Air con experts

[midasthailand]

I am a small BOI company delivering high level training to Oil and Gas industry in Thailand and am in partneship with MOGIT/TPTI. I am owed significant money (for me anyway) for training delivered in July! My contract states payment within 30 days, or when client pays! 

 

We do on average 400K/month

 

Is there a body I can approach to complain?

 

I am paying my staff from my own pocket and this cannot go on indefinitely!

 

Any advice gratefully accepted.

[blackcab]

There is nobody to complain to, other than the company that owes you money. Your only other option is to go to Court.

 

You need a better strategy. Either sell them blocks of training in advance, withhold certification until payment is complete or stop doing business with them.

[fletchsmile]

Make sure you tick the key boxes on paperwork:

- Check you have all in order on the written contract

- Ensure that you have sent out an invoice or proforma invoice requesting payment

- If you haven't already, then send a written reminder that the account is significantly overdue. I assume you've chased them several times verbally, but good to have a documented written reminder

 

As part of the next written reminder:

- Ask them to contact you as soon as possible if they have any questions or difficulties regarding payment

 

Once you've issued 1 written reminder, on the next one

- You might like to state that if payment is not received within 7 days you will proceed with legal action. State that if that legal action is pursued you will hold them fully responsible for all legal costs + interest. Whether you threaten this and whether you actually do will of course will depend on your business relationship with them and whether you expect to do future business with them. Also you may decide to just take it on the chin and write it off, in reality when you consider the time, cost and effort involved vs what you expect to get back

 

It's all accounts receivable 101 really. From there the possible threat of legal action or not, and then ultimately actual legal action or not

 

You should generally have your policy on how such overdues/procedures are dealt with, so it is clear to your staff how to follow up. Unfortunately they are a part of doing business anywhere in the world. eg your AR staff chase 7 days before an invoice is due, chase next day payment is missed - verbal follow up. When a written reminder is sent etc. When 2nd more forceful reminder is sent

 

I assume you have some form of bookeeper AR person who is Thai. They should have chased before you and tried to understand why. In your shoes I would also call myself if you haven't done already, making clear that it's serious if it reaches you. Then ask for an explanation as to why it is unpaid. Maybe they have some difficulties and you can agree a compromise/ reschedule etc . 

 

If the company is a member of any professional or other trade bodies, you could also complain to them. eg if they are a member of XYZ chamber of commerce in Thailand. 

 

To be honest there are so many variables and will depend on a lot of factors how you approach it, and what is the best way. But above are some ideas of the type of thing you should be doing

[fletchsmile]

You also need  some thought about who you will extend credit to or not. Don't necessarily give credit to everyone who asks

 

For some / new / poor credit companies maybe you should be asking for payment or part payment up front.

 

For regular business and good customers with established records though, these are the type you consider giving credit to, but even then maybe it isn't automatic unless they ask.

 

Wherever you extend credit to someone you need to have a plan for what happens when they don't pay on time

 

 

[realenglish1]

Yes you can turn it over the an attorney here in Thailand and have him send a letter of collection first

 

They if all else fails you have the courts here in Thailand

 

Good luck

[midasthailand]

Guys, 

 

thank you for your input, I do not employ anyone ATM, my business partner, who handled all of this previously, died suddenly on Oct 07 2017 and the load has now fallen on my shoulders to deal with it. 

 

The way it works is that companies book training through MOGIT who then inform me of training dates and I deliver as required, then invoice for my services. The excuse they keep using is that TPTI clients pay TPTI and then TPTI pay MOGIT then MOGIT pay me. They keep telling me that TPTI have not paid (TPTI is a semi government regulator for Oil and Gas training and come under the department of Minerals and fuels).

 

I underestimated my turnover as I have just been through bank statements from 22/11/16 - 17/11/17, we have delivered training to the value of 14,505,406! Not a bad turnover for a very small business with only 4 Farang and 1 Thai on the books!

 

They currently owe 1,167,200!

[natway09]

First, employ a good Thai office girl with some clues

[Autonuaq]

First to know.

 

What is in the contract about the terms and conditions.

What is in the conformation letter about payment terms and condition.

 

And did you mention the payment term in the invoices.

Did you put a payment due date on the invoices.

 

Did you send the invoices by ems? Or registered post.

 

You can go to the office and just meet the contact you have.

Take all with you. Well ordered.

 

Just have a good meeting and chat. And ask him/her what the problems are that the invoices not are paid.

 

Depending on the relation all can be solve quick.

And sometimes the pay you in cash. Or transfer all quick.

 

I have had not much problems in getting paid. And when then turned out to be a small issue to be solved.

 

But you run BOI company with other thai, they have 51 percent.

Then they have to solve it.

 

Let them handle this

[Janner1]

44 minutes ago, midasthailand said:

thank you for your input, I do not employ anyone ATM, my business partner, who handled all of this previously, died suddenly on Oct 07 2017 and the load has now fallen on my shoulders to deal with it. 

 

The way it works is that companies book training through MOGIT who then inform me of training dates and I deliver as required, then invoice for my services. The excuse they keep using is that TPTI clients pay TPTI and then TPTI pay MOGIT then MOGIT pay me. They keep telling me that TPTI have not paid (TPTI is a semi government regulator for Oil and Gas training and come under the department of Minerals and fuels).

 

I underestimated my turnover as I have just been through bank statements from 22/11/16 - 17/11/17, we have delivered training to the value of 14,505,406! Not a bad turnover for a very small business with only 4 Farang and 1 Thai on the books!

 

They currently owe 1,167,200!

Would it be possible to ask in turn all of the parties concerned if they have made payment to MOGIT before you start to threatened anyone ?

 

And secondly the one worrying factor in your post are the words ( My contract states payment in 30 days or when the client pays ) could it be that MOGIT is using this factor to with hold payment to you, hence the reason to make discreet enquiries.

[blackcab]

Just out of intetest, if you received 14.5m worth of payments in 12 months, how come you are paying the staff from your own pocket?

 

Where has all the money gone?

[yimlitnoy]

I was Operating Manager of an Oil Services Company in Africa, it was customary to have all invoices sent and paid within 90 days.  Even our best clients, all in the top 100 companies in the world, were paying only on the last day of this 90 days. 

 

You may be the only one asking for payment within 30 days which forced them to use their small cash account (box...) designed for daily operations instead of their approved monthly operating expenditure Funds. 

 

If you threaten them legally you will simply loose their business... 

[Grumpy Duck]

Lots of confusing terminology BOI, MOGIT, TPTI. I saw a few good suggestions as regular billing/collection practices.

It sounds as if there is a government agency involved, If they are involved in the payment it will take a while to get paid. If you are offering mandatory safety training, and are continuing to provide services perhaps talk to the regulators involved, mention you cannot afford to continue training if you are not paid. 

Personally, it doesn't seem wise for one partner to leave all billing/receiving to another partner. It is unfair to that partner, and leaves you ignorant of thr cash flow. I see you seem surprised at the volume of services provided, how do you know your partner was not already paid?

Often, businesses tend to pay consultants or others that don't provide actual physical products, ie pipe, fixtures or other essential hardware slower than vendors that do.  

[midasthailand]

On 11/17/2017 at 4:56 PM, blackcab said:

Just out of intetest, if you received 14.5m worth of payments in 12 months, how come you are paying the staff from your own pocket?

 

Where has all the money gone?

Good question, well asked however I said turned over 14.5 not received! My company receives 50%, MOGIT receives 30% and TPTI take 20% off the top. This means around 6 Mill received and 1.2 still owing. I pay my assistant trainer 7,000/day, my discipline expert 8,000/day and myself 15,000/day. My partner was paid 50K/month and his partner was paid 5k commission for each participant she arranged. Office rental (never used, but required for BOI purposes) currently 21k/month. We also pay a Thai lady to look after all dealings with BOI and Immigration. Also tax and VAT come out of that as well. Around 20 courses over the year with participants from SKD, Shelf and Seadrill mainly with a few from Aban in Singapore. Also need to pay for OPITO audits and Liberian Flag state approval.