School priorities and their consequences

[Brunolem]

Much has been said about the not so efficient school system in the Land of Smiles.

Yet, it is always fascinating to observe self-destruction in action.

My son, 12, just joined the high school big leagues...in a public school.

From the get go, the priorities for both teachers and parents have been made clear: what matters most and foremost are the uniform and the haircut, especially the latter, modelled on the marine corps.

During the first week of school, they had a whole morning dedicated to a close inspection of each pupil, with penalties for those who were not perfectly in line with the rules (not the rules of engagement...yet, just the dressing rules or code).

And what about studying, you may ask?

Well, who cares?

Who cares that, in my son's class, none of the many books provided by the department of education has yet been open in the classroom, after 2 weeks?

Who cares that, in this same class, all the pupils, save for my son, still don't master the (latin) alphabet necessary to learn English...an alphabet supposedly learned in prathom 1, six years ago?

To enquire about when the (serious) work would start, I met the English teacher who speaks a few words of English and doesn't understand any, and who asked me, a French (!) if I would agree to provide some support to the English teaching program!

They have a tendency to think that farang = English, no questions asked.

Well, with a start on such solid footing, no wonder the academic performances many of us, humble farangs, have observed with some amazement...

 

[grollies]

I think you'd do better providing practical help to the school rather than trying to engage in local politics?

[Lamkyong]

oh dear my bubbles burst

[jadee]

Hi, I'm curious, you are French and you are sending your son to a Thai public school? Why? Most Thai parents wouldn't want their kids studying in a public school if they had a choice, they would pay for a private school if they could afford it. As for the priorities being uniform, haircuts etc, that's the basis for discipline for the whole year, it's not misguided, it's essential to maintain discipline for learning. If schools didn't do this, classrooms would be in chaos and no learning would take place. Granted, the low English ability of the teacher is a concern, but there is method to the madness. 

[tonray]

23 minutes ago, jadee said:

Hi, I'm curious, you are French and you are sending your son to a Thai public school? Why? Most Thai parents wouldn't want their kids studying in a public school if they had a choice, they would pay for a private school if they could afford it. As for the priorities being uniform, haircuts etc, that's the basis for discipline for the whole year, it's not misguided, it's essential to maintain discipline for learning. If schools didn't do this, classrooms would be in chaos and no learning would take place. Granted, the low English ability of the teacher is a concern, but there is method to the madness. 

"Classrooms would be in chaos". 

 

Have you ever taught in a Thai government school ?

[Kwasaki]

[wildewillie89]

13 hours ago, jadee said:

Hi, I'm curious, you are French and you are sending your son to a Thai public school? Why? Most Thai parents wouldn't want their kids studying in a public school if they had a choice, they would pay for a private school if they could afford it. As for the priorities being uniform, haircuts etc, that's the basis for discipline for the whole year, it's not misguided, it's essential to maintain discipline for learning. If schools didn't do this, classrooms would be in chaos and no learning would take place. Granted, the low English ability of the teacher is a concern, but there is method to the madness. 

The assumption being that if you are French then you must be rich? 

Basis for discipline? Thai are famous for not being disciplined in the class room. Why? As the focus is on the haircut and uniforms rather than actual classroom discipline. Haircuts/uniforms do not translate into classroom discipline magically lol. They are two completely seperate things. 

[MrJohnson]

Why on earth would you send your child to a Thai school?

 

[wildewillie89]

4 minutes ago, MrJohnson said:

Why on earth would you send your child to a Thai school?

 

Private schools are not as bad (in the sense they don't waste as much time - obviously there are many still below par).

If you live in Thailand you don't have much choice. Generally, those who do know how Thai schools are just send them for the socialization aspect and either home school them on weekends or tutor them in the subjects that the parents may not be efficient in. 

[Brunolem]

5 hours ago, wildewillie89 said:

The assumption being that if you are French then you must be rich? 

Basis for discipline? Thai are famous for not being disciplined in the class room. Why? As the focus is on the haircut and uniforms rather than actual classroom discipline. Haircuts/uniforms do not translate into classroom discipline magically lol. They are two completely seperate things. 

Right, and right!!!

[Brunolem]

19 hours ago, jadee said:

Hi, I'm curious, you are French and you are sending your son to a Thai public school? Why? Most Thai parents wouldn't want their kids studying in a public school if they had a choice, they would pay for a private school if they could afford it. As for the priorities being uniform, haircuts etc, that's the basis for discipline for the whole year, it's not misguided, it's essential to maintain discipline for learning. If schools didn't do this, classrooms would be in chaos and no learning would take place. Granted, the low English ability of the teacher is a concern, but there is method to the madness. 

In my remote area, the closest private high school is 50 to 60 km away, not an option.

As for the uniform and haircut, don't be fooled, this has NOTHING to do with discipline...if only!

In the middle of the first week, we had a parents meeting with all the teachers and administratives.

All the pupils were present, seated on the floor.

Yet, while the principal and the teachers were addressing the parents, the pupils were talking loudly, as if they were at the market!

And no one was reacting....not so surprisingly since the parents, and teachers, behave in exactly in the same way when the monks are speaking at the temple, for example.

The notion of discipline doesn't really exist in this country.

As a matter of fact, the more you tell them to do something, the less they do it...see the requirement to wear a helmet on a motorbike, for example.

Trying to impose discipline on them is like trying herding cats...good luck with that...

I send my son to school because it is mandatory, then I teach him English, maths and sciences when he comes back home...

[wildewillie89]

4 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

In my remote area, the closest private high school is 50 to 60 km away, not an option.

As for the uniform and haircut, don't be fooled, this has NOTHING to do with discipline...if only!

In the middle of the first week, we had a parents meeting with all the teachers and administratives.

All the pupils were present, seated on the floor.

Yet, while the principal and the teachers were addressing the parents, the pupils were talking loudly, as if they were at the market!

And no one was reacting....not so surprisingly since the parents, and teachers, behave in exactly in the same way when the monks are speaking at the temple, for example.

The notion of discipline doesn't really exist in this country.

As a matter of fact, the more you tell them to do something, the less they do it...see the requirement to wear a helmet on a motorbike, for example.

Trying to impose discipline on them is like trying herding cats...good luck with that...

I send my son to school because it is mandatory, then I teach him English, maths and sciences when he comes back home...

 

Good idea. I am in a city with some private schools, but they don't match the private schools in some of the bigger cities. So I will teach English, the Mrs will teach Thai and the Mrs sister is a Science teacher (Physics major) so can do Science/Maths on weekends...I also thought how rude the country was when they just sat and not listened and I wondered why Thai people accepted that. But then I got a few speeches translated and realised Thai just say the same thing over and over again in 60 different ways. I would probably stop listening and have a chat also lol.

[Gumballl]

 

Quote

 

... 

Well, with a start on such solid footing, no wonder the academic performances many of us, humble farangs, have observed with some amazement...

 

Wherever the OP is from, the education must have been just as bad.  Think about it... a wise farang would not raise his kids in Thailand.

[wildewillie89]

32 minutes ago, Gumballl said:

 

Wherever the OP is from, the education must have been just as bad.  Think about it... a wise farang would not raise his kids in Thailand.

Why? I will be. The nursery is free, and the teacher is one of the family (so well looked after). School here is more for social development. I can teach the kids English. The Mrs got the second highest Thai score in the country, so can very effectively teach the kids the level of Thai they need to pass government/uni exams (the number one component failed in government exams is the Thai component). The kids aunt is a Science teacher with a Physics major. The kids grandfather is the Mayor so has implemented programs to benefit families (for example, starting nursery 6 months before the rest of the country to free up the parents if they work). My kids get free schooling (until finish their bachelor), half price private education and free medical due to their mother being a government official. 

If we wanted to, we could go back to Melbourne, however, we would be living in a shitty house and paying a ridiculous amount of rent or loan, or in a really nice house that is miles away from anything. Here we can have a very nice house on a big patch of land that is surrounded by farm land but only 3 km from the city (with your Tesco, Big C, HomePro, Global) etc. We save something like 15-20 million baht on a house. We save crap loads on nursery costs. The kid (kids in future) already has insurance policies so when she turns 18 she will have quite a bit of money to begin her life. And when we die she will inherent not only the money we leave behind (when wife dies the government pay the family a large sum), but around 15 rai of land 3kms from the city. The idea for me in a family is making the kids as comfortable as possible (no matter what career path they choose to go down), so if we can bring her and any future kids up to have a relatively financial stress free life, then I am happy to take a bit of the stress by moving here. 

 

Edited May 29, 2017 by wildewillie89

[grollies]

17 minutes ago, wildewillie89 said:

Why? I will be. The nursery is free, and the teacher is one of the family (so well looked after). School here is more for social development. I can teach the kids English. The Mrs got the second highest Thai score in the country, so can very effectively teach the kids the level of Thai they need to pass government/uni exams (the number one component failed in government exams is the Thai component). The kids aunt is a Science teacher with a Physics major. The kids grandfather is the Mayor so has implemented programs to benefit families (for example, starting nursery 6 months before the rest of the country to free up the parents if they work). My kids gets free schooling (until finish their bachelor), half price private education and free medical due to their mother being a government official. 

If we wanted to, we could go back to Melbourne, however, we would be living in a shitty house and paying a ridiculous amount of rent or loan, or in a really nice house that is miles away from anything. Here we can have a very nice house on a big patch of land that is surrounded by farm land but only 3 km from the city. We save something like 15-20 million baht on a house. We save crap loads on nursery costs. The kid (kids in future) already has insurance policies so when she turns 18 she will have quite a bit of money to begin her life. And when we die she will inherent not only the money we leave behind (when wife dies the government pay the family a large sum), but around 15 rai of land 3kms from the city. The idea for me in a family is making the kids as comfortable as possible (no matter what career path they choose to go down), so if we can bring her and any future kids up to have a relatively financial stress free life, then I am happy to take a bit of the stress by moving here. 

 

I admire your commitment and forward planning. Good luck to you and your family.

[wildewillie89]

8 minutes ago, grollies said:

I admire your commitment and forward planning. Good luck to you and your family.

Thank you. Being only 26 with zero money when I moved here, I understood the risks (as I wont get my countries pension probably). And in all fairness to the poster I probably wouldn't have if my wife didn't have the position she does (would have brought her over at our young ages). However, our house will be easily paid off as the government pays 30% of it and the Mrs pension will be higher than my pension would have been from Australia anyway. So really, it was a no brainer.
Also I can use my university degree without having to pay for it as I am not getting an Australian income. Stomach has toughened up, got used to the weather...the only stress is just stupid ways Thai do things lol 

[NoshowJones]

Thailand is a very militilistic country, this is not Thai bashing, it is their country and we have to accept that.

I was an English teacher here for three years, and one day I arrived in my class to start lessons, the first thing

I noticed was that about half of the boys were missing, why? They were sent to get their hair cut. 

[NoshowJones]

21 hours ago, jadee said:

Hi, I'm curious, you are French and you are sending your son to a Thai public school? Why? Most Thai parents wouldn't want their kids studying in a public school if they had a choice, they would pay for a private school if they could afford it. As for the priorities being uniform, haircuts etc, that's the basis for discipline for the whole year, it's not misguided, it's essential to maintain discipline for learning. If schools didn't do this, classrooms would be in chaos and no learning would take place. Granted, the low English ability of the teacher is a concern, but there is method to the madness. 

They are more concerned about appearances than actually teaching, forcing young boys to have their heads shaved is nothing but bullying. I know personally a teacher who had a more senior one come into his classroom with a pair of scissors in his hand, he picked out a girl, took her on to the floor, and cut her hair in front of the class because it was a little bit below her ears, that was just pure assault, so I ask, is there a method to that madness?

[The Deerhunter]

The big thing to remember in Thailand to do with teaching is that no one can teach a subject that they know nothing about.  This is already covered in this thread with the OP saying the English teacher does not understand English.  We have a really nice young man locally who is an electrician and mostly does an excellent job.  He is careful and conscientious attending extra courses to keep him up to date.  But half our LED light fittings blew because he does not know that unlike normal light fittings, integrated LED fittings gave to be wired up with the correct polarity.

I'll bet his tutor does not know and you can't teach a subject you do not understand yourself.  But TIT.

 

 

[Enoon]

7 hours ago, wildewillie89 said:

Why? I will be. The nursery is free, and the teacher is one of the family (so well looked after). School here is more for social development. I can teach the kids English. The Mrs got the second highest Thai score in the country, so can very effectively teach the kids the level of Thai they need to pass government/uni exams (the number one component failed in government exams is the Thai component). The kids aunt is a Science teacher with a Physics major. The kids grandfather is the Mayor so has implemented programs to benefit families (for example, starting nursery 6 months before the rest of the country to free up the parents if they work). My kids get free schooling (until finish their bachelor), half price private education and free medical due to their mother being a government official. 

If we wanted to, we could go back to Melbourne, however, we would be living in a shitty house and paying a ridiculous amount of rent or loan, or in a really nice house that is miles away from anything. Here we can have a very nice house on a big patch of land that is surrounded by farm land but only 3 km from the city (with your Tesco, Big C, HomePro, Global) etc. We save something like 15-20 million baht on a house. We save crap loads on nursery costs. The kid (kids in future) already has insurance policies so when she turns 18 she will have quite a bit of money to begin her life. And when we die she will inherent not only the money we leave behind (when wife dies the government pay the family a large sum), but around 15 rai of land 3kms from the city. The idea for me in a family is making the kids as comfortable as possible (no matter what career path they choose to go down), so if we can bring her and any future kids up to have a relatively financial stress free life, then I am happy to take a bit of the stress by moving here. 

 

 

Has your little darling started calling herself "Benz" yet?

 

 

[lucjoker]

8 hours ago, Gumballl said:

 

Wherever the OP is from, the education must have been just as bad.  Think about it... a wise farang would not raise his kids in Thailand.

a wise farang will raise his kids in Thailand......

in a public school.

If not , his kids will stay stupid , i mean ,they will never be able to" write and read" Thai......and, 

as their father, only speak 1 language ,witch is very stupid in a non English country.His kids will never be able to compete 

with farang kids who can read and write Thai,English,and French and Flemish and Spanish.....as smart farang - kids do.

The smart farang will teach his children at least 3 more languages ,because he is able to do it himself.

Those kids will be the next generation bosses , and those who can only speak Thai and English will be the small workers.

Imagine a business where the boss can not fluently read,write and speak Thai ......he has no controle at all, can not be understood properly and will not understand what his workers tell him .

No private school  will teach your farang-Thai children to write and read  Thai properly,they dont spend their time on it .

This is only my opinion, smart people will know what to do .

 

[beautifulthailand99]

I have tried to teach Thai kids for a fortnight in a public school - nice kids but an unfolding personal nightmare.

[Chou Anou]

15 hours ago, wildewillie89 said:

The assumption being that if you are French then you must be rich? 

Basis for discipline? Thai are famous for not being disciplined in the class room. Why? As the focus is on the haircut and uniforms rather than actual classroom discipline. Haircuts/uniforms do not translate into classroom discipline magically lol. They are two completely seperate things. 

No, the assumption being that, relative to Thais, if you're a farang and you have the money to buy a plane ticket to Thailand, then you're rich.  Which is a VERY accurate assumption.

[1FinickyOne]

I hear some pretty tough stories about public schools in other wealthier countries too...  it takes time and money to train good teachers. 

 

My kid is in a private Thai school, not international, it costs about 4,000 baht a semester and her vocabulary/spelling list has words like "accommodation" and "architecture" etc... she is also learning Chinese though I am not sure the Chinese teacher has returned. 

 

If not satisfied, there are alternatives including some degree of home schooling. I would not worry so much about the kids needing haircuts. 

[thehelmsman]

My kid's school costs 50,000bht per term and is not international, its an English Program school.  We'll see how it goes. They teach both English and Thai.

[wildewillie89]

2 hours ago, Chou Anou said:

No, the assumption being that, relative to Thais, if you're a farang and you have the money to buy a plane ticket to Thailand, then you're rich.  Which is a VERY accurate assumption.

Maybe some do not have a salary in their new country yet. There are many variables in each individuals life. If i moved to Thailand (only had enough money for the plane ticket), and did not have a job and my wife had a more 'regular' job, then the kid will be forced to go to a government school due to our financial situation at the time. It is not the case, however, it just shows that is why assumptions can be VERY inaccurate. How many homeless westerners are in Thailand now? Quite a few, by your logic there should be zero, as they had money for a plane ticket lol. In what world can be something be considered 'VERY accurate' when you refuse to recognise any potential variables. 

[FritsSikkink]

12 hours ago, Gumballl said:

 

Wherever the OP is from, the education must have been just as bad.  Think about it... a wise farang would not raise his kids in Thailand.

Tell me more about the excellent education in your country.

[FritsSikkink]

10 hours ago, possum1931 said:

Thailand is a very militilistic country, this is not Thai bashing, it is their country and we have to accept that.

I was an English teacher here for three years, and one day I arrived in my class to start lessons, the first thing

I noticed was that about half of the boys were missing, why? They were sent to get their hair cut. 

"militilistic" ?

[wildewillie89]

4 hours ago, Enoon said:

 

Has your little darling started calling herself "Benz" yet?

 

 

Benz as in Mercedes? 
 

Luckily for us her Thai family have kept their values. The grandfather had no money growing up and needed a scholarship just to go to the local government high school. He achieved the top of the school and went into the army. Being naturally intelligent/hard working he moved up the ranks. His father tried to force him to drop out after primary school to work as he refused to pay for high school, but he liked school so went and asked for help as a 12 year old. Once in the army he sent all his money back to the family so his younger siblings could continue school (one is now boss of police in the city).

The point being the family is still very grounded in their morals/minds (especially for Thai people), even though of a high status in society in terms of position, they don't live like it due to past experiences. Even though they have money they do not live in luxury. They prefer to sleep on a blanket than a bed, have air con in only one room,, only installed a seat toilet for me, shower with the 1 litre bucket (like you use to flush toilets), do not drink/smoke, and see the value of helping others out. With that saved money, it has gone into things like land for the children/grandchildren. My daughter will grow up with similar values, just with an added focus on a greater respect for animals of all kinds. The systems we have set in place to make our daughters life more comfortable cannot be accessed until she is an adult. Receiving extra help from schooling I do not consider spoiling her, I consider that a basic human right to be educated.  
 

I am confused as to why she would be calling herself 'Benz'?

Edited May 30, 2017 by wildewillie89

[Trembly]

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