Lightning strike

[Berty100]

Am I a happy chappy?

Today, while I wasn't at home the lightning stroke once again on the cable from BTV which is my internet provider. This is the 4th time in 7 months.

Where the previous times the damage was limited to the router or modem, this time I was a bit luckier.

Cable modem, Router, 24 port Internet hub, 2 android boxes, Hdmi ports from 2 tv's and a Marantz amplifier, all gone to hell. And that's only what I have discovered so far.

Of course BTV will compensate me for everything. NOT

[gmac]

Don't worry your home insurance policy will cover it. No insurance? Oops, after 3 times in the previous few months seems like a no brainer.

[Berty100]

Don't worry your home insurance policy will cover it. No insurance? Oops, after 3 times in the previous few months seems like a no brainer.

oops after 3 times one would think bvn had now protected their network

[stoneyboy]

The joys of living in Thailand.

[guzzi850m2]

I uses same cable net work provider for i-net for app 8 years now and never experienced what OP has, not once.

The service is working in +99.9% of the time too, TOT was a nightmare hence the switch.

[Berty100]

I uses same cable net work provider for i-net for app 8 years now and never experienced what OP has, not once.

The service is working in +99.9% of the time too, TOT was a nightmare hence the switch.

I'm indeed happy with the service as it works very well and they came to replace router and modem at 6pm tonight, but if there is a lightning strike in the area I will need to have at least my router replaced. This time it wasn't restricted to the router though.

I know it didn't hit the mains power, because I forgot to switch off a ceiling fan, and that was still running when I came home.

My cable from the street to the house is underground.

[KhunBENQ]

?:

Broadband Cable TV Lightning Surge Protector

Can' t tell you whether is applicable in your case.

Open a thread about lightning protection on TV/internet cables?

Edited May 15, 2016 by KhunBENQ

[luudee]

Why would BTV compensate you ?

Sounds to me like your house/condo lacks the proper lightning protection ... that's your responsibility, not the Cable TV company ....

[Berty100]

Why would BTV compensate you ?

Sounds to me like your house/condo lacks the proper lightning protection ... that's your responsibility, not the Cable TV company ....

The cable on my property is underground, so impossible to have a lighting strike on it.

The lightning strike was on the coaxial cable outside my property and traveled throughout my system because BTV had put no protection on it.

Yesterday they put such surge protector between modem and incoming cable., at least I think it is one because the device is completely blank.

I have got myself a surge protector as well which I intend to place where the cable eneters my property, but not sure if it is possible to put 2 protectors in line.

[Rimmer]

Lightning hits overhead power and internet lines all the time, it then finds the easiest way to go to ground which could be your system. Your Internet connection should be the first thing to be unplugged in the event of an electrical storm as they are very vulnerable.

[NightRider70]

Use a WiFi router and run everything over WiFi, that way anydamage will be limited to the router.

[Berty100]

Can anyone tell me if you can put 2 surge protectors on the same line without reducing the speed ?

[Crossy]

Can anyone tell me if you can put 2 surge protectors on the same line without reducing the speed ?

Yes you can.

Surge arrestors do invariably insert some attenuation, but unless the line is already bad you should have no issues. They need a good ground to work properly.

Also put surge arrestors on all the outgoing cables from your router (or use Wi-Fi) and at the power plug (they work in both directions).

Lightning induced surges are a fact of life here and you cannot rely on others to protect your kit, that said nothing is going to save you from a direct hit on either the power or phone lines

[Berty100]

Can anyone tell me if you can put 2 surge protectors on the same line without reducing the speed ?

Yes you can.

Surge arrestors do invariably insert some attenuation, but unless the line is already bad you should have no issues. They need a good ground to work properly.

Also put surge arrestors on all the outgoing cables from your router (or use Wi-Fi) and at the power plug (they work in both directions).

Lightning induced surges are a fact of life here and you cannot rely on others to protect your kit, that said nothing is going to save you from a direct hit on either the power or phone lines

This is the "thing" I wanted to put on my incoming coaxial cable, but I see now that it's called isolator instead of surge protector, but don't know if this has the same ffect in my case. I think the BTV guys put something similar on the modem as well. I have only 1 outgoing line from the router that goes to the network hub, but how you add a surge protector to a Ethernet wire?

[Crossy]

I know little about cable TV / internet so can only surmise that the 'isolator' is indeed a surge arrestor, whether it will allow your internet to continue to function I know not

We had similar devices on our satellite dish and receivers. They didn't save the LNB or two of the three receivers connected to it when we had a hit nearby (very close but I don't know exactly what was hit), no other electronics was damaged. I became parnoid about mains surge protection when we had a direct hit to our roof which killed off a lot of LED lamps and two UPSs (they died protecting the PCs connected to them).

Ethernet surge arrestors are available, I have several although since we got fibre (which doesn't conduct lightning surges) they've not been connected. I did note that they didn't like my gigabit links so better quality ones would be needed.

[Berty100]

Time for me to consult the real electrical experts on this forum, as I was notified that the damages amount to about 75K Baht, and I just discovered something that may be an installation fault of BTV. In that case I will sue in court, and so far I have the support from OCPB already, but I don't want to be sure if what I see is indeed a big mistake or not.

Take note, I don't call on the law experts, but on the electrical ones.

All the cable on my property is underground, so impossible to be hit by lightning. I have a transformer on a pole with a lightning arrester.

Now I notice that BTV attached the coaxial cable to the earthing cable of the arrester. I always thought that it was big no no to attach any wires to the earthing cable of the arrester, because when the pole get hit the spike will travel through those wires.

Am I correct in my assumption and is it so that every electrician should be aware of that.?

I include a picture of the pole where you clearly can see the coaxial cable running over the steel earthing cable.

The cable comes down from the arrester at the other side of the pole, then goes under the pole and comes up again for about 3 meter at the other side of the pole.

[Crossy]

First question (a spot of devil's advocate). How do you KNOW the surge didn't come via a strike to the HV supply? What type of arrestor do you have on your transformer? Ratings? Life indicator checked recently?

Do you have any other surge suppression on the house power, on your distribution board, plug-in arrestors etc?

You are correct, they should not have used the arrestor ground as a support and there could be significant coupling to the coax, but I doubt you'll get anywhere relying on just that in court. You'll need an expert in lightning induced damage (not me by the way).

I would be removing the coax from the ground lead ASAP, even a few inches separation would reduce potential coupling significantly.

Does your house insurance have an electrical damage clause?

[Berty100]

First question (a spot of devil's advocate). How do you KNOW the surge didn't come via a strike to the HV supply? What type of arrestor do you have on your transformer? Ratings? Life indicator checked recently?

Do you have any other surge suppression on the house power, on your distribution board, plug-in arrestors etc?

You are correct, they should not have used the arrestor ground as a support and there could be significant coupling to the coax, but I doubt you'll get anywhere relying on just that in court. You'll need an expert in lightning induced damage (not me by the way).

I would be removing the coax from the ground lead ASAP, even a few inches separation would reduce potential coupling significantly.

Does your house insurance have an electrical damage clause?

I have surge protectors and RCBO's on each circuit in my house, no lightning arresters.

I forgot to switch off a fan before I left, and that fan was still running when I cam back home and none of the RCBO's had opened.

If there had been a power interruption of just a second, the fan would switch off and the fan light turn on.

I don't have insurance for electrical damage.

Indeed I should remove the cable now, but then I don't have any proof anymore that it was there during installation.

Any idea how and where I could find such a lightning induced expert?

[Crossy]

I have surge protectors and RCBO's on each circuit in my house, no lightning arresters.

But you said the coax is attached to the earth of the arrestor on the pole. Can you post images of where that earth goes to on the transformer.

RCBOs don't open on power failure or lightning surges.

The power does not necessarily go off if there's a lightning surge on the lines.

Note:- I'm still playing devil's advocate, not flaming / arguing

To be honest, I doubt you're going to get anywhere with your cable supplier and will just have to bite the bullet and mitigate future potential issues. I'd possibly be considering introducing a short wireless link from the modem to the rest of your system in place of the ethernet cable which seems to have been the point of ingress. As a minimum a good quality ethernet surge arrestor on that link would be a wise investment.

If there was obvious burn damage somewhere (have a look at the port the modem was plugged into) indicating where the surge entered you may score some sort of compensation.

Get home insurance that covers electrical damage.

[manfredtillmann]

since we got hit by lightning 2 weeks ago and lost the tv and the cable modem we are now unplugging everything every time we leave home or when ever we hear thunder.

once you get into the routine it takes 30 seconds but will save you a lot of grieve. plus - it costs nothing.

[Berty100]

I have surge protectors and RCBO's on each circuit in my house, no lightning arresters.

But you said the coax is attached to the earth of the arrestor on the pole. Can you post images of where that earth goes to on the transformer.

RCBOs don't open on power failure or lightning surges.

The power does not necessarily go off if there's a lightning surge on the lines.

Note:- I'm still playing devil's advocate, not flaming / arguing

To be honest, I doubt you're going to get anywhere with your cable supplier and will just have to bite the bullet and mitigate future potential issues. I'd possibly be considering introducing a short wireless link from the modem to the rest of your system in place of the ethernet cable which seems to have been the point of ingress. As a minimum a good quality ethernet surge arrestor on that link would be a wise investment.

If there was obvious burn damage somewhere (have a look at the port the modem was plugged into) indicating where the surge entered you may score some sort of compensation.

Get home insurance that covers electrical damage.

Don't know if the pictures are clear enough. How about those power cables bundled with the earthing cable. Should they be in that position or not.

A few years ago we had a lightning strike on the high voltage, which created a lot of damage everywhere in Pattaya, and all 3 RCBO's opened right away.

I don't have the modem or router anymore, but will ask back for it because BTV want to charge me for the new modem, but I don't recall any burn damages seen on the modem.

Another reason why I'm sure the hit was on the coaxial is because only Ethernet connected devices are affected.

Modem - Router - Network switch - 2 android boxes and only the hdmi ports to which these boxes were connected.

Nothing else damaged inside the house.

OCPB has said they support me and provide lawyer and pay court costs, so it is important that I find a qualified expert as you suggested.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Berty100

[Crossy]

OK, looks like that ground goes to the transformer tank and your supply neutral, it also seems to go to that little antenna thingy (lightning rod?).

A hit to the rod would induce massive currents in the coax which is in close proximity, bye-bye modem etc

Sadly i have no idea of anyone who could support you

[Berty100]

OK, looks like that ground goes to the transformer tank and your supply neutral, it also seems to go to that little antenna thingy (lightning rod?).

A hit to the rod would induce massive currents in the coax which is in close proximity, bye-bye modem etc

Sadly i have no idea of anyone who could support you

Would PEA be able to make a report which can be used in court?

[Crossy]

OK, looks like that ground goes to the transformer tank and your supply neutral, it also seems to go to that little antenna thingy (lightning rod?).

A hit to the rod would induce massive currents in the coax which is in close proximity, bye-bye modem etc

Sadly i have no idea of anyone who could support you

Would PEA be able to make a report which can be used in court?

Way outside my experience, can't hurt to ask.

They would probably state that nothing should be attached to their cables.

[Berty100]

OK, looks like that ground goes to the transformer tank and your supply neutral, it also seems to go to that little antenna thingy (lightning rod?).

A hit to the rod would induce massive currents in the coax which is in close proximity, bye-bye modem etc

Sadly i have no idea of anyone who could support you

Would PEA be able to make a report which can be used in court?

Way outside my experience, can't hurt to ask.

They would probably state that nothing should be attached to their cables.

Thanks Crossy, I took more close up pictures and am now attaching the coaxial that it doesn't touch any earthing or power cables anymore.

Those 2 big power cables that are bundled with the earthing cable, is that allowed so?

[Crossy]

Those 2 big power cables that are bundled with the earthing cable, is that allowed so?

Probably not the best installation method, but since you want PEA to assist in your quest ...

[Pib]

Can anyone tell me if you can put 2 surge protectors on the same line without reducing the speed ?

Yes you can.

Surge arrestors do invariably insert some attenuation, but unless the line is already bad you should have no issues. They need a good ground to work properly.

Also put surge arrestors on all the outgoing cables from your router (or use Wi-Fi) and at the power plug (they work in both directions).

Lightning induced surges are a fact of life here and you cannot rely on others to protect your kit, that said nothing is going to save you from a direct hit on either the power or phone lines

This is the "thing" I wanted to put on my incoming coaxial cable, but I see now that it's called isolator instead of surge protector, but don't know if this has the same ffect in my case. I think the BTV guys put something similar on the modem as well. I have only 1 outgoing line from the router that goes to the network hub, but how you add a surge protector to a Ethernet wire?

It really just a galvonic isolator to isolate the RF cable signal from 50/60Hz ground loops which can cause audio and video hum on Cable lines used to carry TV and internet signals. And ground loops can also cause shocks...zap input circuits. I have True cable TV/internet and they have an isolator right after the cable enters the house and just before the two way coupler where the signal splits out to go to the TV boxes and internet modem/router. Sometimes such isolators are advertised as providing some lightning protection also...whether they really do or not I don't know.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Pib

[Berty100]

Today, by coincidence of course, received an email from Amazon with a list of broadband lightning surge protectors.

The email account I received the Amazon message is not the same my Thaivisa account is registered.

You wouldn't think Amazon spies on me, would you

Edited May 17, 2016 by Berty100

[Crossy]

Today, by coincidence of course, received an email from Amazon with a list of broadband lightning surge protectors.

The email account I received the Amazon message is not the same my Thaivisa account is registered.

You wouldn't think Amazon spies on me, would you

You would be amazed (or is that Amazoned).

Tentacles everywhere, even Japanese porn

[Pib]

Today, by coincidence of course, received an email from Amazon with a list of broadband lightning surge protectors.

The email account I received the Amazon message is not the same my Thaivisa account is registered.

You wouldn't think Amazon spies on me, would you

I expect the list showed some examples...hopefully they actually said "Surge Protector" on the label versus "Isolator" as an Isolator just isolates the RF signal from ground to reduce hum, noise, etc.

Surge Protector Example

Isolator Example