Uninsured foreigners burdens Thai public hospitals

[chiang mai]

Make it mandatory for tourist and long stay foreigners to have insurance. No insurance no visa. Sounds reasonable to me. Its just bad of all those foreigners skipping on their hospital bills.

Maybe the government can set up an insurance for foreigners, if not too bad. I am insured.. sure its expensive but at least I have a peace of mind.

In previous topics all the older foreigners are moaning because the premium is so high, that bad for them (and me in future) but not a reason to let the Thai taxpayer pay the bill for their hospital costs. No insurance.. no visa.

And what if I and others want to self insure instead of lining the pockets of the insurance companies?

Then you must put B 5 million into a fixed savings account and provide them with proof.

That's what I've already done.

[jspill]

You don't have to have it either -- you just have to convince your Embassy that you do.

Hopefully not too many retirees are making these false declarations for visa extensions and potentially making things harder for the rest of us tourist visa holders.

[uptheos]

Just allow foreigner's to participate in the country's 30 baht medical universal coverage program by paying a fair fee. Most Thai's don't pay any income taxes and therefore don't provide funds to pay for govt services such as the free health care provides under the 30 baht program...as least a farang would be paying the fee which is more than a Thai pays.

There is a scheme to provide migrant workers with healthcare which is a necessary as leaving their ailments untreated is a threat to Thais and to employers. I think the workers are in the social security scheme adn their non-working families are in the Universal scheme. I agree some form of paid for insurance linked to public hospitals is a good idea. The EU requires visa applicants to have health insurance. So why not require foreigners applying for visas to have it too? Requiring it from visitors coming on transit visas is impractical, as it would create queues at Immigration but no reason not to promote it and sell it at counters in airport arrival halls. Getting widespread sales to people who don't claim would be important to keep the costs down.

Right, but most are trying to get to countries that have it, but costs them nothing.

[Mr Money Bags]

I recently obtained a Tourist Visa for my upcoming trip to Belarus. One of the many conditions was evidence of travel insurance coverage within Belarus.

Perhaps other countries should follow suit......

You're Welcome!!

Travel insurance is short term usually. The issue of "proving" that you have insurance is tricky. Anyone can copy an old policy, change the dates and print it anew. How will the inspecting immigration officer check it?

It's all taken care of during the complicated visa application process. Before your visa is approved, they contact the insurance company whose details you have provided, and verify the existence of pre-paid coverage. The immigration officer in Belarus doesn't need to verify anything.

Personally, I can't imagine traveling to a foreign land without proper coverage......

You're Welcome!!

[perdido]

...or Thailand should get a free NHS service like U.K.

[jpinx]

I recently obtained a Tourist Visa for my upcoming trip to Belarus. One of the many conditions was evidence of travel insurance coverage within Belarus.

Perhaps other countries should follow suit......

You're Welcome!!

Travel insurance is short term usually. The issue of "proving" that you have insurance is tricky. Anyone can copy an old policy, change the dates and print it anew. How will the inspecting immigration officer check it?

It's all taken care of during the complicated visa application process. Before your visa is approved, they contact the insurance company whose details you have provided, and verify the existence of pre-paid coverage. The immigration officer in Belarus doesn't need to verify anything.

Personally, I can't imagine traveling to a foreign land without proper coverage......

You're Welcome!!

Well,,, we're talking about Thailand here - so the question remains -- how does a hard-pressed immigration officer check an insurance policy for someone arriving without a visa.?

[TonyHanscomb]

No mention of the Non tax paying thais doing the same thing I want to see the figures for Thais not paying I bet its a lot more than foreigners.

[Mr Money Bags]

I recently obtained a Tourist Visa for my upcoming trip to Belarus. One of the many conditions was evidence of travel insurance coverage within Belarus.

Perhaps other countries should follow suit......

You're Welcome!!

Travel insurance is short term usually. The issue of "proving" that you have insurance is tricky. Anyone can copy an old policy, change the dates and print it anew. How will the inspecting immigration officer check it?

It's all taken care of during the complicated visa application process. Before your visa is approved, they contact the insurance company whose details you have provided, and verify the existence of pre-paid coverage. The immigration officer in Belarus doesn't need to verify anything.

Personally, I can't imagine traveling to a foreign land without proper coverage......

You're Welcome!!

Well,,, we're talking about Thailand here - so the question remains -- how does a hard-pressed immigration officer check an insurance policy for someone arriving without a visa.?

I apologize unreservedly for being unclear. My intent was to communicate that the time might be here to adopt a far more strict system, such as that used by Belarus.

I know, Baby Steps......

You're Welcome!!

[uptheos]

I recently obtained a Tourist Visa for my upcoming trip to Belarus. One of the many conditions was evidence of travel insurance coverage within Belarus.

Perhaps other countries should follow suit......

You're Welcome!!

Travel insurance is short term usually. The issue of "proving" that you have insurance is tricky. Anyone can copy an old policy, change the dates and print it anew. How will the inspecting immigration officer check it?

It's all taken care of during the complicated visa application process. Before your visa is approved, they contact the insurance company whose details you have provided, and verify the existence of pre-paid coverage. The immigration officer in Belarus doesn't need to verify anything.

Personally, I can't imagine traveling to a foreign land without proper coverage......

You're Welcome!!

Well,,, we're talking about Thailand here - so the question remains -- how does a hard-pressed immigration officer check an insurance policy for someone arriving without a visa.?

It was bedlam last Saturday morning coming into Swampy from UK.

Airlines from other countries arrived early too.

I can just imagine immigration checking the validity of a persons travel

insurance documents, most of which need the 'small print; reading to

know if the person is covered or not.

[billd766]

How many times has this old chestnut been roasted? Getting medical insurance is perfectly possible (ask Sheryl) even for 90-year-olds - see threads I referenced above.

www.CignaGlobal.com

Charging 30/40/50 baht per head at the airport is ridiculous since some people only stay a week and others 3 months or a lot more. Asking already hard-pressed immigration offices to check incomers medical insurance is equally ridiculous. Check against what database, format, standards? It is actually CHEAPER for Thailand to pay the bill in the cases where the farang can't/won't pay,,,,,

I have just got an online quote from Cigna.

Their cheapest rate plan, Silver, comes to £341.01 per month or a little over 17,000 thb per month or 204.606 thb per year using 50thb/£1 as an exchange rate.

The Gold plan is £426,27 or 21,310 thb per month and 255,760 thb per year.

The Platinum plan is £532.83 or 26,640 thb pcm and 319,700 thb per year.

As a quick follow up to this post I got a phone call about 6 pm from Cigna in Scotland.

The guy did offer a reduced premium if I wanted to carry a larger excess myself but when I explained that 10 years ago I had 2 stents put in he suggested that perhaps it not be a good idea for Cigna to insure me.

A very nice friendly guy but if you tell the truth to the insurance companies that you have had a pre-existing condition you become a high riskand they won't touch you except for a VERY high premium. If on the other hand you don't tell them and they accept you then you have another operation similar to the one you had before and they find out your insurance will become null and void and YOU may face the whole bill at your own expense.

10 years ago I has 2 stents put in at the BKK International hospital (private) and the total bill was around 250,000 baht which was about 150,000baht less than Bumrungrad.

[Jools]

When the government FORCES coverage of all expats regardless of age at a fair price (Ecuador's coverage is about 70 USD a month) then situations like this will cease to exist. The continuing fraud of "pre-existing conditions" and "no coverage after age sixty" needs to END. The current system merely guarantees that insurance companies will never have to live up to their agreements. Meanwhile, the best hospitals are allowed to soak farang patients on the premise that "farang rich, him can afford". My quote from Cigna was 570 dollars a month. I am 65 and have had cancer and brain surgery. 570 USD a month is unconscionable when costs are so low. (assuming you aren't charged more for being non-Thai)

Government hospitals charge a fraction of the extortionate private hospitals, I use them, and never fail to pay the final bill.
Why doesn't the Government, or a company within Thailand, introduce an insurance for people restricted to using public hospitals only ?
I am sure the premiums would be a lot more affordable for people here.
With regards to making it compulsory for arrivals to have insurance, this would be impossible to police. With modern technology, it is not rocket science to forge a bill head,from an overseas insurance company, quoting a blag policy number, indicating that the person is insured. Proving that every document people show on arriving is genuine would be impossible.

[HenryB]

mandatory comprehensive insurance for expats over 65 for private hospitals to cover everything without huge Deductible will be at least 80,000 baht a month

Good lucky selling that to Thai Visa Members

[jpinx]

...or Thailand should get a free NHS service like U.K.

Absolutely -- but that depends on everyone paying their taxes.......

[thaiduncankk]

Why do foreigners who marry civil servants or government officials get accepted into the Government scheme ?

Surely, if they can use the system, why not admit others who are single, or married to women with no government attachment.

[uptheos]

mandatory comprehensive insurance for expats over 65 for private hospitals to cover everything without huge Deductible will be at least 80,000 baht a month

Good lucky selling that to Thai Visa Members

And over 70 even if you are a fit 70, you can add another 20-40 K

[thaiduncankk]

Just allow foreigner's to participate in the country's 30 baht medical universal coverage program by paying a fair fee. Most Thai's don't pay any income taxes and therefore don't provide funds to pay for govt services such as the free health care provides under the 30 baht program...as least a farang would be paying the fee which is more than a Thai pays.

I am 79 and am in the 30 bt scheme-------- never had to use it but according to you we (Farangs ) are not entitled---------------- Am I wasting my money ?????????

You must be married to someone who works for the Government, if not, you will find that the card has expired, and not renewable.

And when they were issued, the total cost was 2,800 baht, inclusive of a compulsory medical.

[chiang mai]

How many times has this old chestnut been roasted? Getting medical insurance is perfectly possible (ask Sheryl) even for 90-year-olds - see threads I referenced above.

www.CignaGlobal.com

Charging 30/40/50 baht per head at the airport is ridiculous since some people only stay a week and others 3 months or a lot more. Asking already hard-pressed immigration offices to check incomers medical insurance is equally ridiculous. Check against what database, format, standards? It is actually CHEAPER for Thailand to pay the bill in the cases where the farang can't/won't pay,,,,,

I have just got an online quote from Cigna.

Their cheapest rate plan, Silver, comes to £341.01 per month or a little over 17,000 thb per month or 204.606 thb per year using 50thb/£1 as an exchange rate.

The Gold plan is £426,27 or 21,310 thb per month and 255,760 thb per year.

The Platinum plan is £532.83 or 26,640 thb pcm and 319,700 thb per year.

As a quick follow up to this post I got a phone call about 6 pm from Cigna in Scotland.

The guy did offer a reduced premium if I wanted to carry a larger excess myself but when I explained that 10 years ago I had 2 stents put in he suggested that perhaps it not be a good idea for Cigna to insure me.

A very nice friendly guy but if you tell the truth to the insurance companies that you have had a pre-existing condition you become a high riskand they won't touch you except for a VERY high premium. If on the other hand you don't tell them and they accept you then you have another operation similar to the one you had before and they find out your insurance will become null and void and YOU may face the whole bill at your own expense.

10 years ago I has 2 stents put in at the BKK International hospital (private) and the total bill was around 250,000 baht which was about 150,000baht less than Bumrungrad.

The difference being medicated vs bare metal stents.

[JLCrab]

You don't have to have it either -- you just have to convince your Embassy that you do.

Hopefully not too many retirees are making these false declarations for visa extensions and potentially making things harder for the rest of us tourist visa holders.

There probably are too many some making false declarations on extensions and others on their tourist visa applications.

[Eagle60]

If you go out with a bunch of people and one guy continually does not buy his round and never chips in...does it not annoy you ? If you expect to live in a country and enjoy the facilities, pay for it. Put in something. Its the same issue that is causing so much angst in Europe with people who have put nothing in, but getting all the benefits they do not pay for at the expense of those that do. Its fundamentally not right. If you go to a foreign country have insurance and I think one learns this at aged 18 or before. If you can afford the ticket, hotels and drinking and eating...why can't you pay for adequate insurance and not expect others to pay for you. It ain't rocket science and and sure as hell is not unfair. Why should hospitals pay for people who do not take out insurance. I think its time people took some responsibility and grew a set. Acted like adults not kids who take everything for granted. Get insurance, it is hardly difficult or expensive when coming on holiday. If you can't afford it, then don't come.

[F4UCorsair]

Most of these hospitals are grossly expensive as all of them love to overcharge.

Irrelevant. These jerks aren't paying anything toward the bill.

Are you suggesting that if the hospital halved the cost that it would be paid?? No chance

More foreign creeps sponging on another country's public health system.

[weegee]

Well isnt it just Tit for Tat?....How many thais that travel overseas get all that free medical treatment from most countries...they certainly wouldnt be adding up all the bills and whinging about it would they?...They just get on with looking after the Patient, payment or not...

[stevenl]

Most of these hospitals are grossly expensive as all of them love to overcharge.

Not true. We're talking public hospitals here, which are cheap as chips.

[F4UCorsair]

No mention of the Non tax paying thais doing the same thing I want to see the figures for Thais not paying I bet its a lot more than foreigners.

What's the ratio of Thai nationals to foreigners in Thailand. Of course there would be many times more Thais, but it is THEIR country and public health system.

[chiang mai]

You talk about overcharging but I'm not sure they do, if they do, compared to where, other hospitals in Thailand or other parts of the Western world? I had a PCI eight years ago, a balloon and cardiac stent at Bumrungrad of all places, it cost me 175,000 baht, the Squires Group in the UK wanted 14,000 POUNDS plus travel plus hotel plus plus.

Last year my wife had her gall bladder removed at the Provincial Hospital but as a private patient, it cost 16,000 baht.

I've had MRI's done on a walk in basis that have cost 10/12k baht, had an endoscopy/gastroscopy done at a private hospital and it cost 2,000 baht.

Those things are not expensive or does everyone else think they are?

Bump?

Note: the endoscopy cost should read 20,000 baht not 2,000, apologies.

[peteregion]

Wake up Thailand your people abuse the hospital system in Australia its paid for by the taxpayers , tuff TATAs thailand you make billions yet cry like babies if you have to spend 7 million on Hospital care,

Nonsense. Don't spew rubbish. Aussie taxpayers does not pay for the hospital charges of foreigners. Foreigners must have insurance before they can use the hospital services in Australia.

[Peterphuket]

The problems with Thai private hospitals are, they still try to sucking your complete empty, without hesitation, unscrupulously.

Last I had an experience, and not for the first time, in a hospital in Hua hin,they have to remove a small fat bulge witch was infected, it looks like "horse trading", they started with 8000-9000, but after my abjection on my part, they start lower to 6-7000 thb.

But after I saying I like to go to my own country, because I wash thinking it must be possible for about 4000thb, we get a agreement of a rate of 5000 thb.

You can imagine when you need an emergancy, there is no possebility to negotiate, and they can ask enything they like.

Ive had it with private Thai hospitals!!

[torpedo1970]

Hang on a minute!

Do you all remember a year ago, there was a tax added to all travelers arriving in Thailand. (added to Airlines and cost passed to us)

Guess what it was meant t cover....???

Ta.....da...... Medical bills for foreigners without a insurance ....

So since this is coming up now.... wonder where or who's pocket that money went into.....

[LannaGuy]

...or Thailand should get a free NHS service like U.K.

what 'free' NHS service? you mean the 'free' service all Brits pay into all their working lives???

[peteregion]

Well isnt it just Tit for Tat?....How many thais that travel overseas get all that free medical treatment from most countries...they certainly wouldnt be adding up all the bills and whinging about it would they?...They just get on with looking after the Patient, payment or not...

Nonsense. Don't spew rubbish. Which most other countries provide medical free for foreigner including Thai????

[LannaGuy]

Well isnt it just Tit for Tat?....How many thais that travel overseas get all that free medical treatment from most countries...they certainly wouldnt be adding up all the bills and whinging about it would they?...They just get on with looking after the Patient, payment or not...

Nonsense. Don't spew rubbish. Which most other countries provide medical free for foreigner including Thai????

UK