THAI POLITICS: Why we cannot place our faith in ‘good people’

[webfact]

BURNING ISSUE

Why we cannot place our faith in ‘good people’

Kasamakorn Chanwanpen
The Nation 

 

BANGKOK: -- The strong will always do what they can and power will always corrupt. So instead of slinging mud for short-term gratification, should we not be seizing this opportunity to seriously address good governance? If that goal can be achieved, more than half of the problems facing the country today would be resolved.

 

Last week brought more entertainment for anti-junta elements, as family members of Prime Minister GeneralPrayut Chan-o-cha, the coup-maker and head of the National Council for Peace and Order, came under bitter attack.

Prayut's brother General Preecha Chan-o-cha, permanent secretary of Defence, had a rough week after his wife was widely criticised for allegedly exploiting state budget to burnish her own reputation. 

 

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Why-we-cannot-place-our-faith-in-good-people-30296241.html

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2016-09-27

[jamesbrock]

Chun Kasamakorn is preaching to the (mostly) converted here.

 

Of course the culprits of corruption should be brought to justice. Of course it must be a norm that transactions and affairs follow the proper process and that nobody can abuse their power to favour their family members at the expense of taxpayers. But who is going to govern the government, who to police the police?

 

As Baerboxer wrote yesterday, "Difficult to fight corruption when the whole pile is thoroughly corrupt to the core."

[metisdead]

Please use discretion in your references to the government. Phrases which can be considered as anti-coup will be removed. Referring to Thailand or the government as a dictatorship, military dictatorship or other such terms will be removed. 

 

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/878797-updated-notice-to-members-posting-in-thailand-news/

 

[waldroj]

"...should we not be seizing this opportunity to seriously address good governance? If that goal can be achieved, more than half of the problems facing the country today would be resolved..."

 

Fine rhetoric, but the only seizing to be done in Thailand these days is:

• the country by the army (on behalf of the elite); and,
• anyone who speaks out about it.

For proof of this, look no further than the previous post!

 

As for good governance, well Thai people are still waiting for that one, like they are for the much touted reconciliation (as part of the so-called roadmap). Achieve reconciliation and you will resolve "...more than half of the problems facing the country today..."!

[Thechook]

That would mean speaking out against those currently in power and that will get you arrested and imprisoned.  

[ChidlomDweller]

Suthep's "good people" talk was always a crock of #*%¥.  As if anyone ever took that for anything more than self-serving nonsense.  

[trogers]

This is the problem - the lack of people with integrity.

 

The Thai language points to this fact when it does not even have a Thai word for Integrity.

[Alive]

It's nice to see some folks from this paper being critical of the present situation. At least there we can see some change in views of the people or at least people shaking off the fear and speaking up. Once the 'real' people of Thailand the vast majority are unafraid to speak, this nation will see the changes it needs.

[trogers]

1 minute ago, Alive said:

It's nice to see some folks from this paper being critical of the present situation. At least there we can see some change in views of the people or at least people shaking off the fear and speaking up. Once the 'real' people of Thailand the vast majority are unafraid to speak, this nation will see the changes it needs.

 

The 'real' people where shot and bombed by the previous power holder...

 

Will this change, in a government of any form?

[Alive]

trogers you know who shot the most 'real' people. I can't say it here because my post will be deleted to please this regime. History knows who has blood on their hands in Thailand. There are 50 million people outside of Bangkok but if Bangkok people don't see them outside their window they forget they exist.

[trogers]

27 minutes ago, Alive said:

trogers you know who shot the most 'real' people. I can't say it here because my post will be deleted to please this regime. History knows who has blood on their hands in Thailand. There are 50 million people outside of Bangkok but if Bangkok people don't see them outside their window they forget they exist.

 

Blaming the present body for deeds done by a previous generation is like blaming deeds in a war of the 70's to present servicemen.

[robblok]

Unfortunately in Thailand only those that are not in power currently get punished. So its only good that once in a while an other party comes to power (even if its a coup) otherwise corruption will go unpunished. Now if someone would also go after the army later on I would applaud and support it. I still prefer that someone gets punished then nobody at all. Just imagine how bad it would be if it was sure nobody would ever get punished. 

 

I would prefer a perfect balanced country with good laws.. but this is Thailand and the only way people who are corrupt get punished is after a government change. 

[yellowboat]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

Unfortunately in Thailand only those that are not in power currently get punished. So its only good that once in a while an other party comes to power (even if its a coup) otherwise corruption will go unpunished. Now if someone would also go after the army later on I would applaud and support it. I still prefer that someone gets punished then nobody at all. Just imagine how bad it would be if it was sure nobody would ever get punished. 

 

I would prefer a perfect balanced country with good laws.. but this is Thailand and the only way people who are corrupt get punished is after a government change. 

So you are saying it is okay to depose an elected government to then prosecute a few corrupt officials ?   That flies in the face of good governance.  Right the whole country is being punished by having to put up with a government, not of their choosing, that is inept and serving of the rich.  Punishing a few corrupt officials at the expense of an entire population is extremely poor governance.  Your obsession with punishment is odd.

[maoro2013]

1 hour ago, trogers said:

This is the problem - the lack of people with integrity.

 

The Thai language points to this fact when it does not even have a Thai word for Integrity.

Well the Thai language does actually. Do some research.

[trogers]

No. It does not.

 

Having strong moral principles and adherence to them.

[robblok]

23 minutes ago, yellowboat said:

So you are saying it is okay to depose an elected government to then prosecute a few corrupt officials ?   That flies in the face of good governance.  Right the whole country is being punished by having to put up with a government, not of their choosing, that is inept and serving of the rich.  Punishing a few corrupt officials at the expense of an entire population is extremely poor governance.  Your obsession with punishment is odd.

Good governance would be if they punish their own crooks.. they don't so there is no good governance or a real democracy. So yes I don't mind the army stepping in once in a while to clean the mess. Only problem i see is that the army is a bit too untouchable and does similar things. But now at least some get punished.. if none would ever get punished it would have bee n a lot worse here. There would be no national parks to encroach on anymore it would all be gone already. 

[anon4637435435]

Rubbish, there are good people just not in a system thats setup to encourage the lazy and greedy. Get rid of the benefits to work in any government job and people that want to help and do the right thing will.

Think a pig just flew past.......must be dreaming.

[trainman34014]

This is a country where anyone who gets into any position of power, even on a local basis, believes that they have a right to 'Lord it' over those souls who they believe to be below them.  Power also opens the door to all types of corruption which they think automatically comes with the job and they have this inbred psyche that says they have to 'look after their family'....which also extends to their 'Mia Noi'.

 

If you talk to many Thai's they seem to think it's ok to be corrupt when you get the chance and they look up to people who have large amounts of money, no matter how that money is gleaned.   Unless people are educated from a very young age that any kind of stealing is wrong then it will continue unabated for many more generations.

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, maoro2013 said:

Well the Thai language does actually. Do some research.

Since you know, why don't you share?

[Srikcir]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

came under bitter attack

Makes the accusations sound irrational and meanful, based solely on passion.

 

Rather the accusations are based on the very tenants of the NCPO goals to prevent conflict of interest and promote fair and equal justice. So it is Prayut who comes under justified criticism.

[klauskunkel]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

Why we cannot place our faith in ‘good people’

because the 'good people' don't predict the lottery numbers. Snakes, rocks and mushrooms do, and that's where the faith is placed. (satire emoticon)

[chainarong]

The main crux of this problem is the elite run the country , the political process doesn't include the people except at elections , there should be branches in defined areas , people should be encouraged to support their local candidates nominated from the floor of the branches , the structure of the whole shebang needs re arranging , nothing will eventuate from this discussion , the elites won't give away their power , till some vision is forth coming the Thai parliament will resemble a Chamber of Commerce meeting or a military tribunal,  take your pick , well into the future...............................

[halloween]

1 hour ago, yellowboat said:

So you are saying it is okay to depose an elected government to then prosecute a few corrupt officials ?   That flies in the face of good governance.  Right the whole country is being punished by having to put up with a government, not of their choosing, that is inept and serving of the rich.  Punishing a few corrupt officials at the expense of an entire population is extremely poor governance.  Your obsession with punishment is odd.

The whole country is being punished? According to whom? Aside from a few students, the vast majority of those protesting the current government are those being prosecuted for their crimes and their brain-dead supporters.

BTW when the government is actively involved in corrupt rice sales costing the people billions, where is the "good governance"? Even when their crimes were being exposed, did you expect that they would prosecute themselves?

[jamesbrock]

4 hours ago, trogers said:

Blaming the present body for deeds done by a previous generation is like blaming deeds in a war of the 70's to present servicemen.

 

Ahem. The current PM was Deputy Commander in Chief of the Royal Thai Army and the current Minister of Interior was Commander in Chief of the Royal Thai Army in 2010 - hardly a "previous generation!"

 

Most political watchers have lost count of the number of court inquests that have indicated that the Army is responsible for the deaths of scores red shirt protesters in 2010. According to one inquest handed down by the South Bangkok Criminal Court, there is much evidence that points to the army′s use of live ammunition against Redshirt protesters on 19 May 2010, such as bullet types, video clips of the clashes, testimony by members of the security forces, and ballistic investigation.

 

The judges for that inquest noted that Mr. Narin Srichomphu was apparently shot and killed by military-issued weaponry which was fired from a group of soldiers at Saladaeng Intersection in the Ratchadamri district during the final military assault against Redshirts protesters on 19 May 2010. Furthermore, the court pointed out that Mr. Narin was shot in the same vicinity where an Italian photojournalist, Mr. Fabio Polenghi, was shot and killed on 19 May 2010, whose death the court had previously ruled as caused by the military gunfire. 

 

Quote

"Therefore ... the court found that the deceased was killed by high-velocity bullet which penetrated his head and nerve system, a bullet fired from the direction of the military personnel who were operating under orders of the Centre for Resolution of Emergency Situation (CRES)".

 

Many previous inquests have pointed to the military′s role in 2010 crackdown deaths, such as the incident where six civilians were shot and killed inside Wat Pathumwanararm Temple on 19 May 2010, when the court explicitly identified soldiers stationed in the nearby area as perpetrators.

 

These are the men who are currently installing themselves for perpetual rule. 

[trogers]

People who are paid to gather and threatened to burn the capital city with armed thugs shooting while lying prone under the skirts of women deserved to be put down.

 

Or perhaps they should be allowed to run amok and burn the city?

[jamesbrock]

Just now, trogers said:

People who are paid to gather and threatened to burn the capital city with armed thugs shooting while lying prone under the skirts of women deserved to be put down.

 

Or perhaps they should be allowed to run amok and burn the city?

 

I wasn't supporting the redshirts, nor condoning their actions - I was simply pointing out the ridiculousness of your statement, which, I note, you've moved on from. 

[trogers]

2 minutes ago, jamesbrock said:

 

I wasn't supporting the redshirts, nor condoning their actions - I was simply pointing out the ridiculousness of your statement, which, I note, you've moved on from. 

 

I don't know about ridiculousness, but had to reduce rents to my condo units for a couple of years after the red shirt violence.

[scorecard]

5 hours ago, trogers said:

This is the problem - the lack of people with integrity.

 

The Thai language points to this fact when it does not even have a Thai word for Integrity.

 

Well yes and no. I've lived and worked in very senior business roles and in lecturing for several decades. I am absolutely convinced the good, highly capable and sincere people do exist.

 

So why have they not been in senior roles in political parties, in parliament and not in the senior ministerial positions?

 

Easy answer - 99% of these good folks will not allow themselves to be associated with the existing / the past parties, the paid gangs of thieves, etc.

 

But if this can be seriously cleaned up then I believe (I know) the good folks will appear and will contribute in a style never yet seen in Thai politics and with balance and they will quickly take Thailand forward. 

 

It can be done.  

 

[jamesbrock]

2 minutes ago, trogers said:

I don't know about ridiculousness, but had to reduce rents to my condo units for a couple of years after the red shirt violence.

 

Your response to Alive's question, "you know who shot the most 'real' people" about "Blaming the present body for deeds done by a previous generation is like blaming deeds in a war of the 70's to present servicemen." is ridiculous in the extreme, considering.

 

I note, again, you've deflected.

[trogers]

45 minutes ago, jamesbrock said:

 

Your response to Alive's question, "you know who shot the most 'real' people" about "Blaming the present body for deeds done by a previous generation is like blaming deeds in a war of the 70's to present servicemen." is ridiculous in the extreme, considering.

 

I note, again, you've deflected.

 

Degree met with degree. Nothing is ridiculous.

 

What was ridiculous was using thugs to fire on unarmed protesters who did not threatened violence nor burn the city while one is in the government. The keyword is 'thugs'.