You be the Judge (Jury and Executioner)

[transam]

11 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Yes, So has everyone else who like yourself has looked at the video as a back-seat driver and not as the actual driver admittedly looking the wrong way at the very last minute before pulling out. She wasn't visible to the driver when he first looked left as she was in the 'dark' and further away and quite possibly obscured by whatever roadside detritus there is on that side. This was discussed fully earlier in the thread.

 

PS. Did you notice the time stamp on the bottom right hand side? It says 05:56 which is pre-dawn and there's no other way of saying it but is is dark at that time of the morning and not only in Thailand. As mentioned earlier, the big clue is everyone else has their lights on. Except the bicycle lady that the driver didn't see... because it was dark... and she had no lights on...

 

PPS. Dashcams by nature of the lens apertures used do tend to make things brighter in failing light. If you have one, take a look at how bright the road ahead is even in the gloaming after sunset and before darkness. It's exactly the same pre-dawn.

So now it's the dash cams fault......

[Ron19]

5 minutes ago, Estrada said:

100% your fault. And she was riding in the median strip, where pedestrians walk, not in the road as you can see by the white lines.

Median strip is down the centre of the road not on the side.

 

[smotherb]

12 hours ago, giddyup said:

You didn't notice that it was dark and she had no lights?

You didn't even notice you are not in a nanny state?

[ToddinChonburi]

This the problem here. No common sense.   She should have known you were not looking left or just assumed you did not see here.  I think old people here have a death wish.  Unfortunately we have to look out for the idiots and there seems to be to many of them here.

Edited May 21, 2017 by ToddinChonburi

[Jonmarleesco]

1 hour ago, hobz said:

This is a good point, if it had been a pedestrian walking (not running). Then it would have been possible to see the pedestrian to the left before pulling out. It was dark but it was not pitch black.

 

But pedestrians also have responsibility to be careful.

By which you mean the Thais' version of responsibility.

[smotherb]

1 hour ago, giddyup said:

No. It was dark, she had no lights and she's on the wrong side of the road, don't know how more wrong she could be.

It was dawn, lights are not enforced on bicycles, and neither is being on the wrong side of the road; you are not in Kansas Dorothy

[giddyup]

21 minutes ago, ToddinChonburi said:

This the problem here. No common sense.   She should have known you were not looking left or just assumed you did not see here.  I think old people here have a death wish.  Unfortunately we have to look out for the idiots and there seems to be to many of them here.

Old people have a death wish? Pretty sure all age groups are guilty of the same thing.

[Formaleins]

I was waiting for to jump around doing the heel and toe to "Be Bop A Lu La"  it would have been perfect. 

[NanLaew]

34 minutes ago, Estrada said:

100% your fault. And she was riding in the median strip, where pedestrians walk, not in the road as you can see by the white lines.

No she wasn't. By the 'median strip' I assume you mean the bit of hard shoulder between the solid white line and the dirt. Crossy's front wheels were already on the bitumen. If she was riding on the median strip before, she certainly wasn't at the point when Crossy knocked her off her bike.

 

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

...looking as Crossy slowly comes out at where the hard shoulder starts and its distance from the solid white line and the movement of the front of the car, his front wheels were already on the hard pavement when he stops waiting for a break in traffic. This means his front bumper would have been pretty much on the solid white line. The stupid lady on the bike chose to go around in front of him, shooting the gap between the front of Crossy's car and the motorbike that just passed which was in turn being passed by a car. She was hit while she was completely in contra-flow.

 

[ben2talk]

When it's CAR vs PEDESTRIAN then you're always wrong unless it's a main road. I stopped in a soi and had a woman running across the road crash into me, and fall down in front of my bike... and I was liable.

 

I'm not sure if bicycles are classed as pedestrians. If so, then it's entirely down to the type of road. Even if you're parked, then you are liable.

[rocketman777]

Her fault 100%  - shes riding on the wrong side of the road !!

 

But since you are in Thailand so its really your fault 100% , since you should expect bicycles, Motor Bikes and even cars be driving counter flow on the wrong side of the road.

 

So the rule is Look Right , look Left, Look Right again  , Look Left Again . Look right again etc until you go nuts

[NanLaew]

37 minutes ago, transam said:

So now it's the dash cams fault......

Not quite. The point is we are only viewing what the dash cam recorded and in reality, it is darker to the naked human eye before 6 AM than the dash cam indicates.

 

I get up around 6 AM every morning.* I know this.

 

* not this morning tho' I was pished last night.

[tandor]

...sorry..you didn't look left again.

PS. nice gates.

[ben2talk]

2 minutes ago, rocketman777 said:

Her fault 100%  - shes riding on the wrong side of the road !!

 

But since you are in Thailand so its really your fault 100% , since you should expect bicycles, Motor Bikes and even cars be driving counter flow on the wrong side of the road.

 

So the rule is Look Right , look Left, Look Right again  , Look Left Again . Look right again etc until you go nuts

No, the rule is that you should go straight over her, then reverse and finish the job! Crossly is just too soft for this game

[al007]

This is Thailand,

 

There are no rules,

 

There is no highway code

 

No one has been properly taught to drive

 

The police do not care

 

I live in Issan they drive on the wrong side of the road without lights, they overtake on the inside, whilst another on the hard shoulder coming the wrong way

 

You are lucky sir it could have been much worse

 

The judge will blame you, because if you were not here, the accident would not have happened, and that is true

 

I voted 50 50 its not about blame but about the lack of rules

[khunPer]

I voted 50/50, because...

–That's one of the really difficult questions in Thailand.

 

From many a Western view, the lady is wrong. She's driving in the wrong side of the road – some Nordic countries, however, bikes are allowed to drive in both directions, if the is a bicycle-path – whilst in Thailand driving in the "wrong side of the road" is common, if you are not going that far, or you don't wish to cross a heavy trafficked road.

 

It took me a while to learn to look out enough times and be extra carefully, after some near-miss accidents – luckily I've been driving here for 15+ years now, without any accidents – with bikes and push-bikes coming in the "wrong" direction...

 

After Thai way-of-thinking, however, I believe the car is of fault and should politely pay the bills...

[transam]

1 hour ago, smotherb said:

It was dawn, lights are not enforced on bicycles, and neither is being on the wrong side of the road; you are not in Kansas Dorothy

Something that sticks in my head regarding where we are and really must forget stuff we think is right or wrong here...A true story to think about.....

 

Two 12 year old's on a m/cycle, daylight, yes mum was OK with that....Belting around town they crash into a vehicle that was doing nothing wrong.....One kid dead, one with broken arm...

 

Both parents were paid cash from the vehicle doing nothing wrong insurance company.....

 

Crazy stuff...

[Crossy]

OP here again, yes I have been watching. Some interesting thoughts on how it works in LoS.

 

One of my greatest fears of driving here is following a family on a bike, one lid between them, and they come off leaving me nowhere to go. I would never forgive myself for running over a nipper (or his mum) even if I was totally without fault. I get past, leaving a wide berth, as soon as possible.

 

Take care out there, it can (and does) happen to anyone.

 

[pgrahmm]

3 hours ago, Marvo said:

"In all honesty I reckon it was down to you" ...  Don't listen Crossy 

Right, left, then right again... see below 

"She's got the right of way unimpeded....." That's sarcasm... yes? 

 

Your Mistake Crossy was to learn your driving skills and hone your safety routines in a country where riding with no lights, going the wrong way on the wrong side of the road, in the dark is not something we have programmed ourselves to avoid by instinct. In Thailand I have REPEATEDLY been caught out by following ingrained safety routines learned to pass the driving test back home, and not looking for something coming from oblivion.
I "see" Crossy looking right at the "junction", waiting, looking left as the bike and car passes him then right again to check it's clear before moving off... then Wham! The lady on bicycle appears out of the gloom.

Who said  "She's got the right of way unimpeded..."? Certainly looks like she was impeded to me 
 

Crossy followed procedure correctly. Except that in Thailand, I am receiving daily reminders that my procedures are best modified to account for all the crazy ass riders/drivers/pedestrians who will literally "throw" themselves at you from every conceivable angle at the most inconvenient time.

Crossy.... "Not Guilty"!

Drive in the Phil's for a few years - this is nothing.......

 

Crossy needs one of these.....

 

[gemguy]

More her fault than yours being on the wrong side of the road and she must have seen you ........but nope she does not slow down or give way or exercise any caution when she is the one that is going to feel some pain when an accident happens.

I can only surmise she thought you saw her coming and would let her pass in front of you first...  but you did not see her.

 

They will blame you anyhow as she is just an old lady on her bicycle and you are a farang and believed to have much, much more money..... so blame you.

 

I would also blame you if I was a Thai.....and more or less obligated to blame you by way of Tradition ...LOL

 

Cheers   

 

[Crossy]

7 minutes ago, pgrahmm said:

Drive in the Phil's for a few years - this is nothing.......

 

Crossy needs one of these.....

 

 

I need one of these:-

 

 

http://www.coolest-gadgets.com/20100925/r2d2-vacuum-cleaner/

 

[Crossy]

A response to the R2D2 vacuum has been removed, sorry, brilliant but just a bit too rude for Thaivisa

 

[CMBob]

You ask about fault?  Well, sitting as the requested judge and jury, the only convincing conclusion I reach is that you're definitely guilty of poor film editing....hehe.  Other than that, legally it's likely a split verdict.  In the west, you'd be cleared as she's riding on the wrong side of the road and without a light; however, in Thailand [given you are driving the expensive (and, more importantly, insured) vehicle], you or your insurance company pay whatever is reasonably necessary.  Nice to see, though, that you and wifey kindly attended to the old dear on the bicycle.  You get a couple of karma points for that.

[Crossy]

Just now, CMBob said:

You ask about fault?  Well, sitting as the requested judge and jury, the only convincing conclusion I reach is that you're definitely guilty of poor film editing....hehe.  Other than that, legally it's likely a split verdict.  In the west, you'd be cleared as she's riding on the wrong side of the road and without a light; however, in Thailand [given you are driving the expensive (and, more importantly, insured) vehicle], you or your insurance company pay whatever is reasonably necessary.  Nice to see, though, that you and wifey kindly attended to the old dear on the bicycle.  You get a couple of karma points for that.

 

Not guilty, the video is complete and unedited, soundtrack is what I happened to be listening to (BBC Radio 2).

 

It was nice how the villagers rallied to help the lady, chairs etc materialized and she got a ride to the hospital.

 

Bike is being fixed on my insurance, I'm sure she will get some compensation too, for which I will pay with increased premiums.

[alien365]

Did you have your indicator on? I couldn't hear it due to the music. Either way your headlights were shining in to the road which shows you're waiting to come out. I'm surprised she didn't stop when the motorcycle nearly hit her. That should have at least woke her up, but clearly not. 

 

One more question though, do you think she will learn anything from this? I'm sure you will always make that extra check now, but will she pay more attention, cycle on the correct side of the road, use lights? 

[Foozool]

On 5/18/2017 at 5:37 PM, giddyup said:

She's riding on the wrong side of the road for a start.

He is at fault since he did not pay attention to his left side before moving his car. 

Does not matter if she approached from left or right. She was riding a bicycle , not a motorcycle, nor a car. 

 

This is Thailand, western law will not apply to traffic cases here.

Edited May 21, 2017 by Foozool

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, Foozool said:

He is at fault since he did not pay attention to his left side before moving his car. 

Does not matter if she approached from left or right. She was riding a bicycle , not a motorcycle, nor a car. 

A bicycle with no lights, which by law she is required to have.

[transam]

1 minute ago, giddyup said:

A bicycle with no lights, which by law she is required to have.

It weren't dark...It was dusk....In the vid I can see the lady approaching..Can you...?

[Foozool]

9 minutes ago, giddyup said:

A bicycle with no lights, which by law she is required to have.

He hit her by front bumper.

If she hit his car corner or the side of the car, she could be somehow at fault. 

Edited May 21, 2017 by Foozool

[giddyup]

11 minutes ago, transam said:

It weren't dark...It was dusk....In the vid I can see the lady approaching..Can you...?

Yes, I can also see streetlights, lights from the OP's vehicle and headlights of passing vehicles, what does that tell you? And it wasn't dusk, it was dawn.

Edited May 21, 2017 by giddyup