family of 3 living in CM on £1000pcm

[smotherb]

5 hours ago, Flustered said:

A bit late telling me that. from the age of 30, I spent less than I made which is why I am very comfortably off today. (and no PhD or MSc either - just good plain common sense).

Note, I started that at 8--no college education, but the education got me better paying jobs; that was the plan.

[naboo]

Is this a Biggus Dickus competition?

[smotherb]

8 hours ago, naboo said:

Is this a Biggus Dickus competition?

Read the entire thread of our comments and then decide.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

I know a farang woman, who not only spends 150k per month; she can stop a freight train with a pair of circus pants...just the sight of her wearing them.

[moe666]

Clive how much do you have for retirement, answer that and we ca give you an educated answer. I pay 15,000 a month for a two bedroom 3 bath townhouse a bit south of Chiang Mai Gate. high season 1700b for elect. 200b water. 1200 internet. 350 cable tv. Add food gas for transportation. Even the short distance from the moat transportation can be hard to find. 

[moe666]

Close the thread Clive hasn't posted in a while

[cyberfarang]

On 30/05/2017 at 4:37 PM, NancyL said:

If you've followed my posts on Thai Visa, you'll know I often recommend gov't hospitals and I spend many hours each week in gov't hospitals assisting elderly expats who find themselves in medical difficulty without sufficient funds.  Gov't hospitals are the hospitals of last resort for expats without funds, like those trying to fund family life on a budget of just 45,000 baht/month.  Yes, they can provide good quality care, but there are long queues and, as you said, not every medicine or medical device is on the national list and they expect upfront payment for those.  The OP is from overseas and contemplating a move here.  He may find dealing with a gov't hospital for a major emergency to be a very eye-opening experience, esp for someone not used to dealing with Thai culture.  Much of what I do at the gov't hospitals is to help the elderly expats "navigate" the hospital system and to help them "manage expectations".

It`s often a case of beggars can`t be choosers. Once at the tender mercies of the private medical sectors, as far as medical fees are concerned the sky`s the limit. With regards medical, many of us retirees are in the same boat, extortionate medical fees charged by the private medical practices, second rate treatment at the government hospitals although not in all cases, medical insurance premiums at ridiculous rates or not eligible at all for the over 60s and no longer entitled to free medical care in our own countries, a sort of medical limbo.

 

This subject forms a category of it`s own.

[NancyL]

1 hour ago, cyberfarang said:

It`s often a case of beggars can`t be choosers. Once at the tender mercies of the private medical sectors, as far as medical fees are concerned the sky`s the limit. With regards medical, many of us retirees are in the same boat, extortionate medical fees charged by the private medical practices, second rate treatment at the government hospitals although not in all cases, medical insurance premiums at ridiculous rates or not eligible at all for the over 60s and no longer entitled to free medical care in our own countries, a sort of medical limbo.

 

This subject forms a category of it`s own.

Yes, of course this subject deserves a category of its own.  It's because we all think we're going to live forever ("worked out well so far, right?") and "plan" to die quietly in our sleep.  I'm handling three cases right now where expats are on life support in hospital here and everyone is fluttering around trying to figure out how to arrange payments and what to do the next time the man goes into cardiac arrest.  Without clear instructions they'll just keep him alive, even in a gov't hospital.

 

These are guys who guarded their finances very closely, yet have plenty of money.  Their loving Thai partners or western friends haven't a clue how to get to their western bank accounts where their generous monthly pension checks are deposited.  With my connections at Bangkok Bank, I can see that they manually initiated an overseas transfer or two each month, but nothing has been set up automatically.  

 

Hey guys, you really need to set up your financial life to run on auto pilot when half your candles are out!

 

 

[cyberfarang]

5 hours ago, NancyL said:

Yes, of course this subject deserves a category of its own.  It's because we all think we're going to live forever ("worked out well so far, right?") and "plan" to die quietly in our sleep.  I'm handling three cases right now where expats are on life support in hospital here and everyone is fluttering around trying to figure out how to arrange payments and what to do the next time the man goes into cardiac arrest.  Without clear instructions they'll just keep him alive, even in a gov't hospital.

 

These are guys who guarded their finances very closely, yet have plenty of money.  Their loving Thai partners or western friends haven't a clue how to get to their western bank accounts where their generous monthly pension checks are deposited.  With my connections at Bangkok Bank, I can see that they manually initiated an overseas transfer or two each month, but nothing has been set up automatically.  

 

Hey guys, you really need to set up your financial life to run on auto pilot when half your candles are out!

 

 

I too am not short of a few bob and my Thai partner knows exactly where to access my money, but I don`t think that`s the problem. It only takes one major illness, like a heart attack, a stroke, being smashed up in an accident, the requirement of major surgery or some other form of a serious complicated health problem whereas in a private hospital the medical bill could literally total to millions of bahts, then that would completely wipe me out financially and all I`d have left is my pensions incomes to live on with absolutely no back up money after that. I`d be living from hand to mouth every day.

 

You are right, none of us are expecting such things will ever happen and this is my only concern about living in Thailand. This really is not ideal and that goes for all expats staying in Thailand, no matter how much income they have coming in every month.

[XGM]

Old age means high medical expenses. When you don't live in a country with a good,  subsidized health system you better be rich or forced to receive poor treatments. No way around it. Looking at insurance policies for 75 years old, premiums are 80,000 baht or more *per month*, not including outpatient visits. And of course preexisting conditions are never covered.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

I have ten more years before Medicare, which still isn't free, at all, but beats the heck out of what same age persons have here especially if you are talking cancer drugs.  I will move back to the States by then, but there could be a voucher system in place like Romney presented in 2012.  It would save billions and the Thais would start offering compatible plans.  As it stands, it is costing about 45000 THB per person, per month on Medicare...twice the Thai GDP.  Most would take 30k per month to waive their right to treatment in the US, and I think the Thais would come up with some good plans to take:  our money and care of us.  For those, who have become stateless, look in the mirror if you want to see who to blame.  Maybe a trip to the camps for the stateless on the Burma border would have taught you.  I have sure learned from you to not make the same bad choices.  I know it varies by country of origin, but the time I spend to maintain my address, us accounts, voting registration, and income taxes are relatively minimal.  I make comments about the Hard way Club, and often the stateless are its charter members.

Edited June 1, 2017 by KhonKaenKowboy

[Tony125]

Smog problems in Chiang Mai 

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/laura-nalin/chiang-mais-smog-problem-_b_9725706.html

 

 

 

 

[NanLaew]

If not already mentioned, the OP needs to search out and read the posts of forum member canarysun. He lived quite happily in LOS on much less than most of us.

[rickudon]

I live in Udon, which has been suggested a couple of times. Fair size expat community, and NO, the burning season doesn't really affect people here.

I live on  about 45,000 baht a month for 3 of us and have to be a bit careful, but have reasonable lifestyle. Bills come to under 20,000 baht a month, including mortgage, electric, water, internet, phone, and car+motorbike loan payments. So that leaves us 25,000 baht a month for shopping bills, petrol and the odd ad hoc expense. School fees around 40,000 baht a year (not international, but one of the top schools in town). Do need more for occasional big expense, which comes from savings.

 

The OP hasn't indicated his age, if his wife is Thai (presumably, or he would need more for a visa/extension), and whether his child speaks Thai. Or if he has  significant savings. Health insurance also an issue. Just getting my state pension, so my expenditure will be rising. I must admit, 45,000 baht doesn't leave much wriggle room.

[Flustered]

On 2017-6-1 at 4:07 AM, XGM said:

Old age means high medical expenses. When you don't live in a country with a good,  subsidized health system you better be rich or forced to receive poor treatments. No way around it. Looking at insurance policies for 75 years old, premiums are 80,000 baht or more *per month*, not including outpatient visits. And of course preexisting conditions are never covered.

As you get older, there comes a point of diminishing returns on health insurance.

 

I read in a previous thread some time back (cant find it) about one expat who self insures. While being reasonably healthy he put the money he would have paid the insurance company into a savings account. At a rate of US$500 per month he had accrued some two million baht plus at age 70 and felt that this plus the further payments into his savings account would pay for any major mishap. He tried to lead a healthy life (annual checks etc) and had personal accident insurance with his savings account for other mishaps.

 

I think that if you had all of the work you needed prior to settling in Thailand (hip/knee replacements, appendix out etc) this would be a reasonable solution seeing how the insurance cost for a 70+ year old plus wife will go up while benefits come down. Drugs are reasonably cheap so self insurance looks a good road to go down rather than pay into an insurance company for something you may not need for some time and by then, you will have paid in far more than you need.

 

Anyone use this method?

[heybruce]

27 minutes ago, Flustered said:

As you get older, there comes a point of diminishing returns on health insurance.

 

I read in a previous thread some time back (cant find it) about one expat who self insures. While being reasonably healthy he put the money he would have paid the insurance company into a savings account. At a rate of US$500 per month he had accrued some two million baht plus at age 70 and felt that this plus the further payments into his savings account would pay for any major mishap. He tried to lead a healthy life (annual checks etc) and had personal accident insurance with his savings account for other mishaps.

 

I think that if you had all of the work you needed prior to settling in Thailand (hip/knee replacements, appendix out etc) this would be a reasonable solution seeing how the insurance cost for a 70+ year old plus wife will go up while benefits come down. Drugs are reasonably cheap so self insurance looks a good road to go down rather than pay into an insurance company for something you may not need for some time and by then, you will have paid in far more than you need.

 

Anyone use this method?

If "end of life" involved months of going in and out of hospital for cancer treatment, or several weeks on ICU with a heart problem, or years of care because of a stroke or other debilitating condition, how long would two million baht last?   I honestly don't know, but I can conceive of situations in which it would not be enough.

[grin]

The problem is that Thai health insurance may not be any better than the 2 million Baht savings in dire circumstances. The maximum benefits the insurance pays per instance or even per lifetime may be less than 2 million Baht. If you have high blood pressure or diabetes they may consider those to be a preexisting condition for a critical illness and not cover you. And it is quite difficult to find Thai policies that will cover you past the age of 70 and nearly impossible past 80.

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, grin said:

The problem is that Thai health insurance may not be any better than the 2 million Baht savings in dire circumstances. The maximum benefits the insurance pays per instance or even per lifetime may be less than 2 million Baht. If you have high blood pressure or diabetes they may consider those to be a preexisting condition for a critical illness and not cover you. And it is quite difficult to find Thai policies that will cover you past the age of 70 and nearly impossible past 80.

Yes, if you wait until you are old and have pre-existing conditions to get health insurance, you will probably find it unavailable or unaffordable.  If your friend was already in this situation when he started saving $500 a month until he had the equivalent of two million baht (I assume this took him ten to twelve years), his move was a prudent one.  However it does not guarantee he will have sufficient money for end of life issues.  He may have to use his savings to return to his home country fro treatment, assuming it will provide for him.

 

This is getting far off topic, but it illustrates the problem with voluntary health insurance--the young and healthy are willing to risk doing without it, and once they are old and frail it has become unaffordable.

[Flustered]

42 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

 

This is getting far off topic, but it illustrates the problem with voluntary health insurance--the young and healthy are willing to risk doing without it, and once they are old and frail it has become unaffordable.

Not off topic as it goes to cost of living, especially on a limited budget. Health insurance is expensive and if you are healthy many may see saving the premiums  as an option.

 

At 45,000 Baht, the OP is on the limit of a reasonable life dropping to a hard life. Health insurance is one of the items he would probably drop for himself, especially if he has a Thai wife who gets State cover.

 

The more ideas and figures given enable a fuller picture to be drawn.

 

 

[Sheryl]

The problem is that Thai health insurance may not be any better than the 2 million Baht savings in dire circumstances. The maximum benefits the insurance pays per instance or even per lifetime may be less than 2 million Baht. If you have high blood pressure or diabetes they may consider those to be a preexisting condition for a critical illness and not cover you. And it is quite difficult to find Thai policies that will cover you past the age of 70 and nearly impossible past 80.

You can get Thai policies that cover up to 5 million baht and I believe there is one (MSH) rhat goes much higher than that.

Internationally issued expat policies usually cover up to 1 million US. And several will newly enroll people aged 70, 80 or even above.

[LannaGuy]

I'd say 45 is ok for a single person but 65 is far more comfortable for a couple especially with a kid.

 

 Don't forget many Thais, with a kid (s), do actually live on far less but as we are normally used to a better lifestyle you would not want to go down that road. I know of some living on 15 and it's really tough good luck though and hope it works out.

[grin]

Most of the people from the US that I know here that are over 65 use a combination of medicare and an international health insurance policy that excludes US coverage. So far I have not heard of a better option for US citizens retiring here. When I retire I think that will be my plan as well.

[elektrified]

On 6/1/2017 at 10:13 PM, NanLaew said:

If not already mentioned, the OP needs to search out and read the posts of forum member canarysun. He lived quite happily in LOS on much less than most of us.

He was a troll pulling everyone's leg. Full of B.S.