Crackdown on Phuket condo owners confirmed

[Dancin Dna 11]

Wonder what this will mean for Air Bnb-ers?

[LivinginKata]

Wonder what this will mean for Air Bnb-ers?

Just ignore and hope for the best ....

[webfact]

Campaign launched to rid Phuket of illegal holiday rentals
Suthicha Sirirat


Phuket Vice Governor Chokdee Amornwat announced the campaign to rid Phuket of illegal holiday rentals yesterday (July 5). Photo: Suthicha Sirirat

PHUKET: -- Provincial authorities have launched a campaign to rid the island of illegal holiday rentals with local officials and community leaders compiling a register of all rental accommodations in their respective areas across Phuket.

Phu Yai Baan (village headman) and Kamnan (subdistrict chiefs), as well as officers from each of Phuket’s three District Offices and local administration organisations (OrBorTor) and municipal officials, will scour their areas to compile the register, Phuket Vice Governor Chokdee Amornwat revealed yesterday (July 5).

“They will search their areas and question local residents about any rental accommodations in their areas,” V/Gov Chokdee said.

The move is the first foray under the new “Phuket Hotel Model” policy, which aims to make Phuket a “model province” from which all other provinces in the country can follow in handling rentals of less than 30 days that breach the Hotel Act, he said.

“According to our records, less than 50,000 rooms are legally registered as a hotel rooms in Phuket, but our investigations so far show that Phuket has more than 100,000 illegal hotel rooms,” V/Gov Chokdee said.

“There are too many illegal accommodations that breach the Hotel Act. This includes businesses such as condominiums, apartments, flats, mansions, guesthouses, homes for rent, rooms for rent and commercial buildings, most of which have been altered or developed into accommodation, and rented out on a daily basis,” he added.

In addition to such a large number of businesses potentially avoiding paying the appropriate tax on their income while affecting the income of legitimate hotels, the issue concerned tourist security, V/Gov Noted.

Full story: http://www.thephuketnews.com/campaign-launched-to-rid-phuket-of-illegal-holiday-rentals-58147.php


-- Phuket News 2016-07-06

[natway09]

It really would be better if most posting here understood how & why this law came about before Thai bashing.

My earlier post fully explains

How did the 49/51 get into the story. It has nothing to do with this topic.

[stevenl]

It really would be better if most posting here understood how & why this law came about before Thai bashing.

My earlier post fully explains

How did the 49/51 get into the story. It has nothing to do with this topic.

Won't matter anyhow. Whatever happens, some feel the Thai are out to get them, the farang, as their only purpose in life.

[crosthwaite]

This is another nail in the coffin of the Thai property market. Most people who buy condos in Phuket buy for investment purposes if you are not allowed to rent them out why would you buy. Lets face it 90 percent of condo owners are farang so its just another slap on the face for farangs.

You know not of which you speak. No condominium building can have falang/foreign ownership over 49%.

[geisha]

Quite agree with Pinot. Phuket is now a disaster , such a shame for what was once a beautiful island.

[american12bthai]

Been going on for years. Wonder why the crackdown now?

the 2 million baht fine.

[american12bthai]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

[Pinot]

This is another nail in the coffin of the Thai property market. Most people who buy condos in Phuket buy for investment purposes if you are not allowed to rent them out why would you buy. Lets face it 90 percent of condo owners are farang so its just another slap on the face for farangs.

To be fair they obviously haven't done their due diligence then. The market is over saturated, overpriced and the second hand property market is sluggish to say the least. I know properties that have fallen into disrepair having been on the market for 5 or more years.

2 week millionaires conned by the chick in the miniskirt dribbling all over them and distracting them from the actual costs and returns deserve all they get in my opinion. It's buyer beware. If people are foolish enough to buy into it it serves them right- it comes back to what I said in the closed thread- 'would you do this at home'?

Most of the condos in my property that have changed hands either went for below what people paid for them or at cost.

"We will rent out your property and guarantee 'x' return"- its all complete BS. People barely break even due to the lack of demand and the money being eaten up by CAM fees, taxes, management fees, etc.

Phuket as an investment? Maybe 20-30 years ago but not now. Works for me though as there are cheap rents everywhere.

Maybe some of them needed a slap for plunging into something they had no clue about.

Standing by for incoming!

No, I completely agree. The market is way beyond over-saturated. Nothing is selling. Only the naive with too much money would buy a condo.

Every one of these many condo projects have the "guaranteed X return" bullshit out front on the sign. Buying a condo is crazy in this market and with enforcement of this law, buying becomes absolutely absurd. Now with 3-4000 more condos under construction???

I love this move by the hotel industry because it may give pause to the financing to the next condo project. Thai government isn't going to do anything about the over development. The only way to stop these developers is to educate the potential buyers that it's a terrible financial decision.

[NamKangMan]

This is another nail in the coffin of the Thai property market. Most people who buy condos in Phuket buy for investment purposes if you are not allowed to rent them out why would you buy. Lets face it 90 percent of condo owners are farang so its just another slap on the face for farangs.

To be fair they obviously haven't done their due diligence then. The market is over saturated, overpriced and the second hand property market is sluggish to say the least. I know properties that have fallen into disrepair having been on the market for 5 or more years.

2 week millionaires conned by the chick in the miniskirt dribbling all over them and distracting them from the actual costs and returns deserve all they get in my opinion. It's buyer beware. If people are foolish enough to buy into it it serves them right- it comes back to what I said in the closed thread- 'would you do this at home'?

Most of the condos in my property that have changed hands either went for below what people paid for them or at cost.

"We will rent out your property and guarantee 'x' return"- its all complete BS. People barely break even due to the lack of demand and the money being eaten up by CAM fees, taxes, management fees, etc.

Phuket as an investment? Maybe 20-30 years ago but not now. Works for me though as there are cheap rents everywhere.

Maybe some of them needed a slap for plunging into something they had no clue about.

Standing by for incoming!

"Works for me though as there are cheap rents everywhere." - works for me also.

If enforced, this will surely put downward pressure on rents across the island.

[gemguy]

I wonder if this law will be selectively enforced

Yes and no.

Foreigners will not be able to talk their way out of it so easy...even when they let their wallets do the negotiating.

Thais will make arrangements..as per the usual.

Cheers

Edited July 6, 2016 by gemguy

[trogers]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

My five condo units in Bangkok are only let on an annual basis to tenants with yearly visas.

So, not all of them.

[MockingJay]

Wow! Another crackdown... exciting...

[mcfish]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

Stupid answer thing is Fact trumps fantasy every single time. I just did a search for tomorrow night in all price ranges and got just 17 pages...probably 00.01% of all the rooms out there, if that.

[Puccini]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

Stupid answer thing is Fact trumps fantasy every single time. I just did a search for tomorrow night in all price ranges and got just 17 pages...probably 00.01% of all the rooms out there, if that.

That's a useful website to know, listing all condos in Bangkok available for rent on a given date. Could you post the URL, please.

[mcfish]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

Stupid answer thing is Fact trumps fantasy every single time. I just did a search for tomorrow night in all price ranges and got just 17 pages...probably 00.01% of all the rooms out there, if that.

That's a useful website to know, listing all condos in Bangkok available for rent on a given date. Could you post the URL, please.

https://www.airbnb.com/

[moe666]

You guys all seem to forget this story http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/916967-condo-with-up-to-ten-arabs-in-a-room-raided-for-illegal-hotel-operation-in-sukhumvit-soi-11/ and this was in Bangkok in May this year.

To put it simply there are 4 classes of accommodation in Thailand:

1. Hotels, obvious characteristics;

2. Apartments where the building has one owner and can rent daily, weekly, monthly etc.;

3. Serviced Apartments where fully serviced apartments are rented on a monthly basis; and,

4. Condominiums where only residential access is permitted.

And it should be made clear that condominiums in Thailand are licensed as for "Residential Purposes only" which means exactly what it says.

Statements such as "90% of condo owners are foreigners" is absolutely wrong, the Condominium ACT enforces the 51% local ownership through the Lands Office.

Actually there are two differnt means of buying a condo, in one case the building has to be 51percent owned by thais in the other the whole building can be occupied by farangs. In the first it envolves a purchase of the unit in the second you have a lease hold agreement. there was an article in the Bangkok Post about this

[DaveinAsia]

Been going on for years. Wonder why the crackdown now?

Many wrongs have been going on for years and even decades that past elected governments did not fix.

But this government has started fixing issues since two years ago.

Fixing issues that are more in their and other hiso's interests you mean?

No it's very much in the interests of condo owning farangs not to have their homes used as a cheap rate hotel.

I never found the apartments/houses that I rented on AirBnB to be cheap! More like mid - higher range prices. Most loud tourists don't use the AirBnB service. They prefer package deals and staying down where all the action is. Most AirBnB guests are decent people(mostly middle class couples with kids) in my experience and they all say hello to me and ask me for some advice. I can't complain about them and I love using the service myself too. To see it closed down in Phuket just proves that TH doesn't tolerate any foreign competition but rather than saying this they dress it up a bit differently to save face

[newnative]

The crackdown isn't targeting Airbnb specifically, it's a general crackdown on anybody breaking the Hotel Law by renting their condos for less than 1 month periods, by whatever means they are using. Perhaps the hotel owners have complained but I would wager there are just as many unhappy condo owners also complaining about a greatly increased number of daily or short-term renters making a general nuisance of themselves. I've witnessed several large vans of people pulling up to a condo entrance and 15 daily renters each get out with all their luggage and swarm into the lobby and then spend the remainder of their time breaking all the condo rules. And the whole thing starts again the next day. Is it any wonder resident condo owners are unhappy? Those of you who enjoy renting a condo for a day or two instead of booking a hotel room, whether you are in Thailand or anywhere else, need to remember that in most cases you are violating the condo's rules and regulations, as most condos prohibit daily or short-term rentals.

[HampiK]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

This is an perfect example of a person who have "NO" knowledge but like to give answer which are no true at all.

As another poster already wrote in his condo it's not allowed... the same is in my condo... No daily/weekly rentals allowed. And if there are any, the complain go first to the management and there take the action. In the begining there were of course some daily/weekly rentals.. but they dissapeared over time. And this raids in phuket also help to make afraid more of them for short term rentals.

I am not sure if the complain come from Hotels or other condo owners.. but for sure I also not want that in my condo are daily rentals. This people take care less and mostly are more noisy than the longterm residents. First because they don't care and secondly longterm rentals are older or still at work in daytime.

[balo]

This is another nail in the coffin of the Thai property market. Most people who buy condos in Phuket buy for investment purposes if you are not allowed to rent them out why would you buy. Lets face it 90 percent of condo owners are farang so its just another slap on the face for farangs.

You can still rent out a condo monthly, just not daily.

Given that farang cannot own more than 49% of any condo block, Not sure were the 90% comes from.

you are correct about the 49 51% rule however in Phuket they have circumvented this by the 51 % being bought in a thai company name or leased instead of freehold when I say 90% farang owned I am refering to Phuket only some maybe in girlfriends name etc but in the end its farang money that purchased the property.

Not true at all , many rich Bangkokians and local families in the province invest in condos, and rent them out to tourists .

[KittenKong]

This is another nail in the coffin of the Thai property market. Most people who buy condos in Phuket buy for investment purposes if you are not allowed to rent them out why would you buy. Lets face it 90 percent of condo owners are farang so its just another slap on the face for farangs.

You know not of which you speak. No condominium building can have falang/foreign ownership over 49%.

49% owned outright, plus all the company- name units controlled by farangs, plus all the units that are in Thai wives' names etc.

I estimate that farangs control at least 75% of the units in my Jomtien building, many of which are used for illegal nightly rentals.

[NamKangMan]

Wait till they start renting by the hour.

[MarkyM3]

Interesting topic. I am planning to rent in Bangkok for a couple of months later this year and had considered Airbnb as an alternative to serviced apartments.

But if the owner doesn't have proper consent then could cause issues. At least I can pay for a serviced apartment on credit card and be protected by the issuer if that goes south.

[NamKangMan]

guess how many apartments in bkk DO THE SAME THING?

all of them. ... thats the answer... all of them.

Stupid answer thing is Fact trumps fantasy every single time. I just did a search for tomorrow night in all price ranges and got just 17 pages...probably 00.01% of all the rooms out there, if that.

Just had a quick look at some properties in those 17 pages on AirBnB for Phuket.

Quiet a few Thai's on there, but the majority are foreigners.

[mcfish]

Something fishy going on here. "in fact close to 100,000 rooms in the province that are being operated like hotels "

There are only 17 pages on Airbnb around 340 rooms, so where do they get the 100k rooms from? And how do those people advertise them? Real estate agents wouldn't be interested in nightly or weekly rentals, to much effort for a small commission . Im starting to think they would be mostly Thais or the chubby smiling guy is telling us porkies

[simon43]

Deleted - I posted a long reply and it didn't upload and I can't be asked to type it all out again!

Edited July 7, 2016 by simon43

[Mysterion]

i have rented several different condominium units for one night stays recently in Phuket using the Tripadvisor and Agoda.

The check-in/out for these one night stays was handled by the condo management office in each case. Never had any interaction with any unit owners.

As such, seems like the condo mgt teams and regular hotel booking sites are also in cahoots with the whole short term rental business in Phuket.

[dageurreotype]

Great news. In my little soi in Sai Yuan no less than four bloody condominiums have been thrown up with no thought nor care as to their blocking out residential property owners 'right to light' (yes I know this concept doesn't exist here, neither am I affected by it), slammed right up against adjoining walls as they put in glass blocks to get around the two meter rule for windows, notwithstanding the many cars blocking entrances, all owned by bloody foreigners, not one Thai owned. How were they allowed to get away with that in the Land of Anti Johnny Farang?

Edited July 7, 2016 by dageurreotype