UK Flr spouse visa check list

[samsong101]

Hello all

I am about to start sorting out what i need for my wifes visa for next year but would like a list of all the things i need to do and send off for her application.

She done the A1 English test in Thailand for the toeic certificate but it has a expiry date on it so will she have to take the test again?

Also where do we get the biometrics done and how many bank statements and payslips do they require? Do they need utility bills to be in joint names as currently they are all in mine.Sorry for all the questions but I want to get a clear idea of what i need to send so would appreciate if someone who has done this already and passed could make a check list please.

Any help would be great

Thanks

samsong

[durhamboy]

The TOEIC cert may be a problem. The problem is not the expiry date - all certs are accepted regardless of the fact that they may have expired - but unfortunately TOEIC was struck off for fraud - remember the Panorama programme about 18 months ago? My wife's expired BULATS cert was accepted recently when she got her FLR. I have not heard of anyone being accepted or rejected with TOEIC so you probably need to do more research on that.

You do the biometrics for the BRP when they send you a letter AFTER you submit your FLR application. Bank statements/payslips are either for 6 months or 12 months depending upon what financial requirement criteria you are relying on - savings or income.

[bobrussell]

I would be interested in hearing peoples experiences with use of TOEIC. I had been unaware that voice recognition software was used in an attempt to identify 'ringers' taking the test on behalf of others. Apparently many students had their visas cancelled and had to return home.

https://tribunalsdecisions.service.gov.uk/utiac/2015-ukut-327

suggests that in these cases appeals had to be made at home.

I am far from convinced that TOEIC will be automatically accepted and according to posts elsewhere UKVI have required at least one person applying for ILR to attend an interview. Immigration solicitor websites seem full of invitations to employ them where a visa has been refused.

Hopefully someone here will know more!

[7by7]

For applications made after 5th November 2015, only tests on the new approved list will be accepted.

So she will need to take it again with either Trinity College or IELTS. When she does, aim for B1; then she can use that pass for her ILR application as well.

If she applies in person, her biometrics will be taken when she attends her appointment; if she applies by post she'll be sent a letter asking her to arrange for them to be taken.

As durhamboy says, the financial evidence required depends on how you are meeting the financial requirement. See also the specified evidence appendix.

Other required evidence can be found on Form FLR(M)

You may also find Apply to remain in the UK with family useful.

Remember that in addition to the FLR application fee, she/you will also have to pay the NHS surcharge.

[samsong101]

Thanks for the replies

I meet the financial requirement now but only started the new job in October this year to up my salary to meet the requirements and hope to apply for the visa in April 2016 as the wifes visa expires at the end of May 2016,will 6 month payslips and statements be enough?

Also the English test,she will do that February next year at Trinity, if she does the B1 test will that be ok to use for the ILR visa or will it expire?

Thanks in advance

samsong

[magicroundabout]

Hi,

Just curious about only english tests will be accepted from the new list of approved providers from Nov. I thought if a test was previously used for a successful application it can be used for again. In my case we are going to use bulats for my wife's extension.

[7by7]

Samsong101,

If meeting the financial requirement through employed income then in most situations it is the 6 months prior to the application which count and need to be evidenced. Remember, too, that for an FLR, and ILR, application your wife's income, if any, can be added to yours to meet the requirement if necessary.

For the specific evidence required in your situation, see the specified evidence appendix..

As far as I am aware, at present, provided she obtains at least B1, she can use the same certificate for her ILR application; even if it has expired. But, things change, so I advise that you check on this a few months prior to her ILR application to give her time to take it again if she needs to. Remember that for ILR she'll need to pass the LitUK test as well.

Magicroundabout,

As far as I can ascertain, from 5th November 2015 only tests on the new approved list will be accepted; whether the application is for the initial visa, FLR or ILR.

I will, of course, be overjoyed to be proven wrong on this.

[durhamboy]

7by7, MR - I think there is a lot of confusion about English tests. I am 99% certain that a BULATS A1 English pass that was used for the initial Settlement Visa is valid for all future FLR applications. This is what is said in s32D :-

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/419920/Appendix_FM_Section_1_21.pdf

I think the 5th November (Guy Fawkes come back all is forgiven!) deadline relates to a reorganisation of the approved lists for tests taken for future SVs.

[7by7]

The first part of the note at the start of the new list can be confusing

The following are the lists of approved secure English language tests and test centres that have been assessed as meeting the Home Offices requirements from 6th April 2015. Anyone taking a test on or after 6th April 2015 that they intend to use in a UK immigration application must take one of the tests listed in table 1 at one of the approved test centres in table 2 or table 3. Table 1 also details the CEFR level and minimum grade requirements for each level.

The part I have emphasised does read as if an old test will still be valid if it was taken before 6th April 2015.

But it goes on

Anyone who has taken a previously approved test on or before 5th April 2015 may still use it in a UK immigration application until 5th November 2015..........

Para 32D of the specified evidence appendix still does say that an old certificate may be accepted (note 'may' not 'will'!) if it has previously been accepted in a successful application as a partner or parent.

But experience has shown that these instructions and guidance to decision makers often take a while to be updated after changes!

My advice; watch this space, and check nearer the time.

[magicroundabout]

Hi all,

Well even more confusing...I've always been relying on page 60 of thr flr form where it has a tick box that states you are not including because it's been used on a previous application.

Based on 7by7 concerns I thought I would give immigration a call. The first agent I spoke to confirmed the bulats would be accepted. However, right at the end of the conversation he stated that they are no longer accepting Esol exams. It didn't dawn on me to afterwards that they are the same - are they not? I phoned back to clarify and spoke to another agent. He stated that they will only accept from the new list of providers. When I asked them about guidance notes,tick box and section 32 he couldn't answer.

I really don't know what to do... My wife panics in exams and has already failed the new exam despite her english being reasonably good. Do you think an immigration solicitor would he able to give a definitive answer on the English test? Also, if my wife's visa failed based on using the BULATS test (and her visa has expired) am I right in thinking she could only reapply from Thailand.

[durhamboy]

7by7 - where it says :-

Anyone who has taken a previously approved test on or before 5th April 2015 may still use it in a UK immigration application until 5th November 2015..........

I think that this is intended to relate to transitional arrangements for people who had taken the English test in Thailand before 5th April 2015 and had not yet submitted their SV application. So it gave them a period of grace of 7 months which makes sense.

Also you make the point that under para 32D a "an old certificate may be accepted (note 'may' not 'will'!) if it has previously been accepted in a successful application......"

Yes that is true - it says "may" not "will" because if you read the statement there are certain quite understandable conditions attached to its acceptance, foremost of which is that the certificate wasn't obtained fraudulently hence the possible problem with the TOEIC certs.

So I am still 99% certain that a BULATS test is acceptable but I totally understand MR's (and his wife's) state of confusion and panic over this. The trouble is who can he ask? No one seems to be able to give a definitive answer. HMG keep making rule changes not realising the confusion it causes with rules still in place. In my opinion para 32D is quite clear and I referred to it strongly in my wife's recent successful FLR application albeit that her application was before 5th. November.

[magicroundabout]

Hi,

Thanks durhamboy - I think 7by7 point about may instead of will is very valid.

Given the ECO will have to make decision on this I don't think anyone in authority will says it ok to use hence some confusion .

As you said it appears that it can be rejected if there doubt about the validity of the certificate.

As far as I'm aware there has been no issues with the validity of the bulats therefore I would struggle of a reason why it could be rejected based on there own guidelines.

Looking at other forums most people are still using old certificates although this doesn't necessarily mean it's right - Hopefully some might post up how they got on.

[7by7]

I see what you are saying, durhamboy, but it needs to be remembered that the statement "Anyone who has taken a previously approved test on or before 5th April 2015 may still use it in a UK immigration application until 5th November 2015.........." does not mean just the initial settlement visa, wherever applied for, but all immigration applications; including FLR and ILR.

Hence my confusion.

Magicroundabout,

Remember that your wife will have to achieve at least B1 for her ILR application, did she do so for her initial visa?

If not, then she will have to take a test with a provider from the new list anyway.

When is she due to apply for FLR? If she has the time, then to avoid any possible doubt I recommend she takes this before applying for FLR and uses that pass for her FLR application.

Unfortunately, any person who applies for any form of leave to remain in the UK and is refused no longer has any right to remain in the UK. Though they can do so if they are able to appeal against that refusal until the appeal is heard and decided upon.

Edited November 14, 2015 by 7by7

[magicroundabout]

Hi 7by7 to be honest we intend to move back to Thailand when her next visa expires so the b1 never really been on the radar.

The visa expires on the 28th November...am I right in thinking there is also 28 day grace period on top of this?

I think my plan of action then will be to sit a new test prior to this...if she passes then all is great if she doesn't go with the old one and see what happens.

[7by7]

No, there is not a 28 day grace period after the visa expires.

The earliest one can apply for FLR is 28 days before one has been in the UK with the initial visa for 30 months (unless you want to make a second FLR application to bring the total time up to the 60 months required for ILR); the latest is the day the initial visa expires.

Though I understand UKVI are not going to refuse if the application is a few days late; but I can't say how many days grace an applicant would be given.

Given the timings, it seems that she has no choice other than to submit her application in the belief that para 32D does till apply.

I'd strongly advise doing as durhamboy and his wife did, though, and refer to it in the application.:

[naruk86]

We've booked to submit flr on 28th of November. From everything I have read before, I presumed the BULATS qualification that was accepted on the initial settlement visa was ok, and have added a note referring to section 32 of appendix_fm. This topic has got me bricking it now, might have to get some revision done, and try the b1 test

[magicroundabout]

Hi, Naruk86 looks like we are in the same situation. I've done a bit of digging around and found a freedom of information request that was responded to that indicates that section 32 still applies after the recent changes - which is good news..I think. however, I'm still worried. I've sent my Mp an email asking her if she can look into the issue. Naturally, as soon as I hear anything I will post.

[naruk86]

Just phoned UKVI, no ESOL qualifications are accepted anymore.

Regardless of Appendix FM-SE 32D

I'm pretty sure wife is up to b1 standard but she panics and we don't have time to get 2 tests in before our appointment. So £150 down. I guess we can leave the b1 another 18 months. To spread the costs.

[magicroundabout]

Thanks for the update although not what I wanted to hear if you know what I mean. This would match what I was told by the Ukvi. I think there maybe some confusion from Ukvi staff matching Bulats as an Esol exams. As some people are saying they are phoning and it will be accepted. My Mp as advised me they are contacting the Ukvi to clarify. However I'm going to book an English Exam for Thursday or Saturday. My missus will be furious when I tell her tonight.

[naruk86]

just have to bite the bullet and get it done. £150 is nothing, if you end up getting visa refused because you thought you'd try your luck. My missus is fretting a bit now. Just shown her some example tests online, she's at ease now. It should be a walk in the park, it sounds like the BULATS test was harder.

[TCA]

I'm in the same boat as naruk86 and magicroundabout with regards to BULATS, so not exactly the news I wanted to hear either. Without knowing the level of the B1 test, I would guess it would be 50/50 as to whether my wife would pass. We have time on our side but were planning on making my wife's daughter's initial application right after my wife (hopefully) got FLR, so now we might be battling the expiry of her daughter's September TB certificate and having to do that again as well.

Guess I'll get looking at some B1 sample tests. naruk86, any chance you could post a link to those example tests? Doesn't matter, found some, strange format: http://www.trinitycollege.com/site/?id=3365

And even stranger grading. Scored on 2 tasks (topic and conversation), with scores from A to D, A being the highest. Only a D in both would be a fail. A score of D in topic and a C in conversation is still a pass. I take it back, I think my wife could pass.

Edited November 16, 2015 by TCA

[naruk86]

yeah videos on this website mate. i'm confident wife would pass the grade 5, but booked her on for grade 2 to be sure. As we can only test this Saturday 21st and got our appointment on the 30th to submit the visa application. With them giving 7 days for postal of the certificate, it isn't a risk worth taking. If we booked for grade 5 then she failed, then we would be up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

[TCA]

yeah videos on this website mate. i'm confident wife would pass the grade 5, but booked her on for grade 2 to be sure. As we can only test this Saturday 21st and got our appointment on the 30th to submit the visa application. With them giving 7 days for postal of the certificate, it isn't a risk worth taking. If we booked for grade 5 then she failed, then we would be up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

You're quite right. Probably not worth the risk and you're paying even more with the so-called "premium" service. It's pathetic that there's no definitive guidance on the BULATS/Appendix 32D issue and you get a different answer when calling depending on who you speak to. I think I might write to my MP as well.

[magicroundabout]

Well just broke the news to my missus and she has taken it very well. We are going to book for Thursday on the A1 level. This may make our application a few days late but I think better than not providing the English result. I phone Ukvi tomorrow and seek guidance on late application . In my letter to my Mp I specifically mentioned the guidance notes and section 32 be interesting to see what the reply will be. Trust me looking at other forums this is going to catch out a lot of People!!! I would like to thank 7by7 for pointing this out as I think most of us were relying on the guidance notes

[naruk86]

Yes, I had filled the application in about 3 weeks ago. With a big note referring to section 32D

All the guidance needs sorting out. There's too many grey areas. Thank God for the likes of 7by7 and theoldgit who can point us all in the right direction.

[durhamboy]

Guys, I have done a bit more research on this by way of a google search today of UKVI guidelines. So this should be the current status :-

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/419920/Appendix_FM_Section_1_21.pdf

"Paragraph 32A of Appendix FM-SE makes clear for the avoidance of doubt that paragraphs 27 to 32D of Appendix FM-SE apply to fiancé(e), proposed civil partner, spouse, civil partner, unmarried partner and same sex partner applications for limited leave to enter or remain made under Part 8 of the Rules where English language requirements apply, regardless of the date of application." (my emphasis).

So further searching Appendix FM-SE (as referred to above) :-

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration-rules/immigration-rules-appendix-fm-se-family-members-specified-evidence#

"32D. If an applicant applying for limited leave to enter or remain under Part 8 or Appendix FM submits an English language test certificate or result and the Home Office has already accepted it as part of a successful previous partner or parent application (but not where the application was refused, even if on grounds other than the English language requirement), the decision-maker may accept that certificate or result as valid if it is:

1. (a) from a provider which is no longer approved, or
2. ( from a provider who remains approved but the test the applicant has taken with that provider is no longer approved, or
3. © from a test centre which is no longer approved, or
4. (d) past its validity date (if a validity date is required under Appendix O), provided that when the subsequent application is made:
   1. (i) the applicant has had continuous leave (disregarding any period of overstaying of no more than 28 days) as a partner or parent since the Home Office accepted the test certificate as valid; and
   2. (ii) the award to the applicant does not fall within the circumstances set out in paragraph 32B of this Appendix."

So it is as clear as it can be in Home Office speak that a BULATS cert originally accepted as part of a successful settlement visa application is still acceptable for FLR.

Finally, may I say what an absolute pig's dinner made by the Home Office of what is supposed to be a simple requirement for people to speak English. It is an utter disgrace that things are made so complicated and unclear as to cause great distress for those merely trying to get FLR for their spouses who have already passed required English tests and lived here for 2 1/2 years speaking English everyday. Words fail me as to what I really think of those cretins in government administration. Good luck to all those applying for FLR.

[TCA]

Thanks for staying on the case durhamboy. Clicking "see all updates" at the top of the page you linked "Immigration Rules Appendix FM-SE: family members specified evidence", then running through the updates indicates that this particular update was on 19th October 2015. That to me is a pretty recent confirmation of 32D.

Going back to the April document Appendix FM 1.21 in respect of the 5th November date, they couldn't make it any more ambiguous if they tried.

2.2.4 Test taken before 6 April 2015 - Not required to take a test at a secure test centre if submits partner or parent application before 6 November 2015.

2.5 Applicants who already have a test certificate or result

A partner or parent applying for leave to enter or leave to remain is not required to provide evidence of meeting the English language requirement if they have done so as part of a successful previous application as a partner or parent. Paragraph 32D of Appendix FM-SE provides for when this earlier test certificate or result can and cannot be used.

This flexibility does not apply in circumstances where a test certificate or result awarded to the applicant has been withdrawn by a provider such that it can no longer be relied upon: in those circumstances the applicant must provide a fresh test certificate or result from an approved provider which shows that they meet the requirement, if they are not exempt from it.

Under paragraph 32C of Appendix FM-SE if an applicant in the partner or parent routes submits a test certificate or result which has ceased, by the date of application, to be

A. from an approved test provider, or
B. in respect of an approved test, or
C. from an approved test centre,

we will not accept that certificate or result as valid, unless the decision-maker does so in accordance with paragraph 32D of Appendix FM-SE and subject to any transitional arrangements made in respect of the test provider or test in question.

Which brings us back to 32D and everything looks good for re-use of BULATS.

I'm tending to agree with db's earlier post that section 2.2.4 and the November date is with regard to those who have taken a (now unapproved) test and not yet made an application with it, and section 2.5 is clearly is in respect of those have taken a (now unapproved) test and made a successful application with it already.

Confusing wouldn't describe it.

Edited November 17, 2015 by TCA

[magicroundabout]

Hi all,

I've sat and read all the statement of rule changes to immigration. There is about 350 pages. The only changes that have not been updated in guidance is a paper called HC535 which was issued on the 29th October. The makes a change to section 27 of the FM-se but section 32 is still valid.

I also got a reply from my MP office today. (you will like this) "I've have contacted the Ukvi office today but I could not get an unambiguous reply to your query I will contact them again Tomorrow".

How on earth are normal people meant to understand all this!!!

[naruk86]

I was told categorically by ukvi that all ESOL qualifications are no longer accepted regardless of section 32d.

Therefore £150 new test it is. That's the only thing I can be certain about

[Trevor1809]

And on the subject of English tests http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34857838