Putin 'very smart', says Trump, as Russia fails to retaliate to US 'hacking' expulsions

[narak34]

3 minutes ago, rabas said:

Obama has maintained US policy and strategy that has been tested and proven reliable since the time of Thatcher and Reagan when they  caused the demise of the Soviet Union.

 

Then why did the Soviet Union shrink under Reagan and Russia expand significantly under Obama on two fronts, including military bases in the Middle East? Russia is now on the march (as is China). They ran from Reagan.

 

Reagan built up the US Military.

Obama reduced it.

 

Reagan open mike comment "Bombs away"

Obama open mike comment "Tell Vlad I'll be more flexible after the election"

 

That's like comparing apples and oranges. The cold war was about an ideological conflict. Today Russia is not an enemy. But very influential people in the military industrial complex are trying to perpetuate that myth in order to justify excessive military spending.

 

The reality is that with nuclear weapons there is either peace or complete destruction of humanity.

[boomerangutang]

1 hour ago, narak34 said:

So where is the proof? 

I'll let Geriatrickid frame it: "The president has acted upon the advice of his national security agencies, his military and of his experience with real politik."

 

In other words, the proof is: multiple recent findings by CIA and other US intelligence agencies.  Should the CIA tell us, the general public, all the details about its clandestine operations?  Unless you're a dummy, the answer is 'no.'

[smotherb]

22 hours ago, JHolmesJr said:

Wow….obama's 'legendary' statesmanship and cool demeanour have deserted him…he is behaving like a spoiled brat….what a note to depart on.

 

Don't clear the russians' apartments yet they'll be back in a couple of months.

 

What a plonker Obama is. 

Behaving like a spoiled brat? The Director of National Intelligence, Homeland Security and the FBI have confirmed the hacking and noted Republican congressmen have agreed. Are you saying you know more than they about the alleged hacking, or is it simply your anti-Obama-bias which guides your thoughts?

[smotherb]

Just now, narak34 said:

 

No they haven't. Show me where in that report they have evidence that Russia was behind it. Can we lay the republican vs democrat conflict aside and focus on facts here?

You think we have access to the specific data in a report? Try this Fox News report http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/12/30/us-gives-detailed-look-at-russias-alleged-election-hacking.html

 

Of course, the intelligence community has been wrong in the past and mislead other presidents; so this again may be the case.

 

And, if you think this is not a DEM/REP issue, you haven't been paying attention. Trump is dismissing it because it degrades his election, so I see his point. Do you really think Obama would do this if he were not convinced? The election is over you know.

[rabas]

43 minutes ago, narak34 said:

 

49 minutes ago, rabas said:

Obama has maintained US policy and strategy that has been tested and proven reliable since the time of Thatcher and Reagan when they  caused the demise of the Soviet Union.

 

Then why did the Soviet Union shrink under Reagan and Russia expand significantly under Obama on two fronts, including military bases in the Middle East? Russia is now on the march (as is China). They ran from Reagan.

 

 

That's like comparing apples and oranges. The cold war was about an ideological conflict. Today Russia is not an enemy. But very influential people in the military industrial complex are trying to perpetuate that myth in order to justify excessive military spending.

 

The reality is that with nuclear weapons there is either peace or complete destruction of humanity.

 

I agree, with nuclear weapons there is either peace, or a huge pile of little tiny pieces.

 

I also agree that in principle, Russia should not be an enemy, but that requires change on Russia's, Putin's part, too. Drop the military expansion as a first option to all problems. Historically, Ukraine has always been, and will be, critical to Russia because it's their bread basket. But they should try to build more modern trading relations rather than military/political control. Otherwise they just feed the western military-industrial complex.

 

Higher world oil prices are also critical to Russia, hence it's desire for involvement in the middle east, and the reason the West has kept them out. So yeah, I hope there are ways all sides can learn to work together.

 

But I for one have never viewed the Russian people as an enemy, yes I was there during the cold war, some of the finest people on Earth.

 

 

Edited January 1, 2017 by rabas

[smotherb]

9 minutes ago, narak34 said:

 

The report media is quoting is the report I am asking you to tell me that Russia is behind the hacks. You can't because there is zero evidence. You can read the report here: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/dec/29/fbi-dhs-russian-hacking-report

 

And yes I do believe that Obama is doing this out of spite. Trying to blame Russia for Hillary losing the election.

Ah, ah, your bringing up that buggy-boo you complained about,  " Can we lay the republican vs democrat conflict aside and focus on facts here? "

 

Certainly, you are not basing your argument on " Security experts on Twitter" as your article suggests.

 

There are many nay-saying articles; but as I said, we do not have access to the details of what was reported by the intelligence community. However, Obama does have that access and he decided it was enough. Whether right or wrong, at least Obama didn't start a war over it like Bush did.

[JHolmesJr]

49 minutes ago, smotherb said:

Behaving like a spoiled brat? The Director of National Intelligence, Homeland Security and the FBI have confirmed the hacking and noted Republican congressmen have agreed. Are you saying you know more than they about the alleged hacking, or is it simply your anti-Obama-bias which guides your thoughts?

 

Well....i would think the correct protocol is for him to arrange for mr trump to be briefed and shown the evidence. Then figure out the way forward together. There is no need to start something willy nilly....that he cant finish....hes out in 2 weeks or so....

[smotherb]

Just now, JHolmesJr said:

 

Well....i would think the correct protocol is for him to arrange for mr trump to be briefed and shown the evidence. Then figure out the way forward together. There is no need to start something willy nilly....that he cant finish....hes out in 2 weeks or so....

Yes, that is what you would think. Apparently, the president did not think that.

[anotheruser]

Fails to retaliate? Lol maybe that translates to castrates Obama? Message to Obama "even the Russians don't give a flying lame duck" you have a couple more weeks in office son and people will just step around you like they would a puddle in the path.




Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[Lokie]

The Kremlin must be laughing their Jacob's off at the moment, Obama and Co are looking like a right bunch of ThroBBers!

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Lokie said:

The Kremlin must be laughing their Jacob's off at the moment, Obama and Co are looking like a right bunch of ThroBBers!

They're very happy they helped get their puppet trump elected, that's for sure. 

[Opl]

1 hour ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

Well....i would think the correct protocol is for him to arrange for mr trump to be briefed and shown the evidence. Then figure out the way forward together. There is no need to start something willy nilly....that he cant finish....hes out in 2 weeks or so....

 

1 hour ago, smotherb said:

Yes, that is what you would think. Apparently, the president did not think that.

 

With Trump's addiction to Twitter , anyone should be extremely carefull... 

Edited January 1, 2017 by Opl

[geriatrickid]

4 hours ago, narak34 said:

 

Funny you use the word sheep. Who are the people who believe Russia were responsible for the hacking without any proof? Isn't the definition of sheep in this context people who blindly follows without questioning?

 

What happened to 9/11, never forgive, never forget? And here we are arming, funding and training Al-Qaeda yet again. One would expect we would work with Russia to eliminate terrorism. And not falsely accuse them of meddling with our elections. 

 

The USA is not arming  Al Qaeda. Don't spread disinformation.  This claim is popular amongst those who wish to pursue the Putin partnership. Get it through your head, Russia is using gullible fools who believe  Russia is fighting terrorism.  It should be apparent that when Iran and its proxy army of Hizbollah are aligned with anyone, it's going to be an anti western  coalition. Russia and Iran are  allies in the support of Assad, period. The USA  only supported the FSA and the Kurds who are neither jihadists nor anti west.

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

Well....i would think the correct protocol is for him to arrange for mr trump to be briefed and shown the evidence. Then figure out the way forward together. There is no need to start something willy nilly....that he cant finish....hes out in 2 weeks or so....

At his New Year's Eve party Trump announced that contrary to what American intelligence agencies have determined - that Russian directed the hacking - he knows "things that other people don't know, and so they cannot be sure of the situation." He'll disclose his information this week. 

Trump now says he knows a lot about hacking ... a very hard thing to prove.

http://usa.liveuamap.com/en/2017/1-january-donald-trump-says-he-has-inside-information-on

http://us.pressfrom.com/news/politics/-15471-trump-says-he-has-hacking-information-others-don-t-know/

It's not a question of the government briefing Trump - he has more reliable sources!

[GOLDBUGGY]

10 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

So you're saying it's OK to allow Russia to hack US computers?  With no retaliation?  More like what a plonker Trump is.  Ignores national security.  Not a president we need.

Spying is Spying! This has been going on since the beginning of Time and it will continue to go on until the end of Time! How do you think Russia got the formula for making the A-Bomb so quickly? 

 

As someone else suggested here, we all know that Spying is going on 24/7. We also all know there is nothing we can do to stop that either. That a great deal of Vital Information is in Cyber Space, and thus we need to protect that. That our best Offense to these Cyber Crimes is having a good Defense. By setting up Fire Walls that cannot be penetrated by Hackers.

 

But then you have some High Ranking Government Official (Clinton) who knowingly breaks all the rules and decides to bring her Lap Top Home to use, as it was more convenient for her to do so. Not realizing that the second she plugs her computer into the Internet, there is some Professional Spying Hacker standing by. Who was waiting and just hoping for such an opportunity, so they could enter her computer through the back door and have access to Top Secret Critical and Vital Information, that because of her high position she was allowed to have access to. Also why the FBI got involved in the first place.  

 

So when this news breaks what steps do they take in a form of retaliation a month later? Do they punish the person for bringing home her Lap Top against all the rules? No! They kick out 35 Russian Diplomats, where I am sure there is 75 more their waiting in line to take there place, cause an issue with Russia, by pointing there finger and jumping up and down, and crying as Russia was Spying on them.

 

Don't you think this is Foolish? Is Stupid? Is So Childish? I sure do! I suppose why Russia hasn't reacted to this move as they do to.

 

When secrets about the A-Bomb were known to have been given out, they did not look for the Russian Spies who were receiving this information, and point fingers at them and call them names. They first went after the person who was supplying them this vital information. When he was caught he was given a 14 year jail sentence. After serving 9 years he had his citizenship stripped, he was banned for life for entering the United States, and he was taken to Communist East Germany where he spent the rest of his life.    

 

Now that is what I would call "Retaliation" for such criminal acts.   

[Andaman Al]

14 hours ago, rabas said:

You prefer Trump say Putin was dumb for not responding?

 

 

I would prefer Trump act like a statesman and say "no comment, our President is dealing with it", OR say nothing at all.  Any one that has ever had a boss knows Leadership/Followership 101 NEVER diss a member of your team/company/ Presidential Administration in front of the enemy - EVER!

 

11 hours ago, jaidam said:

When this "hack" turns out to have been a leak from a democrat insider, will there be any apologies given? Sad to see some have swallowed the msm line so thoroughly they are being aggressive and insulting without even a shred of evidence to back up their moonshot. Completely irrational behavior. 

 

I am simply staggered that Trump supporters will now summit that despite 15-17 National Intelligence agencies stating the hacking was the Russians, they suggest that actually it is more likely to be a Democrat Insider!! Your entire post favours the Russians over the entire security professionals in the USA. This type of brain washing that is taking place is quite incredible to watch. Are you all drinking 'Trump Mineral Water' or something?

 

3 hours ago, Srikcir said:

At his New Year's Eve party Trump announced that contrary to what American intelligence agencies have determined - that Russian directed the hacking - he knows "things that other people don't know, and so they cannot be sure of the situation." He'll disclose his information this week. 

Trump now says he knows a lot about hacking ... a very hard thing to prove.

http://usa.liveuamap.com/en/2017/1-january-donald-trump-says-he-has-inside-information-on

http://us.pressfrom.com/news/politics/-15471-trump-says-he-has-hacking-information-others-don-t-know/

It's not a question of the government briefing Trump - he has more reliable sources!

 

Trumps latest 'Little Helper", all the way from New Jersey! Having heard that Government should employ hackers to enhance their security, the newest member of Trumps cabinet was announced today in NJ. He is being given a full pardon by Trump for the Russian Hacking Scandal and Putin will award him the 'Hero of the Russian Federation' when he joins Trump at Mara largo on Jan 21 for Trumps inauguration party.

 

 

 

[craigt3365]

12 hours ago, Grouse said:

The president of the USA uses Twitter!

 

Is it just me or is that rather embarrassing? 

What's embarrassing is what he says.  Like an unruly child.

[craigt3365]

11 hours ago, narak34 said:

 

So where is the proof? 

Read any credible news source and you'll find it.  Plenty of articles here on TVF also.

[craigt3365]

9 hours ago, anotheruser said:

Fails to retaliate? Lol maybe that translates to castrates Obama? Message to Obama "even the Russians don't give a flying lame duck" you have a couple more weeks in office son and people will just step around you like they would a puddle in the path.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

People tend to just focus on the president.  Though he's important, there are many more very important people in the government.  And many are saying they will pursue this hack aggressively.  These are republicans.  Ones Trump desperately needs for support.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out in a few weeks.  Could be lots of fireworks starting then????

[boomerangutang]

12 hours ago, smotherb said:

Behaving like a spoiled brat? The Director of National Intelligence, Homeland Security and the FBI have confirmed the hacking and noted Republican congressmen have agreed. Are you saying you know more than they about the alleged hacking, or is it simply your anti-Obama-bias which guides your thoughts?

 

Obama and HRC haters aren't the brightest lights on the Trump Xmas tree.  During Obama's 8 years at the helm, unemployment has gone down markedly, but if you ask Trump fans, unemployment has risen dramatically.  Also, the Dow Jones has gone up mightily during Obama, but if you ask Trump fans, it's dropped.   Trump fans are so dumb, if you show them a yellow chicken, they would say, "It's red, it's blue, it's black, it's green, ......anything but yellow."

[smotherb]

9 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

 

Obama and HRC haters aren't the brightest lights on the Trump Xmas tree.  During Obama's 8 years at the helm, unemployment has gone down markedly, but if you ask Trump fans, unemployment has risen dramatically.  Also, the Dow Jones has gone up mightily during Obama, but if you ask Trump fans, it's dropped.   Trump fans are so dumb, if you show them a yellow chicken, they would say, "It's red, it's blue, it's black, it's green, ......anything but yellow."

You may be giving them too much credit; are you sure they know that many colors?

[Berkshire]

On 12/31/2016 at 5:14 PM, ukrules said:

Obama is trying to make things hard for Trump, I suspect he's just made it very easy for Trump to improve relations between the US and Russia.

 

Improve relations between the US and Russia?  All that means is letting Putin do whatever he darn pleases. 

[Grubster]

13 hours ago, retarius said:

There is a very old piece of wisdom: never underestimate your opponent.

Obama has, in my opinion, consistently underestimated Putin and has been made to look really stupid by a smarter and more statesmanlike man.

Trump is showing signs of not underestimating Putin which is a good thing if you see Russia as the enemy. The other smart thing Trump is doing is not treating Russia like an enemy as the stupid neocons do.

The US hacks into other sovereign nations computer systems. It even hacked Merkel's phone for goodness' sake. How hypocritical can you be to complain if Russia hacks you back?

Plus after the WMDs in Iraq and what is going on in Syria where the US has been seriously exposed supporting the very groups that brought the WTCs down, I would not trust the US security agencies as far as I could throw them. They need cleaning out and the zealots fired. And the world would be an infinitely better place without the CIA. Overall, based on what limited information that has been released there is not a shred of evidence that Russia hacked the DNC. The 13 pager was a joke, saying that Russia has the capability therefore it did it. Nothing that would stand up in a court of law anywhere on earth. 

More informed opinion (opinion which I believe) tells me that if the DNC was hacked by Russia, why would they use old malware from the Ukraine when they have better tools. When a computer is hacked, there are bits of code left which can be used to identify the source, and since the US monitors everyone remotely connected to Wikileaks they would have seen the transfer of data there and could have identified the source for sure. Assange, a hero to me, says that he did not receive the info from Russia…why shoudln't I believe him. His mate, whose name escapes me says he picked the info up on a stick from a person in the US that actually leaked it…a disillusioned aide in the Clinton campaign.

We all believe what we want to believe, and this is my belief based on what I have read and my own past observations of situations.

Good luck with all that. Putin is an idiot and will go down in history that way. Putin is starving his own people to play his little games. He had a chance to join the free world but can't bring himself to give up his little big man status. I am sorry you don't trust our intelligence, I must admit that they should have stopped G W Bush on his lie about Iraq, which killed thousands of our own and created the vacuum for ISSIS.  I guess if you were in charge you would show your proof of hacks, giving up your methods of finding it. Last I checked we don't go into a court of law before we make international decisions or we surely wouldn't have gone into Iraq would we. Putin has run out of Pawns to move and he doesn't have the balls to move a bigger piece. Good luck

[Andaman Al]

7 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

 

Obama and HRC haters aren't the brightest lights on the Trump Xmas tree.  During Obama's 8 years at the helm, unemployment has gone down markedly, but if you ask Trump fans, unemployment has risen dramatically.  Also, the Dow Jones has gone up mightily during Obama, but if you ask Trump fans, it's dropped.   Trump fans are so dumb, if you show them a yellow chicken, they would say, "It's red, it's blue, it's black, it's green, ......anything but yellow."

 

I think this illustrates your point extremely well! I would hope all the Trump supporters will watch it but most do not have an attention span beyond 2 mins let alone 12.

 

 

[Morch]

On 1/1/2017 at 1:58 PM, tropo said:

Please explain to me how you deduced that Trump thinks that it's OK to allow Russia to hack US computers based on a single tweet. Also please explain how Obama's actions will help the US in any way?

 

It was a case of bad timing, and V Putin's response shows he's a lot smarter than Obama.

 

 

 

Perhaps the same way Trump supporters deduce his supposed wisdom from the very same tweet. And that's pretty much it - a president, or president-elect shouldn't use this platform as the main means to communicate policies and opinions. Certainly not in a manner that resembles a teen with issues rather than a national leader. Not very "presidented" and bound to lead to trouble.

[Berkshire]

2 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

 

I think this illustrates your point extremely well! I would hope all the Trump supporters will watch it but most do not have an attention span beyond 2 mins let alone 12.

 

 

 

I actually watched that whole video.  All  I can say is....WOW.  Trump supporters have got to be the stupidest people in America.  But how in God's name can there be so many of them????  Thank God I'm in Thailand....away from all the stupid people. 

[tropo]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Perhaps the same way Trump supporters deduce his supposed wisdom from the very same tweet. And that's pretty much it - a president, or president-elect shouldn't use this platform as the main means to communicate policies and opinions. Certainly not in a manner that resembles a teen with issues rather than a national leader. Not very "presidented" and bound to lead to trouble.

 

 

 

Why shouldn't a president tweet? It's new technology, why not embrace it? There's no point being stuck in the dark ages where the press has total control over what information reaches the public... and puts spin on everything.

 

Twitter started on 21 March 2006. It's not like many presidents had the option of using it in the past. All the old timers will die out and this will become the new way of presidents and politicians.

Edited January 2, 2017 by tropo

[tropo]

3 hours ago, Andaman Al said:

 

I think this illustrates your point extremely well! I would hope all the Trump supporters will watch it but most do not have an attention span beyond 2 mins let alone 12.

 

 

If you want to get anyone to take your comments seriously and watch your video, it would really help if you didn't insult them first. One must ask, who's more dumb, you or the people you chastise?

[Morch]

54 minutes ago, tropo said:

Why shouldn't a president tweet? It's new technology, why not embrace it? There's no point being stuck in the dark ages where the press has total control over what information reaches the public... and puts spin on everything.

 

Twitter started on 21 March 2006. It's not like many presidents had the option of using it in the past. All the old timers will die out and this will become the new way of presidents and politicians.

 

Because communicating national and international policy on a platform allowing 140 characters is bound to lead to over simplification, misunderstanding and populism. Granted, these are things which serve Trump, less so the USA. Then there are questions of style and how one expresses himself, but guess that's a dead end of a discussion.

 

Spins are actually easier to manufacture nowadays, thanks to internet websites and the social media. Trump made that work for him too.

 

As for embracing new technology, seems like the president elect is more in favor of couriers, except when it comes to 3am tweets.

[tropo]

32 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Because communicating national and international policy on a platform allowing 140 characters is bound to lead to over simplification, misunderstanding and populism. Granted, these are things which serve Trump, less so the USA. Then there are questions of style and how one expresses himself, but guess that's a dead end of a discussion.

 

Spins are actually easier to manufacture nowadays, thanks to internet websites and the social media. Trump made that work for him too.

 

As for embracing new technology, seems like the president elect is more in favor of couriers, except when it comes to 3am tweets.

 

Time will tell. One thing is for sure, the Trump haters better get over themselves because whether they like it or not, they have at least another 4 years of this. It can't be good for their health to work themselves into a tizzy every day because the candidate they supported lost.