Intellectual Whore

[soalbundy]

Cant people just have simple conversations anymore without all this 'women's rights' and 'equality' being brought up? Around how many corners must one think before saying 'hello'.

[SoiBiker]

Just now, soalbundy said:

Cant people just have simple conversations anymore without all this 'women's rights' and 'equality' being brought up? Around how many corners must one think before saying 'hello'.

 

Sure. We just need to achieve equality, and then we can stop talking about it.

[FolkGuitar]

26 minutes ago, buddhalady said:

 

How to make her stay here more comfortable ....smile at her, talk to her, reassure her she's valued as part of the human race, etc, etc, etc.

 

 

 

That's what most folks want, I'd imagine. And having someone come up and talk with her in a polite manner 'should' address that. But from her original post, I got the impression that this is exactly what she does NOT want people to do.... Or at least, men to do.  I may be wrong, which is why I keep asking HER to tell us what it is that will make HER feel more comfortable here, rather than what WE 'think' will make her feel more comfortable.

 

 

Quote

Yesterday in BigC  I attempted my own straw poll on male farangs....every time I walked past one, I smiled and nodded. Guess what - stony-faced rejection of even a smile. Says it all, as far as I'm concerned.

 

No... not at all. This is a VERY common reaction from western people here in Thailand, not just men ignoring women or women ignoring men.  I walk into town every day, right through the middle of the Old City. I pass ex-pats and tourists alike. Less the one in twenty will even make eye contact, much less smile. Please don't imagine that this is a male/female issue... unless you need to imagine it as such to bolster arguments about men.

 

[jpinx]

2 minutes ago, SoiBiker said:

 

Sure. We just need to achieve equality, and then we can stop talking about it.

Equality is like happiness -- it's a choice you make for yourself.  If you feel unequal, change the company you keep -- find nicer friends

[soalbundy]

5 minutes ago, SoiBiker said:

 

Sure. We just need to achieve equality, and then we can stop talking about it.

I don't talk about it, i don't know anyone who does except for my ex-wife in Germany who now lives with and supports an ex-con toyboy who could be her son. Both i and my adult daughter have tried to warn her that a man who is good looking, not yet 30 and has been inside for deception and just been released, is looking for a roof over his head and money, what do we get as a logical answer ? women's lib ! men can go with younger women so she can go with a younger man. My daughter told her not to come running to her when her bank account is empty. 

[WinnieTheKhwai]

47 minutes ago, buddhalady said:

How to make her stay here more comfortable ....smile at her, talk to her, reassure her she's valued as part of the human race, etc, etc, etc.
 

 

Yes.. but.. you better be single when doing that!   (Remember?)  If in the course of that conversation it turns out you are married (and male, and Farang) then you are abusing her as an intellectual whore.   Because, reasons. :)  (Reasons also including the lovely assumption that Thai women are too stupid to have a real conversation with.)

 

Quote

Yesterday in BigC  I attempted my own straw poll on male farangs....every time I walked past one, I smiled and nodded. Guess what - stony-faced rejection of even a smile. Says it all, as far as I'm concerned. Must admit it was a very small poll at only five guys, all of whom were unaccompanied, but sadly it was more or less what I expected.

 

Interesting.  I think this needs extending to a larger group as well as settings that are more conducive to social interactions.  Maybe a pub somewhere that's at a crossroads of lots of potentially angry old Farangs as well as some younger men/women.   To get a good sample.   Big C would drag a lot of the friendliness out of me, too.  Also, maybe asking a question is a better check than just a random smile at a stranger, and then in a supermarket.. that's a little strange.

 

Quote

Soi Biker, I'm as upset at Western culture as are you, have been for years , but it's not feminization that's destroyed it even although Theresa May is doing her best via Brexit. Trump gives the perfect excuse for guys who think the way many posters here seem to, and he's about to be the leader of the so-called free world! The humans who chart the way the West  moves are, almost without exception, male, and they will deserve exactly what they get , although it's us females who will suffer more because of it.

 

So elect a woman then. You guys are in the majority.   (Thailand in contrast elected a woman just fine.)

 

 

 

[amykat]

29 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

For all the self-professed feminist bashers here, FWIW, I don't think anything the OP posted in her start to this thread was anything remotely related to a feminist agenda. Hey, no need to pay any heed to that.

 

But, for those of you who think that way, I guess when some men apparently told her she didn't belong in Thailand, that guy was actually just saying "Good Morning, How are you!"   But it was feminism that made her hear instead, "you don't belong here."

 

Or when some guy called her a "fat cow", the guy was really saying, "Looking very nice today."  But that darned feminism somehow translated that into the cow epithet.

 

Now I'm understanding you. It would seem there are quite a few others here who likewise would benefit from some psychiatric help...

 

If you want to debate with Amy about feminism, that's fine. But that wasn't the OP's agenda.

 

I agree with what you wrote.  But I want to say that I am sure that every Western Woman (unless she is a missionary or otherwise impaired possibly) is a Feminist in the normal sense.  We don't have an agenda, but this is who we are.  We are for equality generally and  support the things I wrote in the definition I posted earlier. There are not some of us who don't believe it and some of us who do.  Do you think there are groups of black people walking around America who are for racism and some who are against it?

 

Earlier today I said Feminism was the older word used, this was because when this started, nobody was even thinking yet of EQUALITY, that wasn't even a dream women could imagine!!  Now men are bashing us over the head with this word, like we have used it to castrate you. And saying it is more than equality.  Really?  We got the right to vote and to do a few things.  We still don't even have equal pay.  Blacks demanded equality ..do you know that some of the rights to work were given to women in some federal legislation in the US, as a way to stop blacks from working (equally)? 

 

So yes, the OP did not have an agenda!! Correct. The agenda is in the minds of you men, those of you specifically, who have the opposite and opposing agenda, and read into these situations things which are not there.

 

You can see this is many posts, from people who are not educated properly and tell us what they KNOW about legal doctrines and principles, one of which I corrected a page or two back. Other "believers" pick that up and "believe it" too.  I believe we are calling this Fake News these days, and I will call it Fake Knowledge ...many of you are suffering from it.

 

 

[tropo]

8 hours ago, George FmplesdaCosteedback said:

Equality means equality. Feminism does not promote equality.

That apart, it seems fairly obvious this woman is having problems adjusting to life as an ex-pat in Thailand.

She has some problem and she needs help of some kind to solve it, or she would never have written the post!

I love women, but not wimin.

Be polite and open a door for a woman in the west and you get abused, or if you don't you are still abused...

 

You must live on a different planet, Venus perhaps?

 

 

All things considered if that's her only problem she's doing quite well.

 

 

[FolkGuitar]

19 minutes ago, amykat said:

So yes, the OP did not have an agenda!!

 

Wow! I thought the OP's post was confusing before. Now I learn that she had absolutely no reason for making her post. At least, that's what you are saying here.  

 

But she made her post. She had a 'reason' (which is actually one of the  definitions of agenda) for making her post. She was making some sort of 'point' by her statement. And we still have no clear idea what that is...

 

We know what yours is. You've told us. Several other women have told us about theirs. But we still don't know about the OP's. The men only have their own interpretations or opinions, which, by your interpretations are all incorrect.  Very confusing, to say the least.

 

[tropo]

8 hours ago, George FmplesdaCosteedback said:

And Wikipedia is the be all and end all of infinite wisdom????

 

 

Meaning what???? One shouldn't make reference to the source of presented information if it's a direct copy?

[Jai Dee]

Several off-topic and argumentative posts have been removed from this thread.

[Jai Dee]

2 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

I am curious how it was edited without the edit stamp, as it was much later than that.. 

The OP posted on Friday at 09:13 PM.

There is an edit stamp at 09:21 PM by Simbaya.

[tropo]

8 hours ago, amykat said:

 Show me an academic journal or something relevant that tells me that "Feminism" as defined by women who are practicing it, means they want to be superior to men. Not just your feeling about it, as a pissed off man in Thailand.

 

1

For some reason, you think you speak for all Western women. You don't. You should spend some time in Australia and New Zealand... and take a trip to Continental Europe if you haven't been there.  

 

Most women are more practical. They accept the best that feminism has to offer and hold on to traditional practices when convenient. They want (and get) the best of both worlds.

 

[fordguy61mi]

49 minutes ago, amykat said:

 

I agree with what you wrote.  But I want to say that I am sure that every Western Woman (unless she is a missionary or otherwise impaired possibly) is a Feminist in the normal sense.  We don't have an agenda, but this is who we are.  We are for equality generally and  support the things I wrote in the definition I posted earlier. There are not some of us who don't believe it and some of us who do.  Do you think there are groups of black people walking around America who are for racism and some who are against it?

 

Earlier today I said Feminism was the older word used, this was because when this started, nobody was even thinking yet of EQUALITY, that wasn't even a dream women could imagine!!  Now men are bashing us over the head with this word, like we have used it to castrate you. And saying it is more than equality.  Really?  We got the right to vote and to do a few things.  We still don't even have equal pay.  Blacks demanded equality ..do you know that some of the rights to work were given to women in some federal legislation in the US, as a way to stop blacks from working (equally)? 

 

So yes, the OP did not have an agenda!! Correct. The agenda is in the minds of you men, those of you specifically, who have the opposite and opposing agenda, and read into these situations things which are not there.

 

You can see this is many posts, from people who are not educated properly and tell us what they KNOW about legal doctrines and principles, one of which I corrected a page or two back. Other "believers" pick that up and "believe it" too.  I believe we are calling this Fake News these days, and I will call it Fake Knowledge ...many of you are suffering from it.

 

 

When feminism first started it was about working outside the home, voting rights and such. Now it seems to me they've become a man-hating movement and they're bashing us all at every turn. So I'm not sure equality is what it's about now. It's turned into something more than that and it involves a lot of anger.

[Paul Catton]

14 minutes ago, amykat said:

 

I agree with what you wrote.  But I want to say that I am sure that every Western Woman (unless she is a missionary or otherwise impaired possibly) is a Feminist in the normal sense.  We don't have an agenda, but this is who we are.  We are for equality generally and  support the things I wrote in the definition I posted earlier. There are not some of us who don't believe it and some of us who do.  Do you think there are groups of black people walking around America who are for racism and some who are against it?

 

Earlier today I said Feminism was the older word used, this was because when this started, nobody was even thinking yet of EQUALITY, that wasn't even a dream women could imagine!!  Now men are bashing us over the head with this word, like we have used it to castrate you. And saying it is more than equality.  Really?  We got the right to vote and to do a few things.  We still don't even have equal pay.  Blacks demanded equality ..do you know that some of the rights to work were given to women in some federal legislation in the US, as a way to stop blacks from working (equally)? 

 

So yes, the OP did not have an agenda!! Correct. The agenda is in the minds of you men, those of you specifically, who have the opposite and opposing agenda, and read into these situations things which are not there.

 

You can see this is many posts, from people who are not educated properly and tell us what they KNOW about legal doctrines and principles, one of which I corrected a page or two back. Other "believers" pick that up and "believe it" too.  I believe we are calling this Fake News these days, and I will call it Fake Knowledge ...many of you are suffering from it.

 

 

Surprisingly a great proportion of women do not and would not define themselves as feminists.

Such a divisive ideology perpetuated on the back of myth and dare I say, at times outright falsehoods.

Being egalitarian which is neither misogynic nor misandric, I believe gives one a better insight into the overall oppressions facing humanity today.

 

An example from gender studies 101.

We still don't have equal pay.

Rebuttal.

https://www.avoiceformen.com/updates/what-pay-gap/

[smotherb]

3 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

 

 

And what exactly is wrong with that ?? 

 

How did having a friendly conversation about something turn into being classed as some kind of cheapened 'whore' ?? 

Why are you asking me? The OP used the term 'intellectual whore' and I too questioned it.

[wealthychef]

11 hours ago, amykat said:

 

You know, your point 1 ..several men have said this, here and at other times in Thailand, more to do with the sex as a weapon thing.  Somebody today made a point also about men here dropping all their pretenses and feeling free to be their "true selves."

 

But I have to say that I wasn't AWARE that you guys were faking it and I personally was never using sex as a WEAPON.  So, if you pretended to like me and be my friend,  because you hoped to have sex with me, and I would have told you that I was with someone and not interested in you in that way, or not right now, and you pursued me, as a friend anyway, than that is on YOU. You have actually been scamming me if you were faking it, not the other way around.  I don't know what your comment about being arrogant or presumptuous has to do with it actually, but many men come here and say they are sick of people like that in West also.  I think this must have to do with your own lack of self-esteem. I have never felt that I have to "pretend" to respect any people back home.

 

So what you are saying, is that you pretended to respect WOMEN at home, (not people) and now you can express yourself more honestly here. . which translates into "I don't respect WOMEN and I won't fake it here."

 

Then you add a big dose of blame to the woman ...why are men showing you contempt? Because you deserve it, you F'ing bitch.

 

Have I got that right??

 

I guess I'm just responding to what I consider the vagueness of your initial post.  I asked for an example of the bad behavior but you don't seem interested in providing details, so I have to continue on in vague terms which will of course lead us both astray as they are wild guesses.  

 

When I talk about being more of my true self, dropping my pretenses, that's because that's just my experience as a man.  Maybe one of the times when you are having an "intellectual conversation" with a guy, you could ask him about these things instead of taking it personally and assuming he's a big fat jerk just because he doesn't happen to fall in love with your sexy body or whatever you are worried about.  You might not think you are using sex as a weapon, maybe you could ask about that too, but I'm just hearing you taking all of this really personally.  

 

I don't "pretend to respect women at home" and secretly crave to abuse them.  Your attitude towards what I have to say shows that you are not aware how repressed men are in the USA.  In my opinion, telling you the truth is not disrespectful, even if the truth is that I don't like you or don't want to talk to you.  Ironically, if I tell you my experience of American women is that they seem arrogant and presumptuous, then you attack me as having low self esteem, which I think is actually arrogant and presumptuous on your part.  In truth the reason I might pretend to like a woman when I don't might be because it is such a drag to listen to American women bitch and moan when you don't treat them as little princesses who are at the same time amazingly strong and capable, depending on their current mood.  Note that I am saying I pretend with SOME women, and actually I like women a lot, just not the whiny arrogant and presumptuous types.  

 

Your response encourages me to continue to think you might be arrogant and presumptuous, and if so, then it seems entirely appropriate to add a big does of blaming the woman, that woman being you here. Your ego is so fragile that you cannot bear the thought that these guys might be reacting to something in your attitude or behavior.  You show no curiosity about them, but rather portray yourself as a victim.  In actuality it seems to me that you just met a couple men you don't like in Thailand and came whining to us here about it instead of just being curious about them or finding some people you do like and hanging out with them.  

 

How about just relaxing and finding some friends who say only things that you like to hear, and stop pretending to be interested in what men have to say about their experience?  Listen to some Enya and get a cheap massage.  

 

Sorry by the way that you are unhappy about this part of your life.  Hope that changes.  

 

 

[wealthychef]

10 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Or equally "probably," just because the guys involved are contemptuous jerks.

 

But for some reason, you felt compelled to automatically blame the woman.... without knowing her or having any first-hand knowledge of the interactions that occurred.

 

Do you always make those kinds of gender-blaming presumptions?

 

Sure, it could be that she is meeting some huge number of contemptuous jerks relative to other women.  But when I find someone making these kinds of general complaints about an entire group of men, I generally find these people are generating some negativity by their attitudes.  I definitely could be wrong.  Shrug, don't know, don't have to care.  Just offering up my idea.  You don't like it, fine.  

[amykat]

54 minutes ago, wealthychef said:

 

I guess I'm just responding to what I consider the vagueness of your initial post.  I asked for an example of the bad behavior but you don't seem interested in providing details, so I have to continue on in vague terms which will of course lead us both astray as they are wild guesses.  

 

When I talk about being more of my true self, dropping my pretenses, that's because that's just my experience as a man.  Maybe one of the times when you are having an "intellectual conversation" with a guy, you could ask him about these things instead of taking it personally and assuming he's a big fat jerk just because he doesn't happen to fall in love with your sexy body or whatever you are worried about.  You might not think you are using sex as a weapon, maybe you could ask about that too, but I'm just hearing you taking all of this really personally.  

 

I don't "pretend to respect women at home" and secretly crave to abuse them.  Your attitude towards what I have to say shows that you are not aware how repressed men are in the USA.  In my opinion, telling you the truth is not disrespectful, even if the truth is that I don't like you or don't want to talk to you.  Ironically, if I tell you my experience of American women is that they seem arrogant and presumptuous, then you attack me as having low self esteem, which I think is actually arrogant and presumptuous on your part.  In truth the reason I might pretend to like a woman when I don't might be because it is such a drag to listen to American women bitch and moan when you don't treat them as little princesses who are at the same time amazingly strong and capable, depending on their current mood.  Note that I am saying I pretend with SOME women, and actually I like women a lot, just not the whiny arrogant and presumptuous types.  

 

Your response encourages me to continue to think you might be arrogant and presumptuous, and if so, then it seems entirely appropriate to add a big does of blaming the woman, that woman being you here. Your ego is so fragile that you cannot bear the thought that these guys might be reacting to something in your attitude or behavior.  You show no curiosity about them, but rather portray yourself as a victim.  In actuality it seems to me that you just met a couple men you don't like in Thailand and came whining to us here about it instead of just being curious about them or finding some people you do like and hanging out with them.  

 

How about just relaxing and finding some friends who say only things that you like to hear, and stop pretending to be interested in what men have to say about their experience?  Listen to some Enya and get a cheap massage.  

 

Sorry by the way that you are unhappy about this part of your life.  Hope that changes.  

 

 

 

I wish people would stop doing this ...I am not the OP ..I wrote to you  ...but I am not the OP.

[Deepinthailand]

All this could easily be put to bed. Man and women are equal in the eyes of the law. The problem is most men have grown up thinking  that they are the bosses and women should be chained to the kitchen sink. Once that pathetic misconception has been eliminated and the old crusties who still hold that to be true have departed the world things will change as the younger generation thankfully treat all as equals.

I treat all as equal I dont talk or act diffrently twds women I don't open doors for them I treat them as I would treat anybody else.

[TKDfella]

1 minute ago, Deepinthailand said:

All this could easily be put to bed. Man and women are equal in the eyes of the law. The problem is most men have grown up thinking  that they are the bosses and women should be chained to the kitchen sink. Once that pathetic misconception has been eliminated and the old crusties who still hold that to be true have departed the world things will change as the younger generation thankfully treat all as equals.

I treat all as equal I dont talk or act diffrently twds women I don't open doors for them I treat them as I would treat anybody else.

Is that right? Give them a slap on the back and say 'how are buddy/friend" Bully for you! Whether you or anyone think differently MEN AND WOMEN ARE DIFFERENT. You wouldn't be here in the same form if they weren't. The 'eyes of the law' is a different philosophy altogether being about Rights and Law Abiding etc. I bet if you look deep enough you'll find some things you for woman you don't for men...oh oh...the mind is wandering eh? Ha!

[Deepinthailand]

Just now, TKDfella said:

Is that right? Give them a slap on the back and say 'how are buddy/friend" Bully for you! Whether you or anyone think differently MEN AND WOMEN ARE DIFFERENT. You wouldn't be here in the same form if they weren't. The 'eyes of the law' is a different philosophy altogether being about Rights and Law Abiding etc. I bet if you look deep enough you'll find some things you for woman you don't for men...oh oh...the mind is wandering eh? Ha!

No there is nothing. Having never slapped anyone on the back I wouldn't know. Yes I greet women I know as hi there mate how you doing. So we have diffrence in our bodies but if that's your only argument for women are diffrent it's pretty weak. How do you know I would do diffrent things to women that I wouldn't do to men?.

[TKDfella]

1 minute ago, Deepinthailand said:

No there is nothing. Having never slapped anyone on the back I wouldn't know. Yes I greet women I know as hi there mate how you doing. So we have diffrence in our bodies but if that's your only argument for women are diffrent it's pretty weak. How do you know I would do diffrent things to women that I wouldn't do to men?.

Ha! what do you mean 'it's pretty weak' It's a scientifically based proposition and you denying is to deny a lot of science. That's pretty strong, I would say.

[canuckamuck]

I admit to giving women preferential treatment in most situations. I treat them like ladies until it appears that that is offensive to them or that they prove they have no interest in being a lady.

Mostly I treat them like a friend. It usually is appreciated.

 

And I went to art college where feminism was a religion. I had artwork in shows defaced because it was deemed sexist while homosexual porn was a common theme among both sexes and none of that was harmed.

[SoiBiker]

It's interesting how the older generation react to feminism. I can see how if you've spent your whole life in a position of advantage, you might normalise that condition. Then from your point of view, a move towards equality may feel like something is being taken away from you. It's understandable that some feel threatened by this. But try to look at things from the opposite perspective, and recognise that you started off in a privileged position that came at a cost to others.

[TKDfella]

1 minute ago, canuckamuck said:

I admit to giving women preferential treatment in most situations. I treat them like ladies until it appears that that is offensive to them or that they prove they have no interest in being a lady.

Mostly I treat them like a friend. It usually is appreciated.

 

And I went to art college where feminism was a religion. I had artwork in shows defaced because it was deemed sexist while homosexual porn was a common theme among both sexes and none of that was harmed.

Nothing wrong there. keep it up

[HooHaa]

19 hours ago, Calach said:

Apart from the derogatory remarks and vulgar behaviours you encountered that are indeed out of line, the very concept of "intellectual whore" and finding some marital cheating in what is basically common curiosity and seeking intellectual interaction with culturally similar people, is a blunt example of over-intellectualizing a trivial fact to turn it into an issue. This is a perversion of intelligence and of feminist awareness to create a problem where there isn't one, just by creating and manipulating vocabulary. 

 

It's quite childish.

 

The concept doesn't seem all that different from having a work "wife" or husband. 

 

 

[true blue]

3 hours ago, buddhalady said:

 

How to make her stay here more comfortable ....smile at her, talk to her, reassure her she's valued as part of the human race, etc, etc, etc. Yesterday in BigC  I attempted my own straw poll on male farangs....every time I walked past one, I smiled and nodded. Guess what - stony-faced rejection of even a smile. Says it all, as far as I'm concerned. Must admit it was a very small poll at only five guys, all of whom were unaccompanied, but sadly it was more or less what I expected.

 

Moving on :-

 

Soi Biker, I'm as upset at Western culture as are you, have been for years , but it's not feminization that's destroyed it even although Theresa May is doing her best via Brexit. Trump gives the perfect excuse for guys who think the way many posters here seem to, and he's about to be the leader of the so-called free world! The humans who chart the way the West  moves are, almost without exception, male, and they will deserve exactly what they get , although it's us females who will suffer more because of it.

 

 

 

How pathetic can you imagine a male walking around tesco ogling and winking nodding at females be arrested 

Slapped called a dom. Or thought he was ting tawn.

[TKDfella]

Equality in Thai women is not quite the same though because they are '2nd class' citizens just by looking at Buddhism. A male may reach Nirvana (or equivalent) but woman may not. So until those kind of ideas collapse, I fear many males would take advantage of that. Shame.

[SoiBiker]

1 minute ago, true blue said:

How pathetic can you imagine a male walking around tesco ogling and winking nodding at females be arrested 

Slapped called a dom. Or thought he was ting tawn.

 

Plenty of examples on this forum of men who go somewhere just to ogle women, if not worse. I recall a recent discussion advocating hanging out at the university in order to get close to the young female students, for example.