SURVEY: Do you want Trump to finish his first term?

[bristolboy]

26 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

Again, deficits are not the same as national debt. 

Do you understand the relationship between deficits and the national debt? It seems from your comments that you believe them to be unrelated things. 

[Scott]

Troll posts and replies removed.  

[jimmyyy]

over 4% growth, and for those of you posting poll numbers, how well did that turn out for you in 2016, 55555555

 

Still winning!

 

Love me some trump

[Credo]

1 hour ago, jimmyyy said:

over 4% growth, and for those of you posting poll numbers, how well did that turn out for you in 2016, 55555555

 

Still winning!

 

Love me some trump

Here's a little clarification on this:

 

AP FACT CHECK: Trump falsely claims historic turnaround

Speaking at the White House Friday after the government reported that the economy grew at an annual rate of 4.1 percent in the second quarter, Trump declared that the gains were sustainable and would only accelerate. Few economists outside the administration agree with this claim.

His remarks followed events Thursday in Iowa and Illinois, where Trump falsely repeated a claim that the U.S. economy is the best "we've ever had" and incorrectly asserted that Canada's trade market is "totally closed."

A look at the claims:

 

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/ap-fact-check-trump-falsely-044729698.html

[jimmyyy]

The US economy is doing great, and that is due directly to Trump's policies.  You and the AP may spin it anyway you want to.  We know the economy is good, which is why he will be reelected it matters not if the AP approves of it or not.  The polls mean nothing as we found out in 2016, nor do liberal economists who simply are hiding in their closets in disbelief as America has become great again. 

 

This is my opinion and the opinion of the majority of Americans......  

[stud858]

4 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

 

 

This is my opinion and the opinion of the majority of Americans......  

I either meet Americans that like Trump or are indifferent,  cheuy cheuy. I've not met one on the street that absolutely hates him. I don't talk to heaps of Americans though and I'm in Thailand . My bet is Trump will stay on. 

[Opl]

44 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

The US economy is doing great, and that is due directly to Trump's policies.  You and the AP may spin it anyway you want to.  We know the economy is good, which is why he will be reelected it matters not if the AP approves of it or not.  The polls mean nothing as we found out in 2016, nor do liberal economists who simply are hiding in their closets in disbelief as America has become great again. 

 

This is my opinion and the opinion of the majority of Americans......  

 

So great .."spin it anyway you want" 

" U.S. farmers could receive cash from Trump aid plan as late as September before midterms",

https://www.politicususa.com/2018/07/28/u-s-farmers-could-receive-cash-from-trump-aid-plan-as-late-as-september-before-midterms.html

Soybean farmers complain about Trump’s trade war but say they’ll stand by him ‘to the death’

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/07/soybean-farmers-complain-trumps-trade-war-say-theyll-stand-death/

Edited July 29, 2018 by Opl

[Scott]

Troll posts removed.  

 

[Jingthing]

I either meet Americans that like Trump or are indifferent,  cheuy cheuy. I've not met one on the street that absolutely hates him. I don't talk to heaps of Americans though and I'm in Thailand . My bet is Trump will stay on. 

Perhaps the anti "trump" ers get your vibe and don't talk to you about it. Personally I like to talk to non Americans about how awful he is but I avoid contact with his complicit fans.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[stud858]

10 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Perhaps the anti "trump" ers get your vibe and don't talk to you about it. Personally I like to talk to non Americans about how awful he is but I avoid contact with his complicit fans.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Not likely.  I deliberately hide my thoughts first off as,. You are right,  it may influence their reply to me.  I genuinely want to know what Americans think overall.  

[Jingthing]

Not likely.  I deliberately hide my thoughts first off as,. You are right,  it may influence their reply to me.  I genuinely want to know what Americans think overall.  

Dude you discount how your look gives strong hints about your politics. Verbal communication is a minor part of sizing up new people.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[mcambl61]

14 hours ago, heybruce said:

Everybody knows there's ample waste but nobody knows exactly where it is.  Even now, with Republicans controlling both houses of Congress and the White House, nobody can find what everybody knows is there.

 

However Republicans know that lots of money goes to Medicare, so that's where they'll start; not by looking for waste but simply by cutting funding, which will transfer cost to seniors.

 

Universal Healthcare works in every first world nation that uses it, in  provides better healthcare and significantly less money.  Why do you think that is?

 

 

Yes we do know, it lies in the ridiculous purchasing "rules" and massive bureaucracy passed by so called law makers on the lobbyist payrolls. Then we have the the unbelievable govt pension scheme that would not ever available to the private sector.

 

 

 

Universal healthcare does not "work" in "every" first world nation that actually has a military capable of defending itself and the world's shipping lanes. the percent of GDP used is ridiculous. not to mention the long waiting lists and rationing and the ever increasing costs. how much free stuff is enough?

 

Make all hospitals and clinics publish prices for everything, allow for competition and stop the insurance companies from charging different prices depending on who is paying.

 

All these"first" world nations you refer to pay over 7 dollars a gallon for fuel, pay a ridiculous GST tax on everything or a VAT tax to pay for all the "free" stuff. That is what the left wants, but will never admit the realities of who pays for it. Add to that, these taxes increase over time and the govt never has responsibility for their horrible mismanagement, but that socialist utopia is just around the next horizon of bigger government and higher taxation.

 

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/268826/health-expenditure-as-gdp-percentage-in-oecd-countries/

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/health-spending-u-s-compare-countries/#item-start

 

 

[mcambl61]

15 hours ago, heybruce said:

For those who don't know how federal budgeting works, the Fiscal Year begins on October 1 of the proceeding year; so the FY 2009 budget was signed into law by George Bush and took effect October 1 2008.  That $1.4 trillion deficit belongs to Bush.

The federal budget is an itemized plan for the annual public expenditures of the United States. he was forced into sequestration, which is why the military budget and spending were cut, or never increased.

 

National debt is the disaster looming, overspending is much easier to fix if we had people that actually wanted to do it in congress.

 

National debt doubled under the obama administration, more than any other president in history

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, jimmyyy said:

over 4% growth, and for those of you posting poll numbers, how well did that turn out for you in 2016, 55555555

 

Still winning!

 

Love me some trump

So you believe Trump on his economy claims and reject the informed analysis that states it's good but, by itself, not indicative of anything longterm.

 

What else does Trump say that you believe?  Do you think he never slept with Stormy Daniels or Karen McDougal?  Do you think he knew nothing about the payment to Stormy?  Do you think he had the largest inauguration crowds in history?

 

Let's see how dedicated a Trump fan you are.  Do you think Trump can always be believed because he's an honest man who never lies?

[heybruce]

28 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

Yes we do know, it lies in the ridiculous purchasing "rules" and massive bureaucracy passed by so called law makers on the lobbyist payrolls. Then we have the the unbelievable govt pension scheme that would not ever available to the private sector.

 

 

 

Universal healthcare does not "work" in "every" first world nation that actually has a military capable of defending itself and the world's shipping lanes. the percent of GDP used is ridiculous. not to mention the long waiting lists and rationing and the ever increasing costs. how much free stuff is enough?

 

Make all hospitals and clinics publish prices for everything, allow for competition and stop the insurance companies from charging different prices depending on who is paying.

 

All these"first" world nations you refer to pay over 7 dollars a gallon for fuel, pay a ridiculous GST tax on everything or a VAT tax to pay for all the "free" stuff. That is what the left wants, but will never admit the realities of who pays for it. Add to that, these taxes increase over time and the govt never has responsibility for their horrible mismanagement, but that socialist utopia is just around the next horizon of bigger government and higher taxation.

 

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/268826/health-expenditure-as-gdp-percentage-in-oecd-countries/

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/health-spending-u-s-compare-countries/#item-start

 

Your statista link is to a site that charges $49 to download data.  I'll pass.

 

Your second link is to a site that shows that the average US citizen pays almost twice as much for healthcare as the average OECD citizen.  Thank you for supporting my point.

 

The long waiting lists in some OECD countries (I'm not aware of any that has rationing) still provides better overall healthcare at a much lower cost than in the US.  These countries also don't have people filing for bankruptcy because of healthcare costs.  https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2009/06/bankruptcy_medical_costs.html

 

Yes, many wealthy nations don't spend enough on military defense, and they pay higher taxes to support more social services and infrastructure.  That is a choice these democratic nations made.  What has that got to do with healthcare?

 

I'm all in favor of greater transparency in hospital costs and more competition among insurers.  However when people are having a medical emergency they, or the first responders, want to go to the nearest hospital.  They don't want to comparison shop.

 

You are dodging the issue of Medicare, which Republicans have clearly stated they want to cut, not to mention the fact that Trump has totally abandoned his promise to provide better healthcare than the Affordable Care Act for everyone. 

[heybruce]

51 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

The federal budget is an itemized plan for the annual public expenditures of the United States. he was forced into sequestration, which is why the military budget and spending were cut, or never increased.

 

National debt is the disaster looming, overspending is much easier to fix if we had people that actually wanted to do it in congress.

 

National debt doubled under the obama administration, more than any other president in history

The federal budget drives the national debt up or down, depending on the deficit.

 

George Bush inherited a nation at peace, with a budget surplus, and emerging from a mild recession that primarily affected tech investors.  He doubled the federal debt by turning budget surpluses into large deficits through a combination of wars, tax cuts, and an economic crash.

 

Obama inherited a nation in economic freefall with two unfinished wars and Bush's $1.4 trillion dollar deficit.  On his watch the economy recovered and the deficit was cut dramatically, but yes, due to the failing economy and Bush's disastrous borrow and spend policies, the federal debt also doubled on his watch.

 

Now we are back to the present, and back on-topic.  Trump inherited a strong economy and a deficit far below Bush's FY2009 deficit.  He immediately set about dramatically increasing deficit spending.  This will not "MAGA", this will create huge problems in the future.

 

In order to stay on-topic, and avoid having these posts deleted, try to focus on Trump, not on  "but, but, but....Obama!" deflections.

Edited July 29, 2018 by heybruce

[mcambl61]

12 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Your statista link is to a site that charges $49 to download data.  I'll pass.

 

Your second link is to a site that shows that the average US citizen pays almost twice as much for healthcare as the average OECD citizen.  Thank you for supporting my point.

 

The long waiting lists in some OECD countries (I'm not aware of any that has rationing) still provides better overall healthcare at a much lower cost than in the US.  These countries also don't have people filing for bankruptcy because of healthcare costs.  https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2009/06/bankruptcy_medical_costs.html

 

Yes, many wealthy nations don't spend enough on military defense, and they pay higher taxes to support more social services and infrastructure.  That is a choice these democratic nations made.  What has that got to do with healthcare?

 

I'm all in favor of greater transparency in hospital costs and more competition among insurers.  However when people are having a medical emergency they, or the first responders, want to go to the nearest hospital.  They don't want to comparison shop.

 

You are dodging the issue of Medicare, which Republicans have clearly stated they want to cut, not to mention the fact that Trump has totally abandoned his promise to provide better healthcare than the Affordable Care Act for everyone. 

I am not "dodging" anything the ACA was and is a disaster, proving exactly how incompetent the Govt bureaucracy is and how a 3000 page bill was never read by the people passing it.

Medicare can fill the gaps and it does for many, people purchase supplemental insurance for the things it does not cover.

 

Trump did not abandon the healthcare issue at all, but the plan was scuttled by the senate, some in his own party. let us not forget how many congressmen are on the lobbyist payroll from the insurance lobby. there is a clear reason for that

 

I never said healthcare was cheaper in the USA at anytime, there is no "point" proven.

 

If you think that a nation of 350 million versus nations of 10 to 30 million can be just as easily managed and controlled you are delusional. 

 

 

 

 

[mcambl61]

26 minutes ago, heybruce said:

So you believe Trump on his economy claims and reject the informed analysis that states it's good but, by itself, not indicative of anything longterm.

 

What else does Trump say that you believe?  Do you think he never slept with Stormy Daniels or Karen McDougal?  Do you think he knew nothing about the payment to Stormy?  Do you think he had the largest inauguration crowds in history?

 

Let's see how dedicated a Trump fan you are.  Do you think Trump can always be believed because he's an honest man who never lies?

you can't claim other peoples bias while displaying your own Bruce, life is not that simple.

 

we get it, you hate the man. ok. But if you actually think he does not genuinely care about getting the economy growing and people working and having more available opportunities I guess we see something different. You can have a different opinion on how to get there but one thing is for sure, what was tried previously did not work out for the middle class.

[heybruce]

29 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

I am not "dodging" anything the ACA was and is a disaster, proving exactly how incompetent the Govt bureaucracy is and how a 3000 page bill was never read by the people passing it.

Medicare can fill the gaps and it does for many, people purchase supplemental insurance for the things it does not cover.

 

Trump did not abandon the healthcare issue at all, but the plan was scuttled by the senate, some in his own party. let us not forget how many congressmen are on the lobbyist payroll from the insurance lobby. there is a clear reason for that

 

I never said healthcare was cheaper in the USA at anytime, there is no "point" proven.

 

If you think that a nation of 350 million versus nations of 10 to 30 million can be just as easily managed and controlled you are delusional. 

 

You are definitely dodging my question about Republicans who want to cut Medicare to reduce the deficits caused by unaffordable tax cuts.

 

I won't address the rest of your deflections, but I'll point out the absurdity of your final comment.  Economies of scale do not make things more expensive.  It's a lot more difficult to build a factory that manufactures billions of nails (or anything else) than to build a single nail, but big producers make nails much cheaper than small scale nail craftsmen.

[mcambl61]

42 minutes ago, heybruce said:

The federal budget drives the national debt up or down, depending on the deficit.

 

George Bush inherited a nation at peace, with a budget surplus, and emerging from a mild recession that primarily affected tech investors.  He doubled the federal debt by turning budget surpluses into large deficits through a combination of wars, tax cuts, and an economic crash.

 

Obama inherited a nation in economic freefall with two unfinished wars and Bush's $1.4 trillion dollar deficit.  On his watch the economy recovered and the deficit was cut dramatically, but yes, due to the failing economy and Bush's disastrous borrow and spend policies, the federal debt also doubled on his watch.

 

Now we are back to the present, and back on-topic.  Trump inherited a strong economy and a deficit far below Bush's FY2009 deficit.  He immediately set about dramatically increasing deficit spending.  This will not "MAGA", this will create huge problems in the future.

 

In order to stay on-topic, and avoid having these posts deleted, try to focus on Trump, not on  "but, but, but....Obama!" deflections.

so you bring up bush and that is on topic?

 

I never supported Bush or his unjustified war in Iraq, a huge horrible Mistake. you can't hide the massive debts of the previous Administration or justify the lack of economic growth and massive increase in people on the dole.

 

Lets just see how the increased GDP effects the budget deficit. The size of the federal budget deficit is tightly linked to how well the U.S. economy is performing. 

 

you think the approach is wrong, we get that. Time will tell, and there are plenty of people hoping for failure

[heybruce]

25 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

you can't claim other peoples bias while displaying your own Bruce, life is not that simple.

 

we get it, you hate the man. ok. But if you actually think he does not genuinely care about getting the economy growing and people working and having more available opportunities I guess we see something different. You can have a different opinion on how to get there but one thing is for sure, what was tried previously did not work out for the middle class.

We get it, you dodged a simple question:  Do you trust what Trump says?

 

Clearly you don't, but you support him anyway.  Think about that and it's implications.

 

For the record, I think Trump cares about nothing but Trump.  If he were genuinely competent and true to the ideals of the United States in his pursuit of glory I could live with that.  However he can't seem to do anything but promote the name "Trump".

[mcambl61]

4 minutes ago, heybruce said:

You are definitely dodging my question about Republicans who want to cut Medicare to reduce the deficits caused by unaffordable tax cuts.

 

I won't address the rest of your deflections, but I'll point out the absurdity of your final comment.  Economies of scale do not make things more expensive.  It's a lot more difficult to build a factory that manufactures billions of nails (or anything else) than to build a single nail, but big producers make nails much cheaper than small scale nail craftsmen.

Medicare was in deep trouble as well as social security long before the tax cuts Bruce.

that is obvious and a deflection. 

 

the only way out of the budget deficit is growth, given the incompetence of the senate and the unwillingness to hold them accountable.

 

I do not need your lectures on absurdity. ever.

 

[watcharacters]

I would like to see those replying to this thread say if they are 
American citizens or not.

 

 

I know  many posters are from other countries  but have not the  nerve or gumption  to admit that.   

 

Stand forth I say.

 

Everyone on the planet can say what he wants on this forum which  by virtue of it's foundation cannot support free speech.   That was really a sarcastic statement  on many levels.  This forum cannot allow free speech at all  based on its foundation

 

Please be honest and at least say if your are a Brit, 
Canadian,  Aussie or whatever

 

Do not be afraid.

 

Just say honestly from where you come..

 

Post accordingly with that honesty,  please.

 

 

I have not one time BUTTED  into the politics of another country with my thoughts.   I do not say anything about May or Merkel  or  any other head of state besides Putin.    I  liked Willie Brandt.

 

I say pause the vitriolic about another countries politics and focus on your own country.

 

TIA

 

 

Edited July 29, 2018 by watcharacters

[mcambl61]

4 minutes ago, heybruce said:

We get it, you dodged a simple question:  Do you trust what Trump says?

 

Clearly you don't, but you support him anyway.  Think about that and it's implications.

 

For the record, I think Trump cares about nothing but Trump.  If he were genuinely competent and true to the ideals of the United States in his pursuit of glory I could live with that.  However he can't seem to do anything but promote the name "Trump".

We get it, you hate the man. that is your choice. 

I did not hate the previous president but disagreed with the ridiculous socialist agenda and the 9 trillion dollar hole it dug with nothing substantial to show for it.

 

Time will tell if your hatred is wrong or just the standard leftist stance, i mean the "informed analysis" has always been spot on aye?

[mcambl61]

3 minutes ago, watcharacters said:

I would like to see those replying to this thread say if they are 
American citizens or not.

 

 

I know  many posters are from other countries  but have not the  nerve or gumption  to admit that.   

 

Stand forth I say.

 

Everyone on the planet can say what he wants on this forum which  by virtue of it's foundation cannot support free speech.

 

Please be honest and at least say if your are a Brit, 
Canadian,  Aussie or whatever

 

Do not be afraid.

 

Just say honestly from where you come..

 

 

[heybruce]

Just now, mcambl61 said:

so you bring up bush and that is on topic?

 

I never supported Bush or his unjustified war in Iraq, a huge horrible Mistake. you can't hide the massive debts of the previous Administration or justify the lack of economic growth and massive increase in people on the dole.

 

Lets just see how the increased GDP effects the budget deficit. The size of the federal budget deficit is tightly linked to how well the U.S. economy is performing. 

 

you think the approach is wrong, we get that. Time will tell, and there are plenty of people hoping for failure

I brought up Bush and the mess he created because you deflected with Obama. 

 

We've seen how the budget deficit is growing.  A $1 trillion budget deficit added to a $15 trillion federal debt equates to a 6.6% increase in debt.  The federal debt as a percent of the GDP is projected to increase dramatically.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/26/the-federal-debt-is-headed-for-the-highest-levels-since-world-war-ii-cbo-says/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0a9f32e3de73

http://thehill.com/policy/finance/245094-cbo-debt-to-hit-101-percent-of-gdp-by-2039

 

Do you want to wait until we are deep into an insolvency crisis before trying to do something about it?

[stud858]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Dude you discount how your look gives strong hints about your politics. Verbal communication is a minor part of sizing up new people.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 next time I meet an American,  I won't use my usual,  " how's things in America? Line.  I'll get right to the point and say, " isn't it shocking what trump is doing? "  and see what response I get.  That will eliminate any false positive. 

[heybruce]

11 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

We get it, you hate the man. that is your choice. 

I did not hate the previous president but disagreed with the ridiculous socialist agenda and the 9 trillion dollar hole it dug with nothing substantial to show for it.

 

Time will tell if your hatred is wrong or just the standard leftist stance, i mean the "informed analysis" has always been spot on aye?

Such a simple question:  Do you trust what Trump says?

 

Twice you've dodged it.  You're in denial of the fact that you follow a man you don't trust.

[heybruce]

17 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

Medicare was in deep trouble as well as social security long before the tax cuts Bruce.

that is obvious and a deflection. 

 

the only way out of the budget deficit is growth, given the incompetence of the senate and the unwillingness to hold them accountable.

 

I do not need your lectures on absurdity. ever.

 

Yes, Medicare was in trouble before Trump made the situation worse.

 

How do you feel about the Republicans who want to cut Medicare?

[mcambl61]

2 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I brought up Bush and the mess he created because you deflected with Obama. 

 

We've seen how the budget deficit is growing.  A $1 trillion budget deficit added to a $15 trillion federal debt equates to a 6.6% increase in debt.  The federal debt as a percent of the GDP is projected to increase dramatically.  https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/26/the-federal-debt-is-headed-for-the-highest-levels-since-world-war-ii-cbo-says/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0a9f32e3de73

http://thehill.com/policy/finance/245094-cbo-debt-to-hit-101-percent-of-gdp-by-2039

 

Do you want to wait until we are deep into an insolvency crisis before trying to do something about it?

of course YOU could do better and have a better idea how to fix things yes?

it would seem you think you do. If the economic growth is sustained, what excuses will you come up with then?

 

if it all falls apart, you can do your victory dance.

perhaps you could give it a chance, or just keep up the deep rooted hatred and vitriol.