University tells students Britain 'invaded' Australia

[webfact]

University tells students Britain 'invaded' Australia

LONDON: -- A top Australian university has rejected claims it is trying to rewrite the nation's colonial history.

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

The University of New South Wales (UNSW) Indigenous Terminology guide states that Australia was "invaded, occupied and colonised".

Full story: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-35922858

-- BBC 2016-03-30

[NumbNut]

Agreed.

Next?

[SgtRock]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Edited March 30, 2016 by SgtRock

[steve187]

what rubbish

[billd766]

Of course what the university conveniently forgets is that without the British or some other country the university would not be there in the first place.

[NumbNut]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Yes, the convicts were transported against their will, with the vast majority of them never to see their families and homes again. It's a crime against humanity, no matter how you dress it up, even looking back with modern eyes and sensibilities.

Which makes it even sadder that these transported convicts, once winning their 'ticket of leave', couldn't wait to join the land grab their 'betters' had instigated while they were still serving their sentences. Wouldn't you have thought they, of all people, would have had an empathy for a people disposed?

Terra Nullius indeed.

[Gsxrnz]

Yeah, well we have this <deleted> all the time in NZ. You Aussies are decades behind us.

We've been calling Maoris "Maori" for 20 years now. Somebody decided that the plural of Maori is Maori, so they're all one people.

Our kids are taught the Maori version of colonial history from day one, and most think our forefathers were nothing short of rapers and pillagers who stole the country from the "indiginous" Maori.....forgetting that the Maori were late settlers on the land having emigrated from polynesia circa 1300.

We are paying huge sums of money for our past sins under a treaty that has been interpreted in a ridiculous manner by a bunch of tree hugging academics and vote hungry politicians - so that now our largest corporation is Maori owned, and they don't pay tax.

Every settlement is a "full and final settlement"......until the next time.

When the Aussies start singing an indigenous version of their national anthem as well as the English version at Rugby matches, and your kids know more Aboriginal history than colonial or world history, you'll know you've truly arrived in the ridiculous PC world that we've been in for 20 plus years.

[laolover88]

The French were complaining about the British Invasion, yes using that word, of the continent in the late 18th Century. They wondered how it had been possible without a squeak of complaint from the Spanish nor the Dutch, who were of course the first european arrivals. In true British fashion the establishment of penal colonies was a smokescreen to try and discover the resource wealth.

[ezzra]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

[Steely Dan]

Perhaps the white 'settlers' should be boycotted until they give Australia back to the indigenous folk.

[SgtRock]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Yes, the convicts were transported against their will, with the vast majority of them never to see their families and homes again. It's a crime against humanity, no matter how you dress it up, even looking back with modern eyes and sensibilities.

Which makes it even sadder that these transported convicts, once winning their 'ticket of leave', couldn't wait to join the land grab their 'betters' had instigated while they were still serving their sentences. Wouldn't you have thought they, of all people, would have had an empathy for a people disposed?

Terra Nullius indeed.

At the time of the prison ships, Australia's population is estimated to have been around 5000. I do not think that there would have been many land grabs or people being dispossessed.

I take it that is what you meant and not people being disposed of.

[keeniau96]

The French (Normans actually) invaded and conquered England in 1066. Several centuries later the British invaded France, and over the next many centuries Britain invaded just about every country around. Now the UK is being invaded by their many of their former subjects, friends, allies and some very nasty folks. "plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose"

[cmsally]

Then logically, Greece is being invaded by Syria ?

[samran]

Given the high court overturned the concept of terra nullius and recognised the reality of native title more than 20 years ago, I'd say the university is onto something.

[Fookhaht]

After having studied the noble "American Revolution" all my life, imagine the shock of opening a British school boy's history book (while on vacation at a B&B in London), and seeing the dastardly chapter title: "The American Rebellion."

One man's revolution is another man's rebellion.

One man's invasion is another man's settlement.

Historians rewrite history all the time according to their own world and life view. Or according to a government's edict. Deal with it.

Edited March 30, 2016 by Fookhaht

[NumbNut]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Yes, the convicts were transported against their will, with the vast majority of them never to see their families and homes again. It's a crime against humanity, no matter how you dress it up, even looking back with modern eyes and sensibilities.

Which makes it even sadder that these transported convicts, once winning their 'ticket of leave', couldn't wait to join the land grab their 'betters' had instigated while they were still serving their sentences. Wouldn't you have thought they, of all people, would have had an empathy for a people disposed?

Terra Nullius indeed.

At the time of the prison ships, Australia's population is estimated to have been around 5000. I do not think that there would have been many land grabs or people being dispossessed.

I take it that is what you meant and not people being disposed of.

5000 is way low. Maybe you're referring to the population of the Sydney Harbour area?

Conservative Aboriginal population estimates for Tasmania alone range from 8000 upwards to 20000. The Australian landmass estimations are up to a million plus.

I was referring to dispossessed, yes.

Edited March 30, 2016 by NumbNut

[billd766]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

Perhaps it is close to the time that the UK asks for compensation from the Romans from 2,100 years ago, followed by the Vikings, the Angles, Saxons Jutes in the 700 to 800s, and then the French in 1066 and the Spanish, Dutch etc.

Then of course the was the invasion and colonisation of the USA by the English, French, Dutch, the Spanish who came up from Mexico and South America, plus the latest invasion by the Mexicans. Don't leave out Canada by the French and British.

How about China and Europe conquered by the Mongol's and Tartar's, not forgetting the conquest of part of Europe by the Muslims and the Saracens.

How much history do you want to re-write?

[NumbNut]

Perhaps the white 'settlers' should be boycotted until they give Australia back to the indigenous folk.

But then you must look at the USA, or even the South America's with their Spanish stuff. England had 500 years of Italians, thankfully they left...So where do we start or Stop...?

One area where it most definitely starts is if there is a continuing and ongoing association with the land/locality. Can you claim that indigenous folks in various locations throughout the South America, Africa and Australia landmasses have an ongoing and continuous association with their land/locality?

I would think yes, this is the case.

[kagan]

America teaches that too

[Thongkorn]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

Totally agree England is going after the Roman Empire from 200 years ago. What did the Romans ever do for Britain .

[Bobotie]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

Totally agree England is going after the Roman Empire from 200 years ago. What did the Romans ever do for Britain .

if it was 200 years ago, no one expected the spanish inquisition

[JetsetBkk]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

Totally agree England is going after the Roman Empire from 200 years ago. What did the Romans ever do for Britain .

if it was 200 years ago, no one expected the spanish inquisition

[Trentham]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Yes, the convicts were transported against their will, with the vast majority of them never to see their families and homes again. It's a crime against humanity, no matter how you dress it up, even looking back with modern eyes and sensibilities.

Which makes it even sadder that these transported convicts, once winning their 'ticket of leave', couldn't wait to join the land grab their 'betters' had instigated while they were still serving their sentences. Wouldn't you have thought they, of all people, would have had an empathy for a people disposed?

Terra Nullius indeed.

At the time of the prison ships, Australia's population is estimated to have been around 5000. I do not think that there would have been many land grabs or people being dispossessed.

I take it that is what you meant and not people being disposed of.

You are so wrong!

Summary of the decade

In 1787 Lord Sydney (1733–1800) of the British Colonial Office in Great Britain gave instructions to Governor Arthur Phillip (1738–1814) to establish a penal colony on the Dutch-named land, New Holland. He was also ordered to open friendly communications with the local Indigenous peoples and encourage the convicts and marines to show them kindness. His instructions required giving protection to Indigenous people and punishing those who harmed them. There is no evidence of any acknowledgement of Indigenous peoples' ownership of the land.

At this time, the Indigenous population of Australia is estimated to have been approximately between 500,000 and 750,000 people. The size and distribution of populations are always an informed estimate. There were more than 250 distinct language groups across Australia, each group with their own land, language and culture.

http://www.myplace.edu.au/decades_timeline/1780/decade_landing_22.html

[kblaze]

Then logically, Greece is being invaded by Syria ?

False equivalence. The Syrians you are referring to are not looking to widen Syria's borders. They are fleeing the country. And of course, they are not under the direction of the rulers Syria (vs. the French, British, U.S. references above)

[Trentham]

It was an invasion and an attempt after a time to "breed out the aboriginal race." The Australian government supported a white Australia policy and also the taking of aboriginal babies from their parents right up to the 1960's. In the late 1950's my sister's best friend was one of those stolen children.

My g.g.g. grandmother was a convict on that first fleet.

Not quite on topic but I once heard an Indian man interviewed on the radio. He said............

“England gave us steam trains and the Westminster system of government and for that we are grateful, but,” he added with a touch of bitterness "the English are so arrogant. They say they discovered India in 1597, but we knew it was there all the time.”

[borisloosebrain]

Students are being encouraged to use the term "invaded" rather than "settled" or "discovered", and avoid the word "Aborigines".

I do not think that those that were forced there on prison ships would agree with your terminology.

Yes, the convicts were transported against their will, with the vast majority of them never to see their families and homes again. It's a crime against humanity, no matter how you dress it up, even looking back with modern eyes and sensibilities.

Which makes it even sadder that these transported convicts, once winning their 'ticket of leave', couldn't wait to join the land grab their 'betters' had instigated while they were still serving their sentences. Wouldn't you have thought they, of all people, would have had an empathy for a people disposed?

Terra Nullius indeed.

At the time of the prison ships, Australia's population is estimated to have been around 5000. I do not think that there would have been many land grabs or people being dispossessed.

I take it that is what you meant and not people being disposed of.

You may not think it but that's exactly what happened, particularly land near water resources, and the indigenous population which was estimated at between 300,000 and 750,000 comprised of about 250 nations speaking several hundred languages at the time the Brits arrived (aka the original boat except except with guns and bad intentions) by the 1930s had fallen to around 75,000.

One family I'm related to by marriage was granted 130,000 acres in country Victoria. Pretty sure the only benefit the locals got from that deal was that they learnt to play cricket and actually toured and played the poms in England. As for their hunting grounds, sacred ancestral sites, waterholes etc access to those was controlled by their new uninvited and unwelcome landlords.

That was no settlement it was an invasion. Some tribes waged war for decades before finally being wiped out by the sheer weight of numbers and weaponry opposing them.

Edited March 30, 2016 by borisloosebrain

[AlQaholic]

Well, Australia is currently being invaded by Chinese and individuals of middle eastern descent......So start teaching Chinese in that University....

[borisloosebrain]

Maybe it's ruse to ask the UK for compensations and restitutions for the ' invasion and colonization of Australia'.....

Perhaps it is close to the time that the UK asks for compensation from the Romans from 2,100 years ago, followed by the Vikings, the Angles, Saxons Jutes in the 700 to 800s, and then the French in 1066 and the Spanish, Dutch etc.

Then of course the was the invasion and colonisation of the USA by the English, French, Dutch, the Spanish who came up from Mexico and South America, plus the latest invasion by the Mexicans. Don't leave out Canada by the French and British.

How about China and Europe conquered by the Mongol's and Tartar's, not forgetting the conquest of part of Europe by the Muslims and the Saracens.

How much history do you want to re-write?

They aren't re writing history so much as including a few truths that have been omitted in previous anglo- centric narratives. Can't see the problem in pointing what a total pack of %#}^ the British Aristocracy were as has been reflected in British foreign policy over the past few centuries.

[mrsomchai]

Wait for the second or third year when kids learn their grand grand grand parents were soldier and and an army hooker. That will give them a shock

[weegee]

SO? Where did the Australian Aborigine originate from then?, when they arrived to call Australia theirs.....This subject will just keep going round and round with regard to Indigenous peoples...Immigrating Tribes started 1000s of years ago...how far is it feasible to go back....If you took away the financial gain these people are chasing nowadays, it would all be forgotten in a heartbeat....