Irish jockey loses foot after horrific motorbike accident on Koh Samui

[Travelman868]

I do not know if this guy was experienced bike rider or not, and the reasons for the accident....but something have to change.

I was in a very busy mountain tourist spot this weekend, frequented by young tourists. The very dangerous road was full of people on motorbikes, and our tour van's driver was racing on it, under rain, and on bad tires. In the city, I saw a girl renting a motorbike, taking a fast "lesson" how to ride it. She left the shop riding in zig zag on the busy main street. After that, arriving at our hotel, we saw a crash between a tourist biker and a car.

I was feeling very unsafe during our 3 hours road ride, and just walking the town's streets later....

If I was in a minibus driven by a fool on bald tyres I would speak to the driver and TELL him to slow down and drive properly. If he did not then I would stop the van and get out.

[2fishin2]

I do not know if this guy was experienced bike rider or not, and the reasons for the accident....but something have to change.

I was in a very busy mountain tourist spot this weekend, frequented by young tourists. The very dangerous road was full of people on motorbikes, and our tour van's driver was racing on it, under rain, and on bad tires. In the city, I saw a girl renting a motorbike, taking a fast "lesson" how to ride it. She left the shop riding in zig zag on the busy main street. After that, arriving at our hotel, we saw a crash between a tourist biker and a car.

I was feeling very unsafe during our 3 hours road ride, and just walking the town's streets later....

If I was in a minibus driven by a fool on bald tyres I would speak to the driver and TELL him to slow down and drive properly. If he did not then I would stop the van and get out.

How do you see the "bald tyres (tires) if you are inside? And the yeah right, after you do that you would TELL the driver to slow down and drive properly? 55555555555555555555555555555555 breath 555555555555555555555

[chrissables]

We don't know the circumstances of the accident, or who was might have been a fault. But regardless, it's not a pretty thing, and hope he is able to recover as much as possible. As another poster commented, with the advance in prosthetic devices these days, he could easily have an artificial foot and possibly go back to his career.

I don't always agree with Robblok, but what we do have in agreement is safety gear in riding. Prior to my stroke, any trip around town on my CBR was with heavy jeans, combat boots, padded racing jacket, racing gloves, and HJC helmet. And that was just to go to 7/11. lol. For my once a month 4-6 day road trips, shin and thigh protectors went over the jeans, and a full upper body kit was added. My wife took a pic of me one time to show all her friends her "RoboCop" husband. Sitting at a long stop light with all that on could be murder sometimes, but once I was moving I was fine. And I'd rather sit and sweat a bit as opposed to laying in a hospital with potentially broken bones and tons of skin shredded off my body. I was also lucky that I had years of experience on sports bikes long before I ever came to Thailand. But even with that, there were times I barely escaped the ignorant stupidity of Thai drivers.

Safety gear is a personal decision, only a helmet is mandatory and many also forget about that one. I just feel more at ease when I wear safety-gear. I put more gear on when I take the big bike out in comparison to the scooter on a 1km shopping trip. (mistake I know) But we all have to make our own choices here.

I won't condemn anyone (except the fools that don't wear helmets). I always worry I will hit one of those idiots without a helmet when I am in the car and kill them. Guess who they will blame and they won't say he could have lived when he had a helmet on.

If YOU kill them then YOU are to blame by definition!

I would hazard wild guess here, but if YOU killed them, they are not in a position to blame anyone!

Does not wearing a helmet suddenly cause accidents?

If you (a person) wears so much safety gear, to a degree does that not make you ride less safely due to thinking you are invincible, as apposed to a guy in flip flops (for example) would be more cautious?

[optad]

A farang right now will be crawling out a of raven on one of those island wondering how he is going to get the bike back. The rental shops love it. $$!

Cannot lump this wholly on the Thais. Imported idiocy.

[robblok]

We don't know the circumstances of the accident, or who was might have been a fault. But regardless, it's not a pretty thing, and hope he is able to recover as much as possible. As another poster commented, with the advance in prosthetic devices these days, he could easily have an artificial foot and possibly go back to his career.

I don't always agree with Robblok, but what we do have in agreement is safety gear in riding. Prior to my stroke, any trip around town on my CBR was with heavy jeans, combat boots, padded racing jacket, racing gloves, and HJC helmet. And that was just to go to 7/11. lol. For my once a month 4-6 day road trips, shin and thigh protectors went over the jeans, and a full upper body kit was added. My wife took a pic of me one time to show all her friends her "RoboCop" husband. Sitting at a long stop light with all that on could be murder sometimes, but once I was moving I was fine. And I'd rather sit and sweat a bit as opposed to laying in a hospital with potentially broken bones and tons of skin shredded off my body. I was also lucky that I had years of experience on sports bikes long before I ever came to Thailand. But even with that, there were times I barely escaped the ignorant stupidity of Thai drivers.

Safety gear is a personal decision, only a helmet is mandatory and many also forget about that one. I just feel more at ease when I wear safety-gear. I put more gear on when I take the big bike out in comparison to the scooter on a 1km shopping trip. (mistake I know) But we all have to make our own choices here.

I won't condemn anyone (except the fools that don't wear helmets). I always worry I will hit one of those idiots without a helmet when I am in the car and kill them. Guess who they will blame and they won't say he could have lived when he had a helmet on.

If YOU kill them then YOU are to blame by definition!

I would hazard wild guess here, but if YOU killed them, they are not in a position to blame anyone!

Does not wearing a helmet suddenly cause accidents?

If you (a person) wears so much safety gear, to a degree does that not make you ride less safely due to thinking you are invincible, as apposed to a guy in flip flops (for example) would be more cautious?

No a helmet is mandatory and if you don't wear one a simple bump on the head can kill you. If you had worn the helmet you would not be dead. So there is a certain difference. Not wearing helmets does not cause accidents but it makes them worse.

And I have no idea if someone in flip flops would drive more careful as someone in safety gear. I think that depends on rider. Some people are just more safety minded as others. I read quite often about foreigners on motorbikes in flip flops drinking and driving. Something I would never do even if I had the best safety gear there is.

[chrissables]

We don't know the circumstances of the accident, or who was might have been a fault. But regardless, it's not a pretty thing, and hope he is able to recover as much as possible. As another poster commented, with the advance in prosthetic devices these days, he could easily have an artificial foot and possibly go back to his career.

I don't always agree with Robblok, but what we do have in agreement is safety gear in riding. Prior to my stroke, any trip around town on my CBR was with heavy jeans, combat boots, padded racing jacket, racing gloves, and HJC helmet. And that was just to go to 7/11. lol. For my once a month 4-6 day road trips, shin and thigh protectors went over the jeans, and a full upper body kit was added. My wife took a pic of me one time to show all her friends her "RoboCop" husband. Sitting at a long stop light with all that on could be murder sometimes, but once I was moving I was fine. And I'd rather sit and sweat a bit as opposed to laying in a hospital with potentially broken bones and tons of skin shredded off my body. I was also lucky that I had years of experience on sports bikes long before I ever came to Thailand. But even with that, there were times I barely escaped the ignorant stupidity of Thai drivers.

Safety gear is a personal decision, only a helmet is mandatory and many also forget about that one. I just feel more at ease when I wear safety-gear. I put more gear on when I take the big bike out in comparison to the scooter on a 1km shopping trip. (mistake I know) But we all have to make our own choices here.

I won't condemn anyone (except the fools that don't wear helmets). I always worry I will hit one of those idiots without a helmet when I am in the car and kill them. Guess who they will blame and they won't say he could have lived when he had a helmet on.

If YOU kill them then YOU are to blame by definition!

I would hazard wild guess here, but if YOU killed them, they are not in a position to blame anyone!

Does not wearing a helmet suddenly cause accidents?

If you (a person) wears so much safety gear, to a degree does that not make you ride less safely due to thinking you are invincible, as apposed to a guy in flip flops (for example) would be more cautious?

No a helmet is mandatory and if you don't wear one a simple bump on the head can kill you. If you had worn the helmet you would not be dead. So there is a certain difference. Not wearing helmets does not cause accidents but it makes them worse.

And I have no idea if someone in flip flops would drive more careful as someone in safety gear. I think that depends on rider. Some people are just more safety minded as others. I read quite often about foreigners on motorbikes in flip flops drinking and driving. Something I would never do even if I had the best safety gear there is.

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

[robblok]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

[chrissables]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

[robblok]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

You still don't get the point probably because you really believe helmets dont save lives and you ride without one.

My point is that the car rider who hits someone is guilty only the degree could lessen if the other has a head injury because he did not wear the mandatory helmet.

The statistics I read comparing between states with and without helmet laws show that in states without more deaths from head injuries. But lets both hit our head to the wall. I will wear a helmet and you wont lets see who is better off afterwards.

[spidermike007]

Here is an excellent chart, that illustrates the dangers of driving on Samui.

A friend of mine, who worked with Samui Rescue for years, tells me in some months, as many of 60 people die on the roads of Samui. It is probably the highest level of fatalities, for a specific area, in the world. Certainly the highest in Thailand, and as the chart below shows, Thailand is ranked either number 2, or number 4 in the world, depending on who you are listening to. Please drive with great caution. If you do not have alot of skill riding a motorbike, do not drive one on Samui. And if you do drive one, please wear a very good helmet. The best one you can find. Not a bean cap. They are for the avoidance of tickets, not safety.

I have half a dozen friends who have been involved in serious accidents on bikes, on Samui. One is walking now, after 15 procedures, and 3 million baht spent, trying to save his leg.

Another recently woke from a coma a few days ago. She was not wearing a helmet. The fareng who hit her, and was responsible is still in the hospital, two weeks later.

Another friend, who owns a popular restaurant in Lamai, was hit by one of the horrendous Jeep safari operators. The jeep hit his bike, as he was entering the road, he flew 10-15 meters in the air, and landed on his head. The jeep did not even stop. When I asked them to pursue the company for damages, I was told they were warned off, and were scared of these mafia guys. Same old, same old. He regained his faculties, after a cracked skull. Thankfully. Very kind man and lovely wife. Again, no helmet.

The authorities for years have tried their best to suppress this information. This group is wonderful. The Facebook page "Roads of Koh Samui" is doing a great service for the island, and hopefully will be responsible for saving lives, and limbs.

[Tocquinio]

Very sorry to hear this. Samui is deadly for bike accidents.. witnessed a few. A friend came close to death after an crash there

[connda]

Since the accident he has been heavily medicated to deal with the pain arising from his injuries.

They gave him 1000mg of Tylenol? Really. All the Western embassies should issue warnings regarding the lunacy of driving on Thai road, especially on a motorcycle. I drive a motorcycle and a car here out of necessity, but I don't like it. I actually really enjoyed driving in my home country.

Hopes for a swift recovery and finding a new career.

[Mudcrab]

We wish this guy good luck with his injuries. Also good luck with the Thai hospital accounts receivable people. hope he had travel insurance.

Australian travel insurances do not cover motorcycle accidents in Thailand or elsewhere.

They do as long as you nominate motorcycle coverage.Done it many times for a number of countries.

[chrissables]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

You still don't get the point probably because you really believe helmets dont save lives and you ride without one.

My point is that the car rider who hits someone is guilty only the degree could lessen if the other has a head injury because he did not wear the mandatory helmet.

The statistics I read comparing between states with and without helmet laws show that in states without more deaths from head injuries. But lets both hit our head to the wall. I will wear a helmet and you wont lets see who is better off afterwards.

I believe in certain circumstances they do work. Sliding down the road after a fall for example.

I believe that if travelling at even modest speeds (say 50mph) and you hit a concrete pylon or any stationary hard object it would not help.

Again, if i ride with one or not is nothing to do with you, why do you think it is?

I guess you work (ed) in the public sector. You spout the usual nonsense of nanny state employment as in there is no accidents. Somebody was at fault and caused it. If you drive into me YOU are at fault. That is it! If i am wearing shorts and flip flops or full body armour, YOU would still be at fault!

Your sentence regarding what you read about states is not understandable. However i will state again, the law was repealed because it was proven they did not actually work. If not proven, it would not have been repealed.

[Stargeezr]

When I visited Samui, a few years ago I rode a Honda 125 Dream 2, around on its narrow cement roads.

I worried all the time about getting ran off the road, or just catching an edge of the road because it was narrow

and total attention was in order, for getting safely around the island. I hope the roadway has been widened

but I doubt that it has been. One time on this island was enough for me. The roads around Hua Hin are much more

friendly and a bit wider even.

[CarolJadzia]

Here is an excellent chart, that illustrates the dangers of driving on Samui.

A friend of mine, who worked with Samui Rescue for years, tells me in some months, as many of 60 people die on the roads of Samui. It is probably the highest level of fatalities, for a specific area, in the world. Certainly the highest in Thailand, and as the chart below shows, Thailand is ranked either number 2, or number 4 in the world, depending on who you are listening to. Please drive with great caution. If you do not have alot of skill riding a motorbike, do not drive one on Samui. And if you do drive one, please wear a very good helmet. The best one you can find. Not a bean cap. They are for the avoidance of tickets, not safety.

I have half a dozen friends who have been involved in serious accidents on bikes, on Samui. One is walking now, after 15 procedures, and 3 million baht spent, trying to save his leg.

Another recently woke from a coma a few days ago. She was not wearing a helmet. The fareng who hit her, and was responsible is still in the hospital, two weeks later.

Another friend, who owns a popular restaurant in Lamai, was hit by one of the horrendous Jeep safari operators. The jeep hit his bike, as he was entering the road, he flew 10-15 meters in the air, and landed on his head. The jeep did not even stop. When I asked them to pursue the company for damages, I was told they were warned off, and were scared of these mafia guys. Same old, same old. He regained his faculties, after a cracked skull. Thankfully. Very kind man and lovely wife. Again, no helmet.

The authorities for years have tried their best to suppress this information. This group is wonderful. The Facebook page "Roads of Koh Samui" is doing a great service for the island, and hopefully will be responsible for saving lives, and limbs.

Very interested in the chart, thanks for sharing. Can you share it's source?

Just I am interested as the topic of road safety in Thailand is also discussed elsewhere and such statistics are very helpful.

The Thai government does release area stats but they are not specific to Samui, just Suratthani which does not suggest the same figures.

http://trso.thairoads.org/statistic/provincial/66/P-SPI-A/P-SPI-A1/P-SPI-A1-05

I would expect similar stats in Phuket and Pattaya as well. I am sure Phuket was recently listed as the most dangerous place for road users, but who's counting?

As for helmets there is no argument that have do save lives, they do not help avoid accidents. But they do help people survive accidents.

• (USA Data)
• More than 80 percent of all motorcycle crashes result in injury or death to the motorcyclist.
• Per mile driven, a motorcyclist is 16 times more likely to die in a crash than an automobile driver. Wearing a motorcycle helmet reduces that risk by almost one-third (29 percent).
• Head injury is a leading cause of death in motor cycle crashes. Riders who don't wear helmets and who experience a crash are 40 percent more likely to sustain a fatal head injury.
• A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.
• From 1984 through 1995, helmets saved the lives of more than 7,400 motorcyclists. But more than 6,300 additional deaths could have been prevented if all riders had been wearing helmets.
• Studies show that laws requiring helmet use are very effective in reducing motorcycle fatalities because such laws influence more people to wear helmets. In Louisiana, the first state to repeal and then re-adopt a helmet law for all riders, there were 30 percent fewer motorcycle deaths during 1982, the first year that the helmet law was reinstated.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/alcohol/Archive/Archive/safesobr/OPlanner/protection/cycle.html

Now I have heard all the arguments for and against, I was a member of the Motorcycle Action Group who in the 70's and 80's protested against wearing helmets and held no helmet demonstrations.

However when a friend got brain damage due to his poorly fitting helmet coming off and him hitting his head on a curb it did make me reconsider. There has been plenty of evidence since then.

But that's not the whole picture. The helmets that are offered to farangs when they hire bikes are very poor by world standards. I thought they like a cross between something you use on a push bike and something from a building site. Not fit for purpose, not much incentive for the bike hirer to wear one. Don't think you will find them on Sharp either - http://sharp.direct.gov.uk/

Last trip we bought our Shoei helmets and riding kit with us, but that's a pain. I have heard of helmets being damaged in the hold but carrying it as hand luggage takes up a big chunk of your carry-on allowance and also have heard of cases on smaller planes of it having to go in the hold anyway.

Not something I can see many farangs doing when planning what to take with them on a trip to the sun.

But this guy in the OP lost a leg, also damage to his arm and jaw. Does not say if he was wearing a helmet. But I would hazard a guess that he may have avoided a broken jaw had he been wearing a full face lid.

No amount of kit will protect us in every situation, but it will help in many to reduce the damage caused to us. Unless we know what caused the leg injury we have no ideas if better gear would have changed the outcome. But it is very good at reducing the amount of Samui Tattoo's.

Not a fan of the 'Samui Roads' site as they only wish to share doom and gloom whilst not offering any answers to addressing the situation. Great if all you want is a daily intake of gore but not very helpful otherwise.

"Jeep Safari's" like this one?

I have some Thai Police officers interested in learning Advanced Police Roadcraft however I cannot directly teach roadcraft as prescribed as it's so far beyond the current driving standards and there are issues with loosing face, Thai Police officers could never have a farang telling them what to do! But they are interested in learning, I am working on a different approach. Not about telling them they are wrong, but working through current ways to incorporate better standards.

Anyone driving on Samui's roads for a reasonable amount of time will have developed survival skills to keep themselves alive. The problem with the farangs is they jump on bikes with no kit and no experience and sometimes no licence. Then encounter poor standards of driving and riding by Thais and other farang's. Like somebody said here the other day - it is the perfect storm.

Edited September 24, 2015 by CarolJadzia

[spidermike007]

Here is an excellent chart, that illustrates the dangers of driving on Samui.

A friend of mine, who worked with Samui Rescue for years, tells me in some months, as many of 60 people die on the roads of Samui. It is probably the highest level of fatalities, for a specific area, in the world. Certainly the highest in Thailand, and as the chart below shows, Thailand is ranked either number 2, or number 4 in the world, depending on who you are listening to. Please drive with great caution. If you do not have alot of skill riding a motorbike, do not drive one on Samui. And if you do drive one, please wear a very good helmet. The best one you can find. Not a bean cap. They are for the avoidance of tickets, not safety.

I have half a dozen friends who have been involved in serious accidents on bikes, on Samui. One is walking now, after 15 procedures, and 3 million baht spent, trying to save his leg.

Another recently woke from a coma a few days ago. She was not wearing a helmet. The fareng who hit her, and was responsible is still in the hospital, two weeks later.

Another friend, who owns a popular restaurant in Lamai, was hit by one of the horrendous Jeep safari operators. The jeep hit his bike, as he was entering the road, he flew 10-15 meters in the air, and landed on his head. The jeep did not even stop. When I asked them to pursue the company for damages, I was told they were warned off, and were scared of these mafia guys. Same old, same old. He regained his faculties, after a cracked skull. Thankfully. Very kind man and lovely wife. Again, no helmet.

The authorities for years have tried their best to suppress this information. This group is wonderful. The Facebook page "Roads of Koh Samui" is doing a great service for the island, and hopefully will be responsible for saving lives, and limbs.

Very interested in the chart, thanks for sharing. Can you share it's source?

Just I am interested as the topic of road safety in Thailand is also discussed elsewhere and such statistics are very helpful.

The Thai government does release area stats but they are not specific to Samui, just Suratthani which does not suggest the same figures.

http://trso.thairoads.org/statistic/provincial/66/P-SPI-A/P-SPI-A1/P-SPI-A1-05

I would expect similar stats in Phuket and Pattaya as well. I am sure Phuket was recently listed as the most dangerous place for road users, but who's counting?

As for helmets there is no argument that have do save lives, they do not help avoid accidents. But they do help people survive accidents.

• (USA Data)
• More than 80 percent of all motorcycle crashes result in injury or death to the motorcyclist.

• Per mile driven, a motorcyclist is 16 times more likely to die in a crash than an automobile driver. Wearing a motorcycle helmet reduces that risk by almost one-third (29 percent).

• Head injury is a leading cause of death in motor cycle crashes. Riders who don't wear helmets and who experience a crash are 40 percent more likely to sustain a fatal head injury.

• A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

• From 1984 through 1995, helmets saved the lives of more than 7,400 motorcyclists. But more than 6,300 additional deaths could have been prevented if all riders had been wearing helmets.

• Studies show that laws requiring helmet use are very effective in reducing motorcycle fatalities because such laws influence more people to wear helmets. In Louisiana, the first state to repeal and then re-adopt a helmet law for all riders, there were 30 percent fewer motorcycle deaths during 1982, the first year that the helmet law was reinstated.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/alcohol/Archive/Archive/safesobr/OPlanner/protection/cycle.html

Now I have heard all the arguments for and against, I was a member of the Motorcycle Action Group who in the 70's and 80's protested against wearing helmets and held no helmet demonstrations.

However when a friend got brain damage due to his poorly fitting helmet coming off and him hitting his head on a curb it did make me reconsider. There has been plenty of evidence since then.

But that's not the whole picture. The helmets that are offered to farangs when they hire bikes are very poor by world standards. I thought they like a cross between something you use on a push bike and something from a building site. Not fit for purpose, not much incentive for the bike hirer to wear one. Don't think you will find them on Sharp either - http://sharp.direct.gov.uk/

Last trip we bought our Shoei helmets and riding kit with us, but that's a pain. I have heard of helmets being damaged in the hold but carrying it as hand luggage takes up a big chunk of your carry-on allowance and also have heard of cases on smaller planes of it having to go in the hold anyway.

Not something I can see many farangs doing when planning what to take with them on a trip to the sun.

But this guy in the OP lost a leg, also damage to his arm and jaw. Does not say if he was wearing a helmet. But I would hazard a guess that he may have avoided a broken jaw had he been wearing a full face lid.

No amount of kit will protect us in every situation, but it will help in many to reduce the damage caused to us. Unless we know what caused the leg injury we have no ideas if better gear would have changed the outcome. But it is very good at reducing the amount of Samui Tattoo's.

Not a fan of the 'Samui Roads' site as they only wish to share doom and gloom whilst not offering any answers to addressing the situation. Great if all you want is a daily intake of gore but not very helpful otherwise.

"Jeep Safari's" like this one?

I have some Thai Police officers interested in learning Advanced Police Roadcraft however I cannot directly teach roadcraft as prescribed as it's so far beyond the current driving standards and there are issues with loosing face, Thai Police officers could never have a farang telling them what to do! But they are interested in learning, I am working on a different approach. Not about telling them they are wrong, but working through current ways to incorporate better standards.

Anyone driving on Samui's roads for a reasonable amount of time will have developed survival skills to keep themselves alive. The problem with the farangs is they jump on bikes with no kit and no experience and sometimes no licence. Then encounter poor standards of driving and riding by Thais and other farang's. Like somebody said here the other day - it is the perfect storm.

Alot of great points. Well taken. Though it is head to find world class helmets here, the Real brand make a decent helmet which would offer alot of protection. Index is even better than the crap the bike rental shops offer and they are cheap and easy to find.

As far as the Thai police wanting to learn, but being afraid to be taught by a foreigner, that is so weak. Man up, for God's sake. If you are comfortable within your own skin, you can take advice, from anyone. This whole face thing is the greatest form of cowardice on the planet.

[balo]

Most locals drive with 300 baht BIG C helmets , they wont protect you. You have to pay several 1000 for a decent helmet.

[spidermike007]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

You still don't get the point probably because you really believe helmets dont save lives and you ride without one.

My point is that the car rider who hits someone is guilty only the degree could lessen if the other has a head injury because he did not wear the mandatory helmet.

The statistics I read comparing between states with and without helmet laws show that in states without more deaths from head injuries. But lets both hit our head to the wall. I will wear a helmet and you wont lets see who is better off afterwards.

I believe in certain circumstances they do work. Sliding down the road after a fall for example.

I believe that if travelling at even modest speeds (say 50mph) and you hit a concrete pylon or any stationary hard object it would not help.

Again, if i ride with one or not is nothing to do with you, why do you think it is?

I guess you work (ed) in the public sector. You spout the usual nonsense of nanny state employment as in there is no accidents. Somebody was at fault and caused it. If you drive into me YOU are at fault. That is it! If i am wearing shorts and flip flops or full body armour, YOU would still be at fault!

Your sentence regarding what you read about states is not understandable. However i will state again, the law was repealed because it was proven they did not actually work. If not proven, it would not have been repealed.

Sometimes, I just ignore all scientific evidence, studies, surveys, and statistics and just go with my common sense. If I am doing even just 40 or 50 kph, and I am thrown off my bike, and hit my head on the pavement or concrete, my common sense tells me that if I have a very good helmet (I wear either Real or Shoei), I have a decent chance of escaping brain injury or a cracked skull, or a disfigured face. I really do not care about the studies that show otherwise. It means little to me. Some of those studies were paid for by interest groups.

I have seen accidents, where the entire side of the helmet was scarred beyond recognition, and the guy just got up and walked away. Granted there were some injuries, but they were the variety of injuries one recovers from. Cracked skulls are not often the kind you walk away from. I have a friend who is in the hospital on Samui now, with a cracked skull. After over two weeks, she is still on oxygen, and cannot speak. She was NOT wearing a helmet, and she was only going 30 km. per hour. I have also seen accidents where brain matter was on the pavement. A good helmet may have helped quite a lot, in those instances.

Granted, I am not referring to skullcaps, nor the 200 baht rental beanies. I am talking about a real helmet. That is real protection for the head, which is about as strong as an egg, when it meets the concrete at speed.

Edited September 24, 2015 by spidermike007

[robblok]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

You still don't get the point probably because you really believe helmets dont save lives and you ride without one.

My point is that the car rider who hits someone is guilty only the degree could lessen if the other has a head injury because he did not wear the mandatory helmet.

The statistics I read comparing between states with and without helmet laws show that in states without more deaths from head injuries. But lets both hit our head to the wall. I will wear a helmet and you wont lets see who is better off afterwards.

I believe in certain circumstances they do work. Sliding down the road after a fall for example.

I believe that if travelling at even modest speeds (say 50mph) and you hit a concrete pylon or any stationary hard object it would not help.

Again, if i ride with one or not is nothing to do with you, why do you think it is?

I guess you work (ed) in the public sector. You spout the usual nonsense of nanny state employment as in there is no accidents. Somebody was at fault and caused it. If you drive into me YOU are at fault. That is it! If i am wearing shorts and flip flops or full body armour, YOU would still be at fault!

Your sentence regarding what you read about states is not understandable. However i will state again, the law was repealed because it was proven they did not actually work. If not proven, it would not have been repealed.

No i have always worked in the private sector and have been a business owner for the last 9 years. Where i come from and in other civilized countries they take into account if the other party has a driving license and if he was drunk and not wearing a helmet. Guess they are still backwards in the states. Not surprising given the fact they have far more traffic deaths there as where i come from.

You already admitted that in certain cases they safe your life. I will admit they cant always safe your life. So we agree that they do safe lives.

[slipperylobster]

it's all been said before...and I am sure he is devastated.

Hope he can still ride the ponies.

[chrissables]

Immmmmm, so by your definition, if you (or anyone) drives a truck into the rear of a bike and they are killed, it is their fault due to no helmet? Sorry, that just is not right.

Mandatory or not, half the states in USA stopped it being mandatory due to lack of evidence in saving lives. I know we live live here in Thailand, just saying there are many mandatory things around the world that make no sense at all.

Educate drivers and riders. Prosecute those who cause accidents rather than blame their victims.

No by my definition it should be taken into account if a head-wound caused the rider to die when not wearing a helmet. If someone hits a bike with 120km an hour front on a helmet is not going to help. Of course the car is at fault when he hits a motorbike but it could not be his fault 100% if the rider dies from head injury when not wearing a helmet.

Oh that old chestnut helmet does not help saving lives. Just foolishness from people with no brain. Maybe your one of those people who rides without a helmet. That would explain a lot.

A study of 900 motorcycle crashes (conducted by the University of Southern California) showed that wearing a helmet was the single most critical factor in preventing or reducing head and neck injuries among motorcycle drivers and passengers.

If the head would was caused by you driving into the rear of me, it would be 100% your fault (using the example given). If you can't accept that you really should not be on the road.

It is so absurd in fact, so to use your analogy if you punched me in the face because i insulted you and you broke my nose, use would say it's my fault for ...what? Insulting you, or not wearing protective head gear when insulting you?

Statistics have proven it, that is why they have been repealed in a lot of the states. We could both "cherry pick" googled statistics to prove we are right, but i will leave it that if they have been repealed in a state, they proved their point.

Weather i ride with or without a helmet, boots gloves or not has no bearing to the argument.

STOP the dam cause of accidents! Stop blaming the victims!Or stick you finger in your ear and keep chanting "wear a helmet" that will cure it!

You still don't get the point probably because you really believe helmets dont save lives and you ride without one.

My point is that the car rider who hits someone is guilty only the degree could lessen if the other has a head injury because he did not wear the mandatory helmet.

The statistics I read comparing between states with and without helmet laws show that in states without more deaths from head injuries. But lets both hit our head to the wall. I will wear a helmet and you wont lets see who is better off afterwards.

I believe in certain circumstances they do work. Sliding down the road after a fall for example.

I believe that if travelling at even modest speeds (say 50mph) and you hit a concrete pylon or any stationary hard object it would not help.

Again, if i ride with one or not is nothing to do with you, why do you think it is?

I guess you work (ed) in the public sector. You spout the usual nonsense of nanny state employment as in there is no accidents. Somebody was at fault and caused it. If you drive into me YOU are at fault. That is it! If i am wearing shorts and flip flops or full body armour, YOU would still be at fault!

Your sentence regarding what you read about states is not understandable. However i will state again, the law was repealed because it was proven they did not actually work. If not proven, it would not have been repealed.

No i have always worked in the private sector and have been a business owner for the last 9 years. Where i come from and in other civilized countries they take into account if the other party has a driving license and if he was drunk and not wearing a helmet. Guess they are still backwards in the states. Not surprising given the fact they have far more traffic deaths there as where i come from.

You already admitted that in certain cases they safe your life. I will admit they cant always safe your life. So we agree that they do safe lives.

I am not an American. I use America as an example because they have the statistics from both use and not used (if repealed).

Driving licence and drunk in charge i agree 100%. I have said many time educate.

I just don't agree with compulsory wear, especially as if they (Thai government) really were interested in saving lives. I am an easy catch, but the bad and drunken drivers here cause death and mayhem every day, and too many responses are "was he wearing a helmet"?

I will say again, stop the cause is the way to go.

I believe they CAN save lives / injuries in certain situations. But i totally don't agree with being forced to wear one whilst they do nothing about stopping accidents.

[CarolJadzia]

Alot of great points. Well taken. Though it is head to find world class helmets here, the Real brand make a decent helmet which would offer alot of protection. Index is even better than the crap the bike rental shops offer and they are cheap and easy to find.

As far as the Thai police wanting to learn, but being afraid to be taught by a foreigner, that is so weak. Man up, for God's sake. If you are comfortable within your own skin, you can take advice, from anyone. This whole face thing is the greatest form of cowardice on the planet.

Thank you.

I do agree that by our standards the Thai ways about loosing face and hierarchy seem strange. But unfortunately just telling them to 'man up' will loose any progress I have made.

It seems that many have tried to impose western standards but even if the results would improve Thailand any progress has been lost due to such issues.

Just on the basics when I made a comment on a video which showed a school kid riding like a loon to supposedly assist an Ambulance cut through the traffic, but instead hinders the Ambulance and also almost needs one himself, my comment was replied to by the kid telling me to 'go forth and multiply'. Fortunately others were more supportive. If anything that is the current change. Thais are starting to show interest in learning better skills. But that tends to be in the 'biker' communities who tend to be at the sharp end and want to improve their skills to ride their 'big bikes' better and stay alive. If you look at most of the comments all they do is say 'well done for helping' nothing of the list of dangerous riding errors or hindering the Ambulances progress.

Heres the video link, it's on Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=980190915337073

[CarolJadzia]

Regarding the helmet law. I am a biker, I love riding with the wind in my hair, it's a wonderful feeling. I hate being told I have to wear a helmet. But there is no argument that helmets do not save lives.

Wearing a helmet is the single most effective way of reducing head injuries and fatalities resulting from motorcycle and bicycle crashes. Wearing a helmet has been shown to decrease the risk and severity of injuries among motorcyclists by about 70%, the likelihood of death by almost 40%, and to substantially reduce the costs of health care associated with such crashes.

World Health Organisation http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2006/pr44/en/

Yes a helmet is not going to prevent an accident, but it increases your chances of not dying in one.

I respect any argument for riders choice as I have done for over 40 years since the helmet law was first introduced in the UK.

But that is not an argument against it saving lives, that is well proven.

Just about our rights to freedom to choose.

[starky]

We wish this guy good luck with his injuries. Also good luck with the Thai hospital accounts receivable people. hope he had travel insurance.

Australian travel insurances do not cover motorcycle accidents in Thailand or elsewhere.

Wow I didnt know that. But surely if you have a Australia bike license you would be covered over here?

From an Australian friend, who visits me on a regular basis, I know that "any sports activities" and "motorcycling riding" is within his insurance is not covered (unless you have a special insurance, which covers this). You are covered by the Thai compulsory insurance though, in case of an injury up to 50.000 THB. Other forum members mentioned, that hospitals will alter the report, that you rode as a pillion, or "broke your leg" in a different accident, in order to get the coverage from an Australian insurance company. One always has to read the fineprint, to find out, what actually is covered, and what is not covered.If a motorcycle accident is covered, you then must produce an international drivers license.

Lucky he is not Australian then eh mate? What part of Irish from Ireland in Australia for work did you not understand?

[TDCNINJA]

I've been in Samui since Aug 4, and I only ride my scooter a short distance.

I've never seen more unsafe drivers than the Thais.

The hell with a Tier 3 rating for human trafficking, give them an international Tier 160 rating for traffic safety.

[CarolJadzia]

Just for the record. I knew I had seen this somewhere. Phuket claiming the title of most dangerous island.

http://www.thephuketnews.com/it-official-phuket-worst-in-thailand-for-road-accidents-53869.php

Lets hope this does not become a race!

[simple1]

Since the accident he has been heavily medicated to deal with the pain arising from his injuries.

They gave him 1000mg of Tylenol? Really. All the Western embassies should issue warnings regarding the lunacy of driving on Thai road, especially on a motorcycle. I drive a motorcycle and a car here out of necessity, but I don't like it. I actually really enjoyed driving in my home country.

Hopes for a swift recovery and finding a new career.

From reading the link in the OP it does not sound as though the injured man had adequate travel insurance as yet another fund raising effort underway.

The Eire government travel warning that is similar to other Western government travel warnings for Thailand...

Get travel and medical insurance.

If you are planning to rent a scooter or motorcycle while in Thailand, we advise you to exercise extreme caution.

In the past few years there have been numerous accidents involving motorcycles and scooters in which Irish citizens have been seriously injured or lost their lives.

https://www.dfa.ie/travel/travel-advice/a-z-list-of-countries/thailand/

Edited September 26, 2015 by simple1

[evadgib]

No one reads such warnings until 10 mins after they needed to!

Edited September 27, 2015 by evadgib

[CarolJadzia]

No one reads such warnings until 10 mins after they needed to!

Well yes, if they are still alive!

I think the big problem with many Farangs in general is on average most people think they are good riders or that riding a motorcycle is easy and due to them being on holiday they don't need to worry so much about health and safety, after all the locals do not appear to worry about it. Neither does it appear that the local police officers are taking much interest.

But they miss the clues that say because of the way the locals and some of the other farangs use the roads the dangers are so much higher.

But it needs proactive not reactive responses. I can currently see no end to these reports on TVF continuing for a long time to come.

There is some progress - http://www.roadsafetythai.org/index.php# but for the moment the situation looks to get worse before it get's better.

Defensive Riding and Driving is the only answer, look after yourself and those close to you.

No Surprise / No Accident