Yingluck govt had role in 2011 flood: Atthawit

[Remus1830]

If in doubt blame shinawat for everything wrong in Thailand. Sad thing is many Thais actually believe this b.s..

[craigt3365]

10 minutes ago, Remus1830 said:

If in doubt blame shinawat for everything wrong in Thailand. Sad thing is many Thais actually believe this b.s..

What's even sadder is they are to blame for many things that are wrong here!  They did run the country for a majority of the last 15 years.  Which means, they were in control of what happened...or didn't...

Edited September 26, 2016 by craigt3365

[hansnl]

2 hours ago, Thechook said:

It has always been personal by Prayuth.   Yingluk should have purchased those submarines when the military requested them.

It might be looking like a witch-hunt.

But, like the rice business it is all about "misplacing" funds.

As she was PM, ultimately the turd is deposited, rightfully, on her doorstep.

If anybody thinks the Thaksin club did "work for the people's, you might think wrong, they just used the voting for their own ends.

Of course, one should always remember that politics is a business of power, or money, or a combination of the two.

Democracy, in most countries, if not all, has been degraded to a periodical voting circus with no real influence at all.

 

 

[williamgeorgeallen]

4 hours ago, NongKhaiKid said:

As usual here somebody always has ' information ' and in this case why has it taken so long to claim it ?

Straight out of the Chalerm operating manual " I know what happened / who did it / who's responsible etc but I'm not revealing it now. "

any incriminating evidence is redundant unless it is against someone who is the opponent of the government. time to put as much money on your private plane as possible and get out of town ying luck. fighting mismanagement/corruption is just another way of saying taking down you political opponents.

[saminoz]

Give the poor lady a break!!!

After all, didn't she come up with the absolutely brilliant plan for a row of boats across the river to help push the water out?

 

Edited September 26, 2016 by saminoz

[jonclark]

And I think to add a bit of balance, we should also say that Abhisit is also being investigated as the flood bridged the premiership of both of these individuals. 

 

Its very likely therefore that this case is being brought against YL to deflect and distract from Abhisits role, given its a member of the Democrats bringing this case, not the government. 

[craigt3365]

12 minutes ago, jonclark said:

And I think to add a bit of balance, we should also say that Abhisit is also being investigated as the flood bridged the premiership of both of these individuals. 

 

Its very likely therefore that this case is being brought against YL to deflect and distract from Abhisits role, given its a member of the Democrats bringing this case, not the government. 

Read my links.  It's worth your time.

[Kiwiken]

Blame Yingluck but that was some of the heaviest rain in nearly a century. I visited Nakhon Sawan and Uthai Thani and they were under water. A one off disaster that was unforseen.

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, Kiwiken said:

Blame Yingluck but that was some of the heaviest rain in nearly a century. I visited Nakhon Sawan and Uthai Thani and they were under water. A one off disaster that was unforseen.

With respect, please read my links.  Seems a lot of the problems were caused by mismanagement and politics.

[mtls2005]

I love the smell of "Reconciliation" in the morning; it smells like 'Victory'.

 

I understand the yellow/green desire to keep their boot on the neck of the masses, but at some point they've got to let up.

[AsianExport]

It was so clear that it was someone stupid action that led to the flooding, and only people on this forum would not understand this. It seems that everybody was thinking that god only caused it. I d not bland Ying but all the high rank stupid who know nothing and cannot accept that someone is smarter than them to explain them life.

Edited September 26, 2016 by AsianExport

[chilli42]

If mismanagement by government were to be a punishable crime them most of the past heads of state  from around the world would be rotting in jail ... that said not an unpleasant thought.

[chilli42]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

I was tuned in to the issue because I was flooded. I took in all information about the flooding because I had nothing better to do at the time as going out was impossible.

 

I can still accept that she had no knowledge of what was going to happen.. though she is responsible. But I cant accept that they did not tell those that were going to be affected that they would be flooded. They had satellites and planes and saw the mass of water going to BKK.. But said dont worry they just did not warn us or provide us with good intel. The reason was of course loss of face. That part I cant forgive... because of the lack of information many people including me made the wrong decisions. I was lucky that we did not need the car often and stored it at a friends condo. But many in our village were not that lucky and lost their cars. 

 

I would have moved out had i known it was going to flood and that it would last so long. I can partly excuse her for being stupid and causing this flood.. but no excuses for not giving accurate information.  

 

Your point is of course valid.  However, if you have ever been in a leadership position in government or a corporation you will know that you are the last one to hear bad news and in this culture this would be amplified many times. I am no fan of the Taksin clan but on this one I doubt she was even told by her "experts" what was going on until it was too late and alreadyhappening.

Edited September 26, 2016 by chilli42

[Eric Loh]

25 minutes ago, robblok said:

Totally different.. we are talking here about the 2011 floods.. a water-mass that slowly descended and could have been followed on satellites and with planes. No information.. only that we would not flood. It was criminal and cause loads of damage. Your defending it.. your crazy.. probably not lived through the floods like i did. 

 

These floods that are here now are minor in comparison and have not hit large area's like the 2011 one and were far less predictable. But sure you must defend YL. The central plains have not been hit hard besides a few communities that are always hit when it floods.  (and I feel sad for them) But you cannot compare it with 2011. The scale was larger she had far more time to come clean and tell there would be a problem. 

 

Besides later information told them to brace for flooding.. we got no such warnings on time. I have read articles after yours that they warned the down stream of the dam before opening it. 

 

Dont try to assumed about me. I live in Patumthani and my ware house is in Klong Luang. Both premises were flooded and I had to live in the city for 2 months and move my office and goods to Bangna. I lived through the floods and I only blamed the extreme and abnormal weather for the bad luck. The floods didnt hit us overnight    like you trying to make out to be but was a moving slowly southwards. That gave us time to do some sandbagging and time to do an organized evacuation when the situation became dire. 

 

You think the current flood in the central plains are small beans, take a visit to Pathumthani and AngThong, the Royal Irrigation Dept is warning of more floods from Chao Phraya. Once again, I am bracing for eventualities that may hit me. 

 

 

[mesterm]

When it floods during our rule, it was a fault of nature. But when it floods during their rule...

[metisdead]

Off topic posts have been removed.  A post containing a link to Bangkok Post has been removed as well as the replies:

 

26) The Bangkok Post and Phuketwan do not allow quotes from their news articles or other material to appear on Thaivisa.com. Neither do they allow links to their publications. Posts from members containing quotes from or links to Bangkok Post or Phuketwan publications will be deleted from the forum.

[elgordo38]

I think you will see more and more moves by the Democratic party to "snuggle up" to the junta. They want a power play role in the new world order of Thailand the next step forward?. They can not rid the country of the Shin's at the ballot box so other methods as we see in progress now must be used to destroy them. There no doubt will be more worms coming out of the woodwork with weird charges with crazy glue attached to them. A martyr in the making. 

[robblok]

40 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

 

Dont try to assumed about me. I live in Patumthani and my ware house is in Klong Luang. Both premises were flooded and I had to live in the city for 2 months and move my office and goods to Bangna. I lived through the floods and I only blamed the extreme and abnormal weather for the bad luck. The floods didnt hit us overnight    like you trying to make out to be but was a moving slowly southwards. That gave us time to do some sandbagging and time to do an organized evacuation when the situation became dire. 

 

You think the current flood in the central plains are small beans, take a visit to Pathumthani and AngThong, the Royal Irrigation Dept is warning of more floods from Chao Phraya. Once again, I am bracing for eventualities that may hit me. 

 

 

Difference is they were warning people.. YL said don't worry you wont be flooded. In the end we had a bit of time to get sandbags and stuff. But had they disclosed how big this flood was (and they could have because they had planes and satellite images then I would have made other choices. For us there was no evacuation possible because of the dogs.. Had we known before we would have left.

 

Are you really trying to compare both floods ? 

 

At least an the people in Ang Thong are getting warned I seen articles about it BEFORE they opened the dams they warned them. Here we all blamed YL because we knew about the agricultural minister and his dealings with YL to delay the water discharge. You probably did not know that or did not want to know that. She made it worse she went in against the experts that told her to release the water. (if you overrule experts its on your head)

 

I hope you don't get flooded this time. I would not wish it on my worst enemy.. though I would not mind YL live though it for 2 months to see how that feels. 

Edited September 26, 2016 by robblok

[jonclark]

39 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

With respect, please read my links.  Seems a lot of the problems were caused by mismanagement and politics.

 

Obviously it was caused by mismanagement and politics, both at a local, regional and national level and by players across the political spectrum, with each group intent on pursuing their own overlapping agendas. YL took office 1 week after the floods were first reported in the North (start of August). Begs the question were people interested in what was going on during the election campaigns, given that the house was dissolved in May 2011. What was being done and by whom during that 2 month period? Given that the house was dissolved were those in power able to make meaningful strategic decisions? 

[Grubster]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

Correct and YL agreed to it. Had they released the water earlier there would have been no problem. This has been known for a long time.

And had she released a lot of water, and then a drought would have started it would also have been a crime wouldn't it. Think, its free, just Think. Its weather, unpredictable weather. 

[craigt3365]

Just now, Grubster said:

And had she released a lot of water, and then a drought would have started it would also have been a crime wouldn't it. Think, its free, just Think. Its weather, unpredictable weather. 

Weather is unpredictable, but in this case, the big problems were created by mismanagement.  As is so often the case here in Thailand.

[Grubster]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

Weather is unpredictable, but in this case, the big problems were created by mismanagement.  As is so often the case here in Thailand.

In hindsight it was mismanagement. The disaster in New Orleans could have been averted too, if you had been there to shore up the dykes a year or two prior to the hurricane. Mismanagement, Yes. In hindsight, Yes.

[mike324]

5 hours ago, AGareth2 said:

it started raining heavily from March

we are talking of a sea of water the size of Wales

Bangkok tried to protect itself at the expense of the country

Where was the army?

Where was the defense of the nation?

Total incompetence all round

Eyes were on the election and nature was forgotten

 

The facts were that it flooded so bad because of mismanagement of Dam water level. water retention level at Dams were still below minimum water retention level in June. It was still at safe level when Yingluck took office, but they mismanaged because they held off releasing water so farmers can bring in an extra crop to benefit from the Rice Scheme. The mismanagement of dam water level was why it flooded so bad.

 

Bangkok did not try to protect itself. If you do not protect Bangkok, customs office will be closed, that means no import / export because documents can't be issued / cleared. I know this very well because Bangkok was shut downed due to political protest for almost a week years ago, my shipments were delayed because customs were closed, I had to pay heavy fines because one of my customer was a retail customer in the USA.

 

Army was all over the country, soldiers were the ones placing sand bags everywhere, did you not watch TV? They were the only helpful ones, bringing food in and out for communities surrounded by flood water. I have loads of pictures, as my house is right outside of Bangkok and it was surrounded by flood water as high as 1 meter in sound places. The army was there daily to pass out food.

 

Eyes were indeed on the election, Irrigation Department and Yingluck both were at fault.

Edited September 26, 2016 by mike324

[chuang]

Rice now flood what next

[Eric Loh]

32 minutes ago, robblok said:

Difference is they were warning people..

 

The PM did more than warning. He stated that boldly that there will be no flooding in the Central Plain in August. Read my link which unfortunately is deleted. Still I cant put the blame on his bold statement and I am sure he was doing something to manage impending flood. No difference with YL. She tried her best and no one except God can guarantee compromising weather. I can also agree that some officials with direct functions should take be held responsible. This direct charges are just another witch hunt to bring down her family influence. 

[robblok]

12 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

 

The PM did more than warning. He stated that boldly that there will be no flooding in the Central Plain in August. Read my link which unfortunately is deleted. Still I cant put the blame on his bold statement and I am sure he was doing something to manage impending flood. No difference with YL. She tried her best and no one except God can guarantee compromising weather. I can also agree that some officials with direct functions should take be held responsible. This direct charges are just another witch hunt to bring down her family influence. 

Your rambling over a PM telling the public there will be no flooding.. things change.. a warning was send out that things have changed. YL did no so such thing and had time enough. This flooding came slow and was of a magnitude not seen in many years. But she kept silent not to lose face.

 

Also she gone against the experts (overruled them when they wanted to release water). You do know that in september oktober the tides are much higher and as a result less water could be drained ? Had they started earlier like the experts said this would have been far less of a problem. YL has a habit going against experts (worldbank and others warned her about the rice program). If you overrule experts then your responsible. 

[pookiki]

8 minutes ago, robblok said:

Your rambling over a PM telling the public there will be no flooding.. things change.. a warning was send out that things have changed. YL did no so such thing and had time enough. This flooding came slow and was of a magnitude not seen in many years. But she kept silent not to lose face.

 

Also she gone against the experts (overruled them when they wanted to release water). You do know that in september oktober the tides are much higher and as a result less water could be drained ? Had they started earlier like the experts said this would have been far less of a problem. YL has a habit going against experts (worldbank and others warned her about the rice program). If you overrule experts then your responsible. 

Yes, it is much better to have Article 44.  Then you always be the expert and can act with impunity and immunity.  I'll take fallible politicians any day.

Edited September 26, 2016 by pookiki
grammar

[Soi Dog]

Good thing they are establishing a precedent so we will know who to go after for this year's flooding.  Karma is a bitch.

[MAN2SIN2BKK]

18 minutes ago, mike324 said:

The facts were that it flooded so bad because of mismanagement of Dam water level. water retention level at Dams were still below minimum water retention level in June. It was still at safe level when Yingluck took office, but they mismanaged because they held off releasing water so farmers can bring in an extra crop to benefit from the Rice Scheme. The mismanagement of dam water level was why it flooded so bad.

 

What a load of crap: please refer to this link http://www.kromchol.com/array/BDam.htm year 2554 the red line: the levels of the Bhumibol dam were abnormal from March, and rose at a higher rate than normal until early October when the level was 100%. The Sirikit dam levels were similar with a surge in late June. When Yingluck took office the damage had already been done; the levels were over 90%, normally in August they are between 40 and 50

 

The Governor of Bangkok did do everything to protect Bangkok to the expense of the rest of the country, my house in Pathumthani was under 1.5 meters of water for 6 weeks, without his intervention this flood would have cleared in 3 or 4 days

 

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, pookiki said:

Yes, it is much better to have Article 44.  Then you always be the expert and can act with impunity and immunity.  I'll take fallible politicians any day.

 

What has article 44 to do with finding YL responsible for going against the advice of experts to safe rice for the rice scam  program. By doing so she caused the flooding (or made it worse). But as I said countless times I blame her the most for not giving good information to those in the path of the flooding. With all the tools at her disposal all she had to do is tell people there would be flooding and prepare for it. We would have left our village and made better preparations. This was the opinion of us who lived through the flooding. Many lost cars in our village because of lack of information, not everyone was insured. Then we got some money from the government nothing compared to the damages. 

 

Oh wow a rant against article 44 so novel..  If Prayut caused it I would have been just as angry with him. Wrong is wrong.