19 hours ago, Wizzy said:

Oh they were forcing me to sign something but nobody wanted to explain me what exactly that is and it says I can appeal that decision in 48 hours. Did anyone went down that road before? How does it look like, can I do it in Thai Embassy? Or would I just be digging myself a hole

You complete a TM11 appeal form and pay a 1900 baht fee while still in detention. They have to respond to it within 7 days or it would be considered approved and you would be allowed to enter the country.

Download: TM11 appeal form.pdf135.52 kB · 95 downloads

21 hours ago, Wizzy said:

EU. They wrote something in Thai. I saw on that paper that says act 12.2. searched a bit, apparently that is "no means to support myself" or something in that regard? I had about 40k in cash and could show them my bank accounts if they wished. I did say on many occasions I have the money, but they didn't care about it. 

 

It translates better as "does not have the means to stay in the country", the means refers to not having an appropriate way or visa to stay in the country. It doesn't refer to your financial ability to support yourself in the country.

4 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

You complete a TM11 appeal form and pay a 1900 baht fee while still in detention. They have to respond to it within 7 days or it would be considered approved and you would be allowed to enter the country.

Download: TM11 appeal form.pdf135.52 kB · 95 downloads

The poster said he was denied at Sadao. Did we ever have a report of anybody who appealed at a land border?

I wouldn't expect them to have detention facilities at a land border.

Would Malaysia cancel the exit stamp without the person having a denial stamp from Thailand? So that the person could wait 7 days in Malaysia until the appeal is processed or he will be allowed to enter Thailand because they didn't process it within 7 days.

But this could be problematic if he had less than 7 days on his Malaysian permit of stay left before he tried to enter Thailand.

 

2 hours ago, G950 said:

It translates better as "does not have the means to stay in the country", the means refers to not having an appropriate way or visa to stay in the country. It doesn't refer to your financial ability to support yourself in the country.

Actually it translates to "doesn't have basic needs", so it basically says that the person is impoverished

Edited December 13, 20196 yr by jackdd

Thank you so much for all of the information! Really valuable. Still seems to me more money related, but maybe I don't understand smaller intricacies of English language.

 

However upon researching:

http://www.mfa.go.th/main/en/services/4908/15405-General-information.html

-12.2 having no appropriate means of living upon entering the country

 

And thai embassy in Moscow had this explanation for this exact act:

http://www.thaiembassy.org/moscow/en/services/79767-Thailand-Immigration-Information-regarding-adequat.html

 

"Q1: Is it true that tourists entering Thailand must be able to prove that they have adequate finances during the stay as currently being widely reported in local and international media?

Yes, this is true, according to the Immigration Act of Thailand B.E. 2522 (1979), foreigners who fall into any of the 11 categories are prohibited to enter Thailand. This includes “having no appropriate means of living on entering the Kingdom”. Without appropriate means of living, tourists risk becoming economic and social burdens of the host country.

In this connection, according to the Notification of the Ministry of Interior dated 8 May 2000, holders of tourist visa must be able to prove that they have adequate finances equivalent to at least 20,000 Bath per person or 40,000 Bath per family."

 

There is another point on having no money, which would suggest 12.2 having a different meaning, but guess not.

 

But seems interesting only talk was about me entering 6 times in one year and being almost 1 whole year in Thailand. Nothing about missing return ticket or money.

 

What would 11. point mean:
Being deported by either the Government of Thailand that of or other foreign countries; or the right of stay in the Kingdom or in foreign countries having been revoked; or having been sent out of the Kingdom by competent officials at the expense of the Government of Thailand unless the Minister shall consider exemption on an individual special case basis.

 

Does bolded part also mean being denied entry as I was sent out of Kingdom by competent official? So can this now be a basis of me being rejected, so no use of trying to get into the country again with a denial stamp?

Edited December 13, 20196 yr by Wizzy

The intended meaning of Section 12 (2) when the Immigration Act was promulgated was that you would not be able to support yourself in an appropriate manner while in Thailand. Mainly, this referred to having the financial wherewithal without needing to resort to illegal or immoral activities. This is distinct from Section 12 (9) which simply lays out a minimum amount of cash you must have on entry. The intended meaning is irrelevant, as Immigration have chosen to reinterpret it to mean you were incorrectly issued a visa according to what we believe the criteria should be.

 

Do not worry about Section 12 (11). Being denied entry is not the same as being deported.

14 hours ago, jackdd said:

The poster said he was denied at Sadao. Did we ever have a report of anybody who appealed at a land border?

I do not know how it would work at a border crossing. I was just replying to his question about the appeal in general terms.

At a land border a person could try at another border crossing. No need to do the appeal in that case. At an airport it is entirely different.

14 hours ago, jackdd said:

Actually it translates to "doesn't have basic needs", so it basically says that the person is impoverished

The official translation of the immigrant act posted on the immigration website states this.

"2. Having no appropriate means of living following entrance into the Kingdom."

Some people want to twist it around to get their opinion it can be applied for not having the proper visa for their stay. In my opinion it means not having financial proof to live on after entering the country beyond the 10k baht or 20k required for entry under clause 9.

"9. Having no money or bond as prescribed by the Minister under him"

ubonjoe,

Assuming someone travels in via an airport and gets denied: You want to do a TM11, but the officer does not give you the form or does not accept your prepared form? This is Thailand, nothing we could do, right? We have no proof that the officer did not take our TM11.

Hi, I'm looking for some advice please. I want to move to Phuket in April, I plan to rent a condo for a year, and will be travelling back and forth to the UK, I would like to stay in Thailand for a total of 9 months in the calendar year, meaning I would need to apply for 3 tourist VISAS in this time. Is this possible? Or is there a limit to how many days you can stay in Thailand in a calendar year? I know there is a limit of 90 days per VISA with extension, but can I do this three times in a year? Ideally I would like a more permanent VISA, but this seems like a minefield. I work online for a company in China so I don't think my work status will help me in terms of getting a working VISA. Any advice or info about limits in multiple tourist VISAS in a year would be greatly appreciated, thanks.  

3 hours ago, christopher80 said:

Hi, I'm looking for some advice please. I want to move to Phuket in April, I plan to rent a condo for a year, and will be travelling back and forth to the UK, I would like to stay in Thailand for a total of 9 months in the calendar year, meaning I would need to apply for 3 tourist VISAS in this time. Is this possible? Or is there a limit to how many days you can stay in Thailand in a calendar year? I know there is a limit of 90 days per VISA with extension, but can I do this three times in a year? Ideally I would like a more permanent VISA, but this seems like a minefield. I work online for a company in China so I don't think my work status will help me in terms of getting a working VISA. Any advice or info about limits in multiple tourist VISAS in a year would be greatly appreciated, thanks.  

It will probably be possible, but difficult, to stay nine months in Thailand in the first year if you have very limited previous history of visits to Thailand. I doubt you would be successful in the second year. There has been a major crackdown on people using tourist visas for extended stays in Thailand. I personally do not see it getting easier. You will have two issues: getting the visas, and entering Thailand,

 

For the visa, it would be best if you can get a multiple entry tourist visa from your home country. If not, you will need to select where you go for single entry tourist visas carefully. 

 

Once you have racked up about six months in Thailand in a rolling 12 month period, you risk Immigration deciding not to honour your visa and denying you entry.  This does not happen (currently) at all entry points. However, if you will be flying from the UK, I would expect you to plan flying in to one of the Bangkok airports or possibly Phuket. None of those airports is a safe entry point once you have spent extended periods in Thailand as a tourist. There is no official rule limiting the time you can spend in Thailand, but unofficial rules are being used (against the spirit of the current Immigration Act).

 

If you are financially secure, look into the Thailand Elite visa. This is your safe way of spending long periods in the country.

On 12/16/2019 at 9:00 AM, BritTim said:

This does not happen (currently) at all entry points.

The problems exist only at airports (i don't know if at all and how much, but definitely at BKK and DMK, for example CNX seems to be more relaxed) and at the Poipet crossing. Currently the other land borders seem to follow the written rules, but the crossings from Malaysia seem to be a bit more strict (insisting on having 10k/20k THB cash)

Edited December 19, 20196 yr by jackdd

Btw for the follow up, I decided to try again to go through Malaysian land border, the other one that you reach with a train, but this time I had all my documents ready and printed out.

They were strict, but correct. I got inspected and asked more questions than other people, but they respected the documents and let me through.

 

But land borders certainly seem strickt, on airports I never had to show anything

 

Now my metv will runnout, so next time I am without a visa, and I have some problem. I will go to Malaysia for a few weeks, but my flight to Europe is from BKK, Suvarnabhumi. 

1. What are my chances of getting single entry tourist visa in KL or Penang? ( After 2 metv for 8months back to back with 2 months in Europe in between, and rejection stamp?). 

2. is there a better place  to get a turist visa or can I get Transit visa?

3. Can I just go without a visa and get visa exemption if I have flight on the same day out?- if they reject me, can they just put me on the flight home?

 

Or should I just get a new ticket.

 

 

@Christoper80 If it is your first time you should be fine imo and easier to just get metv but single entry should work. Maybe the third time do some precaution and fly in from Malaysia not from UK, also if you take a week or two off and not do just fast visa run should help as well. 

Edited December 24, 20196 yr by Wizzy

On 11/14/2015 at 9:07 AM, bubba said:

I see the Thai Consulate in Washington has now posted their METV requirements for Americans. Yes, the bank balance and employment requirements are there. Regarding the funds, it is interesting that they state "bank balance or evidence of adequate finance", so presumably that could mean monetary assets other than bank accounts, such as accounts at investment firms.

Purpose of Visit: This type of visa is issued to applicants who wish to enter the Kingdom for tourism purposes.
Documents Required:

1. Your actual Passport or Travel Document. (Passport or Travel Document must not expire within 6 months and contain at least ONE completely empty visa page).
2. One visa application form completely filled out (Download)
3. Two passport-size photographs (2″x2″) (photocopy or photo taken from Photostat will not be accepted). Photographs must have a light color background with a full- face view of the person without wearing a hat or dark glasses and covering up shoulders Photos must be taken within 6 months.
4. Flight confirmation/reservation (The name of the applicant must clearly appear on it)
5. Hotel reservation confirmation (The name of the applicant must clearly appear on it)
6. A copy of bank statement or evidence of adequate finance for the last 6 months with a minimum balance of $7,000 (every months) (The name of the applicant must clearly appear on it)
7. For non-US citizen, a copy of permanent resident alien card or a copy of valid US visa
8. An employment verification
9. For students, full-time student status proof
10.For self-employed, business license or business registration indicating the applicant’s name.
11.For minor under 20 years old, copy of a birth certificate, copies of mother and father’s passports/ID and copy of Marriage Certificate if any, letter of consent from mother and father for the minor to travel abroad in case not accommany with the child (have to be notarized) . in case of sole custody, a copy of court order must be provided

http://thaiembdc.org/tourist-visa-category-tr-multiple-metv/

For 8,9, and 10; this assumes that everyone is either employed or a student.   What about someone who is neither employed, nor a student, but does have adequate financial means?

On 12/24/2019 at 12:26 PM, Wizzy said:

Now my metv will runnout, so next time I am without a visa, and I have some problem. I will go to Malaysia for a few weeks, but my flight to Europe is from BKK, Suvarnabhumi. 
...

3. Can I just go without a visa and get visa exemption if I have flight on the same day out?- if they reject me, can they just put me on the flight home?

 

Or should I just get a new ticket.

If flying out same-day, I would show them the outgoing ticket upon-entry.  Don't wait for them to ask for it.  They could decide to not allow entry - so you'd say airside - but I doubt they would prevent you from boarding your connecting-flight.  I'd carry the 20K Baht worth of cash, to be on the safe-side.

 

If they start making a fuss about being here 'too much' (there is NO LAW, in this regard, but they don't care what the law is), state clearly you do not want to enter the country - only to go to the gate for your connecting departure-flight so you can Return To Your Home-Country.  They should like the sound of that. 

 

There was a case, awhile back, of a guy denied-entry (for no legal-reason - the usual) and sent back to Laos.  He flew back to the same Thai airport from Laos with a connecting flight-ticket out, and was allowed to board the connecting-flight.

Seeking some advice here.

I have a METV and have been questioned in the past by immigration upon entering, but it was always pretty laid back. Was even told I had to enter on a non-tourist visa next time, but entered successfully several times after that warning. However this past week I got grilled hard! This IO was on a war path and seemed to be pulling many people aside for random issues not even related to visa stuff (taking pics in line, tape being used to repair their passport etc). Anyway, after like 20 minutes, she finally let me in after telling me I wouldn’t be allowed in this time. But the thing that scared me is she told the officer to enter me into the system that I could not enter on a tourist visa anymore.

 

Should I take this more serious than the previous warnings in the past, or is it still the same old deal (i.e. they just check my history like usual)?... the thing that makes me wonder if I should be more worried than normal is she let me in anyway, and she was like strenuously announcing it to me instead of just telling the IO to enter the info (my thinking being, if it was really a legit “note in the system” then I’d be denied anyway, no need for all the emphasis on warning me).

 

Lastly, I have no prob going to Laos to enter on the friendship bridge. Would be a fun trip as I’ve never been. Is the friendship bridge almost a sure thing? Better than Chaing Mai?

thanks in advance for all the advice. I’m honestly still a little shaken

17 minutes ago, Snacks said:

Lastly, I have no prob going to Laos to enter on the friendship bridge. Would be a fun trip as I’ve never been. Is the friendship bridge almost a sure thing? Better than Chiang Mai?

Historically, there have been zero problems entering with a visa at the Friendship Bridge from Vientiane to Nong Khai. With a visa, I have also seen no reports that worry me entering at Chiang Mai airport. However, the consequences if you were denied entry at Chiang Mai airport (possibly even forced back to Sweden) would be more serious than just being told to cross back over the Friendship Bridge from Nong Khai.

49 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Historically, there have been zero problems entering with a visa at the Friendship Bridge from Vientiane to Nong Khai. With a visa, I have also seen no reports that worry me entering at Chiang Mai airport. However, the consequences if you were denied entry at Chiang Mai airport (possibly even forced back to Sweden) would be more serious than just being told to cross back over the Friendship Bridge from Nong Khai.

Thanks! Do you have any opinions about being told that they “put a note” about me in “the system”?... is this as menacing as it sounds or is it just the typical threat that can successfully be overcome with a more chill IO?

Thanks again ! 

USA citizen.

Entered mid-November on an SETV which has to be renewed for 30 days soon, taking me to mid Feb.

(Can I renew a few days early to get it taken care of, or will that cause me to lose some of my 60 days because the renewal begins immediately)?

 

I am then planning to stay in neighboring countries seeking clean air, and reenter Thailand June 1st.

Ideally I'd like to spend June thru December or January here.

 

I'd appreciate advice on my choices.

I was originally planning to deposit the 800k in a Thai bank and go for the Retirement extension.

If I decide over the next few months that I still want to go that way, what Visa would I obtain and where (planning to be in Vietnam - Da Nang, and then in Malaysia/Indonesia/Phillipines)?

 

But I am at the minute undecided and especially if Air Quality is even worse this year and extends even longer for the worst air, I am considering passing on the bank deposit/Retirement Extension and going for a method that will give me hopefully at least 6 months in Thailand (June 1st thru November) or a little longer if possible.

If I decide to go that route, what visa would I obtain to re-enter and which of the countries I've named could I obtain it in.

 

Thanks for all input.

 

PS - Prior to this year, I was in Thailand for a few months in 2018, first on an SETV of which I only used the 1st month, and then a Visa Exempt which I renewed and left before the end of the extension.

Edited January 2, 20206 yr by JimmyJ

3 hours ago, Snacks said:

Thanks! Do you have any opinions about being told that they “put a note” about me in “the system”?... is this as menacing as it sounds or is it just the typical threat that can successfully be overcome with a more chill IO?

Thanks again ! 

The annotation in the system may or may not be real. However, I strongly suspect that, if it exists, it would only have an effect if entering at selected entry points where they use unofficial rules to deny entry. If entering at most land crossings, and even some airports, I think the annotation to your history to the effect that you are a tourist too often will be ignored.

2 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

(Can I renew a few days early to get it taken care of, or will that cause me to lose some of my 60 days because the renewal begins immediately)?

You can apply a week or two before the end of your permission to stay, and the extra 30 days is always added to the end of your current permission to stay.

 

2 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

I'd appreciate advice on my choices.

This is a complicated question.

If you want the retirement extension, the first step is to be in Thailand on a non immigrant (not a tourist) entry. Briefly, this can be achieved with

• A single entry Non O visa based on being over 50 from an embassy/consulate from some locations in the region. For this, you will always need to show the 800,000 baht equivalent (in a bank account anywhere, not necessarily in Thailand) but there are usually some other requirements, and not all consulates will provide the Non O.
• You can enter Thailand either visa exempt or with a tourist visa, and apply to have this converted to a Non Immigrant entry based on the intention later to apply for a one-year extension of stay for retirement. For this, the 800,000 baht must be in a Thai bank account with proof that the funds came from abroad. Depending on the immigration office, this often has fewer requirements that a visa from a consulate.

Either of the above options gives you an initial 90-day stay, which you extend for a further year during about the last month of this initial 90-day stay.

If you wanted to stay as a tourist for about seven months starting June 1, this will probably be possible, but may require some care (applying for visas at the best consulates, and using safe entry points into Thailand). If you will be in your home country at any stage, you could apply for a multiple entry tourist visa which would make things considerably simpler.

5 hours ago, Snacks said:

Seeking some advice here.

I have a METV and have been questioned in the past by immigration upon entering, but it was always pretty laid back. Was even told I had to enter on a non-tourist visa next time, but entered successfully several times after that warning. However this past week I got grilled hard!

 

Where did you enter this last time?

On 12/27/2019 at 4:32 PM, Soneva said:

For 8,9, and 10; this assumes that everyone is either employed or a student.   What about someone who is neither employed, nor a student, but does have adequate financial means?

Soneva,  I'm not too sure how up-to-date that information from 2015 is, but the current wording on the UK Embassy website states:-

 

• A letter from the applicant's employer (in the UK and addressed to the Royal Thai Embassy)
          If you are self-employed, you self-assessment and a company registration document are required.

I have just applied for the METV using the mandatory visa system.  I was asked to choose my work status from a dropdown menu.  I chose "retired."  I had already prepared and scanned a signed statement explaining my retirement status and intentions about travelling as a tourist only.  However, when later prompted to upload the various supporting documents I was not required to upload anything relating to employment status.

 

HTH

10 hours ago, rabang said:

 

Where did you enter this last time?

Entered at Suvarnabhumi

14 hours ago, BritTim said:

You can apply a week or two before the end of your permission to stay, and the extra 30 days is always added to the end of your current permission to stay.

 

This is a complicated question.

If you want the retirement extension, the first step is to be in Thailand on a non immigrant (not a tourist) entry. Briefly, this can be achieved with

• A single entry Non O visa based on being over 50 from an embassy/consulate from some locations in the region. For this, you will always need to show the 800,000 baht equivalent (in a bank account anywhere, not necessarily in Thailand) but there are usually some other requirements, and not all consulates will provide the Non O.
•  
•  can enter Thailand either visa exempt or with a tourist visa, and apply to have this converted to a Non Immigrant entry based on the intention later to apply for a one-year extension of stay for retirement. For this, the 800,000 baht must be in a Thai bank account with proof that the funds came from abroad. Depending on the immigration office, this often has fewer requirements that a visa from a consulate.

Either of the above options gives you an initial 90-day stay, which you extend for a further year during about the last month of this initial 90-day stay.

If you wanted to stay as a tourist for about seven months starting June 1, this will probably be possible, but may require some care (applying for visas at the best consulates, and using safe entry points into Thailand). If you will be in your home country at any stage, you could apply for a multiple entry tourist visa which would make things considerably simpler.

BritTim - Thank you.

 

If I go for the annual retirement extension - 

 

"You 

• can enter Thailand either visa exempt or with a tourist visa, and apply to have this converted to a Non Immigrant entry based on the intention later to apply for a one-year extension of stay for retirement. For this, the 800,000 baht must be in a Thai bank account with proof that the funds came from abroad. Depending on the immigration office, this often has fewer requirements that a visa from a consulate."

Are you  stating that the 800k THB must be already in a Thai bank account before "enter Thailand either visa exempt or with a tourist visa, and apply to have this converted to a Non Immigrant entry based on the intention later to apply for a one-year extension of stay for retirement."???

 

If - due to my assessment of worsening weather and worsening exchange rate - I decide on 6 months annually in Thailand or more if possible but not depositing in bank - isn't it possible to get a METV from a Thai consulate in a country bordering/near Thailand?

 

If not - 

"If you wanted to stay as a tourist for about seven months starting June 1, this will probably be possible, but may require some care (applying for visas at the best consulates, and using safe entry points into Thailand)."

 

What would you suggest as to consulates to apply to, which Visa to apply for, entry points?

 

Isn't 6 months/ year of tourism allowed (generally)?

 

 

 

1 hour ago, JimmyJ said:

Are you  stating that the 800k THB must be already in a Thai bank account before "enter Thailand either visa exempt or with a tourist visa, and apply to have this converted to a Non Immigrant entry based on the intention later to apply for a one-year extension of stay for retirement."???

No, you can being the funds in shortly after your arrival. However, the application for a conversion to a non immigrant entry needs to be made while you still have at least 15 days (possibly up to 21 days) left on your permission to stay. The funds must be in the bank (with proof that they originated from abroad) before applying for the conversion.

1 hour ago, JimmyJ said:

isn't it possible to get a METV from a Thai consulate in a country bordering/near Thailand?

No, the METV is only available from your home country. Only single entry tourist visas are available at consulates elsewhere.

 

1 hour ago, JimmyJ said:

What would you suggest as to consulates to apply to, which Visa to apply for, entry points?

 

Isn't 6 months/ year of tourism allowed (generally)?

You need to plan each step separately. The only major rule I strongly recommend is to resist the temptation to do easy visa exempt entries by land except in an emergency. As acquiring visas in the region becomes ever more difficult, you need the insurance those land based visa exempt entries provides.

 

There is no hard rule as to how long you can be a tourist in Thailand. If entering visa exempt by air, officials might well deny you entry even though you have spent less than 180 days in the previous 12 months in Thailand. On the other hand, if you succeed in getting a visa, many entry points (especially by land) will not currently impose any limits.

 

Let's not clutter up this thread too much with a long discussion of what to do if not using an METV.

15 hours ago, jonzboy said:

However, when later prompted to upload the various supporting documents I was not required to upload anything relating to employment status.

I submitted private pension summary documents to identify myself as retired IIRC.  Did you upload anything similar?

5 hours ago, treetops said:

I submitted private pension summary documents to identify myself as retired IIRC.  Did you upload anything similar?

I was not asked to upload anything in this category as there was no such category for me to enter it in to.  They had my bank statements only, which would not show any details of any pension income.  Of course they also have my DoB from passport, so maybe they have a clever algorithmic thingy that detects old codgers like me ????????????

I'm working for a commercial interior design firm in a nearby country. We are currently doing a few projects here (big companies in the region) so my company sent me here to oversee the project done by a local construction company. My visa allows me up to 30 days at a time, but a friend who is also working here told me that it's better not to exceed 15 days at a time, as they will flag me and affect my chances of coming back in the future. I was planning to stay up to 3 weeks at a time. Does anyone have any experience with this?

10 hours ago, Aesk said:

I'm working for a commercial interior design firm in a nearby country. We are currently doing a few projects here (big companies in the region) so my company sent me here to oversee the project done by a local construction company. My visa allows me up to 30 days at a time, but a friend who is also working here told me that it's better not to exceed 15 days at a time, as they will flag me and affect my chances of coming back in the future. I was planning to stay up to 3 weeks at a time. Does anyone have any experience with this?

I have no idea what visa you have (but it is not a multiple entry tourist visa which allows 60-day stays on each visit) and it is also not clear to me whether you have a work permit. Generally available multiple entry Thai visas do not provide 30-day permissions to stay. The Non B visa usually used for business purposes allows 90-day stays. Are you, perhaps, a national of a neighbouring country with some kind of special work visa only available to such nationals? If you post a scan of your visa (masking individually identifiable information) we might be in a better position to figure out your visa and work permit status, and provide guidance.

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

I have no idea what visa you have

I am guessing a Visa Exempt and certainly no work permit.