SURVEY: Should foreigners entering Thailand be required to have or purchase medical insurance?

[geisha]

All posting against having an obligation for health insurance, obviously have never had a serious health problem away from home ! Apart from all the tragic accidents and scooter falls, agressions and normal health problems, There is the family back home, or here in Thailand , who cannot help financially huge amounts for their loved ones. I would not like to inflict that on my family. I have two examples, that could have led to death. A young friend of mine who went to Costa Rica ( yes!) for a holiday. She suffered a brain haemorrhage while there, and if not for her travel insurance that paid for a helicopter and good care, she would have died ! Another friend of mine, around 50 years old, had a very serious lung problem. Luckily he was able to get back to France , nearly dying on the way, 2  months hospital '! So I'd say, yes, an obligation at least for all people on tourist visas, and some arrangement for people over a certain age that cannot get insurance. 

 

[gamini]

9 hours ago, ksamuiguy said:

Travel insurance is inexpensive if purchased in your home country, coverage for asia in very reasonable.

 

7 hours ago, Gerard052 said:

Try again.  They were going to charge me $ 2,000.00 with $ 1,000.00 deductible for 5 months.  Is it what you call reasonable?  I told them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, I"ll go without it.

 

7 hours ago, Gerard052 said:

Try again.  They were going to charge me $ 2,000.00 with $ 1,000.00 deductible for 5 months.  Is it what you call reasonable?  I told them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, I"ll go without it.

You should read the post properly. It is referring to the travel insurance not about yearly insurance.. Two weeks on global is US$20-US$40.

[gamini]

34 minutes ago, geisha said:

All posting against having an obligation for health insurance, obviously have never had a serious health problem away from home ! Apart from all the tragic accidents and scooter falls, agressions and normal health problems, There is the family back home, or here in Thailand , who cannot help financially huge amounts for their loved ones. I would not like to inflict that on my family. I have two examples, that could have led to death. A young friend of mine who went to Costa Rica ( yes!) for a holiday. She suffered a brain haemorrhage while there, and if not for her travel insurance that paid for a helicopter and good care, she would have died ! Another friend of mine, around 50 years old, had a very serious lung problem. Luckily he was able to get back to France , nearly dying on the way, 2  months hospital '! So I'd say, yes, an obligation at least for all people on tourist visas, and some arrangement for people over a certain age that cannot get insurance. 

 

This post is about Thailand. Medical expenses in a government hospital are very cheap and most very good. The cost of insurance for elderly people far exceeds what they would normally pay out  here for treatment. If you are over 70 you could be paying well over BT 200,000 a year. That would be 2 million over 10 years. I have had considerable amount of medical treatment including two major operation and these expenses came to far far less than 2 million baht.

[roo860]

And I believe that all rich spoiled brats should be expelled from Thailand because of their I'm better than you because I'm rich, never dug a ditch, slogged a rice paddy, had a cave in, got shot at, spent 16 hrs. a day/night on patrol with no back up available for 45 min. much less medical help. At 71, I have insurance back in the states, ended when the plane left the coast, no, one part continued for a month, much like travel ins.,  and VA here, but only for my specific disabilities. If I'm in good enough shape to return to the states and return with the same abilities and life style I live now OK, if not, just pop me in the oven until well done.
 
joebrown, and how much did that insurance cover and what was the cost?
 
Transam, I certainly don't thing so, at least not for the states. But you must have income or certain amount to guarantee support. I gave up on a visa for the wife after seeing and hearing all the hoops, time and cost. It was only for a month, until I finished work. Nothing about insurance. Oh, she didn't want to go anyway, she knows too much about what the states are really like, especially the south.

.
Bloody hell sarge, there's not too many on TVF who've been on a two way firing range!

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[sgtsabai]

There's more than you know. And, a hell of a lot more here in Thailand, including Aussies, bless 'em. Unlike me, they just try to get on with life and keep a low profile. Not in my blood, but I do know when to keep both head and butt low to the ground...lol.

[Deepinthailand]

1 hour ago, geisha said:

All posting against having an obligation for health insurance, obviously have never had a serious health problem away from home ! Apart from all the tragic accidents and scooter falls, agressions and normal health problems, There is the family back home, or here in Thailand , who cannot help financially huge amounts for their loved ones. I would not like to inflict that on my family. I have two examples, that could have led to death. A young friend of mine who went to Costa Rica ( yes!) for a holiday. She suffered a brain haemorrhage while there, and if not for her travel insurance that paid for a helicopter and good care, she would have died ! Another friend of mine, around 50 years old, had a very serious lung problem. Luckily he was able to get back to France , nearly dying on the way, 2  months hospital '! So I'd say, yes, an obligation at least for all people on tourist visas, and some arrangement for people over a certain age that cannot get insurance. 

 

Not so at all but I self fund as insurance would not have covered my illness anyway. government hospitals are good in my area and treated me well.

[Naam]

9 hours ago, Gerard052 said:

Try again.  They were going to charge me $ 2,000.00 with $ 1,000.00 deductible for 5 months.  Is it what you call reasonable?  I told them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, I"ll go without it.

affordable travel insurance is usually limited to two months. and if the Thais are serious and demand health insurance you might go without it... but not to Thailand. as simple as that.

[mrfaroukh]

13 hours ago, Cats4ever said:

Yes they should - bludging off another country is not good. How you prove you have the insurance could be tricky. I have a print out of my insurance with me when I travel; would not be hard to forge.

But if you really need medical attention that may easily cost you many hundreds of thousands Baht then the fake medical insurance is not going to help you.

[Torrens54]

They "should" have Travel Insurance BUT if they were to be refused entry because they don't have it, Thailand would see a whole lot LESS Tourists.

 

[bangkok19]

Some form of Health Insurance when travelling should share the same importance as Passport, visa's and spending money.

An alternative is to UPGRADE your MasterCard or VISA card to one of your bank's GOLD or PLATINUM card options. These cards usually cover you with Travel Insurance if you pay for your ticket with the card. Make sure though you COMPARE the different offers. One of my cards offers DOUBLE Hospital cover compared to the other one.  In a lot of cases to be covered by the card's Travel Insurance you are required to pay for your plane/cruise tickets with the card. Others tell you the minimum amount you must pay towards your holiday with the card,  to be covered.  The Credit Card I pay my tickets with uses Zurich Insurance.  Their cover for loss of luggage, theft or cancellations etc is good, the health side of it borders on basic to okay. However, I think if I was spending a LENGTHY stay in Europe or the U.S. I'd pay the extra for more cover,  BUT for shorter stays in Thailand (<2 months) the Gold Credit card is fine.   Unless of course you are elderly and suffer poor health...  then the safest and most economical option is to stay home!
 

 

[Scott]

After nearly 25 years working in Thailand for a couple of businesses that employed a significant number of people (ranging from 75+ to nearly 1,000), there were a lot of people who required emergency medical care for serious situations.  

 

Thailand has a very high accident rate and a lot of foreigners, both short term and long term residents, end up needing medical care.  

 

The organizations I worked for provided health insurance, but it seemed like every year there were several who managed to get into an accident before the insurance become active.   Some of these were very expensive.

 

[hawker9000]

Oh no.  Not this again. 

 

The idea is impractical and fraught with opportunities for abuse by authorities.  But if they're going to have it, it would best be focused on longstayers residing in the kingdom and not mere tourists (make it part of the visa application and 90d/annual renewal processes).  I realize there's a grey area wherein the tourist visa gets abused - just another example of how the abusers make life more difficult for those playing by the rules. 

 

A better solution is to blacklist - permanently or at least until bills are paid in full - anyone/everyone who doesn't fully pay their medical bills upon hospital release.  Release the deadbeats to immigration authorities who then either carry out immediate deportation or escort them to IDC (no exceptions, e.g., for property, possessions, wife/family in kingdom, etc.).  It won't stop first-timer offenders, but the word will get out (actually leverage the social media for a change instead of pretending it doesn't exist...), repeat offenders will be eliminated from the gene pool, and the level of abuse will subside.

 

If you want to argue about inflated/bogus hospital charges, start another thread.  That's a different problem.

Edited November 27, 2016 by hawker9000

[angelman]

I am over 75. Impossible to get insurance. I would live in a different country if I could. Point. At some point in your life you ARE on your own. Take responsibility for it. Take care, be careful ACCEPT what comes. I have strong Will and Faith in Gods plan for me. I have gone to hospital here for less than catastrophic. Paid cash including deposit up front.   Unless you are a weak socialist, you accept that no-one MUST take care you.

[Sheryl]

18 hours ago, SgtRock said:

 

2 issues here. Foreigners entering Thailand and immigration rules.

 

1. Not many immigration rules apply to foreigners ( tourists ) on holiday. I think it is only correct, for both the tourist and Thailand that the tourist has appropriate medical insurance to cover their short stay in Thailand. I am talking about those that come for a 2 / 3 week holiday and return home.

 

2. Long term foreigners are a totally different barrel of fish. Of course they should also have appropriate medical insurance. The issue arises when they will no longer be accepted for medical insurance due to age restrictions.

 

Grey area, with no specific answers. 

 

Perhaps some sort of Government Health Insurance when people have passed the age limit for Health Insurance might be the answer. Then again, with the amount of Thai bashing that goes on, I would not be inclined to agree to that if I was a Thai Government official.

 

Low age restrictions are a feature of Thai issued policies. There are international  insurance companies offering expat policies who will enroll people as old as 100. So it is not the case that anyone is unable to get insurance solely because of age, though people who have only looked at the  local insurance market may easily get that impression.

 

The problem is rather that insurance for older people is quite costly, and also that many older people have pre-exisitng conditions which insurance will not cover. In most cases they can still get a policy, but the policy will exclude their pre-existing problems, or be limited to acute exacerbations of it.Depending on the specific conditions, this can become pretty far-reaching exclusions.

 

Reasons for the high cost of insurance includes (1) few international policies are specific to this region and rather provide levels of coverage higher than needed based on international costs, and (2) the relatively high and rapidly rising cost of care in private hospitals in the region.  There is certainly a market for a lower cost insurance for expats with coverage limited to government hospitals, or some sort of system whereby they could enroll, for a fee, into either the Social Security system or the so-called "30 baht" scheme (latter would be limited to government hospitals; former to government hospitals and a few private ones that opt into the scheme). There is already such a scheme for migrant workers from neighboring countries, but the premiums would not be appropriate for resident expats who tend to be much older/less fit.  There has been talk over the years of setting up such a thing, I don't know the status - will require some work by health financing experts to figure out an appropriate premium.

 

One would hope that such things would be dealt with before making insurance mandatory for extensions of stay among foreigners already resident here....as it would otherwise  create serious problems for quiet a few people.

[DUNROAMIN]

I am 64 now with existing ailment, my cheapest private cover would cost me about 125,000 - 150,000B a year. When your on a pension that is a large amount to cover you. Health insurance companies are rouges and will pull every trick under the sun and find a hidden term in their policy fine print to get out of paying you.

I believe tourist all should have travel insurance for a holiday here, however I agree with BARNICLEBOB quote, that the Thai government should come up with a health plan for retired farangs, I for one would pay if it was a reasonable cost.

[Gerard052]

21 hours ago, gamini said:

 

 

You should read the post properly. It is referring to the travel insurance not about yearly insurance.. Two weeks on global is US$20-US$40.

I read the post properly and they talk about medical insurance and that what I am talking about.  I got a quote in my country for a 5 month medical coverage for Thailand and their quote was $ 2,000.00 premium with a $ 1,000.00 deductible meaning that if I had a claim for a medical bill it would have cost me a minimum of $ 3,000.00 so I told them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine and I went without any insurance and I still do as I despise insurance company they are all crooks.

[lcp0761]

Respectively, it should be up to the individual traveler to have Intl travel insurance and in the event he/she doesn't have or isn't covered, then they should be referred to their countries Embassy to reach-out to family/friends for financial support.  During the referral period no medical attention should be rendered; period!

 

Its the travelers risk on traveling without insurance so they (the traveler) ultimately will be impacted.

 

 

 

 

[elektrified]

On 11/27/2016 at 1:53 PM, Kabula said:

 

Go in with a $50,000 required procedure like a heart problem without insurance/minimum credit requirements and see what happens! You might find yourself pushed out the door and left at the curb!

My friend who lived in Bangkok for 15 years had a heart attack while on an airplane and on the runway, waiting to take off from Suvarnabhumi. He was taken off the plane and rushed to a hospital near the airport. He couldn't even get into the E.R. until he put a 180,000 Baht deposit on a credit card. It took a while to contact his 92 y/o mother in the USA to get her to contact the bank to authorize the charge on the credit card. He was there the next 6 days or so, CCU for about 3-4 days, had a balloon put in, as well as a couple of other cardiac procedures. His bill was well over 370,000 Baht and he didn't have the money to pay the balance. The hospital sent him home in a mini-van and two guys camped out in front of his house in the van for about 3 days as I recall. They told him that when he could find a way to pay the balance, just to let them know and they would take him anywhere he needed to go to get the money.  They never pressured him or mentioned it again, just waited. His wife gave them a house key so they could use the loo at night! On about the 4th day, my friend came up with the money and they took him to the bank where the transfer was made and he paid the balance of his bill, was taken home and his passport was returned.

[jpinx]

19 minutes ago, elektrified said:

My friend who lived in Bangkok for 15 years had a heart attack while on an airplane and on the runway, waiting to take off from Suvarnabhumi. He was taken off the plane and rushed to a hospital near the airport. He couldn't even get into the E.R. until he put a 180,000 Baht deposit on a credit card. It took a while to contact his 92 y/o mother in the USA to get her to contact the bank to authorize the charge on the credit card. He was there the next 6 days or so, CCU for about 3-4 days, had a balloon put in, as well as a couple of other cardiac procedures. His bill was well over 370,000 Baht and he didn't have the money to pay the balance. The hospital sent him home in a mini-van and two guys camped out in front of his house in the van for about 3 days as I recall. They told him that when he could find a way to pay the balance, just to let them know and they would take him anywhere he needed to go to get the money.  They never pressured him or mentioned it again, just waited. His wife gave them a house key so they could use the loo at night! On about the 4th day, my friend came up with the money and they took him to the bank where the transfer was made and he paid the balance of his bill, was taken home and his passport was returned.

That says more about the hospital he was taken to.  If there was some way of carrying a card that said "Take me to the nearest government hospital"  a lot of these situations would not arise.  The fact is that ambulances here make their money from commissions from the hospitals, so they will drive past a government hospital to get to the private hospital where they get the bigger fee.

[elektrified]

1 hour ago, jpinx said:

That says more about the hospital he was taken to.  If there was some way of carrying a card that said "Take me to the nearest government hospital"  a lot of these situations would not arise.  The fact is that ambulances here make their money from commissions from the hospitals, so they will drive past a government hospital to get to the private hospital where they get the bigger fee.

Except that Suvarnabhumi has a contract with this hospital my friend was told. Can't recall the name. All emergencies from Suvarnabhumi are sent to this hospital. This was about 4 years ago.

[jpinx]

25 minutes ago, elektrified said:

Except that Suvarnabhumi has a contract with this hospital my friend was told. Can't recall the name. All emergencies from Suvarnabhumi are sent to this hospital. This was about 4 years ago.

Please don't misunderstand me - I have great sympathy for your friend and his being caught in a horrible situation,  I merely used that to highlight one of the little mentioned facts about "healthcare" in Thailand.  I hope he has made a full recovery and will enjoy the rest of his retirement without further dramas. 

 

I was unaware of an airport being able to contract a hospital for all cases - one wonders what happens to a luggage handler who breaks his arm on the conveyor system?  Where would he be sent?  Answers on a postcard please,,,,,,,  

[brianlg]

Any "IDIOT TOURIST" who travels ANYWHERE [in the world] WITHOUT appropriate Travel/Medical Insurance deserves what he/she gets !!!.

It is a large [unnecessary] drain on the Thai medical/hospital financial budget and is also a very foolish decision by the said "IDIOT TOURIST" ...

NB: There are on average 25000 Australian tourists just in PHUKET ; on any given day [from my own research; and on ThaiVisa]

AND that is just from my country AND only ONE TH destination ???

Many countries will NOT issue a VISA unless you have Travel/Medical Insurance in place.

I have been visiting Thailand BOTH as a tourist and International Volunteer worker for the past 16 years AND would NEVER travel without Travel/Medical Insurance. It is just not worth the RISK !!!

[Gerard052]

On 11/30/2016 at 0:06 PM, jpinx said:

That says more about the hospital he was taken to.  If there was some way of carrying a card that said "Take me to the nearest government hospital"  a lot of these situations would not arise.  The fact is that ambulances here make their money from commissions from the hospitals, so they will drive past a government hospital to get to the private hospital where they get the bigger fee.

I know exactly what you are talking about, in 2009 I had a hernia operation and the Bangkok Pattaya hospital was going to charge me 6.5 more times than the local hospital(Queen Sirikit)  I went too, so it was an easy decision.  But in case of an emergency they probably go to the most expensive one, as they think all farangs are loaded with money.

[Sheryl]

Except that Suvarnabhumi has a contract with this hospital my friend was told. Can't recall the name. All emergencies from Suvarnabhumi are sent to this hospital. This was about 4 years ago.

I think it is Samitivej Srinakarin.

[jpinx]

11 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

I think it is Samitivej Srinakarin.

I can not believe that an ambulance will be "arrested" for going somewhere else at the patients request?  How is such a travesty enforced? 

[Gerard052]

On 12/1/2016 at 7:54 AM, brianlg said:

Any "IDIOT TOURIST" who travels ANYWHERE [in the world] WITHOUT appropriate Travel/Medical Insurance deserves what he/she gets !!!.

It is a large [unnecessary] drain on the Thai medical/hospital financial budget and is also a very foolish decision by the said "IDIOT TOURIST" ...

NB: There are on average 25000 Australian tourists just in PHUKET ; on any given day [from my own research; and on ThaiVisa]

AND that is just from my country AND only ONE TH destination ???

Many countries will NOT issue a VISA unless you have Travel/Medical Insurance in place.

I have been visiting Thailand BOTH as a tourist and International Volunteer worker for the past 16 years AND would NEVER travel without Travel/Medical Insurance. It is just not worth the RISK !!!

I am one of those "IDIOT TOURIST" and if you don't like it you know what you can do.

[Rhys]

An interesting challenge for the Traveler...well, if one does get hurt and requires care, there must be an option.  The scam potential and over pricing of coverages of will take place.   For the long term  resident or retiree, generally, they have that covered via the 800K security deposit.

 

However, for someone just visiting LOS, going to the provinces and taking a Triple Double decker bus, or taking a train down south, or driving in Thailand, it would be a good idea, if your wallet is sufficient... Heaven knows, the Thai Medical System has altruistic behaviors for travelers.

 

 ....the farang traveler would be such a burden on the Thai health care system.

[Sheryl]

I can not believe that an ambulance will be "arrested" for going somewhere else at the patients request?  How is such a travesty enforced? 

Of course the ambulance will not be "arrested" but as the ambulance belongs to the hospital and its drivers are hospital employees there is no way it is going to go anywhere else. The drivers are under orders and would be fired. This is not an ambulance belonging to a government run emergency service. It is a private ambulance belonging to a private hospital which has a small medical clinic in the airport and contract with the airport.

One does not have to use this service, could also summon an ambulance from another hospital or take a cab to one if stable enough...but most travelers would not know how to do that and some might not be stable enough to.

One can also, on arrival at the hospital, refuse to be admitted and insist on transfer elsewhete. But some issue: would need to know to do this and where else to go, be sufficiently stable and able to communicate.

And don't forget that government hospitals, while less expensive than private ones, are not free and for a serious illness or accident costs can still be quite considerable

[jpinx]

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Of course the ambulance will not be "arrested" but as the ambulance belongs to the hospital and its drivers are hospital employees there is no way it is going to go anywhere else. The drivers are under orders and would be fired. This is not an ambulance belonging to a government run emergency service. It is a private ambulance belonging to a private hospital which has a small medical clinic in the airport and contract with the airport.

One does not have to use this service, could also summon an ambulance from another hospital or take a cab to one if stable enough...but most travelers would not know how to do that and some might not be stable enough to.

One can also, on arrival at the hospital, refuse to be admitted and insist on transfer elsewhete. But some issue: would need to know to do this and where else to go, be sufficiently stable and able to communicate.

And don't forget that government hospitals, while less expensive than private ones, are not free and for a serious illness or accident costs can still be quite considerable

Ah -- ok -- that explains it much better, thanks.  The contract is for ambulance services, and a specific hospitals ambulances won the contract -- makes perfect sense now .  

I've always taken the view that if I am sufficiently coherent and mobile, I'll take a taxi to the hospital of my choice and pay the taxi cleaner if need be.  The option of refusing to go into the ER at a hospital would be quite hard-core and would probably only work if you have someone with you to argue the case. Certainly the government hospital is not free, but the idea is to keep the bill "sensible"

Thanks Sheryl  -- the old brain caught up with you eventually :)

[Sheryl]

I didn't mean refuse to go into the ER for assessment a d stabization, that would indeed be hard to do and probably also unwise if one was ill enough to really need the am ulance to begin with.

I meant refuse to be admitted there as an inpatient if initial assessmented to that recommendation. That would require signing consent forms anf producing proof of ability to pay (insurance or credit card deposit), the perfect point at which to say thanks but no thanks, I don't have funds and want to go to a government hospital....assuming of course you are stable enough to do so.