age. Like all of us when we were that age we thought we knew everything already and this being Thailand with no enforcement of any kind it has become a problem. The above all can also be said for the drinking ban around schools.

[chinostar]

Yeah this will certainly boost up the quality of students. What bull. Instead of focussing on the real development of Thai education they come up with superficial measurements.

[Colabamumbai]

Another step back in the direction of the Stone Age, like so many things this country does or does not do.

[duanebigsby]

Oh dear...look at all the posters who supposedly know all about Thailand.

Simple fact is, and has been for many, many years, part of the Thai culture actually, is if you have visible tattoos you won't get hired,at least not in any meaningful/professional position.

Simple as that.

If you get tatts after you are employed ..all good...just keep them covered up.

Tatts don't mean the same here as they do in the West.

They are a sign of low class.

It wasn't that long ago that only the rough and tumble guys in the west got tatts...think sailors etc.

Nowadays in western culture every man and his dog (and boy aren't them some dogs) NEEDS to get a tatt, for reasons that elude me.

None of us opposed to this are suggesting we know all about Thailand.

How could we? As you keep pointing out, you have sucked up all knowledge of Thai culture and there's none left over for anyone else.

It doesn't matter whether they might be less employable or not, don't restrict their right to the same education. Let them learn the skills and then take their chances in the job market.

So what if tats here are low class, these students are learning to be plumbers, electricians, or bricklayers. They're going to be tradesmen.

It's an attack on civil rights.

I wonder how many of the posters agreeing with the decision also deplore their home countries becoming "nanny states"

[duanebigsby]

Another step back in the direction of the Stone Age, like so many things this country does or does not do.

My school has become concerned with the discipline in one building.

Step 1- blame all the teachers, leaving administration out of it.

step 2 -design a new uniform for Thursdays

[Jim walker]

Brains and tattoos dont go together these are the type of people who encourage the good Thai kids to go drinking at lunch time and a little bit of yaba will help you study and become a brilliant scientist, so better get them barred from school that will teach them some good about discriminating against people with different views opinions or skin colour.

[duanebigsby]

Brains and tattoos dont go together these are the type of people who encourage the good Thai kids to go drinking at lunch time and a little bit of yaba will help you study and become a brilliant scientist, so better get them barred from school that will teach them some good about discriminating against people with different views opinions or skin colour.

You need an LOL in there somewhere, unless, Flying spaghetti Monster forbid, you mean it!

[Doc46]

Why not tell them to cover up the Tat's,,,that what some people have to do in Aus if they work in some shops like sleeves for arm Tat's.

[casualbiker]

Why not tell them to cover up the Tat's,,,that what some people have to do in Aus if they work in some shops like sleeves for arm Tat's.

They did.. It says visible tattoos!!

If they ain't visible it's not a problem.. Some of these guys have Tats on their hands,neck and face!

[Linzz]

Back in the "good ol' days" when I was in management and had the responsibility of up to 300 staff, part of my job description was the hiring and firing of employees. I would NEVER employ staff with visible tattoos or body piercings. Why, you may ask? Well, besides being hideous to a large percentage of people (other staff and customers), it degraded the image of the organisation. Company policy was to allow body piercing, provided any visible would be removed during working hours. A maximum of 2 ear rings/studs was allowed. Initially, I hired 1 or 2 staff according to this policy to my regret. They continually "forgot" to remove the jewelry and it quickly became a nightmare to police at work. Subsequently, these people were subject to the 3 strikes rule and eventually had to find new employment elsewhere. Also, during their term of employment they had encouraged other staff members to get piercings, thus compounding the problem.

I still believe significant body piercings and tattoos limit employment opportunities. A neat appearance will appeal to almost 100% of employers, whereas someone who attends an interview with a nose ring, lip ring, a tongue stud and arms covered in tattoos is unlikely to get a second interview, regardless of their qualifications.

While you have good factual grounds for your opinion and I can't disagree with your logic, the topic of whether people with piercings and tattoos should be denied educational rights based on personal preference is the question. Discouraged yes, but denied is too authoritarian and further ghettoizes those who have severely handicapped themselves already.

[casualbiker]

Back in the "good ol' days" when I was in management and had the responsibility of up to 300 staff, part of my job description was the hiring and firing of employees. I would NEVER employ staff with visible tattoos or body piercings. Why, you may ask? Well, besides being hideous to a large percentage of people (other staff and customers), it degraded the image of the organisation. Company policy was to allow body piercing, provided any visible would be removed during working hours. A maximum of 2 ear rings/studs was allowed. Initially, I hired 1 or 2 staff according to this policy to my regret. They continually "forgot" to remove the jewelry and it quickly became a nightmare to police at work. Subsequently, these people were subject to the 3 strikes rule and eventually had to find new employment elsewhere. Also, during their term of employment they had encouraged other staff members to get piercings, thus compounding the problem.

I still believe significant body piercings and tattoos limit employment opportunities. A neat appearance will appeal to almost 100% of employers, whereas someone who attends an interview with a nose ring, lip ring, a tongue stud and arms covered in tattoos is unlikely to get a second interview, regardless of their qualifications.

While you have good factual grounds for your opinion and I can't disagree with your logic, the topic of whether people with piercings and tattoos should be denied educational rights based on personal preference is the question. Discouraged yes, but denied is too authoritarian and further ghettoizes those who have severely handicapped themselves already.

And that's what the proposal is, to discourage.

The students with Tatoos CAN take evening classes.

[ourmanflint]

As has been mentioned many times before and in the original OP , NO ONE IS BANNED FROM LEARNING!!

They are just being separated. All the "welders and mechanics" can just go to night school instead. Why TVF posters feel the need to defend these young kids with tattoos all over and rubber bungs in their ears is beyond me.I'm also sure if one of them turned up to date your 16 year old daughter you wouldn't be so magnanimous.