Analysis: Trump 'rigged' vote claim may leave lasting damage

[heybruce]

27 minutes ago, Linzz said:

 

American mid east foreign policy seems contradictory. On one hand they are assisting the Iraqi govt fighting jihadists in the form of ISIS, and on the other hand assisting a multitude of jihadists including Al-Nusra (formerly a branch of Al Qaeda) and suicide bombers with arms and info against a legitimate Syrian govt, which is a member of the UN. Have they forgotten 9/11 already? In my view the US has inflicted too much regime change in the middle east and made a bigger mess of it. I can never forget that video of Hillary saying about Gaddafi, "we came ,we saw, he died" and then she laughed loudly. Libya, that went well didn't it?

Once again, the US provided logistical support to the military efforts of the UK and France in Libya.  The power vacuum that followed the fall of Qaddafi should have been filled with a nation building effort also led by the UK and France. The power vacuum was not filled, the ruthless and crazies moved in, and the country descended into chaos.  Libya is on our European allies.

 

Afghanistan and Iraq are on us.  We toppled the regimes without credible plans for the aftermath.  In these places also the crazies rushed in to fill the power vacuum. 

 

If the twenty-first century has taught us nothing else about war it should have taught us that a successful military campaign must be followed by a well thought out, effective, sustained nation building campaign.  Otherwise we will win the war and lose the peace.  It would be better just to stay home.

 

Trump has made it clear that there will be no nation building under his administration.  Unfortunately he has not made it clear that there will be no military interventions.  That worries me.

 

BTW, "a legitimate Syrian govt"?  The overwhelming majority of the deaths in Syria were committed by this legitimate Syrian government.  The only thing saving this legitimate Syrian government from its own people is the support from Hezbollah, Iran, and Russia.  The only reason the US isn't supporting the "good guys" in Syria is that legitimate good guys are hard to find.

Edited November 2, 2016 by heybruce

[Publicus]

 

Nice guys these uniquely American 21st century armed right sector militants. Trump's Troopers.

 

 

Reuters: “As the most divisive presidential election in recent memory nears its conclusion, some armed militia groups are preparing for the possibility of a stolen election on Nov. 8 and civil unrest in the days following a victory by Democrat Hillary Clinton.”

“They say they won’t fire the first shot, but they’re not planning to leave their guns at home, either.”

“Trump’s populist campaign has energized militia members… Trump has repeatedly warned that the election may be ‘rigged,’ and has said he may not respect the results if he does not win. 

 

 

 

They might consider going to the Republican controlled states and counties that have severely restricted voting dates, placed polling stations sprawled great distances, restricted hours and more.

 

Completely Republican controlled North Carolina is perhaps culprit number one in this election. I doubt very much the election will come down to any single one state, but NC may need to be made an example of due to its Republican right wing voter suppression of Democratic Party voters.

 

Democratic Party officials and NAACP among others have filed in the U.S. District Court and oral arguments before the court will occur November 4th. So there's still time.

[Linzz]

6 hours ago, heybruce said:

It would be better just to stay home.

 

We are getting well off topic so I will keep it short.

You have outlined well the succession of failure in nation building when western cultural and political ideas don't fit tribal hegemony. I have a Kurdish acquaintance who is adamant that Hussein should have been left in place.

Added to the mix is proxy war and arms sales. Yemen is a case in point with a $20 billion arms sales by the US to Riyadh. Meanwhile the Saudis won't stop bombing civilians and the US backed jihadists in Syria won't stop shelling in a ceasefire. Also the truth is always the first casualty and what happens on the ground hardly matches the propaganda machines. 

[Alive]

Expert on Trump and the "rigged" election in comparison to the Bush-Gore election issues. Lots of viewers give comments.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?417374-3/washington-journal-julian-zelizer-bush-v-gore

[LannaGuy]

9 hours ago, MiKT said:

 

My views are from a non-American, and I am just reiterating what I have already said several times in this thread. But the views I am putting forward about Trump echo the worries of many millions of people outside the US. They can't understand in this day and age of easy international travel and the internet bringing foreign experiences right to your door, why anybody could support this man.

 

He is so obviously not suited to be POTUS he should have it tattooed on his forehead in bright red letters, like a slave brand from Roman days, beware thief, beware crook, beware carpetbagger, .........and so on almost to an infinity of clichés describing someone you would not want to come begging in your neighbourhood public toilet, let alone running a country. Better still if he was branded with a hot iron and sent to row in the galleys.

 

Its so obvious, that with his limited knowledge of how governments work and how international diplomacy works he could change his name to Duterte and nobody would notice, except his pal Putin might have his nose put out of joint (now theirs a pleasant thought) by the Chinese tie-ups.

 

The world needs a stable prosperous US, not a kindergarten republic run buy a pouting brat.

 

I'm a non-American too and I completely 'get' why millions will vote for him. So one of us understands it and one doesn't and that dichotomy is why there is chaos.

[shadmo63]

I detest every thing about the Donald, but there's a part of me wants him to win because the US deserves him.


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[LannaGuy]

13 minutes ago, shadmo63 said:

I detest every thing about the Donald, but there's a part of me wants him to win because the US deserves him.


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

 

I don't like him but those fat, smug wall street elites deserve him!

[Morch]

12 hours ago, MiKT said:

 

My views are from a non-American, and I am just reiterating what I have already said several times in this thread. But the views I am putting forward about Trump echo the worries of many millions of people outside the US. They can't understand in this day and age of easy international travel and the internet bringing foreign experiences right to your door, why anybody could support this man.

 

He is so obviously not suited to be POTUS he should have it tattooed on his forehead in bright red letters, like a slave brand from Roman days, beware thief, beware crook, beware carpetbagger, .........and so on almost to an infinity of clichés describing someone you would not want to come begging in your neighbourhood public toilet, let alone running a country. Better still if he was branded with a hot iron and sent to row in the galleys.

 

Its so obvious, that with his limited knowledge of how governments work and how international diplomacy works he could change his name to Duterte and nobody would notice, except his pal Putin might have his nose put out of joint (now theirs a pleasant thought) by the Chinese tie-ups.

 

The world needs a stable prosperous US, not a kindergarten republic run buy a pouting brat.

 

Attacking a candidate if one thing. Labeling all supporters is another.

 

Many voters will support Trump simply because he is the only option available which is not HRC, and what she, supposedly, represents. Pretty much the same as  many voters casting for HRC not because they think she's the best candidate, but simply because she is not Trump.

 

While my views on the candidates are no secret (pro tip: I agree that HRC would make a better president, but by all means, a flawed candidate), I can certainly understand voters and posters strongly objecting to and rejecting HRC. Some of the reasons for anti-HRC sentiment are solidly grounded, some less.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Morch

[lannarebirth]

6 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Attacking a candidate if one thing. Labeling all supporters is another.

 

Many voters will support Trump simply because he is the only option available which is not HRC, and what she, supposedly, represents. Pretty much the same as  many voters casting for HRC not because they think she's the best candidate, but simply because she is not Trump.

 

While my views on the candidates are no secret (pro tip: I agree that HRC would make a better president, but by all means, a flawed candidate), I can certainly understand voters and posters strongly objecting to and rejecting HRC. Some of the reasons for anti-HRC sentiment are solidly grounded, some less.

 

You're wrong. It's the supporters of the two leading candidates, both of them horrific, that need to be shamed. This kind of shit couldn't float to the top of the bowl without the support of their utterly stupid and beneath contempt supporters.

[lannarebirth]

12 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Some supporters do not support the candidate they are "supporting" as much as opposing the other candidate.

The options are limited, and voting for independent candidates or not voting at all does amount, IMO, to casting a vote anyway.

 

 

I'm going to disagree with you about that. For almost the entirety of my life Americans have been voting for whomever was perceived to be "least worst" and all it has led to is a steady slope downward. America is an extraordinarily strong country, both externally and internally, although our tendency to vote "least worst" is diminishing us in both those areas. It will take decades to reform this country from where we are now, but a break has to happen from "least worst" first.

[Scott]

Posts removed and suspensions given.  

[Morch]

12 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

I'm going to disagree with you about that. For almost the entirety of my life Americans have been voting for whomever was perceived to be "least worst" and all it has led to is a steady slope downward. America is an extraordinarily strong country, both externally and internally, although our tendency to vote "least worst" is diminishing us in both those areas. It will take decades to reform this country from where we are now, but a break has to happen from "least worst" first.

 

I don't know that US elections can be summed as "Americans have been voting for whomever was perceived to be "least worst"". Certainly, some voters will always feel this way on any given elections. Saying its a general, long standing practice and sentiment needs more beef to it than what was offered.

 

Even if the premise was to be accepted, hard to see the point made with regard to the realistic options at hand.

[heybruce]

5 hours ago, Morch said:

 

I don't know that US elections can be summed as "Americans have been voting for whomever was perceived to be "least worst"". Certainly, some voters will always feel this way on any given elections. Saying its a general, long standing practice and sentiment needs more beef to it than what was offered.

 

Even if the premise was to be accepted, hard to see the point made with regard to the realistic options at hand.

Less than 30% of US votes vote in the primaries that determine the party candidates.  When the primary vote is divided among many candidates the candidate with the loudest message and most simple-minded answers can win.

 

Unfortunately after the primary elections it doesn't get better.  Governing a large nation with a modern economy requires well thought-out, detailed policies.  However detailed policy issues are boring and most voters aren't interested, so the candidates boil down complicated issues into idiotic soundbites.  After that they mostly just attack each other.

[pattayalover]

accept the fact that Trump is winning so much....
it s over guys, Trump is now the president and Obama and his gang will be sent to jail very soon.

[Silurian]

Yep, sure is rigged...by the Republicans. Typical voter suppression techniques from the Republicans.

 

Emails show how Republicans lobbied to limit voting hours in North Carolina

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-northcarolina-insight-idUSKBN12Y0ZY

 

 

[heybruce]

On 11/2/2016 at 9:42 PM, Publicus said:

 

Nice guys these uniquely American 21st century armed right sector militants. Trump's Troopers.

 

 

Reuters: “As the most divisive presidential election in recent memory nears its conclusion, some armed militia groups are preparing for the possibility of a stolen election on Nov. 8 and civil unrest in the days following a victory by Democrat Hillary Clinton.”

“They say they won’t fire the first shot, but they’re not planning to leave their guns at home, either.”

“Trump’s populist campaign has energized militia members… Trump has repeatedly warned that the election may be ‘rigged,’ and has said he may not respect the results if he does not win. "

 

 

They might consider going to the Republican controlled states and counties that have severely restricted voting dates, placed polling stations sprawled great distances, restricted hours and more.

 

Completely Republican controlled North Carolina is perhaps culprit number one in this election. I doubt very much the election will come down to any single one state, but NC may need to be made an example of due to its Republican right wing voter suppression of Democratic Party voters.

 

Democratic Party officials and NAACP among others have filed in the U.S. District Court and oral arguments before the court will occur November 4th. So there's still time.

 

You may be right about North Carolina, but Florida Republicans are doing their part to suppress the vote.  Florida governor and Trump supporter Rick Scott has been overruled by the courts twice in the past month on issues related to voter suppression.  http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/election/article108735512.html    http://edition.cnn.com/2016/10/10/politics/federal-judge-extends-florida-voter-registration-deadline/    I received every mailing from my Florida Supervisor of Elections office except my Absentee Ballot, I had to print a ballot and fax in my vote.

 

There are definitely attempts being made to rig the election, but every attempt I'm aware of has been made by the Republicans.

[pattayalover]

if crooked Hillary win, say bye bye to your little pension.
I think Thailand will kick you back to the USA.

[heybruce]

4 minutes ago, pattayalover said:

if crooked Hillary win, say bye bye to your little pension.
I think Thailand will kick you back to the USA.

 

A hateful, off-topic, fact free post.  What a surprise.

[Publicus]

On 11/3/2016 at 5:44 PM, heybruce said:

 

You may be right about North Carolina, but Florida Republicans are doing their part to suppress the vote.  Florida governor and Trump supporter Rick Scott has been overruled by the courts twice in the past month on issues related to voter suppression.  http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/election/article108735512.html    http://edition.cnn.com/2016/10/10/politics/federal-judge-extends-florida-voter-registration-deadline/    I received every mailing from my Florida Supervisor of Elections office except my Absentee Ballot, I had to print a ballot and fax in my vote.

 

There are definitely attempts being made to rig the election, but every attempt I'm aware of has been made by the Republicans.

 

Yes, and Rick Scott governor of Republican controlled Florida and Republican controlled North Carolina have each earned his own separate and distinctive litigation, where court orders to the Republican Party already exist since since 1982.

 

So it's six high profile suits among several others....

 

Democrats sue Trump, Republicans in four states and allege ‘campaign of vigilante voter intimidation’

November 01. 2016

 

Democratic Party officials filed lawsuits in four states this week against presidential candidate Donald Trump and the Republican Party, accusing campaign officials and supporters of seeking to threaten minorities to keep them from voting.

 

With the bitter election just days away from a seeming conclusion, these lawsuits were part of a flurry of legal action that could alter what voters experience on Election Day and how party officials can approach voters going forward.

 

The federal lawsuits in four battleground states—Arizona, Nevada, Ohio and Pennsylvania—arrived just over a week before Election Day and amid polls showing a tightening campaign between Trump and Hillary Clinton, his Democratic opponent."

 

http://www.theday.com/nationworld/20161101/democrats-sue-trump-republicans-in-four-states-and-allege-campaign-of-vigilante-voter-intimidation

 

 

The 21st century armed uniquely American right sector of society that has taken over the Republican Party which is more than happily taking it lying down.

[Boon Mee]

8 Instances of Voter Fraud in 2016, and It’s Not Even Election Day Yet

In just the last week, prosecutors pursued three voter fraud-related charges in three major battleground states—Florida, Iowa, and Virginia.

Numerous other election irregularities such as voting beyond the grave, voting more than once, voting without citizenship, and registrations by nonexistent people have occurred throughout 2016. While some cases have been prosecuted, others were discovered through various news reports.

Here’s a sampling of election irregularities that have already taken place well in advance of Nov. 8.

http://dailysignal.com/2016/11/02/8-instances-of-voter-fraud-in-2016-and-its-not-even-election-day-yet/?utm_source=TDS_Email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=MorningBell&mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiTURNek5UQXlZVFkzTlRCaSIsInQiOiIyb29KZHdRYWlEcFdPYVVsRDlUU1wvalBEYlV0OGp6TERqeFJtZ2FzRWIxdyt3ZTQxY01iWFNEMHQ3ZHZsRHdxaHdUZ0sxNDQ4OFwvWjIzb0VXUkJ4ZW1XVlhiOVlqeVl6R3ZOUU5pTkJQcG4wPSJ9

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, Boon Mee said:

8 Instances of Voter Fraud in 2016, and It’s Not Even Election Day Yet

In just the last week, prosecutors pursued three voter fraud-related charges in three major battleground states—Florida, Iowa, and Virginia.

Numerous other election irregularities such as voting beyond the grave, voting more than once, voting without citizenship, and registrations by nonexistent people have occurred throughout 2016. While some cases have been prosecuted, others were discovered through various news reports.

Here’s a sampling of election irregularities that have already taken place well in advance of Nov. 8.

http://dailysignal.com/2016/11/02/8-instances-of-voter-fraud-in-2016-and-its-not-even-election-day-yet/?utm_source=TDS_Email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=MorningBell&mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiTURNek5UQXlZVFkzTlRCaSIsInQiOiIyb29KZHdRYWlEcFdPYVVsRDlUU1wvalBEYlV0OGp6TERqeFJtZ2FzRWIxdyt3ZTQxY01iWFNEMHQ3ZHZsRHdxaHdUZ0sxNDQ4OFwvWjIzb0VXUkJ4ZW1XVlhiOVlqeVl6R3ZOUU5pTkJQcG4wPSJ9

Your link supports the claim that the election is being illegally fixed for Donald Trump.  The only votes for president mentioned in the article were fraudulent votes for Trump.  Fortunately the numbers in all 8 instances were trivial, and some of the "instances" were far from conclusive.

[Publicus]

 

The wingnuts are by definition off center, and always. But some of 'em had long since become frantic. And the closer to election day, the more frantic they become. When called on to provide links, they flash out anything with the word in it they can find in the mass of highly financed and well funded rightwhinge media.

 

Meanwhile, there will be oral arguments today in the U.S. District Court for the District of  New Jersey in the case against the Republican National Committee on the 1982 still active decree that it (and now the Trump Troopers) not use the pretense of voter fraud to militarise with militia or to weaponise with militia members, the polling stations of the United States.

 

Interfering with voters at the polling stations is a serious federal offense. James Comey and the FBI pyramid below him should be looked at first and foremost.

[Publicus]

 

The federal judge is expected to issue her order in a matter of hours to immediately reinstate Republican Party-purged Democratic Party voters numbering in the tens of thousands.

 

From the Japan Times in Tokyo.....

 

Federal judge in NAACP suit calls North Carolina voter challenge effort ‘insane’ purge

 

U.S. District Judge Loretta Biggs said multiple times the challenge process sounds “insane.”  “This sounds like something that was put together in 1901,” she told lawyers for the state.

 

The judge also said she was “horrified” by the number of removals in Cumberland County, which accounted for the majority of the statewide total.

 

“It almost looks like a cattle call, the way people are being purged,” she told county attorney Rick Moorefield.

 

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/11/03/world/crime-legal-world/federal-judge-naacp-suit-calls-north-carolina-voter-challenge-effort-insane-purge/#.WBwjmfRp9Bw

 

 

The rightwingnuts are foiled again by the law and the Constitution. Just about everyone in Japan is relieved.

[Brer Fox]

Some interesting campaign badges are appearing. In Philadelphia at a Trump campaign rally these badges showed up by the thousands.

[Jingthing]

 The misogynists are out and proud now.

[Silurian]

How about vote rigging by telling people you can vote for Hillary via text or tweet? No need to actually go to the polling place.

 

Pro-Trump Trolls Want You To Vote For Hillary Via Text (You Can't)

http://www.forbes.com/sites/fruzsinaeordogh/2016/11/03/pro-trump-trolls-want-you-to-vote-for-hillary-via-text-you-cant/

 

http://fortune.com/2016/11/03/text-vote-hillary-clinton/

 

 

 

Edited November 4, 2016 by Silurian

[Linzz]

Reprehensible tactics

[NovaBlue05]

Plenty of bad elements on both sides. 330 million people with freedom of expression combined with the most polarizing political event in recent history tends to turn them out

[Boon Mee]

No Fraud, eh?

 

Breaking: Broward County, Florida Officials Caught Filling Out Absentee Ballots

A massive voter fraud operation was discovered in Democratic Broward County, Florida.

According to a former Secretary of Elections Department employee, there is a secret room where Democrat insiders fill out those absentee ballots.

The woman provided her sworn testimony via affidavit.

Read it here:  http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/11/breaking-broward-county-florida-officials-caught-filling-absentee-ballots/

[SaintLouisBlues]

23 minutes ago, Boon Mee said:

No Fraud, eh?

 

Breaking: Broward County, Florida Officials Caught Filling Out Absentee Ballots

A massive voter fraud operation was discovered in Democratic Broward County, Florida.

According to a former Secretary of Elections Department employee, there is a secret room where Democrat insiders fill out those absentee ballots.

The woman provided her sworn testimony via affidavit.

Read it here:  http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/11/breaking-broward-county-florida-officials-caught-filling-absentee-ballots/

Right, so she's made an affidavit that there's a secret room, blah blah blah. Affidavits aren't proof of anything except a willingness to swear (an assertion in this case). Maybe there is, maybe there isn't. I'd want the video evidence from the DA's office or the FBI when she leads them to this room and shows the perps at work