Expanding Vs Moving Chiang Mai Airport

[sabaijai]

Read a small Post item the other day saying that residents of Tambon Mae Hia were protesting a statement by a development company saying they had surveyed the residents of that tambon (as well as Tambon Suthep) and that 87% of the respondees said they favoured expanding the current airport rather than moving it. Those protesting the statement said they didn't believe there had been any such survey.

I live in Tambon Suthep and have seen no such survey here, nor have any of my neighbours or friends living in T. Suthep. So I suspect the Mae Hia folks are right.

Besides who of us living at one end or the other of the current airport would want to see it expanded, thus inviting more jet noise, etc?

Just wondering what other Ch Mai folks think. Personally I'd rather see the airport moved out to Sankamphaeng or Sanpatong, two possibilities that have been proposed.

[mrmnp]

Nothing personal, saba... but people who locate near an airport and then later complain about more noise and growth only have themselves to blame. I don't think there is an airport in the world that doesn't have similar complaints.

Legally it is callled moving to a nuisance and has no legitimate legal grounds.

When I looked to buy a house two years ago, many agents tried to show we housing in or around the airport or down Hang Dong Road, but it was clear that an airport with eight flights a day in the second largest city in Thailand was due for a major increase in traffic.

Arriving by air, you fly over many new housing developments, some even under construction at this time and one wonders, who would build or live so close to an airport or its approaches. You have answered that question.

[peterdigger]

My wife and I live in Mae Hia (renting while we build elsewhere) and I can only confirm that there has been no survey in our Tambon. My wife's Thai family live 2 doors from us and WANT the airport extended, as there is a solid rumour in our suburb that houses may be bought by the government as part of the extension plan. I like aircraft, but not noise and that is why we bought land in town away from the flight path. There is plenty of land available in our suburb, but with all the new airlines we see and hear umpteen planes a day. Incidently, they would have to extend the runway about 3klms before it would affect our suburb ! Guess the compensation AND the survey are just rumours....

[chanchao]

Well... I personally think that having an airport so close by the city is heaven.. To catch the 7:15 flight to Bangkok I can leave the house at 6:40 and be on time to catch the flight.

The Mae Hia people (which includes me) have had airplane noise all the time, and the worst affected area is perhaps the newer, posh housing estate Ban Khwan Wiang.. Anyone who bought a house there knew very well what he was getting into.

The area on the South end of the airport isn't even that densely populated, no more than Sankamphaeng or Sanpatong anyway: When moving the airport there, that would just create other people having to endure airplane noise, and those people really did NOT know what they got into when settling down there.

I think airports are part of the 'urban buzz' that city dwellers opt for by dwelling in or near a city in the first place. As long as the planes don';t take off directly over the city (they mostly dont, as both starts and landings are over the Southern out-of-town end), I think having some airplane noise is just part of living in a city area.

Actually, moving an airport is just a very costly affair.. And raises queations of corruption.. who by the way owns lots of land in the Sankamphaeng area??

The current airport is far big enough for the moment. (The runway anyway). Thai airways lands 747-400's there on holidays!!! Do planes get bigger than that? Perhaps the terminal building could be expanded a little with a few more gates with movable walkways, but there is probably enough space for that. Chiang Mai air traffic is not going to grow THAT much.

Finally, I was in Had Yai recently. Had to go to the airport. Taxi & tuk tuk drivers wanted 200 baht because the airport is so far away!!! Finally settled for 150 baht, for the indeed very far trip. Happy you can get to CNX airport for just 10 baht.

Cheers,

Chanchao

[Goat Roper]

The current airport is far big enough for the moment. (The runway anyway). Thai airways lands 747-400's there on holidays!!! Do planes get bigger than that?

It is my understanding that the landing of a 747-400 at CNX is no problem as long as fuel load is light(and it usually is coming in) but for International outbound flights with a full load of souls, baggage and fuel tanks topped off the 747-400 does not have enough runway to take off. I was told this by a commercial airline pilot( I am not sure he was a 747 pilot though).

[chanchao]

Okay.. I wonder where they want to fly them then.. Orient Air flies seriously old 747-200's to Hong Kong straight out of Chiang Mai.

Also not that the runway could perhaps be lengthened somewhat by making the Hand Dong road go under the extended runway. On the other end is Transport Authority land anyway, if they must extend that far.

And then, what airline actually wants to fly big planes all the way to Europe from Chiang Mai.. I'm not sure the market is there..

Of course I don't know this for a fact, if there is indeed enough space there that can be gained or not.. Seems to me though that if you can fly an old 747-200 all the way out to Hong Kong with the current runway, then I don't think all THAT much extra space is needed..

[Goat Roper]

Okay.. I wonder where they want to fly them then.. Orient Air flies seriously old 747-200's to Hong Kong straight out of Chiang Mai.

Also not that the runway could perhaps be lengthened somewhat by making the Hand Dong road go under the extended runway. On the other end is Transport Authority land anyway, if they must extend that far.

And then, what airline actually wants to fly big planes all the way to Europe from Chiang Mai.. I'm not sure the market is there..

Of course I don't know this for a fact, if there is indeed enough space there that can be gained or not.. Seems to me though that if you can fly an old 747-200 all the way out to Hong Kong with the current runway, then I don't think all THAT much extra space is needed..

It was dear Thaksin's idea to extend the runway about 1800(?) meters as I recall and yes this did require the building of an underpass on Hangdong road. I did some research into this awhile back when I was considering buying a house in that general area, I do not know where this project stands today and as I recall the estimated cost of this project was Billions plus of Thai Baht, don't remember the staggering number though.

I think you are correct, the 747-200's that fly to Hong Kong are not loaded with people or fuel.

I'm with you, I can't imagine outbound flights going Chiang Mai to Europe direct.

[trawler]

To clarify the 'old 747' to Hong Kong bit.The flight time to Hkg from CnX is approx 3 hrs nd 15 mins.A old 747 can do 12-14 hours non stop when its fully loaded with people/bags nd fuel but as another forum member mentioned it needs a longer runway to get off the ground.So if CNX wants to be a International gateway to Thailand then the runway needs to be extended slightly to cope with non stop flights from further afield than Hkg or other regional airports.

The runway length does limit the flexibility of CNX airport currently as does the lack of suffiecent taxi-ways/airbridges and terminal size.

The effect of making the airport bigger/more useable would be of economic benefit to the city/region.Downside is additional noise/traffic etc etc but being able to get to a international airport within about 20 minutes for most people outways the negatives.

Buying/renting near a airport is going to be noisier than living on the other side of town,but I believe the airport has been there a long time so should not have surprised anyone.

[sabaijai]

Mrmnp - The airport effects residents other than newcomers who 'knew what they were getting into' so I feel the residents of affected tambons have a right to voice their say regardless. Furthermore, if someone falsely claims to have surveyed them, then the fraud should be exposed for what it is.

As for corruption, I didn't mention this in my original post cuz I was hoping to get unbaised opinions (an absurd thought!), but the airport has been scheduled to be re-located for quite some time. The new talk about expansion is directly related to a contract that someone in the thetsabaan wants to push through for a fat kickback. You may be reading more about this soon in City Life. No, I don't write for City Life, but someone I know who does is very close to this story.

Anyway, all valid points. We'll see what happens. Meanwhile I may carry out my own survey and see what results come up.

[Goat Roper]

I was hoping to get unbaised opinions (an absurd thought!), but the airport has been scheduled to be re-located for quite some time.

The last I heard is that dear CEO put his foot down and said absolutely that the airport would not be relocated.

[p1p]

Our dear leader, Taxin, has it in his heart to turn Chiang Mai into a regional aviation hub and that will definitely involve extention of the runway.

I have seen no proposals for any upgrading of the terminal facilities though, and this seems to be required now if the crowds and lack of parking I was experiencing in January are anything to go by.

[chanchao]

Of course there's also the Wing 41 airforce land.. A huge plot that could be used for all the parking & terminal buildings ever needed.. then a replacement military airport could be built somewhere else..

But noooo.. military 'owns' the land.. not the government/people apparently. Same with that silly but very convenient road for which I now finally have a sticker on my windshield so I can pass it.. ;-)

Cheers,

Chanchao

[sabaijai]

Yes the one small advantage to living in a tambon next to the airport is that you can get a sticker to drive through the kawng bin -- sure saves time getting to Airport Plaza ...

[chanchao]

Or you just make up a reason why you have to be at CMU or the general Suthep area.

[Ricardo]

And then, what airline actually wants to fly big planes all the way to Europe from Chiang Mai.. I'm not sure the market is there..

Although you Might make a case , for Thai to look at a 2-stop round-trip to lesser places that are not currently served at all - such as Manchester & Amsterdam ?

And what do they plan to do , with all those 747-400s , once the new 2-decker Airbus A800 appears on their major Europe-BKK routes , in a couple of years' time ?

Were'nt there rumours of direct-to-Europe flights , a couple of years ago ?

I know - T.I.T.

[meadish_sweetball]

And then, what airline actually wants to fly big planes all the way to Europe from Chiang Mai.. I'm not sure the market is there..

I might be naive, but I feel rather sure the market will be there, maybe not next year, but within the next ten years at least.

Thailand is still on the way up as a tourist nation, and people who return (of which there are MANY) are bound to come to the North at one point - eventually they get bored of the beaches - some of them will return, and some of them will retire here or try to make a living otherwise.

[chanchao]

> Were'nt there rumours of direct-to-Europe flights , a couple of years ago ?

Heck, there were rumours of a large SUBWAY/UNDERGROUND or LIGHT RAIL network in Chiang Mai a couple of years ago..! I assume that you too read the BKKPost crapola and added up the numbers and then came to the conclusion that even if the COMPLETE population of Chiang Mai would use the thing EVERY DAY, then they's STILL not break even in anyone's lifetime! ;-)

Anyway, if TG can't fill Amsterdam to Bangkok, why would they be able to fill Amsterdam to Chiang Mai I wonder.. Not everyone wants to go to Chiang Mai, strange as it may seem to us.

Cheers,

Chanchao

[meadish_sweetball]

Chanchao:

Anyway, if TG can't fill Amsterdam to Bangkok, why would they be able to fill Amsterdam to Chiang Mai I wonder..

A more convenient route for smuggling methamphetamines out of Burma, perhaps? Amsterdam is the reloading and logistics centre for distributing all manner of illicit substances and plants out into the rest of Europe...

[Johpa]

Of course there's also the Wing 41 airforce land.. A huge plot that could be used for all the parking & terminal buildings ever needed.. then a replacement military airport could be built somewhere else..

But noooo.. military 'owns' the land.. not the government/people apparently. Same with that silly but very convenient road for which I now finally have a sticker on my windshield so I can pass it.. ;-)

There is already an underused runway up near Mae Rim that could easily be used, with a few modifications and support enhancements, by Wing 41 and their Broncos and whatever else they might fly .

And it is not the "military" that owns the land but the generals who happen to be in positions of power at the time who claim title to the land and who are hoping for huge kickbacks. No different than the useless Air Force base at Don Muang where the generals get a nice cash flow from the golf course not to mention being able to provide jobs for their remote in-laws to drive taxis out of the civilian side of the airport and keep the wife happy in spite of the mia noi.

Happy Trails

Johpa

[ThaiPauly]

I have been very reliable information that the airport is definatley going to be extended and that the final plans for the extension were approved two weeks ago, and it IS so that they can get flights bound for europe out

Who told me this? The developer that is buiding my house, does not bother me as I have lived under the Heathrow and Brize Norton flightpaths before I moved to LOS, but he should knowas it will affect his house sales (oh and he told me after we had paid the deposit on the land) Mai Pben Rai