British migrant rights defender Andy Hall found guilty in a shock ruling by Bangkok court

[BlindMagician]

20 minutes ago, DiscoDan said:

Baby naieve ? 

 

Where the prove of andy's claims I have not seen any have you ?

"If Andy Hall had hard evidence then he would of been found not guilty."... naieve.

 

[KBsinter]

What is naieve please.?

[DiscoDan]

Andy Hall said police did not produce enough evidence to find the Burmese guilty in the Koh Tao case,

and the Andy Hall fan club swallow it hook line and sinker

 

Yet the same fan club are happy to judge Natural fruit as guilty without a shred of evidence.

 

 

[TPI]

7 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

 

If someone makes claims about your company that makes you lose money or possibly lose all your customers  don't you think you should have a right to take them to court?

 

 If Andy Hall had hard evidence then he would of been found not guilty.

Sorry mate that's not correct, truth is not a defense in Thailand, even if the company had been found guilty in any court  Andy still would have lost the case because he named names!

[Golden Triangle]

1 hour ago, stander said:

There are two sides to this case one where Natural Fruits evidence includes the fact that government inspectors regularly visited the process plant and found no serious issues. Then there is Halls side, which included research notes, photos and witness accounts and in the end  the judges gave more credence to the Natural Fruits evidence.

 

I wonder if the government inspectors came away slightly better off than when they arrived............................Just saying 

[Golden Triangle]

17 minutes ago, KBsinter said:

What is naieve please.?

 

Him no hab spillchooker 

[Hawk]

26 minutes ago, BlindMagician said:

"If Andy Hall had hard evidence then he would of been found not guilty."... naieve.

 

 

 

What is hard evidence?

 

In Thailand one can have mountains of evidence and still be found guilty, its all down to the judge what he accepts or ignores.

[aussieinthailand]

7 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

 

If someone makes claims about your company that makes you lose money or possibly lose all your customers  don't you think you should have a right to take them to court?

 

 If Andy Hall had hard evidence then he would of been found not guilty.

In your first line you are indeed correct, lies regarding a company and their actions,  yes a  right to justice. 

Are you at all familiar with the case? 

Did you read the post? 

Did Andy Hall write the article?  NO.!!  

Did Andy Hall publish the article?  NO.!!!

Did the people he reported his findings to author and publish the story?  YES.!!!

Did they say this in court?  YES. !!!

Have you ever looked at who the companies main stack holders are and who they a related to?  could it be powerful people?

 

 

[happy Joe]

Imagine for a moment that a Thai activist comes launch public accusations without proof in any Western country.

 

It would be immediately condemned and expelled.

 

That's it. Good riddance!

[useronthenet]

I don't know why ppl are surprised ... not as if this is the first time a foreigner has been rapped for pointing the finger. It does however send a clear message to all foreigners ... mind your own business, or expect the consequences. Thailand is certainly a country that will not tolerate interference from outsiders. 

Edited September 20, 2016 by useronthenet

[Edu48c]

I was so naive. I moved to this country to teach after 25 years teaching in the UK. I had no idea that a complete bunch of corrupt, ignorant a-holes are slowly destroying this country. Going to break my contract and escape. It's just not worth it. <deleted>, all of them

[DiscoDan]

12 minutes ago, aussieinthailand said:

In your first line you are indeed correct, lies regarding a company and their actions,  yes a  right to justice. 

Are you at all familiar with the case? 

Did you read the post? 

Did Andy Hall write the article?  NO.!!  

Did Andy Hall publish the article?  NO.!!!

Did the people he reported his findings to author and publish the story?  YES.!!!

Did they say this in court?  YES. !!!

Have you ever looked at who the companies main stack holders are and who they a related to?  could it be powerful people?

 

 

Could it be powerful people ? what like the the powerful people on Koh Tao did the murders ?problem with both is you don't have any hard evidence to back these claims they are just assumptions.

 

Natural fruit also gave him the chance to apologize and retract his allegations and they would drop charges but he chose to fight it in court and lost.

 

 

[Stardust314]

Thailand   

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, DiscoDan said:

Samui  times  don't seem to have got the memo on worshipping saint Andy maybe now he is a convicted criminal he will show us what all the public donations was spent on. 

 

http://www.samuitimes.com/the-koh-tao-murders-two-years-on/

 

"Far from being pro bono, Andy Hall raised a phenomenal amount of cash through his online campaign from willing members of the public, but never once showed anything other than very sketchy account. Interestingly Hall is using the same defence lawyers for his own legal battle with Natural Fruit over his Finnwatch report"
 

Only a matter of time before you go completely off topic and bring in the K.T. murders. Can I remind you this is about Andy Hall and Natural Fruit

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Maybe TAT can recruit Andy to speak at their upcoming "Expats Love Thailand" tourist fair, or whatever it's being called.

 

That is, if he's not in jail at the time.

 

[Deepinthailand]

1 hour ago, Xircal said:

Consumers can do their bit now by boycotting this company's products.

 

Check the label the next time you want to buy a tin of pineapple slices.

Why would to want to put a thai company out of buisness!!! Because the tree huggers and green peace donkey's say so no I will continue to buy as I please thank you.

[Xircal]

7 minutes ago, Deepinthailand said:

Why would to want to put a thai company out of buisness!!! Because the tree huggers and green peace donkey's say so no I will continue to buy as I please thank you.

 

So you support child labor and companies that pay less than the minimum wage (which is a pittance) to their workers do you?

Edited September 20, 2016 by Xircal
corrected spelling mistake

[SpokaneAl]

A company essentially brings, what is other countries is essentially a civil suit against a person which ends up with that person receiving a prison sentence. Wow - only in Thailand.

Edited September 20, 2016 by SpokaneAl

[DiscoDan]

10 minutes ago, Xircal said:

 

So you support child labor and companies that pay less than the minimum wage (which is a pittance) to their workers do you?

Yeah close the factories and send the workers  back to Burma where they have not even got a minimum wage  that will really help migrant workers out. 

 

 

[BlindMagician]

53 minutes ago, Hawk said:

 

What is hard evidence?

 

In Thailand one can have mountains of evidence and still be found guilty, its all down to the judge what he accepts or ignores.

Evidence has nothing to do with it. Unfortunately.

[aussieinthailand]

9 minutes ago, DiscoDan said:

Could it be powerful people ? what like the the powerful people on Koh Tao did the murders ?problem with both is you don't have any hard evidence to back these claims they are just assumptions.

 

Natural fruit also gave him the chance to apologize and retract his allegations and they would drop charges but he chose to fight it in court and lost.

 

 

Seems you have a problem with reading/research mate.

Are you familiar with the people he has worked with in the past? 

Again.

Did Andy .Hall  wright the article??? NO.!!!

Did Andy Hall. publish the article . NO.!!!

Did the people he submitted his findings to both wright and publish the article and said so in court?  YES.!!!

Do you think that if there was any discrepancy with his report they would investigate further before publishing such a damming article???

Have you researched the owners of the company and their connections to powerful people?  Me thinks NO.!!!

 

 

[Xircal]

2 minutes ago, DiscoDan said:

Yeah close the factories and send the workers  back to Burma where they have not even got a minimum wage  that will really help migrant workers out. 

 

 

 

Typical Strawman mentality. "Let's exploit them for all they're worth because back home they have even less".

 

Companies which exploit children for profit should be put out of business and quick.

[DiscoDan]

At the end of the day what it comes down to is did he break any laws in Thailand if yes he should be punished accordingly.

 

Its like going to Saudi Arabia and doing a "who can draw the best prophet Mohammed competition and winner gets a crate of beer" 

Then moaning that you don't agree with sharia law.

 

 

[Shaunduhpostman]

Earlier in the thread, some commented to the effect that Andy has somehow lost simply because the court has decided to punish him and how silly it all was, you can't win in a Thai court. To my mind that would be missing the point, whether he loses or not is ultimately immaterial, I would have thought it would be obvious to Andy from the get go they wouldn't win their case against Natural Fruit.

 

The whole point of Andy filing a case against Natural Fruit, I would guess, would be because it was the best strategy to expose them to the rest of the world and perhaps more importantly the nature of labor rights and the Thai justice system as he has also seemingly tried to do in the Kao Tao case. He has already won on that level.

 

I can't imagine he would have filed the case thinking he would win in court and everything would be neatly taken care of, it's similar in developed countries where anyone who wants to go against corporate abuses has to be in it for the long haul and sometimes the very long haul. It isn't stupid or naive, its ballsy as hell and what needs to be done. You want to fight, you will have to pay, perhaps even with your life, but if you are lucky you end up simply spending the best years of your life fighting something and ultimately raising awareness of problem, the courts are there ultimately for the corporations, the governments and the powerful to use, not us, and certainly not just in Thailand either.

[Broeno]

And the whole democratic world is looking at the MESS in Thailand again.

[aussieinthailand]

7 minutes ago, DiscoDan said:

Yeah close the factories and send the workers  back to Burma where they have not even got a minimum wage  that will really help migrant workers out. 

 

 

So you do support paying under minimum wage to people regardless of the laws of the land?

You do support child labor regardless of human rights?  

And if they don't like the go back too where you came from....

What a peace of work you are,,,   OOOpp's my bad Did say  the word "work" relating to you???    Disgusting.!!!

[Bkk Brian]

Now the chicken farm is jumping in on the action. Having dinner with the Natural fruit boss and lawyer to plan a similar action on Andy

 

Tuesday's guilty verdict was met with glee by at least one Thai businessman, the owner of a chicken farm who is facing a $1.3 million lawsuit spearheaded by Hall for alleged labor violations.Chicken farmer Chanchai Pheamphon said he planned to celebrate over dinner with Natural Fruit's owner Wirat Piyapornbaiboon and to work with the victorious lawyer to map out his own lawsuit against Hall. https://www.yahoo.com/news/thai-defamation-verdict-setback-anti-slavery-fight-activists-123734105--finance.html

[Xircal]

16 minutes ago, DiscoDan said:

legal team was supplied by the Lawyers council of thailand free of charge the Burmese government offered financial assistance and the thais declined saying they would cover costs, Andy hall sending a legal team is a myth you can ask him yourself if you don't believe me.

 

Where is your evidence that Andy Hall sending a team of lawyers is a myth?

 

You seem to be fond of making accusations, but a dismal failure when it comes to backing them up.

[Khun Han]

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Now the chicken farm is jumping in on the action. Having dinner with the Natural fruit boss and lawyer to plan a similar action on Andy

 

Tuesday's guilty verdict was met with glee by at least one Thai businessman, the owner of a chicken farm who is facing a $1.3 million lawsuit spearheaded by Hall for alleged labor violations.Chicken farmer Chanchai Pheamphon said he planned to celebrate over dinner with Natural Fruit's owner Wirat Piyapornbaiboon and to work with the victorious lawyer to map out his own lawsuit against Hall. https://www.yahoo.com/news/thai-defamation-verdict-setback-anti-slavery-fight-activists-123734105--finance.html

 

It's turning into a Parade Of The Uglys. Put your inner ugliness on the outside with pride in Junta Thailand.

[DiscoDan]

8 minutes ago, Xircal said:

 

Typical Strawman mentality. "Let's exploit them for all they're worth because back home they have even less".

 

Companies which exploit children for profit should be put out of business and quick.

 

Well thats what has just happened to a poultry company that lost its contract to Betagro and had to lay off 100 workers after  claims made by 6 or 7 workers I wonder if the other 93 workers are happy being made redundant ?  they might not of been paid the minimum wage but it was still more than they would earn in Burma.

 

Don't you think its better for all concerned (workers+companies) to resolve these issues behind closed doors with relevant agencies rather than trying to smear companies using  social media ? 

 

One of the workers who complained said he was getting 7 USD a day roughly 240 thb 

 

( sorry I stand corrected Burma now has a minimum wage introduced in Aug 2015)

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/aug/31/burma-minimum-wage-uk-retailers

On Saturday the Burmese government set a minimum wage of 3,600 kyat (£1.82) 

 

GBP 1.82 =  THB 81

 

So do you really think those 90 workers will be happy and feel that MWRN has saved them from being exploited when they are back in Burma earning 80 odd Baht a day instead of THB 240 ?