BBC journalist faces five years jail for Thailand reporting

[kannot]

9 minutes ago, CGW said:

The BBC (British Brainwashing Corporation?) in recent years has gone downhill, they are not the fair and independent reporters they once were, look at the stance they took in the recent US elections, far from "independent" reporting!

They have long chosen the stance they take in their reporting, often choosing to ignore "news" for reasons only they decide!

If this journalist does end up in prison? which I very much doubt, there are a lot more out there who have no inclining of their responsibility to report the truth & hopefully join him, again - not going to happen. The BBC are not even reporting this, shows how principled they are, IF Thailand does pursue this and the BBC does turn against them, they could inflict a lot of damage, such is the power of the press, right or wrong!

The BBC said it "stands by its journalism" and it intends to clear Head's name.

 

from  the  paper  we  cant   mention

[Raybangkok]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

Care to give examples of Jonathon Head misreporting Thai news?

The 2006 coup, the Bangkok demonstrations, the university demonstrations, the Bangkok floods his comments on the royal family this is the third time now the current one he is under investigation for having been warned over the last two. Report the facts not what you want to make up or use personal opinion in your reporting. I am an international TV presenter and author and have lived here for 25 years and never once have I presented personal views just the facts.

[billd766]

8 minutes ago, CGW said:

The BBC (British Brainwashing Corporation?) in recent years has gone downhill, they are not the fair and independent reporters they once were, look at the stance they took in the recent US elections, far from "independent" reporting!

They have long chosen the stance they take in their reporting, often choosing to ignore "news" for reasons only they decide!

If this journalist does end up in prison? which I very much doubt, there are a lot more out there who have no inclining of their responsibility to report the truth & hopefully join him, again - not going to happen. The BBC are not even reporting this, shows how principled they are, IF Thailand does pursue this and the BBC does turn against them, they could inflict a lot of damage, such is the power of the press, right or wrong!

 

I just Googled BBC News, Asia here http://www.bbc.com/news/world/asia and nothing is reported.

 

I then did BBC reporters in Thailand here http://www.bbc.co.uk/search?q=BBC+reporters+in+Thailand and still nothing.

 

Nothing on Al Jazeera either.  http://www.aljazeera.com/Search/?q=Thailand

 

I would have thought that if a BBC reporter was in trouble in any country that they would be the first to protest. Not this time it seems.

[BwindiBoy]

4 minutes ago, Raybangkok said:

The 2006 coup, the Bangkok demonstrations, the university demonstrations, the Bangkok floods his comments on the royal family this is the third time now the current one he is under investigation for having been warned over the last two. Report the facts not what you want to make up or use personal opinion in your reporting. I am an international TV presenter and author and have lived here for 25 years and never once have I presented personal views just the facts.

Except for now...

[CGW]

8 minutes ago, kannot said:

The BBC said it "stands by its journalism" and it intends to clear Head's name.

 

from  the  paper  we  cant   mention

Sad that they cant run that on their own website!

[heybruce]

38 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

What deflection? Just because I don't agree with you?

 

I was answering somebody else's post and giving my thoughts, not yours or anybody elses. If you don't like my post then don't read it, put me on you ignore list if you wish.

 

Was it equally wrong when Thaksin did the same thing by suing reporters for billions of baht? Of course it was but I don't remember you complaining about that at the time.

 

Please try to get it into your head that the government is NOT involved in this.

 

It is between Jonathon Head and the lawyer.

You are scrupulously avoiding the obvious, on-topic question--is a law used to suppress freedom of the press a good thing? 

 

As I stated in my post, whether it happened under Thaksin or Prayut is irrelevant, it's a bad law and bad for Thailand.  Equally irrelevant is whether I posted comments when Thaksin used the law; I didn't become an avid poster until democracy was well and truly usurped in Thailand and many western posters cheered its demise.

 

Regarding your claim that the government is not involved in this, I'll remind you of your own words:

 

"Try to understand that this government did NOT introduce these laws as they have been on the books for a long time and have been used by ALL political parties if it is to their own advantage. This government OTOH seems to have a different interpretation of those laws and is enforcing them more rigorously ."

 

The government may not be directly involved in this lawsuit, but is not trying to change or rescind this appalling law, and eagerly uses it when it suits the government's purposes.

 

 

[kannot]

2 minutes ago, CGW said:

Sad that they cant run that on their own website!

maybe for legal reasons they cant,  but Im not a lawyer and imagine its in the hands of their lawyers

[Baerboxer]

20 hours ago, mark131v said:

Don't worry we will have a few junta huggers along shortly to attempt to justify the unjustifiable....

 

Er, and what exactly did the three Shin owned governments do to change things when in power? Which they were for most of this century so far.

 

Nothing, absolutely zilch. Because they used those laws often enough too.

 

The plaintiff is an independent person. The government are not the plaintiff. Nor are they the prosecution or judges. That would be the justice system.

 

No government, elected or otherwise has attempted to change these laws. So please explain why you think its the current government's fault?

[the guest]

I think if they jail him it will send a very clear message to foreigners not to get involved with Thais or their politics.

 

Foreigners by now must know the score ... bring loads of money to a tinpot country, then your asking to become an easy target. The law only applies to Thais, foreigners don't stand a chance !

 

There is enough information out there to know what the game is.  

[heybruce]

59 minutes ago, bikerbri said:

Care to mention examples of the misreporting?

 

12 minutes ago, Raybangkok said:

The 2006 coup, the Bangkok demonstrations, the university demonstrations, the Bangkok floods his comments on the royal family this is the third time now the current one he is under investigation for having been warned over the last two. Report the facts not what you want to make up or use personal opinion in your reporting. I am an international TV presenter and author and have lived here for 25 years and never once have I presented personal views just the facts.

I asked a simple question and you failed to give a single example of misreporting.  If this is an example of your reporting I doubt your statement that you just present facts.  I also question how successful an author you are, your writing is appalling.

[heybruce]

11 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

I just Googled BBC News, Asia here http://www.bbc.com/news/world/asia and nothing is reported.

 

I then did BBC reporters in Thailand here http://www.bbc.co.uk/search?q=BBC+reporters+in+Thailand and still nothing.

 

Nothing on Al Jazeera either.  http://www.aljazeera.com/Search/?q=Thailand

 

I would have thought that if a BBC reporter was in trouble in any country that they would be the first to protest. Not this time it seems.

What is your point?

[Baerboxer]

2 hours ago, Dogmatix said:

I was rather shocked when I saw that Head had exposed himself to an inevitable defamation suit with the video which was a worthy piece of reporting to expose the risks of being parted from their life savings faced by not very bright farang retirees in Thailand.  However, it was hardly a earth shattering piece worthy of BBC World.  

 

Now I would say that, in addition, to not being able to work outside Thailand for the duration of the case, Head will face the possibility of not being able to work inside Thailand either.  The new media law will require all journalists to be licensed by a rather dubious committee.  I am willing to guess that a lot of foreign journos regarded as controversial in Thailand, such as Head and Stephff will not get licensed.   There is already one LM case in pending as a result of sharing a BBC article.  Although the article cannot be traced directly back to Head, there must be a lot of influential Thais who would prefer to see someone else in charge of the BBC's Thai office.  

 

I disliked Head's patently pro-red shirt coverage in the past but he does have integrity at a certain level,  even I don't agree with all of his views, and I  would not like to see him forced out of his job or out of the country and certainly not imprisoned. 

 

Interesting to see how this proceeds. 

[gdgbb]

22 hours ago, darksidedog said:

The BBC is known for its impartiality and accurate, well researched journalism.

 

That's funny!

[jgold]

Why no diplomats are raising their voice on this injustice???? What are these ambassadors good for???? 

 

[Seismic]

18 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

Farlangs in Thailand know the score, buying land and businesses in their Thai wives names does not let them off the hook under the law.

 

Can`t feel any pity for that guy at all, he took a gamble on trust and lost as so many others do in Thailand.

You should read the article before commenting, He didn't put it in his wife's name. he had it all under a company with him as director.

[Jonathan Swift]

19 hours ago, the guest said:

I think if they jail him it will send a very clear message to foreigners not to get involved with Thais or their politics.

Meaning that you think human rights activists should say and do nothing, or is your statement simply a grim unbiased observation? I am American, a country which once was a leader for democracy in the free world, and a totally free press and right to speak is guaranteed in our constitution, our courts have solidly upheld those principles with rare exception. Now my (former) country is collapsing under big money corruption and a very large angry and hateful part of the general population who elected an insane monster to the presidency. And yet, the free press remains a loud voice for freedom, and in solidarity with a majority of horrified Americans, this monster president will likely be unseated. It makes me very sad to see a country like Thailand exacerbating its economic woes by failing to act as the prime minister no doubt knows he should. Those American Wall St "gods" who in 2007 caused an economic collapse unheard of since the Great Depression were never prosecuted for their crimes, a dark stain on freedom and democracy. And as it stands, unlike the Obama administration, it's unlikely that America will weigh in and bring to bear the ammunition of public and world condemnation which it could easily do. So I am sad for both countries. Nobody wins except the oligarchs, and the lawyers. Sad, but still hopeful

[Baerboxer]

35 minutes ago, gdgbb said:

That's funny!

 

It used to be so. But like so many British things and values ain't so now.

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, heybruce said:

Care to give examples of Jonathon Head misreporting Thai news?

What? Post links and leave himself open to prosecution under Thailand's "Though shalt not foment popular opinion discontent" internet laws?

 

Do your own defamation, deportation and black-listing exercise google search.

[JaseTheBass]

1 hour ago, CGW said:

The BBC (British Brainwashing Corporation?) in recent years has gone downhill, they are not the fair and independent reporters they once were, look at the stance they took in the recent US elections, far from "independent" reporting!

I think that was just common sense.

[CGW]

30 minutes ago, JaseTheBass said:

I think that was just common sense.

It wasn't the truth though! fair & independent reporting?

[harleyclarkey]

I knew about this the day it happened. Johnathan Head is a very respected, impartial reporter and a very nice individual. He thought so badly of this corruption, even by Thai standards, that he ran a programme on the BBC about it. 

 

I met him over this very issue along with one of the men who has been cruelly and systematically defrauded by all of his properties with the help and encouragement of many state officials and departments. Let's put a figure on what has been scammed, cheated and defrauded.....about €2.5 -3 m euro. Yes, yes. I know all about owning property rights, or rather the lack of, in Thailand. But this post is about fraud, corruption and the appalling abuse of power in Thailand dictatorial minefield. 

 

The cases for the return of both men's properties are now ongoing for over five years. Both have bees stripped bare of all their funds which are needed to further their cases. This is the whole ploy....a sick cynical ploy which is allowed under Thai law.

 

A false allegation of defamation, however absurd, is made against you under this insane Thai law. You then must hand in your passport and wait for three years before the case is heard. If you are a foreigner you can guess what this means for you. For J Head it is his livelihood. His lawyers pleaded with the judge, due to his circumstances as SE Asia correspondent, and this "learned" man, this upholder of justice, said it really would not be a bother for him to come, every single time he wished to travel, to the Phuket court to apply for permission to leave Thailand.

 

The rotten crooked lawyer who has made the complaint very clearly stated on TV that he forged Ian Rance's signature which was the start of the fraud. How can he possibly then sue the BBC and J Head for defamation? A lot of what happens in Thailand defies belief but in this case, It truly defies belief. 

 

I saw the programme. I saw this corrupt lawyer freely state with no coercion or prompting that Ian Rance was NOT present when the document was signed. J head asked him was Ian Rance present when the document was signed..."No". Is this illegal? No, it is allowed under Thai law. The lawyers Council were asked to comment and they stated it was not legal to witness a signature with the person not present.

 

I have posted here before about these cases as I am intimately familiar with them. I have said it many times, to the howls of being told I am talking rubbish from the "intelligentsia" here, that the courts, cops, lawyers, and every official on, especially, Phuket are rotten to the core. It is corruption gone wild all over Phuket.

 

My friend's "lawyer" it transpires, after phenomenal fees, was actually working against him with the courts to make sure he never got a cent back. It transpires that his lawyer may, in fact, be disbarred.

 

He recently was also sued for defamation over a, totally true, comment by one of his children (Justice for Jessie) on Facebook. He, of course, lost and to get his passport back had to pay compensation to the crooked Phuket Lawyers. The lawyer was seen having tea with the judge after the case. Good buddies I am sure. O...the judge commented that my friends children may become involved in the defamation if he does not pay compensation! Nice one that....very impartial. Justice balanced.

 

Every Ministry, from the PM's office, Justice, Anti-Corruption, Interpol, Tourist Police, Bangkok Police HQ, Phuket Governor, Phuket Police, Lawyers Council, and many, many more have all been approached for help. The dreadful thing to show from all of this is that not one department nor one individual has seen fit to correct these injustices done.

There is some promising action now from one department but this may turn out, as every time before, to be hot air and broken promises of action.

 

So for all of you apologists for Thailand and those who shout at people like me who point this out....live and learn. This could so easily have been you.

 

No foreigners property is safe in Thailand. 

 

. 

Edited February 24, 2017 by harleyclarkey

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, NanLaew said:

What? Post links and leave himself open to prosecution under Thailand's "Though shalt not foment popular opinion discontent" internet laws?

 

Do your own defamation, deportation and black-listing exercise google search.

You know that anyone can post accurate links to instances of Jonathon Head misreporting news without fear of being sued by JH, the BBC, or anyone else. 

 

I am not aware of any misreporting by Jonathon Head. I have not found any instances of him doing so.  I've challenged people to prove their claim that he has.  No evidence has been presented.  Therefore I conclude that Jonathon Head reports the news in an accurate manner.

 

I also conclude that people who post unsubstantiated BS and challenge others to find the evidence are trolls.

[ffaarraanngg]

Should lock up all BBC journalists for their agenda setting biased news.

 

[wakeupplease]

20 hours ago, wreckingcountry said:

Hope Jonathan gets another assignment and then writes reams about his time in Thailand "and the goings on "from another country! I'm sure it will fill a book!


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

I know someone who will give him all the web hosting he would ever need free of charge and he can use their name also, over to you j

[wakeupplease]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

You know that anyone can post accurate links to instances of Jonathon Head misreporting news without fear of being sued by JH, the BBC, or anyone else. 

 

I am not aware of any misreporting by Jonathan Head. I have not found any instances of him doing so.  I've challenged people to prove their claim that he has.  No evidence has been presented.  Therefore I conclude that Jonathon Head reports the news in an accurate manner.

 

I also conclude that people who post unsubstantiated BS and challenge others to find the evidence are trolls.

Jonathan Head is a professional and has standards way above most others around here, if you disagree with him, that's your right in a free world, but it aint free here is it because of a law that only seems to help criminals.

 

[JAG]

Should lock up all BBC journalists for their agenda setting biased news.
 

You're"doing a parody" aren't you?
Please say you are, please![emoji6]

[sprongz]

Quey in Singapore

[katana]

Below (italics) are the relevant defamation laws in Thailand from the samuiforsale website:
The BBC's Johnathan Head reported Mr Pratuan, the lawyer, admitted to notarising Mr Rance's signature without him being present.
Mr Pratuan filed a defamation case saying the reports caused him to be "defamed, insulted or hated", according to a copy of the complaint seen by AFP.
If Pratuan really did this, and Head has proof eg a recording, covert film or some other such evidence, then under sections 329 and 330 (bolded) I believe Johnathan Head has a reasonable defence, especially under section 330.

I seem to remember in the BBC documentary, there was a recording of the lawyer stating this and it's confirmed by harleyclarkey in post 144 on this thread.
Although what happens in practice is a different matter. Even if he wins, he will have been severely inconvenienced by having his passport taken away and made to wait in Thailand.

 

"...OFFENCE OF DEFAMATION

Section 326 Whoever, imputes anything to the other person before a third person in a manner  likely to impair the reputation of such other person or to expose such other person to be hated  or scorned, is said to commit defamation, and shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding one year or fined not exceeding twenty thousand Baht, or both.

Section 327 Whoever, imputing any thing the deceased person before the third person, and that imputation to be likely to impair the reputation of the father, mother, spouse or child of the deceased or to expose that person hated or scammed to be said to commit defamation, and shall be punished as prescribed by Section 326.

Section 328 If the offence of defamation be committed by means of publication of a document, drawing, painting, cinematography  film,  picture  or  letters  made  visible  by  any means, gramophonerecord or an other recording instruments, recording picture or letters, or by broadcasting or spreading picture, or by propagation by any other means, the offender shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding two years and fined not exceeding two hundred thousand Baht.

Section 329 Whoever, in good faith, expresses any opinion or statement:

    By way of self  justification or defence, or for the protection of a legitimate interest;
    In the status of being an official in the exercise of his functions;
    By way of fair comment on any person or thing subjected to public criticism; or
    By way of fair report of the open proceeding of any Court or meeting, shall not be guilty of defamation.

Section 330 In case of defamation, if the person prosecuted for defamation can prove that the imputation made by him is true, he shall not be punished. But he shall not be allowed to prove if such imputation concerns personal matters, and such proof will not be benefit to the public.

Section 331 The party in a case or party's lawyer expressing opinion or statement in the proceeding of the Court in favor of his case shall not be offence of defamation.

Section 332 In case of defamation in which judgement is given that the accused is guilty, the Court may give order:

    To seize and destroy the defamatory matter or part thereof;
    To publish the whole or part of the judgement in one or more newspapers once or several times at the expense of the accused.

Section 333 The offences in this Chapter are compoundable offences. If the injured person in the defamation dies before making a complaint, the father, mother,spouse or child of the deceased may make a complaint, and it shall be deemed  that  such person is the injured person..."

https://www.samuiforsale.com/law-texts/thailand-penal-code.html#325

 

 

[yardrunner]

7 hours ago, CGW said:

It wasn't the truth though! fair & independent reporting?

most of it was the truth and all of it was the truth as known at the time,

[rodney earl]

What can I say. AMAZING THAILAND.