The anti-Trump resistance takes shape: 'Government's supposed to fear us'

[PattayaJames]

7 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Nice shot at deflection.

And of course your justification for waiting is ridiculous unless you believe that his words have no connections to his actual program.In that case, how does it make sense to support such a person? It seems your approach has more in common with Roulette. The Russian kind.

I am not deflecting. You butted into a conversation I was having with craigt3365 specifically about:

 

Robert Reich Pens Brutal List of 11 Trump Facts You Need to Show Hard Headed Trump Supporters
" Anyone who still supports Trump is simply in denial.  Former Labor Secretary Robert Reich decided to make a list of things Trump has done to help remind any remaining Trump supporters why the man is a crook."
http://www.impeachdjtnow.com/robert-reich-pens-brutal-list-11-trump-facts-need-show-hard-headed-trump-supporters/

 

I am happy if you want to take on point 5.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, PattayaJames said:

I am not deflecting. You butted into a conversation I was having with craigt3365 specifically about:

 

Robert Reich Pens Brutal List of 11 Trump Facts You Need to Show Hard Headed Trump Supporters
" Anyone who still supports Trump is simply in denial.  Former Labor Secretary Robert Reich decided to make a list of things Trump has done to help remind any remaining Trump supporters why the man is a crook."
http://www.impeachdjtnow.com/robert-reich-pens-brutal-list-11-trump-facts-need-show-hard-headed-trump-supporters/

 

I am happy if you want to take on point 5.

So you are saying Betsy DeVos is the best and smartest person for the job?  Zero experience.  Huge donations to the campaign.  Follow the dots.  The crowd loved her here. LOL

 

 

[PattayaJames]

6 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Hmmmm....seem to be all facts.  I don't see opinions here at all.

He is not involved in the running of his businesses, his sons are.

Rates have gone up at his resort, new trademarks are being acquired in various countries, etc, etc, etc. Well business does go on but not by Trump.

Markets move based on things he says, OK this does not prove he manipulates the markets.

Insider trading?  I guess so.  Seems an investigation might be firing up. Your link is not even about Trump.

Why would they need any investigations? You are telling me all this is FACT. 

It is not, it is opinion and accusation.

[PattayaJames]

13 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

So you are saying Betsy DeVos is the best and smartest person for the job?  Zero experience.  Huge donations to the campaign.  Follow the dots.  The crowd loved her here. LOL

 

 

The best person for a job can ONLY be an opinion. And that is a FACT!

[ilostmypassword]

4 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

He is not involved in the running of his businesses, his sons are.

Rates have gone up at his resort, new trademarks are being acquired in various countries, etc, etc, etc. Well business does go on but not by Trump.

Markets move based on things he says, OK this does not prove he manipulates the markets.

Insider trading?  I guess so.  Seems an investigation might be firing up. Your link is not even about Trump.

Why would they need any investigations? You are telling me all this is FACT. 

It is not, it is opinion and accusation.

It is not a blind trust. So we have only his word that he isn't involved. And one of his sons has already said that he talks with his father about the business. 

[ilostmypassword]

3 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

The best person for a job can ONLY be an opinion. And that is a FACT!

But that a person who is demonstrably massively ignorant is somehow well qualified for the post is clearly nonsense.

[ilostmypassword]

7 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

He is not involved in the running of his businesses, his sons are.

Rates have gone up at his resort, new trademarks are being acquired in various countries, etc, etc, etc. Well business does go on but not by Trump.

Markets move based on things he says, OK this does not prove he manipulates the markets.

Insider trading?  I guess so.  Seems an investigation might be firing up. Your link is not even about Trump.

Why would they need any investigations? You are telling me all this is FACT. 

It is not, it is opinion and accusation.

And of course, there is the question of patriotism. You know, the part that includes making sacrifices for your country. Like giving up income opportunities. Sacrificing self-interest for the good of the country is something Trump seems to be incapable of doing..

[PattayaJames]

8 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

But that a person who is demonstrably massively ignorant is somehow well qualified for the post is clearly nonsense.

She has been active in promoting reform of schools for over 20 years, so Secretary of Education, sounds right up her street.

If you agree with her ideas, I would think she would be an ideal choice.

[F4UCorsair]

14 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

And of course, there is the question of patriotism. You know, the part that includes making sacrifices for your country. Like giving up income opportunities. Sacrificing self-interest for the good of the country is something Trump seems to be incapable of doing..

 

 

Foregoing the Presidential salary doesn't qualify I suspect??

[craigt3365]

21 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

He is not involved in the running of his businesses, his sons are.

Rates have gone up at his resort, new trademarks are being acquired in various countries, etc, etc, etc. Well business does go on but not by Trump.

Markets move based on things he says, OK this does not prove he manipulates the markets.

Insider trading?  I guess so.  Seems an investigation might be firing up. Your link is not even about Trump.

Why would they need any investigations? You are telling me all this is FACT. 

It is not, it is opinion and accusation.

His son is running his business, who works at the White House, with DJT.  One other is in charge of his holdings and Trump has the ability to fire either if he so sees fit.  Thus, still intimately involved, and still personally profiting.  Is he 100% active on a day to day basis like he was no.  Is he still involved.  Yes.  The only way not to be is to divest of the assets.  Impossible any other way.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/documents-confirm-trump-still-benefiting-from-his-business/2017/02/04/848fdd5a-eae0-11e6-bf6f-301b6b443624_story.html?utm_term=.ba988b242cb9

Quote

 

Before taking office, President Trump promised to place his assets in a trust designed to erect a wall between him and the businesses that made him wealthy.

 

But newly released documents show that Trump himself is the sole beneficiary of the trust and that it is legally controlled by his oldest son and a longtime employee.

 

The documents, obtained through a public records request by the investigative news service ProPublica and first reported by the New York Times, also show that Trump retains the legal power to revoke the trust at any time.

 

These are facts, not opinions.

[craigt3365]

23 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

The best person for a job can ONLY be an opinion. And that is a FACT!

I use to live near Ada, Michigan.  HQ for Amway.  The source of wealth for the DeVos family.  It was not a well liked company.  Almost a pyramid scheme and run like a religion.  You can research this easily.  She's a nut.  Watch her confirmation hearings.  She did terrible.  Zero experience.  She even admits it.  She been on some boards, but has never been a teacher.  Just heavily involved in politics.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2016/12/08/a-sobering-look-at-what-betsy-devos-did-to-education-in-michigan-and-what-she-might-do-as-secretary-of-education/?utm_term=.ee0617009c0d

Quote

A sobering look at what Betsy DeVos did to education in Michigan — and what she might do as secretary of education

.....

This deeply dysfunctional educational landscape — where failure is rewarded with opportunities for expansion and “choice” means the opposite for tens of thousands of children — is no accident. It was created by an ideological lobby that has zealously championed free-market education reform for decades, with little regard for the outcome.

 

And at the center of that lobby is Betsy DeVos, the west Michigan advocate whose family has contributed millions of dollars to the cause of school choice and unregulated charter expansion throughout Michigan.

No opinion.  Just facts.  My family is from Michigan and still lives there.

 

 

[PattayaJames]

2 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

No opinion.  Just facts.  My family is from Michigan and still lives there.

I don't know much about Betsy DeVos, not an area I am knowledgeable in.

Sorry, I can't read your link as I am not a WP subscriber. I am sure it has some facts, (along with a bucket load of opinion) And you state some facts yourself.

But, and I am sorry to labor the point here. Your opinion of her and her suitability for the role. is just that an OPINION.

Others who perhaps agree with her ideas would have the opposite OPINION as to her suitability.

[ilostmypassword]

5 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

I don't know much about Betsy DeVos, not an area I am knowledgeable in.

Sorry, I can't read your link as I am not a WP subscriber. I am sure it has some facts, (along with a bucket load of opinion) And you state some facts yourself.

But, and I am sorry to labor the point here. Your opinion of her and her suitability for the role. is just that an OPINION.

Others who perhaps agree with her ideas would have the opposite OPINION as to her suitability.

Just use incognito setting on chrome or inPrivate window on Edge and you can read anything you want on the Post.

[PattayaJames]

Just now, ilostmypassword said:

Just use incognito setting on chrome or inPrivate window on Edge and you can read anything you want on the Post.

Thanks, but that would equal zero :)

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, PattayaJames said:

Thanks, but that would equal zero :)

So, it really isn't about not being a subscriber.

[PattayaJames]

29 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

So, it really isn't about not being a subscriber.

I was just letting it be known that I had not read the link you posted, and therefore was not referring directly to it.

[craigt3365]

37 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

I was just letting it be known that I had not read the link you posted, and therefore was not referring directly to it.

Actually, what you said was:

 

Quote

Thanks, but that would equal zero :)

Not that you hadn't read it, but you had no interest in reading it.  Which is telling.

 

You're an expert at deflection! LOL

[craigt3365]

1 hour ago, PattayaJames said:

I don't know much about Betsy DeVos, not an area I am knowledgeable in.

Sorry, I can't read your link as I am not a WP subscriber. I am sure it has some facts, (along with a bucket load of opinion) And you state some facts yourself.

But, and I am sorry to labor the point here. Your opinion of her and her suitability for the role. is just that an OPINION.

Others who perhaps agree with her ideas would have the opposite OPINION as to her suitability.

If you don't read the link, please don't comment on the quality.  But yes, quite a few facts there.

[PattayaJames]

46 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You're an expert at deflection! LOL

Speaking of deflection. Going back to our original point of discussion: 

 

Robert Reich Pens Brutal List of 11 Trump Facts You Need to Show Hard Headed Trump Supporters
" Anyone who still supports Trump is simply in denial.  Former Labor Secretary Robert Reich decided to make a list of things Trump has done to help remind any remaining Trump supporters why the man is a crook."
http://www.impeachdjtnow.com/robert-reich-pens-brutal-list-11-trump-facts-need-show-hard-headed-trump-supporters/

 

I take it from your edit below, that we now agree, opinions are not facts and that this "Brutal List of 11 Trump Facts " are mostly opinion?

 

3 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

But the 11 listed items are facts.  No arguing that.  Right?

 

Edit: And no arguing the fact Trump has lied many, many, many times

Your edit I will agree with, yes a fact.

[heybruce]

5 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

Foregoing the Presidential salary doesn't qualify I suspect??

He doubled the admission fee to Mar-a-Lago after the election, from $100,000 to $200,000, then called it the "Winter Whitehouse".  I'm sure that has more than off-set the "sacrifice" of the president's salary.

 

It would be very interesting to see who joined Mar-a-Lago after he doubled the fee.  However Trump defies tradition and won't release tax returns, won't put his businesses in a blind trust, won't make White House visitor logs public and won't tell us which cabinet members needed waivers for conflicts of interest and what these waivers covered.  It's safe to assume we won't learn who joined Mar-a-Lago, at least not without a long court battle.

[Jingthing]

Amy's list.
Read it and weep.

 

Quote

 

Trump won, and Amy Siskind started a list of changes. Now it’s a sensation.

 

...

Soon afterward, Siskind began keeping what she calls the Weekly List, tracking all the ways in which she saw America’s taken-for-granted governmental norms changing in the Trump era.

...

The lists “help people experience the history that is being made and keeps them alive and alert to the dangers of eroding norms,” Rosen said.

...

How long does she plan to keep up the list-making? “Until he’s out of power,” she said, which she believes — and fervently hopes — will happen before the end of the first presidential term.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/trump-won-and-amy-siskind-started-a-list-of-changes-now-its-a-sensation/2017/06/23/cdba2b12-575e-11e7-b38e-35fd8e0c288f_story.html

Edited June 26, 2017 by Jingthing

[PattayaJames]

At last some common sense from the US court system.  

 

[Jingthing]

20 minutes ago, PattayaJames said:

At last some common sense from the US court system.  

 

Nothing to do with the resistance. 

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, PattayaJames said:

At last some common sense from the US court system.  

 

Has there been a court ruling relevant to this topic?

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Has there been a court ruling relevant to this topic?

Yes, a temporary win for 45 from SCOTUS on his Muslim travel ban. Until later review. 

[heybruce]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yes, a temporary win for 45 from SCOTUS on his Muslim travel ban. Until later review. 

Thanks, found it. Somewhat premature to call it a victory, SCOTUS has only agreed to hear the case. 

[F4UCorsair]

7 hours ago, heybruce said:

He doubled the admission fee to Mar-a-Lago after the election, from $100,000 to $200,000, then called it the "Winter Whitehouse".  I'm sure that has more than off-set the "sacrifice" of the president's salary.

 

It would be very interesting to see who joined Mar-a-Lago after he doubled the fee.  However Trump defies tradition and won't release tax returns, won't put his businesses in a blind trust, won't make White House visitor logs public and won't tell us which cabinet members needed waivers for conflicts of interest and what these waivers covered.  It's safe to assume we won't learn who joined Mar-a-Lago, at least not without a long court battle.

 

 

OK, but does foregoing the Presidential salary not qualify???   That was the question.

 

There are some masters at deflection here, but you have to be right up there. 

Edited June 26, 2017 by F4UCorsair

[ilostmypassword]

13 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

 

 

Foregoing the Presidential salary doesn't qualify I suspect??

  It's a tiny, tiny sacrifice. Well under one percent of his income. Do you seriously think that equals or outweighs his profiteering from being the President?

[simple1]

5 hours ago, heybruce said:

Has there been a court ruling relevant to this topic?

Trump has unilaterally cut refugees intake by 50k p.a., so currently 50k vetted refugees are permitted entry p.a. I would assume US vetted refugee intake is similar to Australia where the majority of refugees permitted entry are Christian, so kind of cutting off your nose, to spite your face.

[Scott]

4 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Trump has unilaterally cut refugees intake by 50k p.a., so currently 50k vetted refugees are permitted entry p.a. I would assume US vetted refugee intake is similar to Australia where the majority of refugees permitted entry are Christian, so kind of cutting off your nose, to spite your face.

The President sets the number of refugees from the overall number of people allowed to immigrate to the US.    Cutting the number of refugees will allow for more in the other visa categories.  

 

The prevailing attitude toward refugees is more on the negative side at this time.   I think the prevailing negative attitude comes from a variety of issues, including the world watching the influx into Europe as well as strong rhetoric during the campaign.