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Driving - specifically on dual-carriageways - in Thailand


Ossy

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Just get into the right hand lane and do about 60KMH, look straight ahead, do not flinch at flashing headlights in your rear view mirror, ignore the horns, just sit there for a while happily plodding along, then when one of those blacked out 4 x 4 's comes along your inside and you can see a slow moving lorry ahead in the left lane, put your foot to the floor.....oh the sheer pleasure at watching them having to brake as they cannot get past you, it makes the day worth while.

 

You can also if you feel a bit risky, try pulling the handbrake on when one of those idiots is tail gating you, they will tend to leave a bigger gap after they almost plummet into your rear end.

Edited by Formaleins
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I don't dawdle around, I just move to the fastest moving lane. It depends on the roads. If you know them well, very quickly the left lane can turn in to the fast lane because of all the inconsiderate drivers in the right hand lane. Traffic would flow so much better if people overtaking trucks would get a move on rather than driving side by side for 10 mins. 

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On 9/30/2017 at 10:14 AM, Ossy said:

At long last (just over 5yrs) I think I've found what I was looking for, regarding 'good' lane discipline on dual carriageway roads. Like most visiting drivers, I found it inexplicable that about 90% of Thai drivers head straight for the right-hand lane as soon as they join a dual-c road, when, 'at home' it was accepted that the 'keep left (nearside)' rule not only made good sense from the entry and exit point of view, but enabled drivers to continue to overtake other vehicles on the right, as on single-c roads. That Thai drivers considered it OK, on dual-c roads, for this rule to be reversed, as if ordered by some non-existent, mystical rule-maker, had me completely puzzled. Especially so when, from 2015 to 2016, on Highway 22 into Sakon Nakhon, Ministry signs had been erected, about every km, advising/asking slower traffic to keep to the left. This did make some difference but only to the extent that RH lane-hoggers reduced from 90 to about 60% . . . most still stuck to the RH lane and sadly, the Sak-Nak lane discipline initiative was apparently abandoned, with the removal of these well-meaning signs, which must have cost mega-bahts to install.

 

I really enjoy driving - always have done - and this LH vs RH lane issue has never escaped my thoughts; as evidenced by my regular looking for the Thai equivalent of The Highway Code each time I visited a book shop. And I wondered what advice, if any, on this lane issue, is given to new drivers as they apply for and take the shamefully easy Thai driving test. You might laugh if I tell you that, especially during the past month when he has scarcely been out of the news, I have wondered which lane General Prayuth believes is the correct one for 'quiet' driving on dual-carriageways . . . and I bet he always sticks to the RH one. I could be wrong, of course.

 

But, the main motive, behind my submitting this new topic, is not my puzzlement or frustration over the lane issue, but my thinking that I have, at last, found the book of rules that tells us all how to behave on Thailand's roads. Just look at 'Lane Position' rule no. 1 which, I have to say puts a smug smile on my face. Yes, it is good to know that you're right, when you can see the 90% of 'idiot' drivers - including GP, maybe - following this mythical RH lane doctrine.

 

Here's the link and I hope it brings as much comfort to 'you lot' as it's brought to me. And, if 90% of you tell me that you've always known this and that 'I am an Ostrich', I won't believe you.

 

http://anachak.co.uk/highwaycode.php

 

People who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do. Isaac Asimov

Quote from the link. Motorcycles travelling in the wrong direction on a dual carriageway have the right of way. Say no more.

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On 10/1/2017 at 2:06 PM, chickenslegs said:

 

True, in specific circumstances. Section 25 of this ... http://thailaws.com/law/t_laws/tlaw0140_5.pdf

good post, thank you.
section 45 relates to overtaking on the left.

then I saw section 46.... no overtaking when driving up a slope :saai:
But that is when it is possible to quickly overtake that old lorrie or 800 cc passenger car,  puzzled about that.

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40 minutes ago, KKr said:

good post, thank you.
section 45 relates to overtaking on the left.

then I saw section 46.... no overtaking when driving up a slope :saai:
But that is when it is possible to quickly overtake that old lorrie or 800 cc passenger car,  puzzled about that.

Oops! Yes it is Section 45.

Section 25 is about whistles - who knew?

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I worked out quickly to drive right lane and avoid potholes trucks bikes and ghost riders plus idiots who pull out of side roads who dont look or stop. Thais understand.

 

Only if its clear will I pull left.

 

People I know who still drive left lane end up injured and in accidents.

Edited by ICECOOL
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On 30/09/2017 at 4:14 AM, Ossy said:

At long last (just over 5yrs) I think I've found what I was looking for, regarding 'good' lane discipline on dual carriageway roads. Like most visiting drivers, I found it inexplicable that about 90% of Thai drivers head straight for the right-hand lane as soon as they join a dual-c road, when, 'at home' it was accepted that the 'keep left (nearside)' rule not only made good sense from the entry and exit point of view, but enabled drivers to continue to overtake other vehicles on the right, as on single-c roads. That Thai drivers considered it OK, on dual-c roads, for this rule to be reversed, as if ordered by some non-existent, mystical rule-maker, had me completely puzzled. Especially so when, from 2015 to 2016, on Highway 22 into Sakon Nakhon, Ministry signs had been erected, about every km, advising/asking slower traffic to keep to the left. This did make some difference but only to the extent that RH lane-hoggers reduced from 90 to about 60% . . . most still stuck to the RH lane and sadly, the Sak-Nak lane discipline initiative was apparently abandoned, with the removal of these well-meaning signs, which must have cost mega-bahts to install.

 

I really enjoy driving - always have done - and this LH vs RH lane issue has never escaped my thoughts; as evidenced by my regular looking for the Thai equivalent of The Highway Code each time I visited a book shop. And I wondered what advice, if any, on this lane issue, is given to new drivers as they apply for and take the shamefully easy Thai driving test. You might laugh if I tell you that, especially during the past month when he has scarcely been out of the news, I have wondered which lane General Prayuth believes is the correct one for 'quiet' driving on dual-carriageways . . . and I bet he always sticks to the RH one. I could be wrong, of course.

 

But, the main motive, behind my submitting this new topic, is not my puzzlement or frustration over the lane issue, but my thinking that I have, at last, found the book of rules that tells us all how to behave on Thailand's roads. Just look at 'Lane Position' rule no. 1 which, I have to say puts a smug smile on my face. Yes, it is good to know that you're right, when you can see the 90% of 'idiot' drivers - including GP, maybe - following this mythical RH lane doctrine.

 

Here's the link and I hope it brings as much comfort to 'you lot' as it's brought to me. And, if 90% of you tell me that you've always known this and that 'I am an Ostrich', I won't believe you.

 

http://anachak.co.uk/highwaycode.php

 

People who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do. Isaac Asimov

just read the link -- motor cyclists must wear hats and have lights on, cars, must wear seatbelts - no specification for lights - .

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Nobody takes any real notice of traffic laws here, or hadn't you noticed.

UK has had to introduce spot fines for drivers hogging the outside lane as undertaking on the left is only allowed under certain circumstances. There are cameras and patrol cars (many unmarked) to enforce it. The self righteous that drive at or just below the speed limit think they are justified as nobody should go faster, now they have to move over if the lane is clear or be heavily fined and possibly lose their license.

 

On a dual-carriageways here there are U-turns to contend with that nobody even thinks about.

Undertaking is evidently lawful, so those trying to take an off lane has to worry about some numbskull driving fast undertaking vehicles trying to turn off.

The whole thing of unskilled, untrained and arrogant drivers, coupled with badly designed roads and badly maintained vehicles and no enforcement of the rules results in the carnage we see every year.

 

Drive carefully.

 

 

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Although I've tried, as near as I can determine  there are no rules of the road in Thailand except "Me First" and "Up to Me" . I feel sure that there are road statutes but since they are only rarely and selectively enforced, it is best to assume that they don't exist.

 

Initially I thought Thai drivers were annoyed with others drivers but finally realized that most Thai drivers see other traffic not as vehicles carrying passengers, but simply impersonal impediments to their own progress, much like a pothole.

 

From shear experience and observation I have developed my own rules based on empirical knowledge.

 

On divided highways I always drive in the right (innermost) lane, being careful to meet or exceed the posted limit.

 

I do this for several reasons :

 

1. I avoid motorcycles (and cars!) going with and against the proper traffic flow who cause traffic hazards on the narrow shoulders.

2. This largely avoids the wandering cars and overloaded trucks and other slow moving traffic and inattentive drivers.

3. The Rocket ship drivers will pass you with narrow margins regardless of the lane you are in. In that regard I find that they only rarely try to pass me on the right using the shoulder of the road as their personally designated passing lane.

4. Therefore I can focus my attention on the traffic on my left mainly (but not totally!)

 

That said, there are two problems with this system:

 

1. No driving system will always work because there are no generally accepted rules of the road here.

2. I must be hyper-aware when approaching and navigating the U-turn lanes. The principal hazard here are the drivers determined to force entry by easing their vehicles into my lane, following some obscure logic that escapes me entirely as it poses high risk to me and them.

3. Motorcycles often choose to create ad hoc U-turn/wrong way access lanes for themselves at unexpected places, often appearing in my lane from the ditch in the medium and crossing the road in front of me to proceed the wrong way on the shoulder of the road on my side of the medium.

 

To keep my mind focused on safety I play a variation of the "I Spy" road game. I constantly scan the traffic in front of me, behind me, and on both sides of me. The game is to determine what each driver will do before he does it or even knows he will do it.

 

The problem with this game is that sane people tend to use reason and logic to predict events. This can lead to spurious predictions in nearly every aspect of social behavior in LOS.

 

For a society that appears to embrace a relaxed approach to all aspects of life, it is a mystery to me why some of them drive like maniacs, even passing me, to go two blocks down the road before pulling in front of me again to quickly stop and exit their vehicles.

 

I will end this rant by saying that I treasure my life in Thailand and honor the way Thai people choose to lead their lives.

Unlike many on these forums, I don't wish for Thailand to enact and enforce myriad increasingly senseless laws and regulations that choke and smother society in my on Shining Land Across the Sea, which I fled from with extreme prejudice.

 

The only way I would choose to change things here would be for people to realize that when they drive with no forethought or regard for their own safety or that of their passengers and those vehicles and pedestrians around them, that they can reap only death and destruction with no meaningful gain in reaching their destination.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Although I've tried, as near as I can determine  there are no rules of the road in Thailand except "Me First" and "Up to Me" . I feel sure that there are road statutes but since they are only rarely and selectively enforced, it is best to assume that they don't exist.

 

Initially I thought Thai drivers were annoyed with others drivers but finally realized that most Thai drivers see other traffic not as vehicles carrying passengers, but simply impersonal impediments to their own progress, much like a pothole.

 

From shear experience and observation I have developed my own rules based on empirical knowledge.

 

On divided highways I always drive in the right (innermost) lane, being careful to meet or exceed the posted limit.

 

I do this for several reasons :

 

1. I avoid motorcycles (and cars!) going with and against the proper traffic flow who cause traffic hazards on the narrow shoulders.

2. This largely avoids the wandering cars and overloaded trucks and other slow moving traffic and inattentive drivers.

3. The Rocket ship drivers will pass you with narrow margins regardless of the lane you are in. In that regard I find that they only rarely try to pass me on the right using the shoulder of the road as their personally designated passing lane.

4. Therefore I can focus my attention on the traffic on my left mainly (but not totally!)

 

That said, there are two problems with this system:

 

1. No driving system will always work because there are no generally accepted rules of the road here.

2. I must be hyper-aware when approaching and navigating the U-turn lanes. The principal hazard here are the drivers determined to force entry by easing their vehicles into my lane, following some obscure logic that escapes me entirely as it poses high risk to me and them.

3. Motorcycles often choose to create ad hoc U-turn/wrong way access lanes for themselves at unexpected places, often appearing in my lane from the ditch in the medium and crossing the road in front of me to proceed the wrong way on the shoulder of the road on my side of the medium.

 

To keep my mind focused on safety I play a variation of the "I Spy" road game. I constantly scan the traffic in front of me, behind me, and on both sides of me. The game is to determine what each driver will do before he does it or even knows he will do it.

 

The problem with this game is that sane people tend to use reason and logic to predict events. This can lead to spurious predictions in nearly every aspect of social behavior in LOS.

 

For a society that appears to embrace a relaxed approach to all aspects of life, it is a mystery to me why some of them drive like maniacs, even passing me, to go two blocks down the road before pulling in front of me again to quickly stop and exit their vehicles.

 

I will end this rant by saying that I treasure my life in Thailand and honor the way Thai people choose to lead their lives.

Unlike many on these forums, I don't wish for Thailand to enact and enforce myriad increasingly senseless laws and regulations that choke and smother society in my on Shining Land Across the Sea, which I fled from with extreme prejudice.

 

The only way I would choose to change things here would be for people to realize that when they drive with no forethought or regard for their own safety or that of their passengers and those vehicles and pedestrians around them, that they can reap only death and destruction with no meaningful gain in reaching their destination.

 

 

Agree with all that.  Their speed is usually ambition over skill.  As I point out to my Thai wife when she urges an unwise cause of action : I am an atheist, this is my only life, whereas, she, as a Buddhist, has many more to come, so let's be cautious, for my sake alone.   

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4 hours ago, RocketDog said:

Although I've tried, as near as I can determine  there are no rules of the road in Thailand except "Me First" and "Up to Me" . I feel sure that there are road statutes but since they are only rarely and selectively enforced, it is best to assume that they don't exist.

 

Initially I thought Thai drivers were annoyed with others drivers but finally realized that most Thai drivers see other traffic not as vehicles carrying passengers, but simply impersonal impediments to their own progress, much like a pothole.

 

From shear experience and observation I have developed my own rules based on empirical knowledge.

 

On divided highways I always drive in the right (innermost) lane, being careful to meet or exceed the posted limit.

 

I do this for several reasons :

 

1. I avoid motorcycles (and cars!) going with and against the proper traffic flow who cause traffic hazards on the narrow shoulders.

2. This largely avoids the wandering cars and overloaded trucks and other slow moving traffic and inattentive drivers.

3. The Rocket ship drivers will pass you with narrow margins regardless of the lane you are in. In that regard I find that they only rarely try to pass me on the right using the shoulder of the road as their personally designated passing lane.

4. Therefore I can focus my attention on the traffic on my left mainly (but not totally!)

 

That said, there are two problems with this system:

 

1. No driving system will always work because there are no generally accepted rules of the road here.

2. I must be hyper-aware when approaching and navigating the U-turn lanes. The principal hazard here are the drivers determined to force entry by easing their vehicles into my lane, following some obscure logic that escapes me entirely as it poses high risk to me and them.

3. Motorcycles often choose to create ad hoc U-turn/wrong way access lanes for themselves at unexpected places, often appearing in my lane from the ditch in the medium and crossing the road in front of me to proceed the wrong way on the shoulder of the road on my side of the medium.

 

To keep my mind focused on safety I play a variation of the "I Spy" road game. I constantly scan the traffic in front of me, behind me, and on both sides of me. The game is to determine what each driver will do before he does it or even knows he will do it.

 

The problem with this game is that sane people tend to use reason and logic to predict events. This can lead to spurious predictions in nearly every aspect of social behavior in LOS.

 

For a society that appears to embrace a relaxed approach to all aspects of life, it is a mystery to me why some of them drive like maniacs, even passing me, to go two blocks down the road before pulling in front of me again to quickly stop and exit their vehicles.

 

I will end this rant by saying that I treasure my life in Thailand and honor the way Thai people choose to lead their lives.

Unlike many on these forums, I don't wish for Thailand to enact and enforce myriad increasingly senseless laws and regulations that choke and smother society in my on Shining Land Across the Sea, which I fled from with extreme prejudice.

 

The only way I would choose to change things here would be for people to realize that when they drive with no forethought or regard for their own safety or that of their passengers and those vehicles and pedestrians around them, that they can reap only death and destruction with no meaningful gain in reaching their destination.

 

 

Superb and 'reasonably' reasoned, although being a dedicated 'lefty', I can't agree with most of it :post-4641-1156694606:

 

It's simple . . . the Junta, now having experienced SMOOOTH roads and disciplined driving in the US, organises the following:-

1) an IMMEDIATE mass repair of all left lane craters . . . . not a problem for 'total control' man.

2) an IMMEDIATE printing - in Thai and English - and distribution, via police stations, amphoes, local council offices, 7-11's and Tesco's of 'The Good Driving Guide', linked below, but with clarification, in those sections relating to idiot drivers in wrong lane, going wrong way, etc., that make it necessary to 'veer' from the code in order to stay alive . . . not a problem for you know who.  http://anachak.co.uk/highwaycode.php

3) an IMMEDIATE requirement for ALL Thai drivers to be tested - practical and theory - in line with the Driving Guide. Farangs' high driving skills, as proved by their D Licences, will render us immune from this circus in which 95% of test entrants will inevitably fail. The 5% that pass will have already sussed out the need for number 4) The Police Force must set-up and apply an appropriate, strictly implemented test for all police drivers, for which a special licence or permit will be issued.    No problem, again.

4) The IMMEDIATE availability of govt. financial assistance for the setting up of both private and state driving schools. There will need to be a very wily top dog, here, in order to exclude all scope for corruption or other abuse of the scheme.        Difficult but not impossible.

5) As part of the 'Global Revival of Law and Order' that the govt. must carry out IMMEDIATELY, across the entire police structure and from the very top-to-bottom, every effort will be made by the Police to enforce all laws relating to driving in accordance with the 'new' guide, including the use of unmarked traffic-cop cars to help weed out and punish the 'Black & Big-Wheeled' prats . . . you know who I mean. They are going to take quite a bit of persuasion, believing, as they will, that they are above all this new good driver initiative.   

 

OK, I'll be long dead and gone before this will be achieved, but the thought of all this stuff does help my evening U-turn U-beer go down. Thanks to all you lively debaters and evidently PASSIONATE drivers. Now, what's my next moan?

Edited by Ossy
punctuation
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19 minutes ago, Ace of Pop said:

Do You mean you stay on the Correct Left side of the Hiway if dithering along, or a Malcontent English Teacher type lefty?...:partytime2:

Neither . . . unless I'm avoiding a pot-hole or overtaking another good Lefty, I normally vary my left lane speed from the 90 limit to 10kph above limit, depending on other traffic.

 

Normally, of course, I spend far too much time undertaking the often 'endless' queues of traffic, occupying the inner lane, often with not a pot-hole to be seen.

 

Yes, perhaps I'm fortunate that nearly all my main road driving is on H22 between Udon Thani and Sak-Nak, about 170 km and hardly a single reason for going wrong-lane.

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On 03/10/2017 at 8:15 PM, glasswort said:

Quote from the link. Motorcycles travelling in the wrong direction on a dual carriageway have the right of way. Say no more.

 Except the quote is not what the thai traffic law prescribes. No provision for driving or riding against the traffic flow. Its just not enforced. A myth. The laws here are almost identical to British and Australian road rules.

 

(here is a translation)

 

http://thailaws.com/law/t_laws/tlaw0140_5.pdf

 

 

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roads are best upcountry especially isan and far north/south. lots of expansion/improvements noticed last few years and for the old fashioned manual speed trap there is a few innovative friendly experts around yasothon who gets me every time with a smile. everything above the table. receipt done & 200bt less & a 'beware' and I'm on my way :) brilliant. those speedcams will take a long time or forever to earn their investment lol.

trucks overtaking trucks in 3rd or 4th lane up pak chong highway? yup really amazing, but there's always an empty fast lane for me no matter it's rank or number. It's hard to ignore our hardwired 'keep left' rule (although keep right for us righteous EU drivers lol). I even had the 'commercial enhanced driving test...call it taxi test', but the best really is to ignore all rules except the 'idiot' rule. anything that could happen will happen so expect it, deal with it & handle it & so far so good over the years, but every trip is a lesson learned. calm calm...and it really helps to have a vehicle capable to move fast!

Oh don't get started with the motorways!! anybody remembers how easypass lanes at first were scattered around the inside lanes till finally they got moved to outside? although slow but lessons are being learn here & there albit always the hard way. no one master pan will ever get it right :D

Edited by worldfun
up to me
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Just back from a trip to UK where I drove 2000 miles in a busy week of visits, and yes lane discipline is better than here, but I thought driving way too close to the car in front was worse than in Thailand.   I suspect UK drivers are getting complacent, because everyone needs to drive legally as they are on camera 100% of the time, and accident rates are comparatively low, but I saw the aftermath of two serious accidents on the motorways, so they still happen (admittedly if I drove 3000 km in Thailand I'd see evidence of many more than 2 accidents).
On my last trip back to the UK I was shocked by how virtually everyone obediently obeyed the traffic laws and speed limits. It certainly wasn't so Stepfordesque on my previous visit some 15 years before.

Sent from my Cray II supercomputer

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When i first started driving in LOS over 35 years ago, getting busted for staying in the right lane was the major cash cow for traffic cops that weren't armed with radar back then. Nowadays, I doubt they enforce it much at all. A major contributor to right-lane hogging is the generally poor condition of the left-lane which tears up faster due to the constant heavy truck traffic. The worst surface for driving on is where the bitumen has deformed into two grooves with a hump in the middle which can make truck trailers jump around quite alarmingly. To avoid this zig-zagging, the inter-provincial buses like to cruise along in the right lane... then the bloody minivans of course.
The Thai filth tried to nick me for moving into the right lane in order to avoid a gaggle of kids on scooters who were all over the bike and inside lanes. Needless to say I didn't contribute to their Sang Som fund that day.

Sent from my Cray II supercomputer

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37 minutes ago, JaseTheBass said:

On my last trip back to the UK I was shocked by how virtually everyone obediently obeyed the traffic laws and speed limits. It certainly wasn't so Stepfordesque on my previous visit some 15 years before.

Sent from my Cray II supercomputer
 

Damn those cameras that, sadly, have proved to be superior to the guys who install them.

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2 hours ago, JaseTheBass said:

The Thai filth tried to nick me for moving into the right lane in order to avoid a gaggle of kids on scooters who were all over the bike and inside lanes. Needless to say I didn't contribute to their Sang Som fund that day.
 

Get a dash cam.

 

I find that most (if not all) roadside land sharks will just wave you through when they see you have a dashcam.

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Get a dash cam.
 
I find that most (if not all) roadside land sharks will just wave you through when they see you have a dashcam.
Not sure they'd been invented then, but I have one now.

Not a problem - I told them they're idiots and that I wasn't giving them any money.

Sent from my Cray II supercomputer

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  • 1 month later...

I am bilingual :neus:. It is a divided highway. With or without a median.

 

When visiting Thailand, yes we are mostly visitors check your passport, it is important to realize that when you fell down the rabbit hole and entered the Kingdom most of if not all the people you come across be they driving or otherwise are paid up members of the Hatter's Tea Party. Not much of what you learned "above ground" is relevant here.

Edited by VocalNeal
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/3/2017 at 8:00 PM, alien365 said:

I don't dawdle around, I just move to the fastest moving lane. It depends on the roads. If you know them well, very quickly the left lane can turn in to the fast lane because of all the inconsiderate drivers in the right hand lane. Traffic would flow so much better if people overtaking trucks would get a move on rather than driving side by side for 10 mins. 

Yes, that's the part I hate the most - when two trucks or other vehicles swaddle side by side rather than either quickly overtaking or choosing not to overtake at all given their speed is clearly no faster than the vehicle they have decided to "overtake". It's why on any long-distance journey in Thailand, no matter that you can sometimes comfortably reach 130-140 at times, your average speed will always be not much more than 80-90km/h because every so often your speed will be cut down to 60 or less for a while while you wait for the inconsiderate right lane hogger to move out of the way. 80-90km/h is my average driving speed even when I don't stop for fuel, food or anything other than a quick toilet break, say twice on a typical 500-600km journey for a total of 5 min. This despite me being able to reach 120 or higher on many parts of the journey. Of course, traffic lights, most of which are manually operated and where you often have to wait for 2 minutes before it turns green even with no other vehicles in sight also contribute to slowing down average driving speeds.

 

If we could only just be able to cruise at a comfortable 100km/h on any given Thai highway, it would make all the extra fast speeds to make up for the ultra slow lane hogging obsolete. Perhaps it's frustration due to other drivers' poor lane discipline that explains all the aggressive driving, with many drivers overtaking on the shoulder, tailgating and flashing their lights etc. and changing lanes without indicating.

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