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Can I use a pump without a water tank?


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Posted

Can I fix the pump directly to the water supply coming in to the house from the moobaan?

Went to homepro and they said I need a water tank.

But looking round the moobaan there are several houses with a pump but no tank.  The pump just sucks water straight from the water pipe connecting the mains to the house.

Spoke to my neighbour, he said you can do this, but its not 100% legit, you're meant to have a tank, but it will work without.

 

Anybody confirm this?  If it will work or not.

Not a lot of space in my yard and if I can avoid the extra cost of the tank I can live with the less than 100% legitimacy.  It's a rented house and there is an old pump here (that doesn't work anymore) already.  So I presume it can be done,

Anything to be aware of, extra low pressure? dry running pump?  I don't know.

 

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

 

 

Posted
2 minutes ago, park said:

Anybody confirm this?  If it will work or not.

It will work but don't get caught, since depending where on the main line you are located your use of a direct pump from the water supply will effect everyone farther down

 

I would notify the landlord since it is his problem,  that is why you rent  ? 

Posted

It's not so much a concern for getting caught, it's just not a sensible thing to do.  A tank provides a reservoir for when the mains fizzle out so it's something you probably need anyway.

Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Artisi said:

Connecting to the domestic incomimg water supply is illegal, so upto you. 

So is driving without a license, drinking alcohol within Wat boundaries, buying alcohol between 2pm and 5 pm, riding a motorcycle with the rear footpegs down if there is no passenger. Shall I go on?  

 

There are thousands of shop houses and multilevel houses with a water pump connected directly to the incoming water main.  

 

Ask the landlord if you can replace the old pump. It is his house not yours.

Edited by VocalNeal
Posted
56 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

So is driving without a license, drinking alcohol within Wat boundaries, buying alcohol between 2pm and 5 pm, riding a motorcycle with the rear footpegs down if there is no passenger. Shall I go on?  

 

There are thousands of shop houses and multilevel houses with a water pump connected directly to the incoming water main.  

 

Ask the landlord if you can replace the old pump. It is his house not yours.

So that makes it right and assume you do all of the above because others do it? 

Posted

Thanks for peoples input.

I will get the tank, to stay on the right side of the law an dot be considerate of my neighbours further down the line.

Or rather I will get the landlord to get the tank, but thats another battle.

 

Cheers for your help.

 

Posted

Good decision....a tank is the best way to go. 

 

But connecting directly to the soi main water line is very common in Thailand....it's common here in my western Bangkok moobaan and in my mother-in-laws village in a province bordering Bangkok.  Just be sure the soi main always has water...the pressure can be close to zero, just ensure during a 24 hour period there is always water when you need to suck water..  Otherwise your pump may end up sucking air which pumps don't like....causes them to run and run...possibly damage themselves.

 

I use a 2000 liter tank but have my water feed lines setup to also directly suck from the soi line if/when needed.  The developer who build the houses in my moobaan set the water hookup that way for all the houses....he built hundreds of houses that way....that is, suck water from your tank if you buy one or suck directly from the soi water line.

Posted

If you lose water supply and are directly connected, you may have to prime the pump every time it comes back on.

 

I would not want a pump trying to start when you open a tap and there is no water feeding it.

 

Best option, go for a tank and an on-demand pump on the outlet to the house.

 

 

 

Posted
16 minutes ago, The Fat Controller said:

If you lose water supply and are directly connected, you may have to prime the pump every time it comes back on.

 

I would not want a pump trying to start when you open a tap and there is no water feeding it.

 

Best option, go for a tank and an on-demand pump on the outlet to the house.

 

It's not like they are expensive.

Water tanks.jpg

Posted

Looking inside a builders merchants store in Buriram I priced DOS 1000 liter water tanks | Diamond Stainless Steel water tanks, Everest 700 liter water tanks, Green Tree 2000 liter rain water storage tanks, and Safe 500 liter water storage tanks. The OP could consider the option of investing under 4000 baht for an attractive 700 liter water storage tank for his rental home in Thailand.  Not all blue water storage tanks are created equal in Thailand. Check for the lining inside the blue water tank to prevent algae in Thailand. The ability to draw clean water from a water storage tank through a water pump that provides sufficient water pressure to activate hot water heaters is what I bought when I lived a year in a rental home in a small Buriram province town. The same Mitsubishi water pump and GreenTree water tank are in use at my village home Twelve years later. 

Inexpensive Water storage tanks Isaan Thailand.jpg

Posted

Connecting the pump directly to the towns water supply without a buffer/break tank is like sucking on your ass to get the water you are drinking...

Posted

Yea, let it go into the tank first....then feed your pump the nasty town water from the tank.

 

Really, the main goal of not sucking directly from the soi main is to prevent "backflow" from your system which could contaminate the soi water line.   But that can be prevented by a simple check valve (a.k.a, ,  back flow prevention valve, etc.) placed between your system and the soi water line.

 

 

Quote

 

A backflow prevention device is used to protect potable water supplies from contamination or pollution due to backflow.

In water supply systems, water is normally maintained at a significant pressure to enable water to flow from the tap, shower, or other fixture. Water pressure may fail or be reduced when a water main bursts, pipes freeze, or there is unexpectedly high demand on the water system (for example, when several fire hydrants are opened). Reduced pressure in the pipe may allow contaminated water from the soil, from storage, or from other sources to be drawn up into the system.


 

 

 

I know many have said it's illegal to suck directly from the soi water line in Thailand and a tank must be used but I've never seen no one post a reference to the govt regulation saying such.    Unless someone can post such a reference my guess is there is a requirement to have a backflow prevention device/valve installed but not a requirement for a tank. 

 

I sure know here in my Bangkok moobaan the developer who has built hundreds of houses in this moobaan installs a setup where you can suck directly from your tank and/or soi water line...and there are blackflow prevention valves installed also. 

 

And none of my close family/friends out in the provinces have water tanks....they are just hooked directly to the soi water line and I don't remember any of them have backflow valves installed.  Expect enforcement by the authorities is close to zero.

 

I expect the main reason for having a tank is "not" to prevent backflow but to ensure you have sufficient water to feed your pump when the soi water line does not have sufficient water.

 

   

 

Posted

Below is a snapshot from the Provincial Water Authority (PWA) showing the required setup for installation of a water meter.  Notice it shows a backflow/check valve....the circled item #1.    Now it does say the connection behind the water meter (i.e., on the customers property) must be in a pattern defined by PWA....couldn't find anything on their website about "pattern defined by PEA."

 

Now, I live in Bangkok and fall under the Metropolitan Water Authority (MWA) and just two weeks ago the MWA unexpectedly came in and changed the water meters of all houses (a dozen or so) on my soi...probably some other sois also. The old meters were around 10 years old.  Now did they include a backflow valve?  Nope is answer, but maybe the meter has one built-in...I don't know.   

 

The old meter didn't have an associated backflow valve like in the snapshot either....the backflow valves on my property I talked about in my earlier post were installed by the builder a decade ago as for the other homes.   MEA just replaced the meter...maybe they just do it every 10 years or so....I don't know.   About 10 months ago they did replace a lot of the main soi water lines from concrete pipes to PVC pipes....maybe the meter change was just part of that upgrade they are still working on.

 

Snapshot From PEA Website

Capture.JPG.085f244c65468a10a44ef30491b0d757.JPG

Posted (edited)

More surfing around on the PEA website I found this regarding connecting a "pump" directly to soi line....they say you  "should" not.   Didn't say not allowed, must not, etc.  And they are also taking use of a pump versus not having a pump.  If using a pump you "should" use a tank.   But what if you don't use a pump...just get your water directly from the soi line?   All clear as mud. 

 

Does that mean you "should" not if using a pump, but it's not a hardcore requirement?  More like a preferred setup. 

 

Now I have read a few ThaiVisa posts where one or two people have supposedly got fined for not having a tank/sucking water directly from the soi line...but I've never every heard of any of my family/friends out the province or even a few here in my moobaan without a tank ever getting fined for not having a tank.   

 

http://en.pwa.co.th/contents/faq

Snapshot from the Essential Practices for Use of PWA Water sublink

Capture.JPG.8797cd933c2417ee3af720e8f6f0bda1.JPG

 

 

 

 

Edited by Pib
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Pib said:

Below is a snapshot from the Provincial Water Authority (PWA) showing the required setup for installation of a water meter.  Notice it shows a backflow/check valve....the circled item #1.    Now it does say the connection behind the water meter (i.e., on the customers property) must be in a pattern defined by PWA....couldn't find anything on their website about "pattern defined by PEA."

 

Now, I live in Bangkok and fall under the Metropolitan Water Authority (MWA) and just two weeks ago the MWA unexpectedly came in and changed the water meters of all houses (a dozen or so) on my soi...probably some other sois also. The old meters were around 10 years old.  Now did they include a backflow valve?  Nope is answer, but maybe the meter has one built-in...I don't know.   

 

The old meter didn't have an associated backflow valve like in the snapshot either....the backflow valves on my property I talked about in my earlier post were installed by the builder a decade ago as for the other homes.   MEA just replaced the meter...maybe they just do it every 10 years or so....I don't know.   About 10 months ago they did replace a lot of the main soi water lines from concrete pipes to PVC pipes....maybe the meter change was just part of that upgrade they are still working on.

 

Snapshot From PEA Website

Capture.JPG.085f244c65468a10a44ef30491b0d757.JPG

The thinking of the authorities, seeing as they are the  hub of  every thing and a No 1world country, just like the west, the water they supply you should be feed directly to your taps as there  is no need for a tank.

In the case of a supply tank, I would think there is a separate regulation regarding this.

 

Edited to add, just noted a previous post, addressing the pumping from the main which confirms it. 

Edited by Artisi
Posted

Can be done BUT

* You will be sucking dirty water straight into the house where all your filters in any equipment ( washing machine /hot water/toilets / ect ) will clog up in no time

* This is why it's good to have a tank & for the storage of water you shall need

* You will also require the Non return valve (as mentioned ) if you go direct ALONG WITH - The electrical equipment that shall monitor the inflow from the Moo Baan that will shutdown the pump due to lack of water preventing pump burn out

 

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