Cabinet to be asked to completely ban second-crop farming for 2015-16 season

[anotheruser]

'Tap water' is a luxury in Thailand. If the farmers need to make sacrifices for city folks to have water on tap, then, the country is in serious trouble. Most rural people collect rain water off the roof for drinking. Thai farmers need to gain control their own destiny, sustain only themselves, stop growing anything for the market and watch how the precious ones that make their 'money' off the farmers back enjoy the taste of 1000 baht notes.

LOL You think rural people collect rainwater to drink in the dry season?

[JAG]

Won't this have a catastrophic effect on GDP, with all sorts of socioeconomic knock-on effects? Have they thought this through at all?

Rice makes up about 3% of Thailand's exports. It is politically important because there are a few million rice farmers, but financially it is not a very valuable crop. Thailand's GDP would be higher if there were fewer rice farmers and some of them went to work in factories.

Ideally the rice farmers would go get a temporary job during the second crop phase. They would have more money instead of going into debt buying seed and fertilizer and then having the crop die due to lack of water.

Up here in the "top north", the main rice crop is primarily for subsistence. The first priority for the farmers is to grow enough to feed their extended families, any surplus is then sold for cash. In the (relatively) few areas where a second crop can be grown, then it is used to produce cash. The supply of "temporary jobs" is limited, and more than oversubscribed with applicants. Most of the locals scratch a living in between crops, but it really is subsistence farming.

I suspect that the people who will be most affected by this ban are the larger scale commercial farmers in the central part of the country.Interestingly, are they not the ones who are more likely to favour a "yellow tinged" administration?

[robblok]

Won't this have a catastrophic effect on GDP, with all sorts of socioeconomic knock-on effects? Have they thought this through at all?

Rice makes up about 3% of Thailand's exports. It is politically important because there are a few million rice farmers, but financially it is not a very valuable crop. Thailand's GDP would be higher if there were fewer rice farmers and some of them went to work in factories.

Ideally the rice farmers would go get a temporary job during the second crop phase. They would have more money instead of going into debt buying seed and fertilizer and then having the crop die due to lack of water.

Up here in the "top north", the main rice crop is primarily for subsistence. The first priority for the farmers is to grow enough to feed their extended families, any surplus is then sold for cash. In the (relatively) few areas where a second crop can be grown, then it is used to produce cash. The supply of "temporary jobs" is limited, and more than oversubscribed with applicants. Most of the locals scratch a living in between crops, but it really is subsistence farming.

I suspect that the people who will be most affected by this ban are the larger scale commercial farmers in the central part of the country.Interestingly, are they not the ones who are more likely to favour a "yellow tinged" administration?

Do you really think they care that the farmers who loose out (bigger ones) are supportive of the government. This is drinking water crisis vs some farmers not making money. They can compensate farmers, not magically let water appear.

This has nothing to do with allegiances only with priorities and anyone with half a brain knows that water for households trumps all other things. Just imagine if water runs out.

[JAG]

Roblock, before you get carried away with " half a brain" remember we agreed several days ago that drinking water was more important. I was merely pointing out some of the implications of such a ban.

[sandyf]

'Tap water' is a luxury in Thailand. If the farmers need to make sacrifices for city folks to have water on tap, then, the country is in serious trouble. Most rural people collect rain water off the roof for drinking. Thai farmers need to gain control their own destiny, sustain only themselves, stop growing anything for the market and watch how the precious ones that make their 'money' off the farmers back enjoy the taste of 1000 baht notes.

LOL You think rural people collect rainwater to drink in the dry season?

Yes. We collect it when it rains and drink it all year round.

[Jon Wetherall]

'Tap water' is a luxury in Thailand. If the farmers need to make sacrifices for city folks to have water on tap, then, the country is in serious trouble. Most rural people collect rain water off the roof for drinking. Thai farmers need to gain control their own destiny, sustain only themselves, stop growing anything for the market and watch how the precious ones that make their 'money' off the farmers back enjoy the taste of 1000 baht notes.

LOL You think rural people collect rainwater to drink in the dry season?

Yes. We collect it when it rains and drink it all year round.

Indeed they do. I was surprised (shocked) when I first arrived but truth to tell, I haven't suffered any ill-effects. Tap water is only a recent thing and many people say it is more risky than rainwater.

[anotheruser]

Okay. Good on them. In the dry areas in southern Laos they do it as well but more often than not they have some community well or get it from a river and boil it. So each house in dry areas of Issan has water storage containers big enough to last the entire dry season if it doesn't rain? Just curious now.

Edited September 13, 2015 by anotheruser

[robblok]

Roblock, before you get carried away with " half a brain" remember we agreed several days ago that drinking water was more important. I was merely pointing out some of the implications of such a ban.

True.. you are right I admit my mistake. I was wrong here.

I just got blinded by the color of shirts things because I think it just too important even for the government to care about how it will affect support among their farmer supporters.

It would hit everyone so hard that if they don't take measures and the drought does mean no drinking water they got every color shirt and then some complaining them.

But we agreed upon it and you were right, i should have remembered that you said that.

[sandyf]

'Tap water' is a luxury in Thailand. If the farmers need to make sacrifices for city folks to have water on tap, then, the country is in serious trouble. Most rural people collect rain water off the roof for drinking. Thai farmers need to gain control their own destiny, sustain only themselves, stop growing anything for the market and watch how the precious ones that make their 'money' off the farmers back enjoy the taste of 1000 baht notes.

LOL You think rural people collect rainwater to drink in the dry season?

Yes. We collect it when it rains and drink it all year round.

Indeed they do. I was surprised (shocked) when I first arrived but truth to tell, I haven't suffered any ill-effects. Tap water is only a recent thing and many people say it is more risky than rainwater.

Not for rural people, a future thing maybe. They laid a water pipe near us a couple of weeks ago and it is 6000 baht to get connected. The jury is still out on that one.

My SIL & BIL are on the same plot of land but they do not have the option, buildings are too far from the pipe

[halloween]

Nam Um Dam in Sakon Nakhon is very much full and my FIL already said that he will plant again in November. I just told him its not permitted for the 2nd planting season and he told me they can <SNIP> them-self in Bangkok.He even told me those f..ks in Bangkok are gone in the next election so let them enjoy them-self and clean up the coffers as long it last.

Nam Oum dam is currently at 46% which is far from very much full. http://www.thaiwater.net/DATA/REPORT/php/rid_dam_1.php?lang=en

The larger dams in the area, 4 and 5 times the size, vary from 25 -50%.

[englishoak]

What id like to see is a long term plan or proper water management at least.

Sadly it wont happen until its at least an annual problem that actually forces things through tough lessons, even then I cant see it being addressed purely because and answer has to be an ongoing and sustainable planned out and stuck to... there is not a cat in hells chance of that ever happening for more than a few years in a run before it would be cancelled, messed with or generally milked for the fund allocation.

Dropping one rice crop aint gonna fix squat longterm.

[anotheruser]

Still no answer as to how rural people store rainwater to drink for 5 months to save for drinking let alone washing?

Edited September 13, 2015 by anotheruser

[billd766]

Okay. Good on them. In the dry areas in southern Laos they do it as well but more often than not they have some community well or get it from a river and boil it. So each house in dry areas of Issan has water storage containers big enough to last the entire dry season if it doesn't rain? Just curious now.

Yes rural people do collect and store water mainly in ongs and each ong holds about 1,500 usable litres of water and costs around 1,000 baht. Will it last out the dry season. It all depends on the number of people in the household, how much each person uses and the length of the dry season.

Most rural people don't flush the toilet with 5 litres every time they piss 250 ml they use a container and a plastic saucepan and use much less water that way. In the cities if 4 people use the toilet a total of 5 times a day and flush it each time that will use 3,000 litres a month.

Shower and don't take a bath, don't leave the tap running while you clean your teeth or shave and remember this.

When using the toilet, if it's yellow, let it mellow but if it'd brown then flush it down.

This is how we store water in rural Khampaeng Phet near the Mae Wong national park. I have 20 ongs in a block and they are cross connected plus a further 7 as spares. The 2 stainless steel tanks are 3,000 litres each and are rainwater storage for drinking only and are fed from the roof run off.

The main tanks are fed from the government water supply which generally runs out for a couple of months of the year. My wife goes to the Tessaban as all the villagers do and orders more and every 3 weeks or so the fire truck turns up and delivers about 9,000 litres for free. If we need more we can order it at 50 baht per 1,000 litres. This year the government water was cut off for 6 months. It is one reason why many of us living in rural Thailand laugh at you city folk when you whine that the water was cut off for a day or two.

Still no answer as to how rural people store rainwater to drink for 5 months to save for drinking let alone washing?

[impulse]

I suspect Mother Nature is about to have a laugh:

http://earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/isobaric/1000hPa/overlay=total_cloud_water/orthographic=-254.25,13.90,1991

[sandyf]

Okay. Good on them. In the dry areas in southern Laos they do it as well but more often than not they have some community well or get it from a river and boil it. So each house in dry areas of Issan has water storage containers big enough to last the entire dry season if it doesn't rain? Just curious now.

Yes rural people do collect and store water mainly in ongs and each ong holds about 1,500 usable litres of water and costs around 1,000 baht. Will it last out the dry season. It all depends on the number of people in the household, how much each person uses and the length of the dry season.

Most rural people don't flush the toilet with 5 litres every time they piss 250 ml they use a container and a plastic saucepan and use much less water that way. In the cities if 4 people use the toilet a total of 5 times a day and flush it each time that will use 3,000 litres a month.

Shower and don't take a bath, don't leave the tap running while you clean your teeth or shave and remember this.

When using the toilet, if it's yellow, let it mellow but if it'd brown then flush it down.

This is how we store water in rural Khampaeng Phet near the Mae Wong national park. I have 20 ongs in a block and they are cross connected plus a further 7 as spares. The 2 stainless steel tanks are 3,000 litres each and are rainwater storage for drinking only and are fed from the roof run off.

The main tanks are fed from the government water supply which generally runs out for a couple of months of the year. My wife goes to the Tessaban as all the villagers do and orders more and every 3 weeks or so the fire truck turns up and delivers about 9,000 litres for free. If we need more we can order it at 50 baht per 1,000 litres. This year the government water was cut off for 6 months. It is one reason why many of us living in rural Thailand laugh at you city folk when you whine that the water was cut off for a day or two.

10082010_resize.jpg

Normal water storage_resize.JPG

Fresh water storage_resize.JPG

Still no answer as to how rural people store rainwater to drink for 5 months to save for drinking let alone washing?

Impressive arrangement Bill. We have 3 houses on the land and probably about 25 ongs between us, also some plastic tanks and my sister in law has some large holding tanks made from 5 ft concrete rings.

Each house has separate ongs for the drinking water, only collect the rainwater about once a year during thunderstorms so the roof and guttering has been washed clean. Gets filtered for drinking and used in cooking.

[billd766]

Okay. Good on them. In the dry areas in southern Laos they do it as well but more often than not they have some community well or get it from a river and boil it. So each house in dry areas of Issan has water storage containers big enough to last the entire dry season if it doesn't rain? Just curious now.

Yes rural people do collect and store water mainly in ongs and each ong holds about 1,500 usable litres of water and costs around 1,000 baht. Will it last out the dry season. It all depends on the number of people in the household, how much each person uses and the length of the dry season.

Most rural people don't flush the toilet with 5 litres every time they piss 250 ml they use a container and a plastic saucepan and use much less water that way. In the cities if 4 people use the toilet a total of 5 times a day and flush it each time that will use 3,000 litres a month.

Shower and don't take a bath, don't leave the tap running while you clean your teeth or shave and remember this.

When using the toilet, if it's yellow, let it mellow but if it'd brown then flush it down.

This is how we store water in rural Khampaeng Phet near the Mae Wong national park. I have 20 ongs in a block and they are cross connected plus a further 7 as spares. The 2 stainless steel tanks are 3,000 litres each and are rainwater storage for drinking only and are fed from the roof run off.

The main tanks are fed from the government water supply which generally runs out for a couple of months of the year. My wife goes to the Tessaban as all the villagers do and orders more and every 3 weeks or so the fire truck turns up and delivers about 9,000 litres for free. If we need more we can order it at 50 baht per 1,000 litres. This year the government water was cut off for 6 months. It is one reason why many of us living in rural Thailand laugh at you city folk when you whine that the water was cut off for a day or two.

10082010_resize.jpg

Normal water storage_resize.JPG

Fresh water storage_resize.JPG

Still no answer as to how rural people store rainwater to drink for 5 months to save for drinking let alone washing?

Impressive arrangement Bill. We have 3 houses on the land and probably about 25 ongs between us, also some plastic tanks and my sister in law has some large holding tanks made from 5 ft concrete rings.

Each house has separate ongs for the drinking water, only collect the rainwater about once a year during thunderstorms so the roof and guttering has been washed clean. Gets filtered for drinking and used in cooking.

The last time my rainwater tanks were full was October last year and by July this year I was looking at about 1,500 usable litres left. After a few heavy storms I collected rainwater once in August and once a couple of weeks ago and they are now about 75% full. We have had some good heavy rain during the last couple of days and if we get another this afternoon after about 10 minutes rain I will be up the ladder to open the valve and leave it open until the morning as we had some good downpours in the early hours too.

I am hoping to get another 13 ongs in the next couple of months to add to my storage. When we first moved here in 2004 and I put in 6 ongs I got some odd looks and when I had a slab made and went up to 20 ongs people were laughing at the stupid farang. They have been very quiet about that lately.

My fish pond, such as it is holds about 500,000 litres when full to the brim but it seeps away and hasn't been full for nearly 3 years now and it is only rain fed.