'US teen' among five dead in West Bank and Tel Aviv attacks

[Ulysses G.]

Are you trying to be funny through some warped parody of some Westboroesque pastor?

You find an objection to those justifying the murder of an innocent teenager amusing? Bizarre.

[dexterm]

Absolutely incredible. The same cadre of jew haters show up to justify the murders. The same psychopathic inspired excuses. Stabbing old jewish men bent over in prayer is glorified. A drive by shooting of a tourist and local arab is excused as a fight against the occupation.

Indeed.

Incredibly tiresome and offensive. I'm sure the advertisers who's ads are showing up on this page will be delighted to know that their names are linked to supporters of violence and hate.

I am not a Jew hater. Call me a hater of the current right wing Israeli government who endorse illegal occupation. Call me a hater of the racist supremacist principle Zionism. Call me a hater of extremist Islam. Labels I wear with pride. But I am not anti Semitic. Understand the difference.

The 18 year old was not simply a tourist. He was actively assisisting an illegal army of occupation.

"Ezra Schwartz of Sharon, MA., was on his way to deliver snacks to IDF soldiers with a group classmates when the attack occurred."

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.687313

You have justified the murder of an unarmed 17 year old student on a tourist visa for gap year stay in Israel to pursue education and community service because you "hate" the current government of Israel, and you hate Zionists. That is not an emotionally stable or rational position. What of the 24 year old Arab kid who was murdered in this incident? Was he collateral damage and you send your regrets? Is his life less worthy because he was guilty of non violent co-existence with the "juden"?

It is also evident from those agreeing with you that there are a number of ignorant bigots who share your hate. As it is impossible for anyone who is non violent and rational to reason with someone who espouses violence and admits to being hateful, all I can do is to wait for the inevitable. Your philosophy can only get one so far until the people recognize the infectious disease of hate you espouse, deal with it. It happens. Just ask Saadam Hussein, or Moammar Ghaddaffi. Many African despots have found themselves dealt with in some brutal ways. Mussolinni was hung upside down and the dicator(s) of Romania were quickly executed. That's what the embrace of hatred and violence will get you. You are in need of something more positive to believe in. However, I won't lose sleep over people who are obviously very angry with their station in life, and cling to the crutch of blaming others. May Jesus have pity on you, because I do not.

My hatred of the current Israeli government and the atrocities they commit, and my hatred of racial supremacist, Zionism, are the most rational stands anyone with a social conscience could take.

I suggest you watch the videos on related tvf threads featuring extra judicial killings of unarmed children by the IDF, and express your disgust at that.

I have expressed my sorrow for any innocents in posts above.

Your final paragraph is just a rambling unstable rant expressing some sort of fantasy schadenfreude.

The positive thing I believe in, and motivates me is that one day there will be a just peace in the Middle East, when incidents such as the OP are consigned to the archives. I will be one of the first cracking open the champagne toasting Palestinians and Israelis who have finally seen common sense and are living side by side in peace.

Edited November 21, 2015 by dexterm

[Thorgal]

Islamic terrorists are Islamic terrorists regardless of who the victims are, their false pretexts may differ, their motives are identical. Anyone who condemns the Paris murders but not the murder of Israeli civilians is showing ignorance, cowardice and in many cases antisemitism.

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1448070031.223585.jpg

They are totally different situations.

The Paris atrocity was committed by barbaric religious nut jobs who have a warped interpretaion of Islam.

The killing of illegal Israeli colonists and the IDF is a legitimate response to an army of occupation and those illegal squatters living on stolen Palestinian land, that the army is protecting

Murdering innocent civilians, some of whom were not settlers, some not even Israelis is not in any way legitimate, except to degenerates with the morals of hyenas. By its very nature the indiscriminate targeting of civilians is liable to create victims in no way connected with the so called occupation, as is demonstrated by the deaths of an 18 year old American student and a Palestinian, but still you refuse to condemn random attacks on civilians making you as bad as the terrorists who kill satisfying your own blood lust by proxy.

P.s the Palestinians are not driven by desperation, they are driven by hope, hope of committing genocide, just as Isis are driven by hope of forming a Caliphate and subjugating others to their fascist doctrine.

Being active around IDF, border police, etc in supplying food etc means he was active.

There are so many Israeli international programs and initiatives to encourage overseas young Jews to support the IDF military forces in combatant and non-combatant bases.

http://www.mahal-idf-volunteers.org/links/volunteer.htm

Quote from link :

- Marva : Minimum 8 weeks of exposure to the complexities of the problems and challenges facing the Israeli Army, and the role of the IDF within the framework of Israeli society. Qualification: Jews from overseas, age 18-28. Marva is not part of the IDF.

- Sar-El : Minimum 2 weeks working on IDF bases, packing food, medical supplies and equipment. Sar-El is not part of the IDF.

[Steely Dan]

Lol. I keep seeing the apologists ask why there is no sympathy for the Palestinian who was also murdered.

I have yet to see their sympathy!

I declared the Arab man killed to be equally innocent. Incidentally "apologists" apologizing for what? Israel existing or civilians of whatever background being free to go about their business without being murdered?

[Scott]

An inflammatory post has been removed.

[Jingthing]

Remembering young Ezra Schwartz. A proud American, a proud Jew, a proud supporter of Israel, an unusually short baseball player, clearly a wonderful human being who loved life. On the day he was murdered by a Palestinian terrorist Ezra visited a memorial to three Israeli boys who were are also murdered by Palestinian terrorists.

All murders are tragic, whether by terrorists or not, but if seeing these pictures doesn't pull at your heartstrings, hmm.

http://forward.com/news/325174/9-heartbreaking-pictures-of-ezra-schwartz-the-teen-killed-in-west-bank-terr/?attribution=home-hero-item-text-4

Edited November 21, 2015 by Jingthing

[seedy]

Two Troll / Flaming post removed

[Morch]

And you are quite certain that all the Palestinians can trace their roots back to show "countless" generations of living in the land ? (if that's an acceptable term in the current Newspeak). Fair enough for some of the central families in the more influential clans, I suspect (which is a polite way of saying I know) that some of those who can actually track their family roots that far back would scoff at the peasantry putting up airs.

Where was this sentiment when the West Bank and the Gaza Strip under Jordanian and Egyptian rule? Were those occupations (not to say annexations) right? Does it make killings such as described in the OP more palatable?

Better ask the Jewish Virtual Library where they got their figures from then.

In 1800 Jews formed a mere 8% (24,000) and Palestinians 92% (268,100) of the population.

Even in 1922 after the first waves of Zionist immigration when the first census was taken, Jews were only 11% of the population.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/demograhics.html

The 18 year old was a foreigner aiding the IDF in their occupation, perpetuating what Zionists have been doing for over a 100 years. He knew the risks he was taking and the harm he was doing to the Palestinian residents by being a party to their repression.

Lets try again - not all the Palestinians can trace their ancestry far back. Not all can trace their roots in the area far back. "Countless" is a hyperbole description.

I was making qualifying remarks, on over the top statements. Not a general comment, and was not even comparing it to the Jews. Deflection - failed.

The murdered USA teen was not in Israel to aid the IDF, regardless of your ceaseless spinning attempts. There are many local initiatives were drinks and food are distributed to soldiers, most often at certain crossroads. This is one of them. Blowing it out of proportion is simply trying to divert attention from the murder and to a rather poor attempt do whitewash a Palestinian terrorist attack.

Guess if he was a USA pro-Palestinian activist, or a USA Palestinian participating in a demonstration, you would have been all over the topic denouncing the outrage. As it is..... seems like double-standards mode activated.

And not a word on the other victims, including the Palestinian.

You were the one to introduce the spin and the words "trace your roots". How many indigenous peoples in the world can produce a family tree? Doesn't make them less indigenous.

If Palestinians outnumbered Jews in 1800 according to the Jewish Virtual Library by a huge ratio of 11:1, any sensible person would assume they have been around for a long time. Or were 268,100 Palestinians suddenly somehow transported there in 1800 to accompany the tiny Jewish population of 24,000? That's about 10 generations ago. And if many of the Palestinians in 1800 were descendants of others in the prior 200 years that's another 10 generations...how many do you want before you regard the existing population of Palestinians to be residents by far outnumbering Jews, and so had at least an equal right to live in Palestine, and not in the refugee camps where they have since been ethnically cleansed to?

So you tell me where they came from, and more importantly what happened to their descendants.

Lehi and Irgun were not Freedom Fighters, but were terrorist arms of invading European illegal immigrants, intent on taking away the freedom of the existing Palestinian population, which they have succeeded in doing. The US teen in the OP was assisting the IDF in perpetuating the occupation.That's a very strange and clearly dangerous sort of community service he was encouraged to practise in his gap year. If he was 17 when he started, did his parents know and approve. If he was 18 he's an adult, and fully responsible for his actions.

If it had been a USA pro-Palestinian activist killed I would indeed have been denouncing the outrage. They are fighting occupation, the OP teen was supporting it.

I was very sorry to hear of the Palestinian from Hebron being killed if he were an innocent bystander..I am presuming he was. I have no sympathy for the 51 year old illegal Israeli colonist, apart from common humanity that is tragic when anyone has their life cut short unnaturally. He would have had loved ones too who now grieve for him. I blame the Israeli government for encouraging the occupation.

I have sympathy for the 2 Israeli Jews killed in Tel Aviv. Unless he was deranged, who knows what drove the perp to do it. Violence and rage do not occur in a vacuum. He was from Hebron, scene of many of the recent Israeli extra judicial killings.

The spin and twisting are yours. Seastallion's original comment was "these people LIVED there for countless generations". How is tracing one's roots irrelevant to the original comment? The objection was mainly to the over the top claim, not a rejection of all Palestinian connection and history with the land. People may be called indigenous without resorting to hyperbole. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/872161-us-teen-among-five-dead-in-west-bank-and-tel-aviv-attacks/?p=10101516

Instead of waiving the Jewish virtual library link, one may consider how the numbers correlate with historical events and certain policies taken by the Ottoman Empire. These often had an effect on demographics. Note that the figures do not make distinctions between Palestinian, Bedouins and migrant workers, but simply lump them all together as Muslims. For various reasons, land ownership was a multi-faceted issue under the Ottoman rule. It is not the case that all, or even most, Palestinians can easily demonstrate land ownership by modern standards. Certainly not one going back "countless generations". Again, this is not a rejection of the Palestinian's right for self-determination or of their right, as a people, to the land. It simply rejects the incorrect notions some posters advertise as gospel.

And another spin and twist attempt - I did not claim that the Lehi or the Irgun were Freedom Fighters, check my posting history and you'll see them described as terrorist organizations. The point made was that calling them terrorists on the one hand, and insisting on dubbing Palestinian terrorists as Freedom Fighters is just another instance of applying double standards.

Give your over the top descriptions of the murdered USA teen a rest - one might think his actions are tantamount to a war-crime, no less. Some proportions would make your position less ridiculous. Same goes for blanket justification of foreign citizens involvement in political activities when it suits your agenda. Sounds like anyone not in line with your version of the Palestinian narrative is fair game. Once again, double standards.

Amazingly (or not), even a simple rejection of murder needs to be qualified and explained away at every turn - "if he were an innocent bystander", "I blame the Israeli government", "unless he was deranged, who knows what drove the perp to do it", "he was from Hebron".... Pathetic.

[Morch]

I think it is pretty disgusting that Netanyahu has tried to score poiltical points by conflating the killing of the teenager with unrelated events in Paris in order to whitewash the very essence of the Palestinian Israeli conflict...the occupation.

In a Facebook post, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu expressed his sympathy to the families of the victims. "Behind these terrorist attacks stands radical Islam, which seeks to destroy us, the same radical Islam that struck in Paris and threatens all of Europe," he said

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.687313

Yeah, but since you're currently deep in your double-standards zone, probably didn't have as many issues with the Swedish Foreign Minister tying the Paris attacks to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Of course, she had different notions than Netanyahu, so should be alright in your "book".

The only mention the Swedish Foreign Minister made was that it was easier to radicalize young Muslims when they see the west turning a blind eye to anti Muslim atrocities such as those committed by Israel.

Netanyahu and his Foreign Ministry Director-General Dore Gold had better get their stories straight.

“During the conversation, Dr. Gold harshly criticized the hurtful remarks by the Swedish minister and said any connection between Islamic State terror and the Palestinian issue is baseless" ...the exact opposite of what Netanyahu said above

https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/54266/after-paris-terror-sweden-and-abbass-palestinian-factions-point-finger-at-israel/#uJzItteezqbFdfcW.99

So when Wallström attempts to make a connection in order to support her political views (which coincide with yours), this is an acceptable and legitimate behavior, whereas Netanyahu's comments are defined as "disgusting" and trying to "score political points". To be clear, I think, they are both cynical politicians, so no big expectations from either. Then again, most statements by politicians and office holders regarding the attacks were aimed at scoring political points and furthering political agendas.

[Morch]

Islamic terrorists are Islamic terrorists regardless of who the victims are, their false pretexts may differ, their motives are identical. Anyone who condemns the Paris murders but not the murder of Israeli civilians is showing ignorance, cowardice and in many cases antisemitism.

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1448070031.223585.jpg

They are totally different situations.

The Paris atrocity was committed by barbaric religious nut jobs who have a warped interpretaion of Islam.

The killing of illegal Israeli colonists and the IDF is a legitimate response to an army of occupation and those illegal squatters living on stolen Palestinian land, that the army is protecting

One of the main justifications for the current Palestinian violence relates to rumors regarding supposed Israeli nefarious intentions for the al Aqsa.

Now spin this is not being Islamic related.

The current topic does not detail any attacks on the IDF. Among the casualties, are one Palestinian and two Israeli civilians in Tel Aviv.

Now spin this is being a legitimate response to the occupation.

[Jingthing]

Yes they are both different situations, of course, but both situations definitely do involve Islamic Jihadist ideology. Of course!

[Morch]

Islamic terrorists are Islamic terrorists regardless of who the victims are, their false pretexts may differ, their motives are identical. Anyone who condemns the Paris murders but not the murder of Israeli civilians is showing ignorance, cowardice and in many cases antisemitism.

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1448070031.223585.jpg

Don't try to conflate Islamic terrorism with freedom fighters and oppressed people driven to desperation.

Just as Netanyahu was doing, you're trying to demonise with the "Islamic terrorist" label people who are certainly not Islamic terrorists such as ISIS.

Ignorant people try to do the same with the Southern Thailand Muslims.

If it's out of ignorance, then sorry for your lack of knowledge, but if it's deliberate false demonisation such as what Netanyahu did, it's sheer lies and contemptible.

So there is absolutely no use of religious themes as justification for the current Palestinian violence? Nothing at all about al-Aqsa being in danger? No Islamic leaders quoting the usual hateful bits to incite violence?

That the Palestinians, on the whole, do not exhibit much support for the Islamic State, does not mean that their own rhetoric and violence are free from radical Islamic influences.

Blanket description of all Palestinian violence as politically motivated, rather than religious, or as freedom fighting rather than terrorism - is about as absurd as making all of the Palestinians into Islamic State advocates.

[Morch]

My hatred of the current Israeli government and the atrocities they commit, and my hatred of racial supremacist, Zionism, are the most rational stands anyone with a social conscience could take.

I suggest you watch the videos on related tvf threads featuring extra judicial killings of unarmed children by the IDF, and express your disgust at that.

I have expressed my sorrow for any innocents in posts above.

Your final paragraph is just a rambling unstable rant expressing some sort of fantasy schadenfreude.

The positive thing I believe in, and motivates me is that one day there will be a just peace in the Middle East, when incidents such as the OP are consigned to the archives. I will be one of the first cracking open the champagne toasting Palestinians and Israelis who have finally seen common sense and are living side by side in peace.

One way or another, the conclusion of your positions ultimately arrives at defining most Israelis as "supremacist", "racist" and perhaps a couple more unflattering descriptions. This is based on the misguided notion that any instance of Zionism corresponds to a radical narrow interpretation. Holding such a view essentially rejects the majority of the Israeli public, without actually making the effort to differentiate between schools of thought. And no, claiming fringe extreme left to be a valid alternative representation is nothing but a fig leaf.

Unsurprisingly, the very same attitude is rejected when others apply it to the Palestinians or Muslims in general. May want to take a page from your own "book" - "Don't prejudge people you have not even met. Take people as you find them on an individual basis. Room enough for all of us on the planet without all this xenophobia." http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/870964-australia-minister-dutton-rejects-mps-call-for-middle-east-refugee-ban/?p=10084986

On the face of it, blanket justifications of violence, absolution from any accountability and wrongdoing, are not in line with the proclaimed ideals some claim to uphold. For those wishing to look at it from a different angle - declaring all members of a group (in this case, Palestinians) automatically relieved of responsibility to any wrongdoing, is just the same "don't prejudge people you have not even met...etc", turned backwards.

Who will you crack your champagne with? Doubt most Israelis, regardless of how the conflict is resolved, will have warm feelings with respect to your view of Israel or Israelis, and many Palestinian are not really that appreciative of foreigners taking up their cause. Most Palestinians abstain, by the way, at least formally.

[Morch]

Being active around IDF, border police, etc in supplying food etc means he was active.

There are so many Israeli international programs and initiatives to encourage overseas young Jews to support the IDF military forces in combatant and non-combatant bases.

http://www.mahal-idf-volunteers.org/links/volunteer.htm

Quote from link :

- Marva : Minimum 8 weeks of exposure to the complexities of the problems and challenges facing the Israeli Army, and the role of the IDF within the framework of Israeli society. Qualification: Jews from overseas, age 18-28. Marva is not part of the IDF.

- Sar-El : Minimum 2 weeks working on IDF bases, packing food, medical supplies and equipment. Sar-El is not part of the IDF.

Spin away....

There is actually quite accurate information regarding the relevant program (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masa_Israel_Journey), the relevant place of study (http://www.ashreinu.org.il), and the purpose of his trip to the place where he was murdered - visiting the memorial statue for the three teens kidnapped and murdered on June 2014. As far as I understand the snacks to IDF thing, was more about visiting so-called "lone soldiers" (mainly new immigrants without a family in country), hardly amounts to sustaining the whole Israeli occupation single handed. To head off expected silliness - one may run across an image of the murdered USA teen in what looks like IDF fatigues, this is accounted for by the institute running a First Aid, S&R program (not military).

[dexterm]

My hatred of the current Israeli government and the atrocities they commit, and my hatred of racial supremacist, Zionism, are the most rational stands anyone with a social conscience could take.

I suggest you watch the videos on related tvf threads featuring extra judicial killings of unarmed children by the IDF, and express your disgust at that.

I have expressed my sorrow for any innocents in posts above.

Your final paragraph is just a rambling unstable rant expressing some sort of fantasy schadenfreude.

The positive thing I believe in, and motivates me is that one day there will be a just peace in the Middle East, when incidents such as the OP are consigned to the archives. I will be one of the first cracking open the champagne toasting Palestinians and Israelis who have finally seen common sense and are living side by side in peace.

One way or another, the conclusion of your positions ultimately arrives at defining most Israelis as "supremacist", "racist" and perhaps a couple more unflattering descriptions. This is based on the misguided notion that any instance of Zionism corresponds to a radical narrow interpretation. Holding such a view essentially rejects the majority of the Israeli public, without actually making the effort to differentiate between schools of thought. And no, claiming fringe extreme left to be a valid alternative representation is nothing but a fig leaf.

Unsurprisingly, the very same attitude is rejected when others apply it to the Palestinians or Muslims in general. May want to take a page from your own "book" - "Don't prejudge people you have not even met. Take people as you find them on an individual basis. Room enough for all of us on the planet without all this xenophobia." http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/870964-australia-minister-dutton-rejects-mps-call-for-middle-east-refugee-ban/?p=10084986

On the face of it, blanket justifications of violence, absolution from any accountability and wrongdoing, are not in line with the proclaimed ideals some claim to uphold. For those wishing to look at it from a different angle - declaring all members of a group (in this case, Palestinians) automatically relieved of responsibility to any wrongdoing, is just the same "don't prejudge people you have not even met...etc", turned backwards.

Who will you crack your champagne with? Doubt most Israelis, regardless of how the conflict is resolved, will have warm feelings with respect to your view of Israel or Israelis, and many Palestinian are not really that appreciative of foreigners taking up their cause. Most Palestinians abstain, by the way, at least formally.

I will crack open the champagne with my best American friend who is Jewish, but is not a Zionist.

He is an American born Jew who could if he wished simply because of his religion get on a plane to Tel Aviv, be warmly welcomed, offered citizenship, financial assistance, and subsidized housing in an illegal West Bank colony.

Whereas Palestinians who still hold the keys to their own homes from which they were ethnically cleansed within Israel decades ago are living in refugee camps and are not allowed to return contrary to the Geneva Convention.

That is the racial supremacy of Zionism that I object to, and if you agree with Zionism, then I despise you too. If that means the majority of Israelis, then I despise their racism also.

I don't like racists; I don't like bullies.

The 18 year was clearly aiding soldiers in their occupation, and was in a war zone. You are trying to spin that into innocent tourism.

Edited November 22, 2015 by dexterm

[Seastallion]

Islamic terrorists are Islamic terrorists regardless of who the victims are, their false pretexts may differ, their motives are identical. Anyone who condemns the Paris murders but not the murder of Israeli civilians is showing ignorance, cowardice and in many cases antisemitism.

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1448070031.223585.jpg

They are totally different situations.

The Paris atrocity was committed by barbaric religious nut jobs who have a warped interpretaion of Islam.

The killing of illegal Israeli colonists and the IDF is a legitimate response to an army of occupation and those illegal squatters living on stolen Palestinian land, that the army is protecting

One of the main justifications for the current Palestinian violence relates to rumors regarding supposed Israeli nefarious intentions for the al Aqsa.

Now spin this is not being Islamic related.

The current topic does not detail any attacks on the IDF. Among the casualties, are one Palestinian and two Israeli civilians in Tel Aviv.

Now spin this is being a legitimate response to the occupation.

I'll just try to spin it out of where you've spun it.

"Islamic", when talking about terrorists, refers to the extreme Muslims, so called jihadis. "Islamic" can indeed be used in it's tamer form to refer to the religion in general. These days, "Islamist" can NOT be used for "Muslim".

You conflate the two simply by the fact that there is a mosque involved.

[Thorgal]

Remembering young Ezra Schwartz. A proud American, a proud Jew, a proud supporter of Israel, an unusually short baseball player, clearly a wonderful human being who loved life. On the day he was murdered by a Palestinian terrorist Ezra visited a memorial to three Israeli boys who were are also murdered by Palestinian terrorists.

All murders are tragic, whether by terrorists or not, but if seeing these pictures doesn't pull at your heartstrings, hmm.

screen-shot-2015-11-20-at-105438-am-1448034979.png

http://forward.com/news/325174/9-heartbreaking-pictures-of-ezra-schwartz-the-teen-killed-in-west-bank-terr/?attribution=home-hero-item-text-4

You could also name Gilad Shalit, a French-Israeli IDF soldier who was taken as hostage by Hamas.

In fact, he was just a simple corporal.

But his father who was a simple employee of the Israeli government went so far to meet in person : Netanyahu, Merkel, Sarkozy and Kofi Annan.

After his release Gilad Shalit was laureated as honorary citizen of Paris, Rome, Miami, New Orleans, Baltimore, and Pittsburg. Most cities he never visited before his abduction.

Although both Gilad Shalit and the US volunteer from OP were having dual citizenship, they were in a war zone and became unfortunately useful for the Israeli double standards media circus...

Edited November 22, 2015 by Thorgal

[up-country_sinclair]

The 18 year was clearly aiding soldiers in their occupation, and was in a war zone. You are trying to spin that into innocent tourism.

This is undeniable, yet our resident spinmeisters for the occupiers are trying to use the diversionary tactics that worked so well for them in the past. Sorry, but those days are over.

Remembering young Ezra Schwartz. A proud American, a proud Jew, a proud supporter of Israel, an unusually short baseball player, clearly a wonderful human being who loved life. On the day he was murdered by a Palestinian terrorist Ezra visited a memorial to three Israeli boys who were are also murdered by Palestinian terrorists.

All murders are tragic, whether by terrorists or not, but if seeing these pictures doesn't pull at your heartstrings, hmm.

screen-shot-2015-11-20-at-105438-am-1448034979.png

http://forward.com/news/325174/9-heartbreaking-pictures-of-ezra-schwartz-the-teen-killed-in-west-bank-terr/?attribution=home-hero-item-text-4

You could also name Gilad Shalit, a French-Israeli IDF soldier who was taken as hostage by Hamas.

In fact, he was just a simple corporal.

But his father who was a simple employee of the Israeli government went so far to meet in person : Netanyahu, Merkel, Sarkozy and Kofi Annan.

After his release Gilad Shalit was laureated as honorary citizen of Paris, Rome, Miami, New Orleans, Baltimore, and Pittsburg. Most cities he never visited before his abduction.

Although both Gilad Shalit and the US volunteer from OP were having dual citizenship, they were in a war zone and became unfortunately useful for the Israeli double standards media circus...

Actually, the occupiers and their apologists tried to spin his capture as a "kidnapping". That was the specific word they repeatedly used. How in god's name can a soldier be kidnapped? It's almost as absurd as claiming a man providing support to an occupying force in a war zone is "murdered".

[dave_boo]

The 18 year was clearly aiding soldiers in their occupation, and was in a war zone. You are trying to spin that into innocent tourism.

This is undeniable, yet our resident spinmeisters for the occupiers are trying to use the diversionary tactics that worked so well for them in the past. Sorry, but those days are over.

Remembering young Ezra Schwartz. A proud American, a proud Jew, a proud supporter of Israel, an unusually short baseball player, clearly a wonderful human being who loved life. On the day he was murdered by a Palestinian terrorist Ezra visited a memorial to three Israeli boys who were are also murdered by Palestinian terrorists.

All murders are tragic, whether by terrorists or not, but if seeing these pictures doesn't pull at your heartstrings, hmm.

screen-shot-2015-11-20-at-105438-am-1448034979.png

http://forward.com/news/325174/9-heartbreaking-pictures-of-ezra-schwartz-the-teen-killed-in-west-bank-terr/?attribution=home-hero-item-text-4

You could also name Gilad Shalit, a French-Israeli IDF soldier who was taken as hostage by Hamas.

In fact, he was just a simple corporal.

But his father who was a simple employee of the Israeli government went so far to meet in person : Netanyahu, Merkel, Sarkozy and Kofi Annan.

After his release Gilad Shalit was laureated as honorary citizen of Paris, Rome, Miami, New Orleans, Baltimore, and Pittsburg. Most cities he never visited before his abduction.

Although both Gilad Shalit and the US volunteer from OP were having dual citizenship, they were in a war zone and became unfortunately useful for the Israeli double standards media circus...

Actually, the occupiers and their apologists tried to spin his capture as a "kidnapping". That was the specific word they repeatedly used. How in god's name can a soldier be kidnapped? It's almost as absurd as claiming a man providing support to an occupying force in a war zone is "murdered".

Amazing how the pro-"Palestinians" always want to cry about international law and how they assume Israel is abusing it...and yet they are so wilfully ignorant of the said law.

It's right there on the ICRC website.

https://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/Article.xsp?action=openDocument&documentId=A4E145A2A7A68875C12563CD0051B9AE

So yes, he was kidnapped and used as a hostage contra section (.

As the people murdered by that monster were not taking an active part in hostilities, it's quite clear per section (a) that they were murdered.

Of course pointing out "Palestinian" crimes against humanity seems like a pointless exercise. Seems like there is mostly two camps of thought; there are those apologist who assume a death for a house attitude and there are those anti-"Palestinians" who just assume that's all they can do. Both reduce the people down to absurd caricatures and do nothing to promote peace.

**edit**

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

Edited November 22, 2015 by dave_boo

[uptheos]

Really, occupied West Bank? It's not the sort of place I'd want my teenage son to go for tourism.

First out of the traps again on an Israel thread......really, how do you do it?

[seedy]

Two Troll / Flaming post removed

[DaddyWarbucks]

Really, occupied West Bank? It's not the sort of place I'd want my teenage son to go for tourism.

First out of the traps again on an Israel thread......really, how do you do it?

I'd like to know how he does it too.

His intelligent posts are almost always factual and well-considered.

Their veracity can't be challenged, so the resident Zionists on the forum resort to snarky personal insults.

[Seastallion]

<snip>

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

And yet, the outrage at one Jewish teenager dying is about a hundred-fold more than the collective deaths of hundreds of Palestinian children from you and your co-apologists.

There is a huge difference, too. Ezra had a choice to be where he was. Palestinian toddlers do/did not.

[dave_boo]

<snip>

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

And yet, the outrage at one Jewish teenager dying is about a hundred-fold more than the collective deaths of hundreds of Palestinian children from you and your co-apologists.

There is a huge difference, too. Ezra had a choice to be where he was. Palestinian toddlers do/did not.

Please quote my post where I did not afford the "Palestinian" deaths the same compassion as the Jewish.

So let me get this right...since he was traveling in an area that the Palestinians didn't want him in...and he was feeding the soldiers...that makes him an acceptable 'casualty'?

And how does that differ than the needless deaths on the "Palestinian" side?

[Jingthing]

He was a religious Jew and there are places of interest to religious Jews in Judea and Samaria. Israel demonizers may not want to visit there except to show solidarity with Jew seeking rock throwing, knife wielding, and car ramming "freedom fighters" (TERRORISTS actually) but this boy was not there with any kind of weapon. He was murdered by a terrorist. Period. End of.

The Israel demonization agenda is so transparent. Imagine the attention that would paid to this conflict by the very same obsessive demonization movement if the sides in conflict were both Arabs. You wouldn't hear a peep. Their issue is about Jews being in that region period, in ANY borders, and the BS propaganda about "European colonization" as if Jews in Israel was anything at all similar to Belgians in the Congo.

Edited November 22, 2015 by Jingthing

[dexterm]

<snip>

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

And yet, the outrage at one Jewish teenager dying is about a hundred-fold more than the collective deaths of hundreds of Palestinian children from you and your co-apologists.

There is a huge difference, too. Ezra had a choice to be where he was. Palestinian toddlers do/did not.

Please quote my post where I did not afford the "Palestinian" deaths the same compassion as the Jewish.

So let me get this right...since he was traveling in an area that the Palestinians didn't want him in...and he was feeding the soldiers...that makes him an acceptable 'casualty'?

And how does that differ than the needless deaths on the "Palestinian" side?

Tha Palestinian as far as I know was an innocent bystander, the 18 year old American was not. However much spin you put on it, he was there assisting the IDF in their occupation.

[dave_boo]

<snip>

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

And yet, the outrage at one Jewish teenager dying is about a hundred-fold more than the collective deaths of hundreds of Palestinian children from you and your co-apologists.

There is a huge difference, too. Ezra had a choice to be where he was. Palestinian toddlers do/did not.

Please quote my post where I did not afford the "Palestinian" deaths the same compassion as the Jewish.

So let me get this right...since he was traveling in an area that the Palestinians didn't want him in...and he was feeding the soldiers...that makes him an acceptable 'casualty'?

And how does that differ than the needless deaths on the "Palestinian" side?

Tha Palestinian as far as I know was an innocent bystander, the 18 year old American was not. However much spin you put on it, he was there assisting the IDF in their occupation.

You didn't address all my questions.

We get the fact that you celebrate the guy's death. You're happy that he was in the 'wrong' place doing the 'wrong' thing and was murdered for that.

Now kindly answer the second part of my post. When Hamas indiscriminately fires rockets into Israel proper, is Israel morally right for wiping out the whole family of the Hamas person(s)? After all they are helping Hamas shoot rockets at civilians.

[dave_boo]

I also would like to know why pro-"Palestinian" posters edit quoted posts (in clear violation of forum rules) and wilfully ignore valid questions about their stances. It's almost like they're shouting a mantra trying to drown out what they believe is the opposition.

[Seastallion]

<snip>

I know that there are some who will say that merely feeding someone is taking an active role. Are they sure that they want to claim that? Because if so, Israel bombing a house full of people who live with Hamas commanders is completely justified then....

And yet, the outrage at one Jewish teenager dying is about a hundred-fold more than the collective deaths of hundreds of Palestinian children from you and your co-apologists.

There is a huge difference, too. Ezra had a choice to be where he was. Palestinian toddlers do/did not.

Please quote my post where I did not afford the "Palestinian" deaths the same compassion as the Jewish.

So let me get this right...since he was traveling in an area that the Palestinians didn't want him in...and he was feeding the soldiers...that makes him an acceptable 'casualty'?

And how does that differ than the needless deaths on the "Palestinian" side?

Seriously? Quote the post where you didn't afford the same compassion?

How about all of your posts?

[dexterm]

He was a religious Jew and there are places of interest to religious Jews in Judea and Samaria. Israel demonizers may not want to visit there except to show solidarity with Jew seeking rock throwing, knife wielding, and car ramming "freedom fighters" (TERRORISTS actually) but this boy was not there with any kind of weapon. He was murdered by a terrorist. Period. End of.

The Israel demonization agenda is so transparent. Imagine the attention that would paid to this conflict by the very same obsessive demonization movement if the sides in conflict were both Arabs. You wouldn't hear a peep. Their issue is about Jews being in that region period, in ANY borders, and the BS propaganda about "European colonization" as if Jews in Israel was anything at all similar to Belgians in the Congo.

The early Zionist immigrants probably did get the idea from European colonists. They can do it, and get away with it, why can't we? They had considered other places such as Argentina, northern Australia,and Uganda among others.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposals_for_a_Jewish_state

And like other European colonists they probably didn't think twice that there were other peoples already resident there..they are just natives, invisible men.

Maybe there were some Zionists who genuinely wanted to bring prosperity to the region and share their wealth and know how with the locals, just as other European colonists elsewhere thought they were bringing civilization and God's words to the heathens. There were other Zionistss who had no intention of doing so and realized that the locals had to go by ethnic cleansing,bribery, or manipulating foreign powers if they were to become a Jewish majority in their own state.

Zionists simply chose their run at colonialism about 100 years too late, at the worst of possible moment just as Palestinian nationalism was increasing. And that conflict continues today.

Through their superior wealth, know how, technology, weapons, organization and international political influence, the mainly European Zionists have been victorious ...so far. But it ain't over yet.

Just because the bully wins does not make it right.

One day history will come full circle and Israel/Palestine will become a multicultural society, probably invited to join the EU where they will all be able to work, worship and live in each other's present lands in peace and prosperity. that's my dream. I hope it happens in my lifetime.

Edited November 22, 2015 by dexterm