How are the condos like in view talay 6?

[pegman]

I've read before that the exception are units on the ground floor which can be rented down to a daily basis. View Talay 2a has a couple of these.

[ThaiBob]

Thanks to the posters and their rental links. On airnbn I see 3 units available for daily rates at vt6 (after I registered for the website).  I also saw units in vt5d, vt5c and vt7 which are of interest to me. I saw no evidence of obvious subleasing but the illegal daily renting is troublesome. This will be discussed by the homeowners committee and our lawyer. I would think the Pattaya hotel association (especially with all the vacancies)  would be interested as it is competition in violation of the law. 

[Jiu-Jitsu]

8 hours ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

Great idea to get sued by 10 different landlords.

 

I honestly think that selling crack in Thailand would be a safer bet than this scummy "business".

 

You just don't mess with other people's property.

 

I think that you are getting a bit carried away. If sub letting is not excluded and the sub-letter maintains the property, there should be no major issue. It's a business after all.

The landlord is renting out their property to make money. They are not being altruistic.

Not saying that I agree with the practice, just saying that your statements are patently ridiculous.

 

So if you "honestly think that selling crack is better", I honestly think that you are a bit cracked.

 

[newnative]

The problem, Jiu-Jitsu, is that it's illegal.  The landlord has rented his condo out for a year to a renter--no problem there.  The renter of the condo is then turning around and using the condo as a hotel room, renting it daily--that is in violation of the Thai Hotel Law.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

41 minutes ago, Jiu-Jitsu said:

 

I think that you are getting a bit carried away. If sub letting is not excluded and the sub-letter maintains the property, there should be no major issue. It's a business after all.

The landlord is renting out their property to make money. They are not being altruistic.

Not saying that I agree with the practice, just saying that your statements are patently ridiculous.

 

So if you "honestly think that selling crack is better", I honestly think that you are a bit cracked.

 

 

You are honestly telling me the landlords agree their condos be used by different guests they have never met?

 

Subletting is different than AirBnB rental.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

19 minutes ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

You are honestly telling me the landlords agree their condos be used by different guests they have never met?

 

Subletting is different than AirBnB rental.

 

 

No I'm telling you that you suggesting that selling 'crack' is better than subletting is madness.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

22 minutes ago, newnative said:

The problem, Jiu-Jitsu, is that it's illegal.  The landlord has rented his condo out for a year to a renter--no problem there.  The renter of the condo is then turning around and using the condo as a hotel room, renting it daily--that is in violation of the Thai Hotel Law.

 

I'm not arguing with that....I'm disagreeing with the statement that selling 'crack' is better.  

 

As to what is legal and illegal....sometimes "the law is an ass". It doesn't affect me either way. My point is simply, that the suggestion that selling 'crack' is better is pure madness.

 

I agree with the point that it can be an inconvenience for others to have to put up with short term lets. But then even one month lets can be an inconvenience.

 

It's what happens when people buy property for the purpose of speculation. Perhaps that should be outlawed?

 

The are many points of view.

[Rimmer]

Off topic posts removed, please get off the crack and back on topic thank you

[newnative]

There are a lot more issues than just 'inconvenience' in regard to short-term rentals and the laws prohibiting them in residential condominiums are rightly in place to protect the residents. I'd love to see one month rentals outlawed, too, but at least you are only dealing with at the most 12 different neighbors a year. With daily renters it could be 200, 300 or more.  I think many condo residents would be happy if these people doing illegal  short-term rentals as a business were out selling crack instead.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

3 hours ago, newnative said:

There are a lot more issues than just 'inconvenience' in regard to short-term rentals and the laws prohibiting them in residential condominiums are rightly in place to protect the residents. I'd love to see one month rentals outlawed, too, but at least you are only dealing with at the most 12 different neighbors a year. With daily renters it could be 200, 300 or more.  I think many condo residents would be happy if these people doing illegal  short-term rentals as a business were out selling crack instead.

 

 

I rent apartments almost exclusively when I travel, as they often provide superior accommodation. Perhaps you could explain to me what inconvenience I cause in doing so?

Even if there were twelve different neighbours per year...so what? Would I be using the facilities any more than the landlord, if the landlord was resident in the apartment?

 

Of course there should be steps taken to protect long term residents. Landlords need to be held responsible. but that doesn't mean that they should be disallowed from renting their apartments.

 

The laws are hardly there to protect long term residents, but to protect businesses, such as hotels and their subsequent tax payments. 

 

I am sure that I cause no inconvenience to any long term residents. That is just nonsense. Wear and tear indeed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[newnative]

You misread my post.  I said there were a lot more issues than just inconvenience with regard to short-term renters.  You seem to think it is just an inconvenience but it's more than that. Someone renting for a month or more will have filled out a rental contract with information about himself, including things like employment, references, emergency contact number, etc.  The landlord likely would have likely met with him and made a judgement as to whether he was someone he would want living in his condo. The renter would have had to come up with the first and last months rent and a security deposit--so figure maybe 60,000 baht rather than 2,000 baht for a 1 night rental.   With daily renters there is little or no screening so there is a big issue regarding the safety of the condo's residents. Another issue is the conduct of the daily renters both in their rooms and on the property. You may be an ideal short-term renter but I assure you that many aren't.  They have no respect for the condo's rules--and why should they? They're just here for a day or two and then they're gone. Broken glass beer bottle in the pool?  Oops, sorry.  I don't know where the trash room is so  I will just open the door and throw the trash in the hall--the hotel maid will get it.    Hotels are equipped to handle short term guests with regard to security, dealing with disruptive guests, and handling all their travel demands--condos aren't.  You may know that you are staying at a condo and you cannot expect hotel services but I assure you that many are clueless and do expect hotel services and they are bothering the condo staff with demands for extra toilet paper, more towels, and tickets to 'that ladyboy show'.   There is also the issue of wear and tear--which you pass off lightly.  Hotels are designed for hard usage--for big, heavy luggage banging off the hall walls and the elevator walls, for lots of people moving in and out every day.  Condos are not.   You mention 'steps taken to protect long term residents'. And, 'landlords need to be held accountable.  Nice, but what steps and who is going to hold them accountable?  The law against short term renters might, indeed, be to protect the hotels but it is also there to protect long term condo residents as well.

[KittenKong]

8 hours ago, Jiu-Jitsu said:

The laws are hardly there to protect long term residents, but to protect businesses, such as hotels and their subsequent tax payments.

 

Actually the internal rules in most condo buildings, and also the condo act which is law, do specifically prohibit the running of businesses outside of the designated commercial section of a building (which is commonly the ground floor). The reason for this is specifically to allow co-owners and residents to live in peace. There has been some discussion about the actual meaning of the Thai wording of the act but there is no doubt in my mind that it does specifically exclude all business activity, and rightly so.

 

The comings and goings of many short-term tenants is entirely detrimental to the building and the well-being of co-owners and residents, and condo buildings are simply not designed for this. What is designed for this are apartment buildings (serviced or otherwise) and these are the buildings that should be receiving tenants for periods of less than, say, 6 months or a year. In most countries in the world, including Thailand, such buildings exist and cause no problems to anyone. There are several of them within a few minutes walk from my condo building.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

10 hours ago, KittenKong said:

 

Actually the internal rules in most condo buildings, and also the condo act which is law, do specifically prohibit the running of businesses outside of the designated commercial section of a building (which is commonly the ground floor). The reason for this is specifically to allow co-owners and residents to live in peace. There has been some discussion about the actual meaning of the Thai wording of the act but there is no doubt in my mind that it does specifically exclude all business activity, and rightly so.

 

The comings and goings of many short-term tenants is entirely detrimental to the building and the well-being of co-owners and residents, and condo buildings are simply not designed for this. What is designed for this are apartment buildings (serviced or otherwise) and these are the buildings that should be receiving tenants for periods of less than, say, 6 months or a year. In most countries in the world, including Thailand, such buildings exist and cause no problems to anyone. There are several of them within a few minutes walk from my condo building.

 

 

?? What is the difference between a 'Condo' and an Apartment?? Is there some kind of different construction method? What you are writing doesn't make sense at all.

In fact I rent 'condos' and apartments from the owners of the building as well as individual owners. We don't use the word 'condominium' in the UK.

 

So they rent the condo or apartment out on the ground floor. There is no business going on in the apartment. You really should stop.

 

If it's ok in an apartment, it's ok in a condo. Just semantics.

 

[Jiu-Jitsu]

12 hours ago, newnative said:

You misread my post.  I said there were a lot more issues than just inconvenience with regard to short-term renters.  You seem to think it is just an inconvenience but it's more than that. Someone renting for a month or more will have filled out a rental contract with information about himself, including things like employment, references, emergency contact number, etc.  The landlord likely would have likely met with him and made a judgement as to whether he was someone he would want living in his condo. The renter would have had to come up with the first and last months rent and a security deposit--so figure maybe 60,000 baht rather than 2,000 baht for a 1 night rental.   With daily renters there is little or no screening so there is a big issue regarding the safety of the condo's residents. Another issue is the conduct of the daily renters both in their rooms and on the property. You may be an ideal short-term renter but I assure you that many aren't.  They have no respect for the condo's rules--and why should they? They're just here for a day or two and then they're gone. Broken glass beer bottle in the pool?  Oops, sorry.  I don't know where the trash room is so  I will just open the door and throw the trash in the hall--the hotel maid will get it.    Hotels are equipped to handle short term guests with regard to security, dealing with disruptive guests, and handling all their travel demands--condos aren't.  You may know that you are staying at a condo and you cannot expect hotel services but I assure you that many are clueless and do expect hotel services and they are bothering the condo staff with demands for extra toilet paper, more towels, and tickets to 'that ladyboy show'.   There is also the issue of wear and tear--which you pass off lightly.  Hotels are designed for hard usage--for big, heavy luggage banging off the hall walls and the elevator walls, for lots of people moving in and out every day.  Condos are not.   You mention 'steps taken to protect long term residents'. And, 'landlords need to be held accountable.  Nice, but what steps and who is going to hold them accountable?  The law against short term renters might, indeed, be to protect the hotels but it is also there to protect long term condo residents as well.

 

 

Nonsense. Short term renters also leave a deposit with the likes of AirBnB. If you think the average Pattaya landlord vets their renters, you are clearly retarded. That is why the take deposits....to protect themselves.

 

I own apartments and know how difficult it can be to get a long term renter OUT.  You are just making up silly scenarios about short term renters. I have never engaged in such behaviour, such as breaking glass in the pool.

 

You can have a bad long term tenant just as easily as you can have a bad short term renter. Nonsense about luggage bouncing of the hall walls is just that. Really nonsense.

 

In fact I have had owners/long term residents come over to introduce themselves to me and even offer their apartments to me. That certainly doesn't happen in hotels.

 

I prefer to choose where I stay. Not have it dictated to me.

 

 

 

 

[newnative]

To paraphrase Shakespeare, I think you're protesting too much, bud.  Generally when there is a rule or a law, it's there for a good reason.  Most jurisdictions have laws against short-term rentals in residential condominiums and  the condominiums, themselves,  have their own rules prohibiting it as well.  Most of the condos I've owned in the USA had one year rental minimums.   Thailand's one month minimum is not ideal but it certainly is better that potentially 300 or more strangers parading in and out each year--and that's just with one condo unit.  Multiply that by  the number of condos being illegally rented.    The rules and laws are in place for all the reasons I've talked about any probably some I've left out--and protecting hotels doesn't enter into it as these laws have been in place long before Airbnb and the like.   You may 'prefer to choose where I stay' but you're choosing to break the law--and most of the law-abiding  residents for whom the condominium is their home don't want you there.

[newnative]

Just noticed the earlier post.  Don't know about the UK but in America apartments and condominiums are two completely different things.  An apartment is a building with individual living units owned by a company with the specific purpose of renting out the units to renters.  It is a BUSINESS.  A condominium is a building of individual  living units that are owned by individual owners with restrictions and rules as to what can and cannot be done within and without the individual units.  Example: No pets allowed.  Example: No swimming after 10pm.  Example: No Short-term rentals allowed.  It is a RESIDENCE.  (Not a hotel.)

[Jiu-Jitsu]

5 hours ago, newnative said:

Just noticed the earlier post.  Don't know about the UK but in America apartments and condominiums are two completely different things.  An apartment is a building with individual living units owned by a company with the specific purpose of renting out the units to renters.  It is a BUSINESS.  A condominium is a building of individual  living units that are owned by individual owners with restrictions and rules as to what can and cannot be done within and without the individual units.  Example: No pets allowed.  Example: No swimming after 10pm.  Example: No Short-term rentals allowed.  It is a RESIDENCE.  (Not a hotel.)

 

 

You do know that this is not America, don't you Dorothy?

 

When we are writing about the USA, I'll give you a nudge so that you can join the conversation. 

 

Now...let's talk about Thailand...eh? 

 

In the apartments in which I stay, short term renting is not restricted. 

[Jiu-Jitsu]

5 hours ago, newnative said:

To paraphrase Shakespeare, I think you're protesting too much, bud.  Generally when there is a rule or a law, it's there for a good reason.  Most jurisdictions have laws against short-term rentals in residential condominiums and  the condominiums, themselves,  have their own rules prohibiting it as well.  Most of the condos I've owned in the USA had one year rental minimums.   Thailand's one month minimum is not ideal but it certainly is better that potentially 300 or more strangers parading in and out each year--and that's just with one condo unit.  Multiply that by  the number of condos being illegally rented.    The rules and laws are in place for all the reasons I've talked about any probably some I've left out--and protecting hotels doesn't enter into it as these laws have been in place long before Airbnb and the like.   You may 'prefer to choose where I stay' but you're choosing to break the law--and most of the law-abiding  residents for whom the condominium is their home don't want you there.

 

Law abiding residents? A rather baseless leap. Have you met them?

Thailand's one month minimum is not ideal, for whom? Certainly ideal for those who want to rent their apartments out for a month.

May I suggest that you move back to the USA, if Thailand's laws are not 'ideal' for you?

 

You agree with the law when they are in your favour and disagree when they don't. What a surprise.

 

I often stay in Centrepoint Serviced Apartments. Offered much more than the competing hotels. Would stay both short and long term. Because of lobbying by competing hotels, they are now registered as hotels.

 

I am sure that there are many who purchased units in View Talay 6 so they can rent them out....both short term and long term.

I can't imagine that there are too many who would wish to make a box in the sky their permanent home.

Not accounting for the taste of some folks.

 

 

 

...and I'm not your bud, <deleted>.

 

 

 

 

[KittenKong]

10 hours ago, Jiu-Jitsu said:

?? What is the difference between a 'Condo' and an Apartment?? Is there some kind of different construction method? What you are writing doesn't make sense at all.

 

The difference is the ownership structure and purpose.

[newnative]

Yes, let's talk about Thailand. What I mentioned about apartments and condos being different in USA applies to Thailand, too.  Thailand has what they call "Serviced Apartments'--a building consisting of rental units that can be rented.  It has one owner and it is operated as a business--same as USA for the most part. Condos here are the same as in USA in regard to having multiple owners and having rules and regulations and restrictions on rental terms.  I don't know what the laws are regarding serviced apartments but with condos if you are renting for less than a month you are breaking the Thai Hotel Law and probably the condo's rules and regulations.   It would be nice if the rental period was longer than a month, but at least the law is there.  I think you will find that there are a number of us making our homes in 'boxes in the sky' here, and boxes closer to the ground, in both large and small ones.  Sorry you feel we have no taste.  Which begs the question, if you think these boxes are so awful and tasteless, why do you want to rent one short term and break the law?

[Jiu-Jitsu]

11 minutes ago, newnative said:

Yes, let's talk about Thailand. What I mentioned about apartments and condos being different in USA applies to Thailand, too.  Thailand has what they call "Serviced Apartments'--a building consisting of rental units that can be rented.  It has one owner and it is operated as a business--same as USA for the most part. Condos here are the same as in USA in regard to having multiple owners and having rules and regulations and restrictions on rental terms.  I don't know what the laws are regarding serviced apartments but with condos if you are renting for less than a month you are breaking the Thai Hotel Law and probably the condo's rules and regulations.   It would be nice if the rental period was longer than a month, but at least the law is there.  I think you will find that there are a number of us making our homes in 'boxes in the sky' here, and boxes closer to the ground, in both large and small ones.  Sorry you feel we have no taste.  Which begs the question, if you think these boxes are so awful and tasteless, why do you want to rent one short term and break the law?

 

Duh....because it is short term.

 

I know about Serviced Apartments. Is that what we were discussing? I don't recall you using that term before I utilised it.

 

In addition, I was under the impression that this thread is about View Talay 6....and your silly statements about broken glass and big luggage banging against the wall and wear and tear....as if having a long term tenant will produce less wear and tear. Patently ridiculous.

 

Short term can cover one month.....or is that long term in your eyes? It's only you who has made ridiculous and presumptuous statements about breaking the law and broken glass in the pool. 

Rein in the over dramatic statements or you might be accused of being a drama queen.

 

 

 

 

[gmac]

On 3 September 2016 at 0:27 AM, Jiu-Jitsu said:

 

 

I rent apartments almost exclusively when I travel, as they often provide superior accommodation. Perhaps you could explain to me what inconvenience I cause in doing so?

Even if there were twelve different neighbours per year...so what? Would I be using the facilities any more than the landlord, if the landlord was resident in the apartment?

 

Of course there should be steps taken to protect long term residents. Landlords need to be held responsible. but that doesn't mean that they should be disallowed from renting their apartments.

 

The laws are hardly there to protect long term residents, but to protect businesses, such as hotels and their subsequent tax payments. 

 

I am sure that I cause no inconvenience to any long term residents. That is just nonsense. Wear and tear indeed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Interesting short-sighted view of the level of inconvenience caused to long-term residents.  I have previously lived in condo's and apartments and the difference between short and long term stayers is huge.  On a floor with only long term renters I rarely saw or even heard my neighbours, with short term lets the noise was constant with frequent comings and goings at all hours.  

[KittenKong]

13 minutes ago, gmac said:

Interesting short-sighted view of the level of inconvenience caused to long-term residents.  I have previously lived in condo's and apartments and the difference between short and long term stayers is huge.  On a floor with only long term renters I rarely saw or even heard my neighbours, with short term lets the noise was constant with frequent comings and goings at all hours.  

 

Yes, this is exactly the problem. Short--term tenants neither know nor care about how their activities affect the building or other residents. They care only about themselves.

 

It is for this reason that they are banned in condos here. In places where there is massive tourism (near the theme parks in Florida, for example) villages and condo buildings are often zoned to allow short- and medium-term rentals in some but to restrict rentals to long periods or not at all in others. This is exactly what should be implemented and enforced rigorously here.

[newnative]

Why would you want to stay in a so-called tasteless box even short-term?  You can protest all you want but there are valid reasons why there are laws on the books prohibiting short stays in residential condominiums both here and elsewhere.

[Peterw42]

14 minutes ago, gmac said:

Interesting short-sighted view of the level of inconvenience caused to long-term residents.  I have previously lived in condo's and apartments and the difference between short and long term stayers is huge.  On a floor with only long term renters I rarely saw or even heard my neighbours, with short term lets the noise was constant with frequent comings and goings at all hours.  

 

I was in my condo management office yesterday sorting some things out. In comes Vladimir and Tatiana (on their 1 week vacation from the tractor factory in Siberia) with a broken TV remote control. The condo manager explained that this is not a hotel and this is not hotel reception. Told Vlad that he had rented (illegally) directly from the owner, pointed to the big sign on the wall (in Russian) "No short term rentals" any problems talk to the owner. Vlad didnt get it, as far as he was concerned, he was in a hotel, wanted the TV remote fixed, some towels for the pool and some water for the fridge.

I saw Vlad later that day, he had just had a couple of beers by the pool, and left the empties for the hotel staff to take care of.

 

[newnative]

Multiply Vlad by the number of rooms being rented  illegally short-term...   I've seen very angry and abusive behavior directed at condo staff by illegal short term renters who have arrived to be 'checked in' to their room and the owner or rental agent has not shown up and is nowhere to be found.  Of course the anger and abuse is directed at the nearest convenient target--the condo reception staff--and they are expected to be able to locate the agent or 'check in' the guest--never mind that doing so would be aiding the breaking of the law. 

[Seizetheday]

47 minutes ago, newnative said:

Multiply Vlad by the number of rooms being rented  illegally short-term...   I've seen very angry and abusive behavior directed at condo staff by illegal short term renters who have arrived to be 'checked in' to their room and the owner or rental agent has not shown up and is nowhere to be found.  Of course the anger and abuse is directed at the nearest convenient target--the condo reception staff--and they are expected to be able to locate the agent or 'check in' the guest--never mind that doing so would be aiding the breaking of the law. 

Can't believe it but I'm going to agree with you, I've just learnt there is a house in our village that does Airbnb short term  rentals, when I get back home to Pattaya I'll be reporting it to the committee and hoping the rules are the same for houses. 

[Jiu-Jitsu]

7 hours ago, newnative said:

Why would you want to stay in a so-called tasteless box even short-term?  You can protest all you want but there are valid reasons why there are laws on the books prohibiting short stays in residential condominiums both here and elsewhere.

 

 

Because that is all that is near the beach....in that seaside resort. Otherwise I would have a bungalow at the beach. Any other silly questions?

I'm not protesting silly, you are. I'm getting what I want. It's you who is complaining about it....remember? Wow.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

7 hours ago, gmac said:

Interesting short-sighted view of the level of inconvenience caused to long-term residents.  I have previously lived in condo's and apartments and the difference between short and long term stayers is huge.  On a floor with only long term renters I rarely saw or even heard my neighbours, with short term lets the noise was constant with frequent comings and goings at all hours.  

 

 

Interestingly biased view of short term renters.

[Howitzer]

so if i book an apartment from say agoda for this condo it might not actually be a smart thing to do?