Ex-foreign minister Noppadol proposes “super reconciliation”

[slapout]

If i come across as anti Thaksin, I intend to as i have spoken out against any official who is stealing from the people who ultimately pay t heir salary. I do not care if the call themselves democrats, red shirts, cabinet members or coalition partners.The dishonest ones have been in power too long and their offspring are following the same course if activity ''theft'' this government seems to have gone after more offenders rhan the groups in power for the past 15+_ years and it certainly includes more tha the 3 or 4 mentioned. What part of anti corruption activity do you reconcilition people want to despense with? I support going after all of them an Thaksin and his crew were the most blantent and made prior corruption look like childs play when comparisions are made in real numbers.

[jayboy]

If i come across as anti Thaksin, I intend to as i have spoken out against any official who is stealing from the people who ultimately pay t heir salary. I do not care if the call themselves democrats, red shirts, cabinet members or coalition partners.The dishonest ones have been in power too long and their offspring are following the same course if activity ''theft'' this government seems to have gone after more offenders rhan the groups in power for the past 15+_ years and it certainly includes more tha the 3 or 4 mentioned. What part of anti corruption activity do you reconcilition people want to despense with? I support going after all of them an Thaksin and his crew were the most blantent and made prior corruption look like childs play when comparisions are made in real numbers.

Can you be more precise about which corrupt offenders this government has gone after because to most people's knowledge there has been next to no activity on this front.

I am aware of one major purge in the police force but this had little to do with corruption ie other factors were in play

The military is one of Thailand's most corrupt institutions.In your response could you briefly outline the progress made there.

Thanks

[scorecard]

Give it another year or so until all opposition has been eliminated and then the REAL reconciliation can start, mai pen rai.

Actually no. Reconciliation can never start while Thaksin is in the picture.

Couldn't the same can be said that reconciliation can never start while Suthep is in the picture. if you factor in the Suthep and Prayuth collaboration, reconciliation is not the top agenda. Remember the war chant of Suthep and the continuing blame game by Prayuth? It's a pattern all too obvious and it's not about reconciliation.

Reconciliation you say.

Well I've asked at least 20 times for the red leaners to give:

- A detailed definition / picture of what reconciliation would look like, when achieved.

- A detailed description of the actions and processes which would produce 'reconciliation'.

There has never been one reply.

IMHO reconciliation means everybody respects the letter of the law, acts with ethics and responsibility to ensure their actions and words are within the law and within normal values, ethics and morals in terms of respect for all citizens regardless of their personal social status, their education level, etc.

And when needed the application of the law is transparent and fair for all citizens.

What's your definition Mr. Loh?

[rice555]

When Noppadol was FM, wasn't he the one that gave PV Temple to Cambo??

Isn't that why he was replaced??

rice555

[oldsailor35]

What is the third point? A hidden agenda?

Blanket amnesty for all Shin and redshirt crimes.

I see, like the one that Suthep enjoys ?

[yellowboat]

What is the third point? A hidden agenda?

Blanket amnesty for all Shin and redshirt crimes.

Well if the army automatically get amnesty....... would not want double standards now would we......

What were the crimes of the army?

1. Deposing an elected government.

2. Installing military rule

3. Detainment of people without charge

4. Quashing free speech

[jayboy]

In the context of Thai politics generic disparagement of politicians across the board has a different meaning from similar comments in the West. Here an attack on politicians is a coded attack on democracy. Although there is certainly extensive corruption among the political class, including the Shinawatras, one never hears public denunciations of the Thai military as a corrupt class, even though their degree of corruption probably surpasses that of the politicians as a group. So, for expats here casually to condemn Thai politicians en masse supports the anti-democratic activism of the elites very much including the coup-makers.

Agreed but it goes even further so that atttacks on "corruption" are often just coded attacks on politicians, and by extension democracy itself.Obviously everybody understands the damage corruption does so it is hard to argue against anti-democrats who package their message in this way.They fetishise "corruption" because even they understand the risks of making a head on attack on democracy itself.So all quite complicated though I suspect all participants fully understand the game that's being played.

Some of the hypocrisy of the anti democrats would be tolerable if the real corruption was actually being tacked.But of course nothing is really happening on that front.

[Lorn]

Give it another year or so until all opposition has been eliminated and then the REAL reconciliation can start, mai pen rai.

Actually no. Reconciliation can never start while Thaksin is in the picture.

Couldn't the same can be said that reconciliation can never start while Suthep is in the picture. if you factor in the Suthep and Prayuth collaboration, reconciliation is not the top agenda. Remember the war chant of Suthep and the continuing blame game by Prayuth? It's a pattern all too obvious and it's not about reconciliation.

Reconciliation you say.

Well I've asked at least 20 times for the red leaners to give:

- A detailed definition / picture of what reconciliation would look like, when achieved.

- A detailed description of the actions and processes which would produce 'reconciliation'.

There has never been one reply.

IMHO reconciliation means everybody respects the letter of the law, acts with ethics and responsibility to ensure their actions and words are within the law and within normal values, ethics and morals in terms of respect for all citizens regardless of their personal social status, their education level, etc.

And when needed the application of the law is transparent and fair for all citizens.

What's your definition Mr. Loh?

A good start towards reconciliation would be treating both sides fairly don't you think? So maybe not only allow gatherings by Suthep's mob. Then there could be some yellow shirts targeted for corruption. Only looking to punish one side for past and current misdeeds is going to widen the divisions. Scrapping plans to have an unelected military/elitist dominated senate with all the power while giving the other side none might too.

[Ichabod]

In the context of Thai politics generic disparagement of politicians across the board has a different meaning from similar comments in the West. Here an attack on politicians is a coded attack on democracy. Although there is certainly extensive corruption among the political class, including the Shinawatras, one never hears public denunciations of the Thai military as a corrupt class, even though their degree of corruption probably surpasses that of the politicians as a group. So, for expats here casually to condemn Thai politicians en masse supports the anti-democratic activism of the elites very much including the coup-makers.

Agreed but it goes even further so that atttacks on "corruption" are often just coded attacks on politicians, and by extension democracy itself.Obviously everybody understands the damage corruption does so it is hard to argue against anti-democrats who package their message in this way.They fetishise "corruption" because even they understand the risks of making a head on attack on democracy itself.So all quite complicated though I suspect all participants fully understand the game that's being played.

Some of the hypocrisy of the anti democrats would be tolerable if the real corruption was actually being tacked.But of course nothing is really happening on that front.

Of course, that's true. The entire "anti-corruption" campaign is a sham from start to finish. How could it not be, having been led by the highly corrupt Suthep, whose own corruption scandal brought down the last elected Democrat government twenty years ago? Corruption went up in Thailand after the last coup and will increase this time as well. The only thing that will change is the actual pockets being filled.

It beggars belief that so many of the expats here take the "anti-corruption" campaign at face value.

[GAZZPA]

So, stop spouting hatred about each other, get together and discuss solutions to our problems in a civilised manner and work to fair rules for all.

Genius, amazing, no body has ever thought of such a thing, (apart from the Ancient Greeks 2500 years ago) look forward to seeing his 3 point plan put into practice.

[GAZZPA]

In the context of Thai politics generic disparagement of politicians across the board has a different meaning from similar comments in the West. Here an attack on politicians is a coded attack on democracy. Although there is certainly extensive corruption among the political class, including the Shinawatras, one never hears public denunciations of the Thai military as a corrupt class, even though their degree of corruption probably surpasses that of the politicians as a group. So, for expats here casually to condemn Thai politicians en masse supports the anti-democratic activism of the elites very much including the coup-makers.

Agreed but it goes even further so that atttacks on "corruption" are often just coded attacks on politicians, and by extension democracy itself.Obviously everybody understands the damage corruption does so it is hard to argue against anti-democrats who package their message in this way.They fetishise "corruption" because even they understand the risks of making a head on attack on democracy itself.So all quite complicated though I suspect all participants fully understand the game that's being played.

Some of the hypocrisy of the anti democrats would be tolerable if the real corruption was actually being tacked.But of course nothing is really happening on that front.

Of course, that's true. The entire "anti-corruption" campaign is a sham from start to finish. How could it not be, having been led by the highly corrupt Suthep, whose own corruption scandal brought down the last elected Democrat government twenty years ago? Corruption went up in Thailand after the last coup and will increase this time as well. The only thing that will change is the actual pockets being filled.

It beggars belief that so many of the expats here take the "anti-corruption" campaign at face value.

It is not undemocratic to openly attack another politician who has been involved in corrupt practices, indeed keeping quite is not supporting democracy at all.

If democracy is to work then all sides must denounce corruption and remove anyone who is corrupt. No elected Government can ever perform its duties and serve the country (people here forget politicians work for them) if corruption, greed and self renumeration are at the heart of the decision making process.

What I would like to see here is 2 or 3 political parties fighting for their policies to won power, this is how it happens in other democratic countries..

[springheeled jack]

I do wish they would get it right one minute he is an ex foreign minister then hes an ex prime minister get a proof reader someone who can sort out the mistakes put it right