Trump outlines big cuts to Utah monuments, tribes prepare to sue

[webfact]

Trump outlines big cuts to Utah monuments, tribes prepare to sue

By Valerie Volcovici and Roberta Rampton

 

U.S. President Donald Trump displays an executive order after announcing big cuts to Utah's sprawling wilderness national monuments, at the Utah State Capitol in Salt Lake City, Utah, U.S., December 4, 2017. REUTERS/Kevin Lamarque

 

WASHINGTON/SALT LAKE CITY (Reuters) - President Donald Trump on Monday shrank two wilderness national monuments in Utah by at least half in the biggest rollback of public land protection in U.S. history, drawing praise from pro-development lawmakers and threats of lawsuits from tribes and environmentalists.

 

Trump’s announcement followed months of review by the Interior Department after he ordered the agency in April to identify which of 27 monuments designated by past presidents should be rescinded or resized to give states and local governments more control of the land.

 

"Some people think that the natural resources of Utah should be controlled by a small handful of very distant bureaucrats located in Washington. And guess what? They’re wrong," Trump said in the state capitol alongside Utah's Republican Governor Gary Herbert, the Utah congressional delegation and local county commissioners.

 

Unlike national parks that can only be created by an act of Congress, national monuments can be designated unilaterally by presidents under the century-old Antiquities Act, a law meant to protect sacred sites, artifacts and historical objects.

 

Trump said former presidents abused the Antiquities Act by putting unnecessarily big chunks of territory off limits to drilling, mining, grazing, road traffic and other activities – a headwind to his plan to ramp up U.S. energy output.

 

Trump signed two proclamations after his speech. One would reduce the 1.3-million-acre (0.5 million hectare) Bears Ears National Monument, created in 2016 by then-President Barack Obama in southeastern Utah, by more than 80 percent split into two areas.

 

The other would cut the state’s 1.9-million-acre Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument, designated by President Bill Clinton in 1996, nearly in half. The landscape of canyons, ridges and rock formations would be split into three zones.

 

While a handful of monuments have been resized in the past, none has been cut back to such an extent, putting the president's proclamation in uncharted legal territory. Previous presidents including Woodrow Wilson and William Howard Taft reduced some monuments but were never challenged in court. 

 

Trump will ask Congress to look at the areas that are being removed from the current monuments to consider legislation designating some as a national conservation or national recreation areas, and create a co-management structure for tribes, an administration official said.

 

He said in his speech that the move was aimed in part at helping local communities access the land for hunting and grazing.

"Here, and in other affected states, we have seen harmful and unnecessary restrictions on hunting, ranching, and responsible economic development," Trump said. "We have seen grazing restrictions prevent ranching families from passing their businesses and beloved heritage on to the children."

 

Grazing and hunting were already permitted in both the Bears Ears and Grand Staircase monuments

 

The results of the Interior Department's broader review of U.S. national monuments will be published on Tuesday and is expected to outline changes to a number of other sites.

 

"FIGHTING BACK IMMEDIATELY"

 

Leaders representing the five tribes that pushed for the creation of the Bears Ears monument and who now manage it, said they will take the Trump administration to court. They include the Navajo, Hopi, Pueblo of Zuni, Ute Mountain and Ute Indians who consider Bears Ears sacred.

 

"We will be fighting back immediately. All five tribes will be standing together united to defend Bears Ears,” said Natalie Landreth, an attorney for the Native American Rights Fund, which believes the cut would violate the Antiquities Act.

 

Jonathan Nez, vice president of the Navajo Nation, said the president was ignoring the treaty rights of sovereign Native American nations and that the Interior Department did not listen to tribal leaders who fought to create the monument.

 

"It’s a sad day in Indian country," said Nez.

 

Obama created Bears Ears – an area bigger than the state of Delaware and named for its iconic twin buttes - days before leaving office after lobbying by the tribes.

 

Conservation groups and outdoor clothing company Patagonia have also said they plan to file a legal challenge, arguing the administration ignored public support for the monuments.

 

Others, however, welcomed Trump’s announcement as a chance to boost the economy in one of America’s most remote areas. 

 

"Reducing the size of monument would help free up a lot of land that has been under oppression," said Mike Noel, a state representative from Kane County, more than half of which is occupied by Grand Staircase.

 

Utah Senator Orrin Hatch, who led the push by the state's congressional delegation to shrink the monument, introduced Trump at his speech on Monday and thanked the president for the proclamation.

 

“I appreciate his willingness to listen to my advice and even more importantly, to give the people of Utah a voice in this process," he said.

 

(Reporting by Valerie Volcovici; Roberta Rampton and Lisa Lambert; Editing by Richard Valdmanis and Cynthia Osterman)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-12-05

[FreddieRoyle]

Yes Trump Yes! Private enterprises will run everything better and cheaper than bloated inefficient state enterprises. We saw just the same in Britain where privatization of railways and the postal service saved taxpayers billions(OK the moron govts squandered it anyway, but it was a champion idea). Trump is succeeding in downsizing government, which is what voters wanted from him. Great stuff. 

 My sympathy for native American Indians has vanished after the Pocahontas saga, I mean fair enough if these guys are living in wagwams and hunting buffalo with spears and communicating with smoke signals well yes such a treasure would be worth preserving 100%, but as we see the modern "Native Indians" are looking like regular Joes, have no valid link to their former spiritual past, often living in multimillion dollar mansions and living modern lives - so need to special status or tax breaks or any other special benefits. Use it or lose it - as they say.

[isaanbanhou]

Trump Resorts, Towers and Golf Courses coming to Utah soon.  

[binjalin]

5 minutes ago, FreddieRoyle said:

Yes Trump Yes! Private enterprises will run everything better and cheaper than bloated inefficient state enterprises. We saw just the same in Britain where privatization of railways and the postal service saved taxpayers billions(OK the moron govts squandered it anyway, but it was a champion idea). Trump is succeeding in downsizing government, which is what voters wanted from him. Great stuff. 

 My sympathy for native American Indians has vanished after the Pocahontas saga, I mean fair enough if these guys are living in wagwams and hunting buffalo with spears and communicating with smoke signals well yes such a treasure would be worth preserving 100%, but as we see the modern "Native Indians" are looking like regular Joes, have no valid link to their former spiritual past, often living in multimillion dollar mansions and living modern lives - so need to special status or tax breaks or any other special benefits. Use it or lose it - as they say.

I must say I have to agree with most of this. Bored to death of PC 'save the natives' when there is no link to the past or tenuous at best. We ALL have links to the past worth preserving but all this wailing over 'native rights' is nonsense. We live in 2017 not 1217.

[Get Real]

22 minutes ago, binjalin said:

I must say I have to agree with most of this. Bored to death of PC 'save the natives' when there is no link to the past or tenuous at best. We ALL have links to the past worth preserving but all this wailing over 'native rights' is nonsense. We live in 2017 not 1217.

Right, you just stated that it only took 800 years to totally steal the nation from the natives. You´re my biggest hero!

[mamypoko]

He is a monumental a-hole

[binjalin]

10 minutes ago, Get Real said:

Right, you just stated that it only took 800 years to totally steal the nation from the natives. You´re my biggest hero!

"stealing"  hahahaha  that is funny when ALL nations are a mix and ALL nations develop. Respect the past and enjoy the history and move forward not wallow in PC sentimentality for some 'rosy past' that never actually existed. 

[simple1]

34 minutes ago, binjalin said:

I must say I have to agree with most of this. Bored to death of PC 'save the natives' when there is no link to the past or tenuous at best. We ALL have links to the past worth preserving but all this wailing over 'native rights' is nonsense. We live in 2017 not 1217.

Yes, that's correct, rip up  Native Rights and return to the wonderful days of Manifest Destiny. Indeed why not rescind Native American's US citizenship and make them Stateless. Hail to Trump the destroyer of Human Rights and the Environment of the USA for future generations.

[binjalin]

40 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Yes, that's correct, rip up  Native Rights and return to the wonderful days of Manifest Destiny. Indeed why not rescind Native American's US citizenship and make them Stateless. Hail to Trump the destroyer of Human Rights and the Environment of the USA for future generations.

Hyperbole

[simple1]

8 minutes ago, binjalin said:

Hyperbole

Your hyperbole below below is to what I was responding...

 

all this wailing over 'native rights' is nonsense. We live in 2017 not 1217

 

It is not hyperbole to identify the leader of the alt right, Trump, as the enabler for reversing environmental protection legislation in the USA, together with domestic and international human rights.

Edited December 5, 2017 by simple1

[binjalin]

7 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Your hyperbole below below is to what I was responding...

 

all this wailing over 'native rights' is nonsense. We live in 2017 not 1217

 

It is not hyperbole to identify the leader of the alt right, Trump, as the enabler for reversing environmental protection legislation in the USA, together with domestic and international human rights.

What I stated is FACT what you did was repeat the crying of the sentimentalists over the past. If you want to live in the past go live in a wigwam with no electricity. I am against Trump's reversal of environmental protections and for respecting the past but, unlike you, I am FOR the future. I accept great injustices were done... I'm sorry for that... now lets move on and make sure it never happens again. 

[boomerangutang]

1 hour ago, FreddieRoyle said:

Yes Trump Yes! Private enterprises will run everything better and cheaper than bloated inefficient state enterprises. We saw just the same in Britain where privatization of railways and the postal service saved taxpayers billions(OK the moron govts squandered it anyway, but it was a champion idea). Trump is succeeding in downsizing government, which is what voters wanted from him. Great stuff. 

'Trump is downsizing gov't, which is what voters wanted from him. Great stuff.'

Yea right, by pumping hundreds of billions of added dollars into the military which spends more on air-conditioning some tents in the desert, than NASA's entire budget.

 

The other would cut the state’s 1.9-million-acre Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument, ...nearly in half. 

This hits me like a punch in the gut.  For 4 years, I've been planning to move to that region.  I've been corresponding with some residents there.  The main reason I want to move there is the Escalante Park, and other magnificent parks in that desert region.   

 

I honestly think Trump gets fun kicks from screwing liberals and environmentalists.  He's like the guy in the p.u. truck who purposefully pollutes a forest lake just for the glee he gets - knowing he'll anger nature lovers.

 

 

[simple1]

14 minutes ago, binjalin said:

What I stated is FACT what you did was repeat the crying of the sentimentalists over the past. If you want to live in the past go live in a wigwam with no electricity. I am against Trump's reversal of environmental protections and for respecting the past but, unlike you, I am FOR the future. I accept great injustices were done... I'm sorry for that... now lets move on and make sure it never happens again. 

Living in the past? Don't you wish to see protection of unspoilt areas for future generations? Erosion of protection for natural areas is living in the past!

Edited December 5, 2017 by simple1

[Get Real]

1 hour ago, binjalin said:

"stealing"  hahahaha  that is funny when ALL nations are a mix and ALL nations develop. Respect the past and enjoy the history and move forward not wallow in PC sentimentality for some 'rosy past' that never actually existed. 

Today it´s all a mix, and you are right at that all nations develop. Just that some countries long time ago forgot how to develop with respect, like US for instance.

Are you trying to tell me that the Indians ain´t the native people of the USA?

[binjalin]

35 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Living in the past? Don't you wish to see protection of unspoilt areas for future generations? Erosion of protection for natural areas is living in the past!

I am for environmental protections. What I don't like is all the PC BS which got Trump elected (God help us).

[helpisgood]

2 hours ago, binjalin said:

"stealing"  hahahaha  that is funny when ALL nations are a mix and ALL nations develop. Respect the past and enjoy the history and move forward not wallow in PC sentimentality for some 'rosy past' that never actually existed. 

 

"Mix" and "develop"?  For the Native Americans, it's more like genocide and the breaking of treaties to force peoples off their lands for gold, etc.  Just check out, among many others, the history of Trump's hero, Andrew Jackson, and how he defied the US Supreme Court by starting the "Trail of Tears."  With butcheries by the "civilized" white man like Sand Creek and Washita, their past is not so rosy.

Edited December 5, 2017 by helpisgood
punctuation

[Langsuan Man]

Obviously Trump is not familiar with the this meme:

 

 

But what can you expect from a Republican that has spent his life building on land,  vacant or not 

[selftaopath]

16 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

'Trump is downsizing gov't, which is what voters wanted from him. Great stuff.'

Yea right, by pumping hundreds of billions of added dollars into the military which spends more on air-conditioning some tents in the desert, than NASA's entire budget.

 

 

 

This hits me like a punch in the gut.  For 4 years, I've been planning to move to that region.  I've been corresponding with some residents there.  The main reason I want to move there is the Escalante Park, and other magnificent parks in that desert region.   

 

I honestly think Trump gets fun kicks from screwing liberals and environmentalists.  He's like the guy in the p.u. truck who purposefully pollutes a forest lake just for the glee he gets - knowing he'll anger nature lovers.

 

 

I believe 45 is a very troubled and unhappy privileged white man who wants to do anything and everything he can to make others join him in his misery.  He revels in creating chaos and being the ultimate "crazy maker."  He's the biggest liar in perhaps the world and wants others from his regime to mimic him; unfortunately they do.

 

Edited December 5, 2017 by Scott
Graphic removed

[spidermike007]

This is about native rights only on the fringes. This is more about a visionary society, that sees the need to protect gorgeous, and precious land, and is willing to say no to developers, lobbyists, and the rest of the swamp, this charlatan spoke so much about during his campaign. There are few arguments about stimulating the economy by using this pristine parkland, that even a moron will buy into. Now that he is the circus huckster in chief, he is inviting every member of the swamp to profit, at the expense of the average American, and the legacy of the nation. This is a man so lacking in vision, it defies the imagination. And this is a man so lacking in ethics, or morality, that he is exactly the swamp creature he described in his pre-election speeches. Dino Don. Tyrannosaurus Trump. A prehistoric, sold out, street walking  creature from the dark lagoon, hellbent on destroying the environment, and scrapping all safeguards, at all costs. 

 

Why did I do it? Because the lobbyist asked for it. Is that not enough reason? 

 

Today the conman says it is about hunting and grazing, which sounds innocent enough, right? Want to wager within a few years, the land will be open to mining, logging, and oil gas drilling? There are no reasonable boundaries with this enemy of the earth. It is all about money. Legacy means nothing. The land means nothing. The future means nothing. It is all about money, money, money, now, now, now. 

 

How many readers are aware that over the next 10 years, the new tax plan is going to save the Trump family nearly a billion dollars. It has so many perks for commercial real estate developers, it should have been called the "personal Trump family tax plan". Me, myself, and I. Those are the three entities he considers, above all else. 

Edited December 5, 2017 by spidermike007

[simple1]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

Today the conman says it is about hunting and grazing, which sounds innocent enough,

Which is another blatant lie by Trump. The OP states the concerned areas were already available for hunting and grazing.

 

Every day I am perplexed by Trump's supporters, who claim to be "patriots", supporting this lying destructive frontman of the alt right. Trump is the quintessence of PC for the alt right. Trump is unfit to represent the Office of the President of the USA.

[JAG]

I think that the key to understanding this decision is to consider who established the parks. President Obama and President Clinton.

It really is sad that the President of The United States can be so ******g venal!

Sent from my KENNY using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Get Real]

3 hours ago, binjalin said:

and who are the natives of England?  France?  Germany? Russia?  China?  are you trying to tell me that we IGNORE that we have ALL developed and moved forward?  Who cares if they were there first we have moved forward since those times. Historical interest only or are you telling me the casino owning descendants are a 'spiritual people'?  it's changed, the world has changed all this sentimentality of the past is unhelpful for our future. We have mega problems NOW and no pow-wow with peace pipes is gonna help us deal with North Korea.

Oooj! Slightly over 3 lines of text and you managed to include 5 countries, the change of the world, the people running casinos are not spiritual people and that a peace pipe ain´t the solution for the crisis with North Korea. I guess you are a big fan of simplistic declarations. 

To go back to the subject at hand. Has the five countries you took as an example created reservation camps for their native population, and at the same time for everyday that goes try as hard as they can to push them into even smaller areas of the country? That´s an All American invention. Really something to be proud about, ain´t it? Guess it deserves another clap with the hand guy. 

Edited December 5, 2017 by Get Real

[ballpoint]

28 minutes ago, Get Real said:

Oooj! Slightly over 3 lines of text and you managed to include 5 countries, the change of the world, the people running casinos are not spiritual people and that a peace pipe ain´t the solution for the crisis with North Korea. I guess you are a big fan of simplistic declarations. 

To go back to the subject at hand. Has the five countries you took as an example created reservation camps for their native population, and at the same time for everyday that goes try as hard as they can to push them into even smaller areas of the country? That´s an All American invention. Really something to be proud about, ain´t it? Guess it deserves another clap with the hand guy. 

Not that I think it will happen, but given the dire warnings some give about Muslim immigration to the UK, it would be interesting to read the posts of their decendents in a thread titled "Last remaining non-sharia enclave in England to be abolished by President Mohammed Abdul bin Ibrahim" on some future forum.  I'm sure they will be full of such comments as "Yes, we were here first, but that was then and this is now, and we should all get over it".

[Bluespunk]

Yet another step towards the point where environmental destruction reaches the point of no return. 

 

Bravo grand poobah. 

[mikebike]

1 hour ago, Get Real said:

Has the five countries you took as an example created reservation camps for their native population, and at the same time for everyday that goes try as hard as they can to push them into even smaller areas of the country? That´s an All American invention. Really something to be proud about, ain´t it? Guess it deserves another clap with the hand guy. 

I doubt it is a USA invention. Marginalizing native populations is what colonists did/do.

[Get Real]

49 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

Not that I think it will happen, but given the dire warnings some give about Muslim immigration to the UK, it would be interesting to read the posts of their decendents in a thread titled "Last remaining non-sharia enclave in England to be abolished by President Mohammed Abdul bin Ibrahim" on some future forum.  I'm sure they will be full of such comments as "Yes, we were here first, but that was then and this is now, and we should all get over it".

Getting over it is not any problem for me. The only need to get over it, is that all people can get the same chance to live under the same conditions. Disregarding if they are native, muslims, democrats or plain idiots. 

[SiSePuede419]

It's just horrible how all those poor people keep walking on Orrin Hatch's Rich Cronies land. ?

 

 

[Get Real]

2 minutes ago, mikebike said:

I doubt it is a USA invention. Marginalizing native populations is what colonists did/do.

Ok, Made in the USA and spread by invasive forces.

[mikebike]

22 minutes ago, Get Real said:

Ok, Made in the USA and spread by invasive forces.

Again no. Invented long before the USA was. Look into what ancient societies did when colonizing.

[boomerangutang]

Trump is like the guy at the party, who pees in the punch bowl when no one is looking, just so he can get a giggle each time he sees someone drinking the mix.

 

One of the first things Trump did, when elected, was to send agents over to China to secure as many trademark and copyright names as possible, using the (wait for it) ....Trump name.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if, after he takes away protection status from beautiful desert regions, that he'll send agents in to buy large chunks of properties, to secure for future golf courses, oil wells, mining, and other Trump enterprises.   He may even bottle the sand and, with his excellent salesman abilities, sell it as "The greatest sand anyone has ever seen! It's so amazing, I can hardly find to words to describe it.  Trust me folks, you've never experienced sand this delightful.  Believe me.  Only $9 a bottle.  If you buy 10 bottles right now, you get a free bottle of water at any one of my excellent hotels."