Young boy dies in hospital waiting room "because he had to wait"

[Gandtee]

From when he was a toddler I read to my son in English every night before he went to bed. Even at fourteen he was still trying to get me to do it. It paid off, but I still get him to read books in English on a regular basis.It helps him with spelling and grammar.

[Here2008]

2 minutes ago, psyvolt said:

How do you come to that conclusion?

Over 25 years of professional experience. 

OK ?

[atyclb]

31 minutes ago, akampa said:

 large hospitals that I have been to here in Chiang Mai with my  baby always checks temperature and blood pressure  before anything else.

 

and in doing so also know pulse and respiratory rate.  its possible the boy was triaged and vital sign did not suggest anything catastrophic, then he would have been asked to wait.

 

in the usa hospital er's that are overwhelmed go on ambulance divert until they have cleared patients. if every hospital is on divert they take turns receiving patients and it becomes russian roulette for new  patients

 

 

in addition, a triple a in a otherwise healthy boy is not a primary diagnostic consideration but typically one of exclusion and likely picked up while doing sonogram for other more common problems.

Edited July 22, 2017 by atyclb

[atyclb]

3 hours ago, Prbkk said:

In this case any reasonable triage system would indicate urgency: severe pain including an inability to sit. At the very least that would be indicative of something like appendicitis, with the consequent need to get him in to be seen, STAT.

They can be excused for not foreseeing the clot, but inexcusable to keep a child with severe pain waiting ( or any patient for that matter).

 

 

problem with "drama" in society may make the triage staff a bit immune to what claimed bad pain.  sad but true

[Joebuzz]

5 hours ago, billd766 said:

 

Read the world news.

 

Things like this happen all over the first world countries as well.

 

I rarely use hospitals here in Thailand but when I have I have had no qualms about the training that the hospital staff received.

 

You always do your best to find fault with this government but if you think about it few elected governments did anything either.

 

Why not bitch about them too, or doesn't that fit in with your agenda?

Wrong!  If you enter an ER in the USA with chest OR serious abdominal pain you are seen immediately.  A check on his blood pressure would have likely saved him before he bled out internally.

[psyvolt]

3 hours ago, Here2008 said:

Over 25 years of professional experience. 

OK ?

Over 25 years of experience, and yet you can't/wont explain what made you come to that conclusion (which was my question).. Yeah ok mate.

 

Btw, I too have experience in the medical field - hence why I'm questioning your reasoning for your conclusing it could have been cerebral blood vessels that caused the aneurysm. I get the feeling your only experience in the hospital is as a wardie or kitchen hand.

[TheLobster]

Our only experience with the local hospital was terrible based mainly on the attitude of the staff. They appeared to do the minimum they could possibly get away with whilst still maintaining their 'employed' status.

[Here2008]

58 minutes ago, psyvolt said:

Btw, I too have experience in the medical field -

Please detail your experience of sudden catastrophic intra-abdominal(or other) bleeds in children  together with reputable links to the literature.

[billd766]

8 hours ago, dcnx said:

Probably because we're in Thailand and we're all posting on a forum called Thai Visa.

 

But don't let something so unbelievably obvious get in the way of your agenda.

 

 

How strange that you leap to his defence.

 

Would you care to explain to me which country you think I am talking about and what my agenda is?

 

 

[mommysboy]

5 hours ago, pauleddy said:

As someone who was Head of ER for 12 years, my first comment is that Abdo Pain in young children is very common and usually nothing or of unknown origin. By that, I mean that it's wind, constipation or 100 other things. Peritonitis following a burst appendix  can take a while to distinguish but it is pretty obvious and should not be missed. A burst aorta (blood vessel) in any part of the trunk is quite rare in children unless there is some type of congenital defect--ruptured aortas happen to older people who have loads of cholesterol. Diverticulitis can be very painful and may need surgery in extreme cases.

 

Differential diagnosis of Abdo pain is an art and a great skill. Only experienced surgeons do it well, and scans plus bloodwork often helps. Sometimes the surgeon has no idea, and will open the abdo to do an exploratory laparotomy

  But, this is a tragedy nonetheless.

 

Every ER dept "misses" things from time to time, especially when we are busy. Often, the stuff missed consists of fractures which are small and need difficult and unusual XRays to locate, but "silent" heart attacks do exist and I have had people die in my arms for no obvious reason.

 

RIP and best wishes to the family.

 

Eddy 

Nevertheless!

[cyberfarang]

Since the introduction of the 30 baht scheme, many Thais do visit hospitals even for the most minor complaints. That`s because it`s free rather than going to a drug store and paying for medications.

 

I recently had to attend the Hang Dong, Chiang Mai,  government hospital to have a cyst removed from my neck. After the op, I had a quick conversation with the middle aged male doctor. He looked tired and worn out. The doctor told me that he`s worked to the extremes, many so-called patients going to the hospital just to receive pain killers for a slight headache or medication for constipation and the elderly attending for minor aches and pains.

 

Tragic for the boy, but the hospital cannot be blamed. Unless the child showed obvious symptoms of being seriously ill in the first instance, then he would have been just placed in the queue. 

[mommysboy]

5 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

Since the introduction of the 30 baht scheme, many Thais do visit hospitals even for the most minor complaints. That`s because it`s free rather than going to a drug store and paying for medications.

 

I recently had to attend the Hang Dong, Chiang Mai,  government hospital to have a cyst removed from my neck. After the op, I had a quick conversation with the middle aged male doctor. He looked tired and worn out. The doctor told me that he`s worked to the extremes, many so-called patients going to the hospital just to receive pain killers for a slight headache or medication for constipation and the elderly attending for minor aches and pains.

 

Tragic for the boy, but the hospital cannot be blamed. Unless the child showed obvious symptoms of being seriously ill in the first instance, then he would have been just placed in the queue. 

 

I think he did show serious symptoms.

 

I'm sure the staff will be over-worked.

[colinneil]

I have been following this thread, and noticed a lot of posters blaming the staff, which in my humble opinion is a disgrace.

One of the biggest problems for hospital staff here is Thai people yes a hell of a lot of them are hypochondriacs.

 

One perfect example is my father in law, a few weeks ago he was at our gate, shouting for my wife.

Wife went to the gate, he said i need to go hospital now.

Wife took him to hospital emergency room, what is the problem doctor asks him.

My leg hurts, silly old sod is 79 years old, and his leg hurts.

Doctor gave him some paracetamol, go home and rest your leg.

My point is the silly old bugger wasted nurses /doctors time for nothing.

People like my f.i.l. are the biggest problem distracting staff from patients who genuinely need help.

[LazySlipper]

I know this hospital. Many years ago my ex-mother in law went there to receive treatment... we rushed from BKK to Petchaburi to find the mother in law sitting on the sidewalk with blood spurting out of her nose. They had just given her pills and told her to go home. 

 

I took her to the private hospital where she spent the night and was given proper treatment.

 

<deleted> hospital to say the least.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.  This is not about NHS, Australian health care or Obamacare. 

[psyvolt]

8 hours ago, Here2008 said:

Please detail your experience of sudden catastrophic intra-abdominal(or other) bleeds in children  together with reputable links to the literature.

I'm not the one proclaiming a ridiculous diagnosis, and then unwilling to share how i came to that conclusion. If you care to look, I havent given an opinion as its impossible to do so with the little data we have.

Nice try thou, but if your going to make claims that you have over 20 yrs as a health professional, at least don't speak rubbish.

[Happyman58]

My Thai wife first husband died from high blood pressure 8 years ago Wife took him to hospital and the  nurse on duty said he will have  to wait Doctor is playing golf That was at 2 He died at 4 Doc came at 5 after he finished his game. The nurse did not even try to get into contact with doctor

[hansnl]

20 hours ago, LannaGuy said:

Very difficult for hospital staff to know it was that serious. Just a very unfortunate incident but I wouldn't blame the hospital as long as they triage as normal. 

A burst blood vessel, or maybe even the aorta, is very difficult to recognise and treat.

But reading the article, I might start to think the triage was not sufficient.

[Rancid]

19 hours ago, seajae said:

in Australia you are seen by the nurse as you come in, temp and bp taken as well as pulse, this is everyone. If you happen to have bad readings you are pushed through, this is always the best method but here someone with a runny nose gets preference over someone dying because they were there first, very backward.

 

Really? In Australia I had nasty abdominal pain, the doctor told me to get to the hospital. On arrival with a referral to investigate possible acute appendicitis I sat and waited for hours. I was not seen by a nurse at all, just told to wait, in fact no one paid any attention till I went to the counter and asked if they were aware appendicitis can be fatal and did they want that on their watch, I was then reluctantly seen.

[petermik]

9 hours ago, colinneil said:

I have been following this thread, and noticed a lot of posters blaming the staff, which in my humble opinion is a disgrace.

One of the biggest problems for hospital staff here is Thai people yes a hell of a lot of them are hypochondriacs.

 

 

Colin.... this happens the world over unfortunately,it is not a disgrace to question the competence of whoever assessed (or maybe he was not and simply told to take a seat and wait) this young chap when he first arrived,for him to die suddenly like this he surely must have been showing obvious signs of distress and clearly these were missed,overwork or whatever the reason we shall never know but someone for sure is to blame for not taking the time to check him out properly.

[Here2008]

2 hours ago, psyvolt said:

I'm not the one proclaiming a ridiculous diagnosis, and then unwilling to share how i came to that conclusion. If you care to look, I havent given an opinion as its impossible to do so with the little data we have.

Nice try thou, but if your going to make claims that you have over 20 yrs as a health professional, at least don't speak rubbish.

 

Which translated means presumably you do not have a clue and the "experience" you claim is non-existent ? 

[Bill Miller]

Symptoms of acute abdominal pain could have been appendicitis as well, also fatal if not properly treated.
Hospitals available to "The People" are chronically understaffed and underfunded. Not unique to Thailand at all.
In the US I was lingering in our version of a Provincial hospital for two days before being transferred to a hospital that could (would?) do an angiogram. It was a weekend.
Within an hour of the angiogram, I was air lifted to a heart hospital for an emergency by pass operation.
I was lucky to live, in the US which often ballyhoos it's superior medical capabilities.
I feel very sad for this young guy and his family. I do not pretend to know all the reasons this happened, nor have I the education and experience to remedy the Thai medical system.  

[lvr181]

21 hours ago, LannaGuy said:

Very difficult for hospital staff to know it was that serious. Just a very unfortunate incident but I wouldn't blame the hospital as long as they triage as normal. 

But did they 'triage as normal'?  

 

If what they did was 'normal' then they need to revise their procedures!

[Here2008]

1 minute ago, lvr181 said:

But did they 'triage as normal'?

What does "normal" triage consist of?

[colinneil]

8 minutes ago, petermik said:

Colin.... this happens the world over unfortunately,it is not a disgrace to question the competence of whoever assessed (or maybe he was not and simply told to take a seat and wait) this young chap when he first arrived,for him to die suddenly like this he surely must have been showing obvious signs of distress and clearly these were missed,overwork or whatever the reason we shall never know but someone for sure is to blame for not taking the time to check him out properly.

Yes i agree with you on certain points.

Not every hospital has fully trained qualified staff on duty all the time.

Reason being lack of finance, not training, also i as am in a position to notice, first thing you ar e told to do is take a seat, or in my case lie on the gurney and wait.

Nurses will not attend to you without your notes being present, so somebody has to go to the office and queue to get them.

Before anybody tells me i am wrong, wife takes me every 3 weeks for the catheter to be changed, every staff member knows me, knows why i am there, but will do nothing until my wife appears with my notes, so she goes park the pickup walks back to the hospital, goes gets the notes, meanwhile 15/20 minutes have past.

Crazy because i am on a gurney blocking part of the emergency room.

[lvr181]

2 minutes ago, Here2008 said:

What does "normal" triage consist of?

Ask the hospital, not me. 

 

But I will take your question as rhetorical.

[Here2008]

1 minute ago, lvr181 said:

Ask the hospital, not me. 

 

But I will take your question as rhetorical.

 

9 minutes ago, lvr181 said:

But did they 'triage as normal'?  

So what did this mean?  It implies you have knowledge of triage systems and what is "normal"  ...........

 

If in fact you do not know  then just admit your lack of knowledge

[psyvolt]

34 minutes ago, Here2008 said:

 

Which translated means presumably you do not have a clue and the "experience" you claim is non-existent ? 

Ahhhh, from the person who posted a rediculus theory, then can't back it up- yet says they have over 20 years as a health professional. Ha ha ha your laughable mate, and your not fooling anyone. 

Anybody thats ever worked in thr health field knows that the information given in this story is no where near enough information to make an assessment, let alone a diagnosis like you did by saying it was congenital cerebral blood vessels. Your a fraud for even trying to pass yourself off as a professional.

[psyvolt]

19 minutes ago, Here2008 said:

 

So what did this mean?  It implies you have knowledge of triage systems and what is "normal"  ...........

 

If in fact you do not know  then just admit your lack of knowledge

Pot-kettle-black

[barefootbangkok]

22 hours ago, petermik said:

Sadly the lack of real basic training in most government hospitals here is obvious,lots of nurses/staff with little or no real knowledge to deal with cases such as this....tragedy that never should have happened but sadly will again and again

R.I.P. young man

My father-in law was in a coma. The nurses said no need to put him in CCU. He would get better care in the regular ward. He went brain dead that night due to a lack of oxygen. In the morning, they placed in CCU, apparently to cover up their mistake. The family didn't want to sue the hospital since it would only cause more trauma. The hospital wouldn't even transport the father to the family home, insisting that the family pay for transport after they killed him.