Burkini ban suspended by top French court

[Oxx]

56 minutes ago, Calach said:

 

In reality the integration of most Muslims in France works rather well

 

I presume that you know nothing about Moslem integration in France.

 

Moslems largely live in very poor ghettos where drugs and crime are rife.  The youths regularly riot, setting fire to cars, burning buildings.

 

In some Moslem areas youth unemployment is in excess of 40%.

 

Moslems regularly attack Jews and damage churches.

 

There are 750 zones urbaines sensibles (ZUS) - usually translated into English as "No go zones" where police are reluctant to venture.  The official French government list is at http://sig.ville.gouv.fr/Atlas/ZUS/

 

If that's working "rather well", I can't imagine what "rather badly" would look like.

 

[ClutchClark]

Cannot use quote function.

 

yes, its like a wetsuit "hoodie" or loose version is like a sweatshirt hoodie and when worn with sunglasses it removes too many identifying feathres for my liking. 

 

Ofcourse, if it were cold outside, then its not unlike other cold weather gear but we take that stuff off when we exit the cold weather where I live. 

 

I believe people should be able to be readily identified.  I want to know its a woman wearing that non-gender identifying clothing and not some guy bent on harm. Its alot like those "duster" type coats some guys wear. Too easy to be hiding a firearm (or explosive) under there.

 

Thanks for posting.

[NoshowJones]

4 hours ago, KonaRain said:

I'd like to show the BBC, or some of the French, the way that some of the women in Hawaii, who aren't Asians or Southern European, but Scotch Irish or English, and they might be wearing an old long sleeve wetsuit top, with longer shorts, so as not to attract every guy on da beach, or to protect from scorching sun..
-whatever's
Aloha

Everybody should be allowed to wear whatever they like, whether they are Muslims or any other faith.

But nobody should be allowed to walk the streets with their face completely covered with only their eyes visable.

If anyone thinks I should explain why, then there is no hope for them.

[ClutchClark]

3 minutes ago, English 1 said:

What is the point of going to a beach dressed like a garbage sack.

 

Muslims are not sun seekers but the opposite.

 

I think these incidents are a set up by the Ragheads.

 

 

Although I don't disagree that some muslims are excited to push limits in their new freedom loving new homes without fear of being stoned to death like back home, I can say that based on the kids at my hotel swimming pool, little muslim children absolutely love the water as much as every other child of every other faith. 

 

It might be that some of these mothers just want to provide a beach opportunity to their kids...but some probably like to push the boundaries as well and stage it like you say.

[simple1]

4 minutes ago, Oxx said:

 

I presume that you know nothing about Moslem integration in France.

 

Moslems largely live in very poor ghettos where drugs and crime are rife.  The youths regularly riot, setting fire to cars, burning buildings.

 

In some Moslem areas youth unemployment is in excess of 40%.

 

Moslems regularly attack Jews and damage churches.

 

There are 750 zones urbaines sensibles (ZUS) - usually translated into English as "No go zones" where police are reluctant to venture.  The official French government list is at http://sig.ville.gouv.fr/Atlas/ZUS/

 

If that's working "rather well", I can't imagine what "rather badly" would look like.

 

 

 No Go - ZUS, as falsely interpreted by the right. Even Daniel Pipes stated...

 

Having this first-hand experience, I regret having translated what the French government terms Zones Urbaines Sensibles as no-go zones. One can indeed "go" in them.

 

[NongKhaiKid]

4 hours ago, KonaRain said:

I'd like to show the BBC, or some of the French, the way that some of the women in Hawaii, who aren't Asians or Southern European, but Scotch Irish or English, and they might be wearing an old long sleeve wetsuit top, with longer shorts, so as not to attract every guy on da beach, or to protect from scorching sun..
-whatever's
Aloha

Scotch is whisky.

[Steely Dan]

3 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

Anything that covers the face and prevents recognition should be banned anywhere in public, simple as that !

I quite agree, but even here there needs to be common sense applying it. What about parades featuring Chinese dragons? Does each person inside have to stick their head out of a porthole (even though they all look the same)? You could certainly hide a large firecracker inside one of them things.

[Calach]

16 minutes ago, Oxx said:

 

I presume that you know nothing about Moslem integration in France.

 

Moslems largely live in very poor ghettos where drugs and crime are rife.  The youths regularly riot, setting fire to cars, burning buildings.

 

In some Moslem areas youth unemployment is in excess of 40%.

 

Moslems regularly attack Jews and damage churches.

 

There are 750 zones urbaines sensibles (ZUS) - usually translated into English as "No go zones" where police are reluctant to venture.  The official French government list is at http://sig.ville.gouv.fr/Atlas/ZUS/

 

If that's working "rather well", I can't imagine what "rather badly" would look like.

 

 

Keep presuming, it seems to be working well for you. Confusing everything too. 

[ClutchClark]

5 minutes ago, Steely Dan said:

I quite agree, but even here there needs to be common sense applying it. What about parades featuring Chinese dragons? Does each person inside have to stick their head out of a porthole (even though they all look the same)? You could certainly hide a large firecracker inside one of them things.

 

There could be a single exception made for people who are wearing dragon costumes within so many metres of a parade route? 

[NativeSon360]

OP ~ nonsense. The Burkini ban has absolutely nothing to do with infringing upon anyone's "religious" freedoms. Burkini is simply a traditional dress-style, perpetuated in Muslim-based societies. In this topic discussion regard, Burkini applies only when directly related to personal choices made by any Muslim woman residing in a Christian country. 100 years ago, western beach-wear attire was quite similar to the Burkini attire of today.

 

Frankly, I always believed the French to be far more sophisticated, than to lend themselves to dwelling upon such utter nonsense. Perhaps I should review my previous take on French mentality, eh?

Edited August 27, 2016 by NativeSon360

[ClutchClark]

2 minutes ago, NativeSon360 said:

OP ~ nonsense. The Burkini ban has absolutely nothing to do with infringing upon anyone's "religious" freedoms. Burkini is simply a traditional dress-style, originating in Muslim-based society. In this topic discussion regard, Burkini applies only when directly related to personal choices made by any Muslin women residing in a Christian country.

 

Frankly, I always believed the French to be far more sophisticated, than to lend themselves to dwelling upon such utter nonsense. Perhaps I should review my previous take on French mentality, eh?

 

I think this ban was the essence of french thinking. 

 

And I do not mean that in a bad way at all. 

 

They are trying to deal with a grieving process against a threat they had not anticipated. Ofcourse, some decisions will be rash but as we have just seen, these will be moderated. Their democracy is a living and breathing thing. 

 

just my 2 cents  ;-)

[NativeSon360]

22 minutes ago, ClutchClark said:

 

There could be a single exception made for people who are wearing dragon costumes within so many metres of a parade route? 

did you read my edit update, yet?

[NativeSon360]

3 minutes ago, ClutchClark said:

 

I think this ban was the essence of french thinking. 

 

And I do not mean that in a bad way at all. 

 

They are trying to deal with a grieving process against a threat they had not anticipated. Ofcourse, some decisions will be rash but as we have just seen, these will be moderated. Their democracy is a living and breathing thing. 

 

just my 2 cents  ;-)

Indeed. Thanks for that reminder. Cheers

[Scott]

Inflammatory post removed.  

[NongKhaiKid]

I sincerely hope whoever is in charge of these things allows me to live until 2022 and the World Cup in Qatar  so I can marvel at the amount of restrictions the authorities there will warn fans from all over the world apply and WILL BE enforced.

[swanny321]

6 hours ago, Class C said:

 

You could make a good case for arguing that France is inciting the whole situation by allowing ‘charlie hebdo’ cartoons that are totally disrespectful. 

 

Where is the logic in fanning the flames ?

 

charlie hebdo cartoons
 

 

  I was going to say 'I'm prone to agree with you!' but laying prone you're likely to get <deleted>'d, I think the word is appeasement.

[NativeSon360]

2 hours ago, Calach said:

 

In reality the integration of most Muslims in France works rather well, but of course we rarely notice normality. But constantly pointing them as the main challenge for the nation and for "identity" may indeed in the end alienate them and push them towards religion and communalism. 

Interesting thought pattern. Thanks for sharing.

[swanny321]

3 hours ago, ClutchClark said:

 

I thought burkini included a head covering?

 

I like all the muslims here on Sukhumvit...some of those women are quite beautiful and I love to openly check them out with a hungry lustlful eyeful in front of their hubbies.

 

i am an old man and some of those young cuties still enjoy the attention. 

 

;-)

 

  Ughuh!

[Oxx]

43 minutes ago, NativeSon360 said:

Burkini is simply a traditional dress-style, perpetuated in Muslim-based societies.

 

Uh, the "burkini" was invented in the early 2000's by the Australian fashion designer Aheda Zanetti.  Note quite sure how "traditional" and "perpetuated in Muslim-based societies" fits in.

 

Zanetti herself says that around 40% of customers aren't even Moslem.  One famous burkini wearer is (Jewish) Nigella Lawson.

[Calach]

31 minutes ago, NativeSon360 said:

OP ~ nonsense. The Burkini ban has absolutely nothing to do with infringing upon anyone's "religious" freedoms. Burkini is simply a traditional dress-style, originating in Muslim-based society. In this topic discussion regard, Burkini applies only when directly related to personal choices made by any Muslin women residing in a Christian country. 100 years ago, western beach-wear attire was quite similar to the Burkini attire of today.

 

Frankly, I always believed the French to be far more sophisticated, than to lend themselves to dwelling upon such utter nonsense. Perhaps I should review my previous take on French mentality, eh?

 

French have a very strong sense of national identity and common belonging, and no intermediate identity (regional or ethnic, etc) between the nation and individuals. I believe that's why when a French sees a different behaviour or tradition he might feel more concerned or threatened in its own identity, instead of just letting others be. And of course some politicians are entertaining this kind of anguish for electoral purposes, others following the movement by fear of being excluded of the game. 

 

And yes, France does have a culture of authoritarian state, deemed legitimate by the mass to interfere in people individual choices. 

 

However many French are ashamed and scandalized by this debate and the repeated attempts to basic individual freedom. Though it can't be denied there's a part of the French mentality that is intolerant, or turned so in the face of modern challenges. 

[metisdead]

An offensive post has been removed. 

[GuestHouse]

Welcome to the beach ladies, wear a bikini or a burqini or your birthday suit as you wish. (Well certainly at the beach at Nice).

 

You can come to the beach safe in the knowledge that those who have been ranting about defending the freedoms and rights of French people before the Conseiller d'État suspended the band on Burqinis, will now stand by you are defend you against anyone harassing you for exercising the rights you have under French law. 

 

Please don't be afraid of these people, the eagerness has always been to uphold rights under the law and decry people who break the law, they are not only interested in upholding the law when the law supports their own personal point of view. 

 

The next time someone tells you to 'go back to where you belong', 'go live in a Muslim company' or demands you remove your Burquini, there are dozens of members of TVF who will be eager and willing to support your liberty and rights to wear your Burqini as underscored by the Conseiller d'État.

 

The guardians of freedom and liberty are with you. 

Edited August 27, 2016 by GuestHouse

[ClutchClark]

2 minutes ago, GuestHouse said:

Welcome to the beach ladies, wear a bikini or a burqini or your birthday suit as you wish. (Well certainly at the beach at Nice).

 

You can come to the beach safe in the knowledge that those who have been ranting about defending the freedoms and rights of French people before the Conseiller d'État suspended the band on Burqinis, will now stand by you are defend you against anyone harassing you for exercising the rights you have under French law. 

 

Please don't be afraid of these people, the eagerness has always been to uphold rights under the law and decry people who break the law, they are not only interested in upholding the law when the law supports their own personal point of view. 

 

The next time someone tells you to 'go back to where you belong', 'go live in a Muslim company' or demands you remove your Burquini, there are dozens of members of TVF who will be eager and willing to support your liberty and rights to wear your Burqini as underscored by the Conseiller d'État.

 

The guardians of freedom and liberty are with you. 

 

That is very well written.

 

I certainly do not speak for the French but I wish the USA would foolow Australia on this one.

 

cheers

[stander]

Shame the French court has overruled the burkini ban (for now) with elections soon the new government will ban it

[happy Joe]

2 minutes ago, stander said:

Shame the French court has overruled the burkini ban (for now) with elections soon the new government will ban it

 

You're still wrong, Stander. The next French president will probably Alain Juppe and he spoke clearly and courageously against the ban Burkini.

[stander]

5 minutes ago, happy Joe said:

 

You're still wrong, Stander. The next French president will probably Alain Juppe and he spoke clearly and courageously against the ban Burkini.

We will see happy Joe, ........

Sarkozy told supporters in Chateaurenard, his first rally for the 2017 election, that the full-body swimwear known as the burkini should be banned throughout the country.

 

Edited August 27, 2016 by stander

[GuestHouse]

19 minutes ago, stander said:

Shame the French court has overruled the burkini ban (for now) with elections soon the new government will ban it

 

Explain to me stander, where is the shame in the Conseiller d'État upholding the law?

[stander]

The burkini is not about a dress choice, it’s about  a warped theology, which is nothing more than medieval clerical opinion with its 7th Century barbarism.

[ilostmypassword]

5 minutes ago, stander said:

The burkini is not about a dress choice, it’s about  a warped theology, which is nothing more than medieval clerical opinion with its 7th Century barbarism.

 

Clearly you are completely and utterly ignorant of the history of Islam.  Let's just say that when Europe was in its dark ages, the Islamic world was by far the most civilized portion of the globe. (With China running a close second) Literature and the sciences flourished. Islam was certainly far more tolerant of Christians and Jews than the Christianity was of Muslims and Jews.

[ClutchClark]

4 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Clearly you are completely and utterly ignorant of the history of Islam.  Let's just say that when Europe was in its dark ages, the Islamic world was by far the most civilized portion of the globe. (With China running a close second) Literature and the sciences flourished. Islam was certainly far more tolerant of Christians and Jews than the Christianity was of Muslims and Jews.

 

I have read all those same attributes and I am left with only one question:  What happened?