Chavalit defends submarine purchase, says it will boost Navy’s capabilities

[webfact]

Chavalit defends submarine purchase, says it will boost Navy’s capabilities
By JITRAPORN SENWONG
THE NATION

 

 

BANGKOK: -- THAILAND IS not involved in a war or even a battle that made submarines a necessary purchase, but the learning process involved in the acquisition of the vessels would contribute to the Navy’s capabilities, said former prime minister General Chavalit Yongchaiyudh yesterday.

 

“Navy forces should be trained in submarine maintenance and operations. The training will require a great amount of time to complete,” Chavalit said. “We have to be considerate and understand each other on the needs of the country.”

 

When he was acting military chief in 1990s, Chavalit gave the same reason when negotiating military equipment deals with China.

 

Former Chinese leader Deng Xiaoping then agreed to provide Thailand with 200 tanks, eight frigates, two ships and a small-scale submarine, the retired general said.

 

His comment was in line with the Navy’s reasoning that Thailand, although not facing any major maritime threats, should be concerned about its security because neighbouring countries were equipped with submarines. The fast-changing terrorist threat was also a plausible justification, authorities have said.

 

The Bt13.5-billion submarine deal, signed on May 5 between the Thai Navy and a Chinese state-owned company, has become controversial as the Kingdom’s economy struggles, with the deal binding Thailand to instalment payments for seven years starting from this year. The deal was for the first of three Yuan-class S26Ts, which will cost Bt36 billion in total, that the Navy plans to procure over the next eleven years.

 

Critics have said that neighbouring countries have conflicts in the South China Sea and face the threat of piracy in the Malacca Strait, but Thailand does not face a maritime threat that justifies the submarine purchase.

 

Chavalit was speaking on his 85th birthday yesterday as he opened his residence to well-wishing guests.

 

An elected premier from 1996 to 1997, the long-retired general has been an active political commentator, sometimes contradicting the ruling junta’s approach. Last year, he mentioned marshalling “a million intellects” to solve the country’s problems but the group has yet to materialise on the political scene.

 

Chavalit refused to directly comment yesterday on the junta government, which will mark its third anniversary in power next Monday. “I can only give them courage,” he said. “I also believe they will achieve reconciliation. As for myself, I’m not thinking about being politically active anytime soon.”

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/30315197

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-05-15

[smedly]

that is all well and good but it is about priorities 

 

Thailand needs investment in Education - Law enforcement - Health - Road safety

 

Buying Subs just for the sake of it should be way way down the list if even on it at all.

[Estrada]

Just waiting for him to announce that he is relaunching his activities to promote the Kra Isthmus Canal again.

[Nowisee]

This news is informational only, no reason to debate it and non negotiable on my levels.  It's a done deal.  Sit back and watch the sub show.

[Moti24]

"The Bt13.5-billion submarine deal, signed on May 5 between the Thai Navy and a Chinese state-owned company, has become controversial as the Kingdom’s economy struggles, with the deal binding Thailand to instalment payments for seven years starting from this year. The deal was for the first of three Yuan-class S26Ts, which will cost Bt36 billion in total, that the Navy plans to procure over the next eleven years."

 

Bt 13.5 Billion is only the first installment.  I can think of a few better uses for that amount of money; hospitals for a start, education, the list goes on.  And why not give the BiB a payrise, maybe then they would start doing the job they are paid to do; having them paint kerb stones in Bangkok is not their job, no wonder they get pissed-off.

[mtls2005]

It looks like his wife, who was previously referred to in the press as  "a walking jewelry box", has the smarts now to not wear the good stuff when being photographed.

 

She wore some infamous gems at a very public gala, and they had to scramble with an excuse or seven.

 

 

“We have to be considerate and understand each other on the needs of the country.”

 

I can translate this for you: "You have to be considerate and understand me when I tell you what the needs of the country are."

 

 

 

Edited May 15, 2017 by mtls2005

[soalbundy]

I thought that this old fool was dead, i can remember when he wanted all English signs in Thailand banned, even road destination signs. When he wanted to borrow money for Thailand as PM, nobody trusted him enough to give him any.

[Sydebolle]

I thought this dinosaur of Thai politics is long gone - I stand corrected. Prior to the Army's departure from the government house it would be nice to see all those dinosaurs permanently and irrevocably retired as they - all of them - were definite assets in Thailand's problems of today. 

[maewang99]

even us armchair military experts can figure out that submarines... even just one..... gives Thailand optionality.... in the all important local body of sea...... the Bay of Bengal.... that they would not otherwise have. 

given that one of the two most likely ACC scenarios is salt water inundation of Bangkok, Dhaka and the Mekong.. within weeks of each other and how that just might play out.... in a world of chaos.... and the ACP says this isn't unlikely... it's in the cards.  it is.

that's a Big Whopper of a scenario..... with dressing, fresh sweet onions and a cucumber on a sesame seed roll.  what's there to rant about?

nada.

 

it was the same in the USA.  it was a Navy..... a very recent Pacific commander... who was actively speaking out on Climate.... while in command.... the ocean is where 90% of the effect goes.... over a 40 year latency between Co2 emission and it's climate effect. the latency is because the oceans get hit first and deep sea circulation effects take decades to play out.


 

Edited May 15, 2017 by maewang99

[mtls2005]

even us armchair military experts can figure out that submarines... even just one..... gives Thailand optionality.... in the all important local body of sea...... the Bay of Bengal.... that they would not otherwise have. 

 

Can't honestly tell if this is serious, or tongue-in-cheek?

 

As this sub will be based at Sattahip, how the heck could it operate in the Bay of Bengal? Assuming the Kra Isthmus Canal remains a pipe-dream? The RTN would have to haul it overland, or get lost going around Singapore.

[Dobredin Ghusputin]

To his credit, he has outlived Banharn and Samak.

[ratcatcher]

9 minutes ago, maewang99 said:

even us armchair military experts can figure out that submarines... even just one..... gives Thailand optionality.... in the all important local body of sea...... the Bay of Bengal.... that they would not otherwise have. 

given that one of the two most likely ACC scenarios is salt water inundation of Bangkok, Dhaka and the Mekong.. within weeks of each other and how that just might play out.... 

that's a Big Whopper of a scenario right there..... with salad dressing, fresh sweet onions and a cucumber... on a sesame seed roll.  what's there to rant about?

nada.

"............ in the all important local body of sea...... the Bay of Bengal.... "

Bay of Bengal?   Isn't that just a bit far away to have Thai submarines patrolling? Surely that's the area of concern to India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh & Myanmar. The Thais need to stick to the Andaman Sea and Gulf of Thailand during this learning process..

 

"...that's a Big Whopper of a scenario right there..... with salad dressing, fresh sweet onions and a cucumber... on a sesame seed roll.  what's there to rant about?"         No all beef patties?

 

 

[JAG]

even us armchair military experts can figure out that submarines... even just one..... gives Thailand optionality.... in the all important local body of sea...... the Bay of Bengal.... that they would not otherwise have. 
 
Can't honestly tell if this is serious, or tongue-in-cheek?
 
As this sub will be based at Sattahip, how the heck could it operate in the Bay of Bengal? Assuming the Kra Isthmus Canal remains a pipe-dream? The RTN would have to haul it overland, or get lost going around Singapore.

If the submarine (s) are to deploy to The Bay of Bengal they would have to sail past Malaysia, Singapore and Indonesia. Given that an oft quoted justification for the submarines is these countries capability in submarine warfare I doubt that they would make it!

As for the preceeding post, well he is talking about chaos - and giving a literal example...

[Rhys]

...and meanwhile, Healthcare providers, such as nurses.... cannot find govt appointed positions at the govt hospitals. 

[Srikcir]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Former Chinese leader Deng Xiaoping then agreed to provide Thailand with 200 tanks, eight frigates, two ships and a small-scale submarine

Frigates and ships!

 

First I've seen of these planned purchases. Unknown billions of baht more appears to have been secretly planned and committed by Prayut's government. No doubt with more taxpayer debt by borrowing from the Chinese. Let's see in there's any Thai journalistic investigation or questions into another apparently hidden government agenda to identify the scope of these previously undisclosed purchases.

[soalbundy]

All his enemies hate him and even his friends dislike him

[mtls2005]

First I've seen of these planned purchases. 

 

Chavalit is recounting his glorious past, and his arms-deals with China.

 

 

[ratcatcher]

6 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Frigates and ships!

 

First I've seen of these planned purchases. Unknown billions of baht more appears to have been secretly planned and committed by Prayut's government. No doubt with more taxpayer debt by borrowing from the Chinese. Let's see in there's any Thai journalistic investigation or questions into another apparently hidden government agenda to identify the scope of these previously undisclosed purchases.

"First I've seen of these planned purchases."

That was nearly 30 years ago, .Was this agreement between the Chinese Deng and the Thais ,Chavalit, ever finalized?

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, maewang99 said:

even us armchair military experts can figure out that submarines... even just one..... gives Thailand optionality

Don't know if this comment is satire or serious. But assuming the latter ....

The purchase of a single sub wherein there is no existing submarine force doesn't provide any naval security or "optionality." It would be like the Air Force buying its first and only jet fighter.

[Xobtsiwt]

Heh, good old Big Jiew. Some solid military advice from the head of the RTA when little Laos gave the Thais a bloody nose in the border war of '87/'88.

[YetAnother]

thai leadership is painful to watch

[elgordo38]

Looking at the picture and reading Wissau's comments I can plainly see there is need for new fresh blood in the decision making process. 

[Guitar God]

Thailand needs submarines because the surrounding countries have them?

 

Laos, Cambodia and Myanmar all have submarines ? I doubt that. 

 

Spend the money on hospitals and education, not toys. 

[Dogmatix]

It is not difficult to guess the reasons military hardware was purchased from China during his watch, despite low quality vs European and American hardware.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Dogmatix

[Krataiboy]

Has the military learned nothing from the ill-fated purchase of the aircraft carrier Chakri Naruebet? The "flagship" of the Thai navy never saw military action over two decades, was prematurely mothballed and is now ignominiously paying for its early retirement as a tourist attraction.

 

It is difficult to see, knowing their operational options will be severely limited by the shallow waters of the Gulf. how the three Chinese submarines are going to repay the massive taxpayer investment.

 

If push comes to shove, I suppose they could do always be sent on escort duty to Sattahip, where the former pride of the Thai fleet sits helplessly in a dry dock without a single aircraft on its decks for defence.

[clockman]

5 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

It looks like his wife, who was previously referred to in the press as  "a walking jewelry box", has the smarts now to not wear the good stuff when being photographed.

 

She wore some infamous gems at a very public gala, and they had to scramble with an excuse or seven.

 

 

“We have to be considerate and understand each other on the needs of the country.”

 

I can translate this for you: "You have to be considerate and understand me when I tell you what the needs of the country are."

 

 

 

Blue diamond!

[sawadee1947]

His comment was in line with the Navy’s reasoning that Thailand, although not facing any major maritime threats, should be concerned about its security because neighbouring countries were equipped with submarines. The fast-changing terrorist threat was also a plausible justification, authorities have said.

 

Well, this makes sense. If my neighbor got a new toy I need one new as well. And it's soooo easy to grab the money in these days. And....it's not that old man's money.

Concerning terrorists.....: Yes, now I can understand what the subs are used for. To chase terrorists.......

It's amazing for me that Thai society listen and accept all this nonsense what comes from the soldiers. They are a bunch of little boys with no brains, just discharged from Kindergarten.

One advice. Go play with your North Korean fellow and get a bloody nose....

[Chama1]

Best excuses so far?

[janclaes47]

This comes from the same guy who spent $32 million on his election campaign in 1996, and after be elected publicly announced that he would be satisfied if he could stay on for 6 months.

 

He also didn't last any longer

[hawker9000]

"Chavalit defends submarine purchase, says it will boost Navy’s capabilities"

 

'To do what, exactly?   Practicing navigation to and from the Chinese yards where they'll spend most of their time undergoing maintenance  & upkeep?  It's hard to imagine anything Thailand needs less than 3 Chinese submarines.  What's worse, the figures you see for these subs represent the acquisition price only, which for subs is a LONG way from total cost of ownership!

Edited May 16, 2017 by hawker9000