Govt approves 10 year visas for foreigners over 50

[tukkytuktuk]

Some great posts in the opinion box of the newspaper bp.

[elviajero]

58 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

The Thai version has more detail on conditions than the English version. Same  http://www.thaigov.go.th website, select Thai language, go to the same cabinet meeting, but you must download a docx file with a numerical number name, the announcemt text  is not on the page itself. (I'm not sure TV allows a link to a thai page)

 

If your Thai is not so good, compare the English and Thai versions, find the section number of interest then google translate.

Thanks. Yes I read the Thai version before the translation was posted on the English site.

 

My understanding is that you need to deposit 3M which must be maintained for 1 year. At the end of the year you can withdraw 50% as long as it's spent on condos, cars etc, but there is nothing about the balance being topped up after 5 years as suggested by @Jingthing.

[tropo]

2 hours ago, chang50 said:

I agree its not certain what this all means and it is wise to wait and see.However what is really disappointing is the obvious delight displayed by several posters at the discomfort even fear felt by many elderly expats whose lives, would be ruined (at a minimum) if the worst scenario is realized.Smdh.

 

There's no doubt about it - there's a lot of nasty expats with holier than thou attitudes living in Thailand.

 

Perhaps living in a poorer country makes them feel superior compared with back at home where no one notices them.

[tropo]

1 hour ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

Forget about income, but I'm surprised most people over 50 don't have 3m baht saved up.
 

 

Why are you surprised about that? I'm surprised anyone is surprised about that.

 

I think a lot of people are out of touch with reality. Not everyone retires with lots of cash to spare, for a multitude of reasons. At least people on lower retirement incomes and savings can still enjoy a better life in Thailand than they can back at home. I thought that was the point of retirement in Thailand for most.  

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Why are you surprised about that? I'm surprised anyone is surprised about that.
 
I think a lot of people are out of touch with reality. Not everyone retires with lots of cash to spare, for a multitude of reasons. At least people on lower retirement incomes and savings can still enjoy a better life in Thailand than they can back at home. I thought that was the point of retirement in Thailand for most.  

I am surprised because in the past I received a lot of bashing from people telling me to pack up and make some money before settling in Thailand. I naturally assumed most of those people were thai visa millionaires. I have spent less than 20 years in canada, one third of that getting a useless degree while being taxed to death and I still managed to save well above this amount.

Let's just say I don't get it.

[chiang mai]

8 hours ago, elviajero said:

Many expats live in Thailand because of the differences!

 

...and the temples!

[chiang mai]

7 hours ago, chang50 said:

 

Really some expats are living from pension payment to pension payment believe it or not.

 

And some expats are living on self certified pension income they don't even receive!

[Thaidream]

People come for retirement with money in the bank- they then use that money to purchase cars; houses/Condos; furniture; other items and  the pot of cash is spent. A person on a fixed retirement pension then mainains themselves  and family if married off their monthly income.

Very easy to understand and accounts for many of us who do not have 3 Million Baht sitting in a bank. We have already spent it on assets in Thailand. Shall we now be forced to sell off our homes to meet a new requirement that was not in force at the time we came here ?  I think not and that is why every prior change of requirements included a clause that 'grandfathered'.

 

If by chance there was no grandfathering- I would still not sell my fully paid home. It would be unfair to my family  but my life would become quite complicated as would many others.

[JLCrab]

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

<snip> I think not and that is why every prior change of requirements included a clause that 'grandfathered'.

 

If by chance there was no grandfathering- I would still not sell my fully paid home. It would be unfair to my family  but my life would become quite complicated as would many others.

'Grandfathering' is a component of extensions as specified in the various Immigration Bureau / Police Orders such that if you were on 'continuous' extensions for say 10 years the old regs would remain in effect. I do not know that 'grandfathering' has ever applied to Visa regs as specified by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

I am surprised because in the past I received a lot of bashing from people telling me to pack up and make some money before settling in Thailand. I naturally assumed most of those people were thai visa millionaires. I have spent less than 20 years in canada, one third of that getting a useless degree while being taxed to death and I still managed to save well above this amount.

Let's just say I don't get it.

 

You don't have children do you

[JAG]

8 hours ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

Forget about income, but I'm surprised most people over 50 don't have 3m baht saved up.
 

 

Are you? Surprised I mean? Or are you making sure that everyone knows that you have 3m ThB sloshing around?

[tonray]

6 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

'Grandfathering' is a component of extensions as specified in the various Immigration Bureau / Police Orders such that if you were on 'continuous' extensions for say 10 years the old regs would remain in effect. I do not know that 'grandfathering' has ever applied to Visa regs as specified by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

In Thailand I thought 'grandfathering' was when a 20 something waif takes up with a 60+ expat for the cash flow.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

 
Are you? Surprised I mean? Or are you making sure that everyone knows that you have 3m ThB sloshing around?

Nah....I'm surprised. As I said in the previous post there were so many pensioners lecturing the cheap Charlies about finances and how expensive everything is in Thailand. I was expecting everyone would be overjoyed about fully refundable 3m 10 year visa. I guess I was wrong.

[Peterw42]

Forget about income, but I'm surprised most people over 50 don't have 3m baht saved up.

It's not that people don't have the money, for many that's their working capital, ie: the money they use to make money, share trading, flipping properties, etc.

[SaintLouisBlues]

I checked the web sites of Thai embassies in some of the countries where this new visa will be made available from 1 December according to one post I read. Not a single mention

[Thaidream]

I literally know hundreds of people from a variety of nationalities who do not have 3M Baht in cash to place in a Thai bank. Almost all of them have the amount tied up in assets such as houses/Condos; cars; and other accessories. It is much the same in my birth country of America. Ninety nine% of retirees  do not have this type of cash for the same reason- they purchased homes, cars etc. 

In addition- people already retired  obtained their assets based upon salaries that were quite low 40-50 years ago and gradually went up. People who are not yet retired will have a higher salary level because they started working at a higher salary.

All the people I know and are retired worked very hard to get what they have. They busted their butt for years and years. As I mentioned before  shall we all be forced to sell our houses so we can put 3M Baht in a Thai bank.  No one I know will do that. It would be ridiculous to get rid of a family asset that will be passed on to the next generation to meet an arbitrary requirement. That is why I believe there will be a grandfathering because the basic rule of  International law is that you don't make new rules/laws retroactive.

[newnative]

7 hours ago, tropo said:

Why are you surprised about that? I'm surprised anyone is surprised about that.

 

I think a lot of people are out of touch with reality. Not everyone retires with lots of cash to spare, for a multitude of reasons. At least people on lower retirement incomes and savings can still enjoy a better life in Thailand than they can back at home. I thought that was the point of retirement in Thailand for most.  

It's likely to be worse down the road, at least for future American retirees.  Read an article  the other day that said very few millennials are saving much--the majority had little or no savings.  Traditional pensions are going extinct so most of them will be relying on 401 retirement accounts, which they are probably not putting enough into, Social Security, and whatever they inherit from their parents.

[Peterw42]

I literally know hundreds of people from a variety of nationalities who do not have 3M Baht in cash to place in a Thai bank. Almost all of them have the amount tied up in assets such as houses/Condos; cars; and other accessories. It is much the same in my birth country of America. Ninety nine% of retirees  do not have this type of cash for the same reason- they purchased homes, cars etc. 
In addition- people already retired  obtained their assets based upon salaries that were quite low 40-50 years ago and gradually went up. People who are not yet retired will have a higher salary level because they started working at a higher salary.
All the people I know and are retired worked very hard to get what they have. They busted their butt for years and years. As I mentioned before  shall we all be forced to sell our houses so we can put 3M Baht in a Thai bank.  No one I know will do that. It would be ridiculous to get rid of a family asset that will be passed on to the next generation to meet an arbitrary requirement. That is why I believe there will be a grandfathering because the basic rule of  International law is that you don't make new rules/laws retroactive.

Yes, most retirees are asset rich cash poor.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Yes, most retirees are asset rich cash poor.

I don't believe replies like this at all.

Nope. Sorry.

[BarnicaleBob]

Can anyone tell me one benefit to having this new 10 year visa?

1. You still have to do 90 day checks

2.  You still have to do an annual check of which we don't have the details on yet. 

3.  It isn't really a 10 year visa, it is a 5 year visa that you can extend another 5 years, what is the fee for the extension?

4.  10,000 baht cost for 5 years comes to 2,000 a year, that is 100 baht a year more or 500 baht more expensive for the 5 years.

5.  So not only does it cost more and you still have to go to immigration the same number of times but you must have 3 million baht rather than 800,000 or 100,000 baht income rather than 64,000 baht.  

What is the advantage of this so called 10 year visa?

Edited November 27, 2016 by BarnicaleBob

[i claudius]

1 hour ago, BarnicaleBob said:

Can anyone tell me one benefit to having this new 10 year visa?

1. You still have to do 90 day checks

2.  You still have to do an annual check of which we don't have the details on yet. 

3.  It isn't really a 10 year visa, it is a 5 year visa that you can extend another 5 years, what is the fee for the extension?

4.  10,000 baht cost for 5 years comes to 2,000 a year, that is 100 baht a year more or 500 baht more expensive for the 5 years.

5.  So not only does it cost more and you still have to go to immigration the same number of times but you must have 3 million baht rather than 800,000 or 100,000 baht income rather than 64,000 baht.  

What is the advantage of this so called 10 year visa?

none ,by the sound of it , but then T.I.T.

[Wilsonandson]

I think most retired expats might be able to prove an income of 100,000 baht a month or keep three million-plus baht in a Thai bank, but the requirement for health insurance is absurd.

Who's going to insure a 60-70 year old. Well that is a dilemma. Bupa, Allianx, AXA, Thai health insurance, Aetna International or you could try the Thai banks.

Maybe it is possible, although expensive, but after all, if you can afford to retire abroad you must be able to afford the health insurance premiums.

[Momofarang]

20 hours ago, smutcakes said:

The only thing i have learnt from this thread is the alarming amount of farangs living here without a pot to piss in. For some reason many of them seem to have the notion that Thailand owes them some sort of gratitude to. Its very odd.

To me this sounds like the contempt of someone making 101KTHB a month ...

 

Have been here only a couple of years, but ha met some very decent Farangs taking good care of Thai families with less then a quarter of what I'm making.

[Momofarang]

10 hours ago, chang50 said:

I agree its not certain what this all means and it is wise to wait and see.However what is really disappointing is the obvious delight displayed by several posters at the discomfort even fear felt by many elderly expats whose lives, would be ruined (at a minimum) if the worst scenario is realized.Smdh.

This is a common disorder called schadenfreude... (From German; schaden=damage, freude="joy"). 

 

Guess some guys are just getting too old to watch porn..

[DavisH]

26 minutes ago, Momofarang said:

To me this sounds like the contempt of someone making 101KTHB a month ...

 

Have been here only a couple of years, but ha met some very decent Farangs taking good care of Thai families with less then a quarter of what I'm making.

The salary / money in the bank requirements are ridiculous. Our combined salary is more than 100K a month, but when I retire I could live on 30-40K comfortably. But then again, this policy is not about attracting retirees to live here. Remember, this is a policy pushed by the Health Ministry, so as to reduce any burden of sick, under insured retired foreigners living here; and just taking the wealthiest ones who how can afford to pay / spend lots of money here. Fortunately, work-based and marriage based extensions are still relatively easy to obtain. 

[Diplomatico]

38 minutes ago, BarnicaleBob said:

Can anyone tell me one benefit to having this new 10 year visa?

1. You still have to do 90 day checks

2.  You still have to do an annual check of which we don't have the details on yet. 

3.  It isn't really a 10 year visa, it is a 5 year visa that you can extend another 5 years, what is the fee for the extension?

4.  10,000 baht cost for 5 years comes to 2,000 a year, that is 100 baht a year more or 500 baht more expensive for the 5 years.

5.  So not only does it cost more and you still have to go to immigration the same number of times but you must have 3 million baht rather than 800,000 or 100,000 baht income rather than 64,000 baht.  

What is the advantage of this so called 10 year visa?

 

  It's a multiple entry visa, for one thing.  Yes, the current in-country, annual extension process is 500 baht less expensive for the first five years....if you never leave the country in those five years.  Otherwise, the cost of a single re-entry permit over the course of those five years pushes the annual extension higher than the newly proposed visa.  (Btw, 500 baht over five years is about 2 baht per week.  Enjoy that.)

 

  (Btw, how many guys on here use visa agents every year?  Add that cost onto the 1,900 baht per year that the annual extension costs.)  

 

  By way of comparison, a current O-A visa costs 7,000 baht for basically two years (if you time it correctly) plus another 3,800 for a MRE permit the second year.  That's 10,800 baht for just two years; the new visa would be 10,000 baht for five years (we don't know what the second five years costs.)

 

  Depends upon your perspective and your lifestyle.  If you live in Nakon Nowhere and never leave then you probably wouldn't benefit from this visa.  If you enjoy traveling in retirement and visit your home country every so often to visit friends and family, it's a bargain compared to the current O-A visa.  

 

 

[JLCrab]

1 hour ago, tonray said:

In Thailand I thought 'grandfathering' was when a 20 something waif takes up with a 60+ expat for the cash flow.

No -- according to the latest Police Order you would only get grandfather status after having continuously had extensions with the waif for 10 years.

[watgate]

So  you need 3 million in the bank and the law is changed whereby banks will only insure your deposits up to 1 million baht. Very interesting.

[David Walden]

I'd be happy with this one as I'm 75 and still in good health.  Anything serious I could just fly back to Australia and use my Govt. nearly free? health cove.r 

[Evilbaz]

3 minutes ago, David Walden said:

I'd be happy with this one as I'm 75 and still in good health.  Anything serious I could just fly back to Australia and use my Govt. nearly free? health cove.r 

 

Happy for you.

But - if you have a cardiac episode or a stroke and can't fly do you have the AUD100,000 for emergency evacuation?